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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.01.02 01:17:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Shadarle on 02/01/2007 01:20:54
Edited by: Shadarle on 02/01/2007 01:19:57
Akita, I may be able to help you a great deal with solving your problem. I attempted to tackle this issue a few months back. I created a massive list of missions, rewards, etc. It would probably be better for me to provide you the excel sheet itself, as there is too much info to easily provide on the forums.
I have alway assumed that the connections skills were multiplicative... the formula never worked correctly though. I just redid the formula with connections as additive and it now works correctly.
The "worth" of a mission is based off the bonus time you are given. So, for the 6 bonus hour missions (the highest you can get), I would receive 2702 LP with one advanced connection skill to level 4, the other to level 3. When both were level 4 I receive 2802. When calculated additively they both come out nearly identically (off by just a fraction). Multiplicatively they come out far off.
Basically, to get the "worth" you need to just keep peeling back the layers of factors until you are left with the base points of the mission. I am really curious if missions that are gotten from agents of multiple levels are based off the same base points. If so then we can determine how much each level adds and thus how much level 5missions will be worth if they are added.
Another special note. Make sure you get the REAL security status of a system, not the one listed in game which are rounded. This is crucial or you'll never figure it out. Even in my spreadsheet I don't have the best values listed... but I can tell you that my .49's are from Kaunokka, so if you look up the more detailed security status and replace all the .49's in my list with that you'll have a LOT of data to work with :) Dump all the rest imo, or you'll be screwing yourself up. Dump any without the bonus time. Dump any without every piece of data you need.
You may find out they use more variables than you know about... so try to list EVERYTHING you have access to. Even if you never use it is a lot better than realizing you have to scrap all your current data because you are missing a critical variable.
Mission Spreadsheet
I'd love it if you could pop over to another thread of mine and help me determine the formula for Broker Fee's that you are accessed when placing orders on the market. I have figured a lot out and I have a similar spreadsheet with lots of values listed which I can provide if you are willing to help me out. I will be happy to do a lot more documentation of missions with different skillsets/standings/eq's for your mission "worth" formula as well.
That thread is here: Broker Fee Thread linky
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.01.09 06:51:00 -
[2]
Are you still working on this Akita?
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.01.09 17:26:00 -
[3]
I am ready to put a lot of effort into helping to figure this out... I just want to make sure Akita is still working on it.
One thing I will mention though is that after training a skill you generally have to relog before it will take effect. I'm not really sure why... but this is the case with many different types of skills, including trade skills and connections.
Also, if the agent in .5 and .9 space were for different corps it could explain it as well... if they were the same corp then I don't know... was it the identical mission? Remember, the main number that determines the LP of a mission is it's bonus time. This is a direct multiplier for LP and could be considered the missions "difficulty factor".
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.01.10 07:40:00 -
[4]
I know Akita just said bonus time isn't required but it would certainly make things a lot easier if you list them imo. It isn't required to do it... but it's an instant indication of how difficult a mission is. And, if a mission changes it's difficulty rating it would be the only way to explain away the irregularities. Missions can change their difficulty based on how fast they are run, etc... I've seen it happen, especially after patches, but sometimes just out of the blue a mission will be worth a slightly different amount.
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:47:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Shadarle on 11/01/2007 18:46:38
Come on, don't go posting skill descriptions or someone will post that of a shield compensation skill to show you how worthless that is.
It matters how the skills actually work, not how they say they work :)
Payment from missions is separate from their LP rewards and are not constant. Increasing negotiations does not increase the LP reward but does increase the ISK reward as far as I know. Feel free to raise your negotiation level by one tho to test it. It is a bit complicated tho as ISK rewards are not constant as I said. LP are constant tho, so it would take an averaged sample of the same LP valued missions compared to their ISK values with and without that point of negotiations to see what the impact is or if it's even working.
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.01.12 08:18:00 -
[6]
If your EQ was higher and your LP did not change then that is very interesting. I had thought LP was tied to it fairly tightly. It does give me a good hint of how to proceed on figuring out a formula tho.
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.01.12 17:32:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: Arrs Grazznic
Some useful formula for you:
Effective Agent Quality = Base Agent Quality + ( 5 * Level of Negotiation Skill ) + Effective Agent Standing
where
Effective Standing = Actual Standing + ( ( 10 - Actual Standing ) * 0.04 * Level of Relevant Connection Skill )
where 'Relevant Connection Skill' is one of COnnections, Diplomancy or Criminal Connections.
This would mean:
Actual Standing = Effecting Standing - ((10-Actual Standing) * .04 * Level of Relevant Connection Skill)
Which unfortunately is not accurate. It's actually closer to .045, not .04 per relevant connections skill. I know, I know... this makes no sense... but it fits better if you analyze enough data.
Use your formulas for these numbers:
6.89377229701 (Corp Standing, affected by connections 3). You'll get 6.521... but in game the value without connections is 6.47.
Here is another one to try:
5.33470618253 (Corp Standing, affected by connections 2). You'll get 4.9615... but in game the value without connections is 4.93.
The closer to 10 you get the more accurate it is, the further from 10 the less accurate it is. If you adjust it to .45 a lot of numbers get a lot closer... but it's still not right. I've tried tweaking it even more but no matter what I do it starts to throw off numbers at one end of the spectrum. So I'm honestly at a loss for how connections actually works in game... as opposed to "in theory".
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.02.03 01:32:00 -
[8]
THANK YOU! I've been wondering what was wrong with my formula for quite a while... looked at it too long to see the obvious problem :)
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