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Petra Hakaari
Empire Assault Corp Dead Terrorists
133
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Posted - 2015.11.05 12:53:17 -
[1] - Quote
I started playing during the Incarna expansion.
After not much ccp started rebalancing ships...
4 years later it hasn't finished yet.
I know you don't do that in a couple of months but on the paralax release there wasn't nothing rebalanced...
Because tities .
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Val'Dore
PlanetCorp InterStellar
1122
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Posted - 2015.11.05 12:56:07 -
[2] - Quote
Beware of any MMO that is 'finished'.
Star Jump Drive A new way to traverse the galaxy.
I invented Tiericide
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Eternus8lux8lucis
Primus Inc. LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM
527
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Posted - 2015.11.05 13:02:20 -
[3] - Quote
Redoing and rebalancing stuff over time is actually a good way of doing it, even if all the information and general changes are out all at the same time. Why? Because then its a gradual shift of usage as well as pseudo "new" content for players and a lot less to have to get used to changing rather than a huge information dump. So no I agree with how CCP is doing it. Allows for more gradual changes from both CCP and the player base, allows more small tweaks and tinkering to occur over longer to get that balance 'right' and keep ships and modules from overuse, underuse and OP related issues.
So I must say.... DOWN IN FRONT!!! /throws popcorn
Imam: Have you heard anything I've said?
Richard B. Riddick: You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?
Imam: That's right.
Richard B. Riddick: Had to end sometime.
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Petra Hakaari
Empire Assault Corp Dead Terrorists
133
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Posted - 2015.11.05 13:04:16 -
[4] - Quote
Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:Redoing and rebalancing stuff over time is actually a good way of doing it, even if all the information and general changes are out all at the same time. Why? Because then its a gradual shift of usage as well as pseudo "new" content for players and a lot less to have to get used to changing rather than a huge information dump. So no I agree with how CCP is doing it. Allows for more gradual changes from both CCP and the player base, allows more small tweaks and tinkering to occur over longer to get that balance 'right' and keep ships and modules from overuse, underuse and OP related issues. So I must say.... DOWN IN FRONT!!! /throws popcorn
dont you think its about time to get blops tweaked already? or t3s? or.....
focusing too much on some stuff and neglecting others, lemme tell you my man, its an awful bsns strategy, just sayin'
Because tities .
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1788
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Posted - 2015.11.05 13:09:51 -
[5] - Quote
posting in a stealth blops are useless thread
Recruiting V I R I I Small Gang Nullsec PVP
Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic | Angel Cartel | Serpentis |
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Eternus8lux8lucis
Primus Inc. LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM
529
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Posted - 2015.11.05 13:35:22 -
[6] - Quote
Petra Hakaari wrote:Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:Redoing and rebalancing stuff over time is actually a good way of doing it, even if all the information and general changes are out all at the same time. Why? Because then its a gradual shift of usage as well as pseudo "new" content for players and a lot less to have to get used to changing rather than a huge information dump. So no I agree with how CCP is doing it. Allows for more gradual changes from both CCP and the player base, allows more small tweaks and tinkering to occur over longer to get that balance 'right' and keep ships and modules from overuse, underuse and OP related issues. So I must say.... DOWN IN FRONT!!! /throws popcorn dont you think its about time to get blops tweaked already? or t3s? or..... focusing too much on some stuff and neglecting others, lemme tell you my man, its an awful bsns strategy, just sayin' Considering blops arent in an awful position right now, and that T3s have been tweaked a bunch through module nerfs and buffs, module changes and hp nerfs........ nope not one bit.
Imam: Have you heard anything I've said?
Richard B. Riddick: You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?
Imam: That's right.
Richard B. Riddick: Had to end sometime.
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Petra Hakaari
Empire Assault Corp Dead Terrorists
133
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Posted - 2015.11.05 14:56:32 -
[7] - Quote
Eternus8lux8lucis wrote: T3s have been tweaked a bunch through module...
You must be hypoxic...
Because tities .
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Otso Bakarti
Filial Pariahs
448
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Posted - 2015.11.05 15:01:36 -
[8] - Quote
They're not re-balancing. They're balancing. Kinda like you imagine yourself trying to do while you walk with a front porch like your would-be you is sporting there. Balancing is done with a lot of cross-referencing, so the data becomes rather involved, and much trial and error ensues.
TL;DR Don't ask for too much too soon, you just might get it.
Fear of death follows from fear of life. A man who lives fully is prepared to die at any time. -Mark Twain -
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Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
732
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Posted - 2015.11.05 15:14:01 -
[9] - Quote
The changes in steps is a good thing. Allows identification of holes or missing opportunities in a faction. The big ones got done right away, now it is fiddling. Parallax didnt seem like much, but there were some big behind the scenes updates.
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
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Doddy
Esoteric Operations
927
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Posted - 2015.11.05 15:21:44 -
[10] - Quote
Petra Hakaari wrote:I started playing during the Incarna expansion.
After not much ccp started rebalancing ships...
4 years later it hasn't finished yet.
I know you don't do that in a couple of months but on the paralax release there wasn't nothing rebalanced...
It is a slow process, to be honest it should be running as long as eve is running. Every change you make can unbalance other things and so you need to go back and fix those or roll back previous changes. To be honest there is not much left to do a major rebalance on after the big cap change sin the Spring. T3 cruisers are the elephant in the room.
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Bobb Bobbington
The Cult of the Rare Pepes
116
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Posted - 2015.11.06 03:27:48 -
[11] - Quote
I think the difference between doing what's important now or going one by one is sort of like the difference with a car with a lot of dents. You could bang them all out, but they probably won't look as great still, or you could shell out and get it repaired, which would take more time/money. Instead of repeatedly playing whack a mole with the FOTM 'dents' they're trying their best to slowly smooth them all out instead. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16895
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Posted - 2015.11.06 03:41:46 -
[12] - Quote
They got all the low hanging fruit and are now faced with the ships that will cause the most rage when they are altered. Capitals were always going to be a big job and after citadel hits there is only the other massive problem area to deal with. 2016, the year CCP finally deals with T3's.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Petra Hakaari
Empire Assault Corp Dead Terrorists
133
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Posted - 2015.11.06 12:46:26 -
[13] - Quote
Bobb Bobbington wrote:[...]
I agree guys, going slow is the way to go, but lets be honest: paralax had no rebalance, you're tellin me there's nothing more to rebalance out of capitals ? really ?
that hipoxic personage earlier said that the blops are kinda okay... well, let me tell you pal, marauders where too, yet with the bastion thingy and small tweaks they are awesome right now, are you telling me there is no magic ccp can do with blops?
i mean, there was this cpm guy like 2 years ago, the bald one, he said some pretty interesting things such as: allow cloaky ships only to refit on blops (this was before the mobile depo), and have a ship hangar that only allows bombers to get in... some other people suggested that they'd be able to fit cov ops cloak...the first two suggestions are awesome, the third one would make em quite op, but still, then are cool enough but they can be better without being op, and these are only 4 ships, the blops community has been beging for love for quite a while and this has been the first release since the rebalance began that there's nothing being rebalanced...
it makes me wonder.
Because tities .
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ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers EVEolution.
475
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Posted - 2015.11.06 12:56:19 -
[14] - Quote
well Capitals are a whole different ball game and those need a bit longer than the other classes. i wasn't expecting a ship class to be re balanced every single patch but they have done it a lot more frequent than i thought. give it time. |
Doddy
Esoteric Operations
938
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Posted - 2015.11.06 22:18:53 -
[15] - Quote
Petra Hakaari wrote:
I agree guys, going slow is the way to go, but lets be honest: paralax had no rebalance, you're tellin me there's nothing more to rebalance out of capitals ? really ?
it makes me wonder.
You know capitals are getting completely redone top to bottom in Citadel right?
You are right about Blops though.
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Marsha Mallow
2721
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Posted - 2015.11.06 23:07:19 -
[16] - Quote
These questions seem fair. Perhaps you aren't aware of where to look to monitor future/ongoing balance topics? That might be more to do with the forum layout and working out how to follow certain topics.
Features & Ideas < for proposed changes, keep an eye on the dev stickies EVE Information Portal < for implemented changes with a request for feedback or for larger changes being considered
Some balancing/new ship topics I found with a quick skim of F&I: [December] Balance Smorgasbord [December] Module Tiericide - Warp Disruption Field Generators [December] Module Tiericide - Neutralizers and Nosferatu [December] Discovering a New Expedition Frigate [December] Navy EWar Frigates [December] Missile Disruptors and Tweaks to Missile Guidance Mods [Future] Module Tiericide GÇô Shield Rechargers and Others [Focus Group] Tactical Destroyers [Focus Group] Capital Ships Signup
That suggests there are massive rebalancing passes in progress - not just related to tiercide, but the release of new ships/modules to plug existing gaps and give people new things to OoOh over. I'm not hypoxic over a policy of continued balancing mixed in with fresh items. Would you prefer this was done quickly and permenantly over a year then never revisited? Actually I hope 'rebalancing' is an ongoing theme, rather than nerfing. Caps really are a big deal btw, it needs to be done properly. If that means waiting for T3s/Blops to be done next year, I'm not too fussed. There's only so much the playerbase can take in terms of fixing before they turn nasty, and T3s will probably get spanked when it lands. Maybe Blops will get a huge boost as compensation.
I was feeling part of the scenery ~
I walked right out of the machinery
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Doddy
Esoteric Operations
939
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Posted - 2015.11.06 23:40:22 -
[17] - Quote
Also the capital stuff was announced at Eve Vegas
key note
Capital presentation
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Chocolaty Sprogmaster
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
27
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Posted - 2015.11.07 05:26:30 -
[18] - Quote
Slow balance passes are fine, but there is a limit. We're running into the problem now where some of the first ships to be rebalanced (such as AFs) are pretty much terrible because later rebalances and other changes during that time have outdone the buffs they got. This means they're gonna hafta either be rebalalanced again before some ships even get one pass, or they'll remain garbage tier. |
Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3367
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Posted - 2015.11.07 13:38:54 -
[19] - Quote
Chocolaty Sprogmaster wrote:Slow balance passes are fine, but there is a limit. We're running into the problem now where some of the first ships to be rebalanced (such as AFs) are pretty much terrible because later rebalances and other changes during that time have outdone the buffs they got. This means they're gonna hafta either be rebalalanced again before some ships even get one pass, or they'll remain garbage tier. By design.
Rebalancing can be a job for life if you choose to make it so.
Post on the Eve-o forums with a Goonswarm Federation character that drinking bleach is bad for you, and 20 forum warriors will hospitalise themselves trying to prove you wrong.
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2374
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Posted - 2015.11.07 13:49:47 -
[20] - Quote
It is generally considered to be good game design to keep moving the flavour of the month around and having your players cycle through existing content.
I don't think the ships will ever be properly balanced. That said, the Tengu is puzzling.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
There are other ways to fix Null Sec stagnation and Fozzie SOV is the wrong approach.
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SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1080
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Posted - 2015.11.07 15:04:49 -
[21] - Quote
Petra Hakaari wrote:
I agree guys, going slow is the way to go, but lets be honest: paralax had no rebalance, you're tellin me there's nothing more to rebalance out of capitals ? really ?
Oh man are you ever going to feel stupid - and rightly so - when you take a quick break from your idiotic whining to read the dev blogs.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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Petra Hakaari
Empire Assault Corp Dead Terrorists
133
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Posted - 2015.11.07 20:50:33 -
[22] - Quote
all i said is that this patch didn't had any rebalance yet some of you keep obssessed about me not reading the devblogs, i read em all... always, even the fozzie sov which dont even affect me because i live in low.
i wonder if that you guys suffer from projective neurosis and didnt read what i say xD
Because tities .
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Petra Hakaari
Empire Assault Corp Dead Terrorists
133
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Posted - 2015.11.07 20:53:57 -
[23] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:[...] Well, i red all of these, I even read the world news, they are pretty cool for rp and stuff, but thanks for your info and politeness.
Chocolaty Sprogmaster wrote:[...] Yeah well, i agree, that might be the case, but still, this was the perfect momento to rebalance blops, they're just 4 ships ffs xD
SurrenderMonkey wrote:[...] With that fancypants bigboy internet warrior attitude i think that you suffer from projective neurosis because you didn't understand jack of what i say.
Because tities .
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Saede Riordan
Alexylva Paradox Low-Class
7856
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Posted - 2015.11.08 17:24:51 -
[24] - Quote
Every release doesn't need to have balance changes. Parallax was pretty light on content, but that's because there is a massive amount of backend stuff getting released. The balance changes are continuing. Check here for the ships receiving balance tweaks next.
I don't see T3s getting touched anytime soon. Rebalancing the T3 cruisers is going to be a herculean task and one with the potential to **** off literally everyone. It will happen, but I don't see a radical rework of them happening until after the capital changes are good and settled in.
Blops? CCP needs to decide what they're doing with Blops before they do any balance passes on them. Right now they're a slightly worse T1 battleship that can move under a cloak and has no targeting delay. I for one think they should have a covops cloak, they cost enough that I don't think it'd be game breaking. But then I'm not a game designer so wahey.
Fear and Loathing in Internet Spaceships
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Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
324
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Posted - 2015.11.08 18:28:36 -
[25] - Quote
Six week release cadence means not everything will be touched each cycle.
Team 5-0 double backed to work on Sov, the new destroyers, new logi frigs, and new ewar frigs coming next cycle.
I want Tiericide as much as you do, but with nearly all of the sub-capitals done, that roughly concludes "ship tiericide"
BLOPS isn't technically Tiericide as they have no internal tiers. All T1 ships that had tiers, now do not.
Does that mean re-balance is over? Absolutely not. So lets look at what their focus really is.
* New ships * Mods Tiericide (which you dismiss earlier, but honestly is the biggest impact of balance compared to things like BLOPS) * Sov tweaks * Capital re-balance (which is basically rebuilding them from the ground up and shouldn't be underestimated)
Furthermore in the last cycle we got a re-balance of BCs and Navy BCs.
Complaining that there is no ship re-balancing going on simply because of a single 6 week cycle, and one focused on Sov, is ignorant at best, and deceptive at worst.
Re-balancing is never done, for example AFs are in desperate need of love... again. The cycle continues.
I hope this addresses your concerns.
- Ash
Listen to Hydrostatic Podcast for all your Empyrean needs!
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Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
324
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Posted - 2015.11.08 18:31:00 -
[26] - Quote
I forgot: It is clear that a lot of the re-balances coming next all fit in together. They don't want the pieces to fit. It is clear that they have targeted Dec as a serious content patch.
Listen to Hydrostatic Podcast for all your Empyrean needs!
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Petra Hakaari
Empire Assault Corp Dead Terrorists
133
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Posted - 2015.11.09 18:43:29 -
[27] - Quote
Saede Riordan wrote:I for one think they should have a covops cloak, There's a reason why the nestor can't use it... battleships warping cloaked...
Ashterothi wrote:Six week release cadence means not everything will be touched each cycle. Why not?
Ashterothi wrote:Furthermore in the last cycle we got a re-balance of BCs and Navy BCs. So? Are these autoexcluding? nope, right?
Because tities .
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