I can definitley see why the leaders of PL, goons, and others are so fiercely in favour of this.

They can go **** themselves. They're just as bad as all the miners who whined about barge HP until CCP finally caved and buffed it.

indeed - if they price TSEs like they price skins... oh boy. expect to see 1 plex (3500 aur) extractors.

skin prices are, imo, absurdly high considering what they are.

Pay to Access.

you ignoring the fact that when most of us started, cruiser/bc/bs/whaterver lvl 5 was not a requirement to join a basic alliance op; yes the game evolved, and we evolved with it; while we spent those months training all those ships, it was done in years, and we had fun doing so;
when i started i was joining in a t1 fitted tempest and no one was telling me to just dock up; the fact is that, back in the day you could join main fleets allot faster, and there where 2-3 main doctrines; now? oh you need to train 3 months to get that tengu lvl 5; 3 months later-OH CRAP CCP just nerfed tengus, you need to train to proteus, so good luck with training 3 more months and so on;
this is just one ex, i know you can have fun in some smaller ships, but there is a point where flying a t1 frig all the time waiting to skiil up just isn't fun anymore

herding them all to nullsec entities with srp is much better than herding them out of the game;
and that is a mart thing to do, for a new player, instead of just playing solo mission running in high sec; you want to stay "safe"? play in empire solo, but train at normal speed;
you want to advance at a faster speed? join a player corporation, be it nul sec/low sec/incursion that can help you make isk>advance faster, and that will be a win-win situation:good corps get more active players, new players get to train a bit faster, and reach that "confort" zone

Doubtful it would work out like this. All those vet accounts subbed with no real intent to play regularly but not wanting to miss out on training would suddenly have the SP addiction removed as a reason to stay subbed. Add to that the likely outrage this thread evidences for any change to the SP system and "invalidating years of training" and you'll probably kill off any notion of an increase in subs or plex consumption.

Edit: Maybe my experience is highly atypical but I never actually made the line strait for BSs. They were a tool of necessity for PvE due to being actually better for that purpose. And even then there was no hurry either, getting 500m for the ship + fitting was trivial with all the time I spent before even injecting my first BS skill.

you think people are pissed now when a ship they've skilled into is nerfed? Wait until they bought their way into it ?

I'd also like to bring up that I strongly doubt alliances will suddenly fund skill injection for people on any meaningful scale. If they were willing to do this, we'd already have seen alliances bulk buying characters for their members.

Just listened to Jeff Raiders latest podcast and Gorski Car was there taking about sp proposal. It gave me a slightly better understanding where he's coming from. He's thinking that overcoming some initial training barriers will allow newcomers to get involved with the 'cool' stuff in eve.

I would like to respectfully disagree. I have interacted with new players ALOT. At the risk of sounding arrogant I'm going to say that I have helped to get dozens if not hundreds of new players realize the beauty of eve and get hooked. Sometimes they were as young as few of days old. Big nullsec alliances want people in specific doctrines because they can't overcome their static bureaucratic nature. This is a problem that needs to be worked out internally by players instead of with a change that is forced on the entirety of eve

I and I'm sure most of the people opposed to this proposal want to help new players. We just don't think pressuring those players into paying money for skills is going to help that and it sends the wrong message. I keep hearing people say what are you worried about, sp doesn't mean **** in eve, its about skillz. Then why are we reinforcing this false belief by giving them an option to buy sp? Personally I don't give a damn if we give new players a bunch of unallocated sp. Do it through non tradable means as a reward for completing certain story arcs. Make it once per account and they should take a certain amount of time to complete to limit its abuse with alts.

This community has many intelligent, creative players and devs. If team size matters gives a good and clear idea of goals they want to achieve we can come up with solutions that everyone can be happy with. The dev blog seems a bit disingenuous and needs clarification for the reason behind this proposal.

I agree with the change. CCP is right with the SP penalty, without it only the rich veterans would use this.

This feature should be aimed towards new players and low SP characters.

Can you list any problems that aren't..

veterans getting the option of alts

it plausibly being ineffective

?

You'll always be able to make your own for 1/4 PLEX + extractors. There is literally no way prices will raise above that.

More SP doesn't mean more fun. What is peers, since almost everybody starts on their own? Also, who cares?

Renters pay ISK or SP, it will be the exact same thing since they'll be interchangable.

Why is FOTM an issue? Ships are cancerous when they're unbalenced, not when a number of people choose to fly them.

LOL at SP loss actually limiting T3 use.


Look, you're free to not like this proposal, but what you write are sloppy predictions that simply will not happen. Wait and see if you don't believe me.

that simply will not happen

. No way SP prices will rise above 1/4 PLEX + Extractor, this is simple market logic

. FOTM is a balance issue, sames as T3s. SP makes no difference. Certain ships being significantly more effective than others is a problem because it limits variety and interesting gameplay. The solution is balancing the ships, not having SP or ISK barriers (slightly) limiting player choice of ships

The proposal creates the concept of SP farms, and allows veteran players with lots of spare SP or ISK to setup these farms to milk as much ISK as they can out of it. Also this is PASSIVE income which is something that CCP has been trying to remove from the game, and worst off it is passive income with absolutely no effort required to set it up or defend.