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Are interdictors viable pvp ships outside of 0.0?

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Patryn Xar	Posted - 2007.01.22 16:36:00 - [1] I ask this knowing full well what their niche is - but take the ability to launch interdiction spheres away, and are they worthwhile? For example, would it be a ship you would use in low-sec or empire to pvp in? Just looking at the numbers, it looks like they are better than an interceptor. They have more mass, but they go almost as fast (within a few hundred m/s) depending on fitting. They also have worse scan resolution, and they have a much higher sig radius than an interceptor. But that is where the downsides end. The obvious advantage is that each of them has 8 high slots to fill with guns and missiles - and you no longer have the ROF penalty that you do with a destroyer - which allows you to at LEAST approach the dps of a cruiser (maybe out-DPS even). They each have far better shield, armor, and hull hp (about 2/3 of its class-specific cruiser). And as I said before, they go almost as fast as any interceptor - faster in some cases. The lock range is that of a cruiser (50-60km), and the lock time is much faster than a cruiser (though not quite as fast as a frigate or inty). To top everything off, interdictors (at least the eris and the heretic) cost about half of what their interceptor equivalent costs (The sabre is about the same cost, and the cormorant is a bit more expensive). Am I missing something? Is this one of those ships that look really good on paper but in reality are worthless?
LUGAL MOP'N'GLO	Posted - 2007.01.22 16:40:00 - [2] I'd say no. For the money an assault frigate would do a much better job in any pvp situation. ~~~~~~~~~ Caldari. It's so easy a Minmatar could do it.
LUGAL MOP'N'GLO	Posted - 2007.01.22 16:41:00 - [3] Originally by: Patryn Xar Am I missing something? Is this one of those ships that look really good on paper but in reality are worthless? Look at sig radius. ~~~~~~~~~ Caldari. It's so easy a Minmatar could do it.
Patryn Xar	Posted - 2007.01.22 16:47:00 - [4] Yeah, i mentioned in my original post that it has a higher sig radius - but if you're still going 4km/s it shouldn't matter. Even small missiles shouldn't do that much damage with an explosion velocity of 1,750k/s, and guns cant hit you when orbiting that fast. Or I could be completely wrong...
LUGAL MOP'N'GLO	Posted - 2007.01.22 16:53:00 - [5] Edited by: LUGAL MOP''N''GLO on 22/01/2007 16:49:50 Originally by: Patryn Xar Yeah, i mentioned in my original post that it has a higher sig radius - but if you're still going 4km/s it shouldn't matter. Even small missiles shouldn't do that much damage with an explosion velocity of 1,750k/s, and guns cant hit you when orbiting that fast. Or I could be completely wrong... No, no you're absolutely correct. I think my main point is in my first post. Put it this way, if you get webbed up in a dictor you're going to be dead alot faster than if you get webbed up in an AF. The dictor is a niche ship, even more so than a force recon. My guess would be that if you were Really going to solo in a dictor you'd be picking targets very wisely (Like frigs only). I doubt even the best dictor pilot could take on a decent cruiser pilot. However, a decent AF pilot can easily hurt the pride of any decent cruiser pilot. ~~~~~~~~~ Caldari. It's so easy a Minmatar could do it.
Still Hart Aurora Medical Systems	Posted - 2007.01.22 17:45:00 - [6] I say experiment with them. I have a sabre fit up for PvP sans bubble launcher and the dps is retarded. I'm not gonna give away my whole setup, but they are definately viable. The only thing is they're about 3-5x as expensive as an interceptor. For a ship that acts nearly the same, I'd generally go with the cheaper version.
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2007.01.22 18:06:00 - [7] Small guns can track you.
Mar vel Caldari H.Y.D.R.A. GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.01.22 18:48:00 - [8] Assuming that you can find a 1:1 matchup, which is pretty unlikely. So basically you can gank frigs, haulers, pods. Outside of 0.0 - not much us imo, as the niche is the bubble.
goodby4u Logistic Technologies Incorporated Free Trade Coalition	Posted - 2007.01.22 18:52:00 - [9] Well for the love of god dont engage on the gates in a flycatcher in 0.4 Other then that you CAN pvp in lowsec,but i think an interceptor would probably be better and cheaper. __________________________________________ Yes it is great being amarr.
Patryn Xar	Posted - 2007.01.22 18:56:00 - [10] Well, honestly the only ones i would consider using in lowsec or empire would be the Eris and the Heretic - both of which are about half-price of what their interceptor counterpart is. More utility, damage, tank, and almost the speed for half-price. And it looks like both (if not all) ships' setups are long-range, which means even if small guns COULD track it, you are probably far enough away to avoid getting hit (not to mention the 3500m/s transversal). Even if you COULD get hit you should be able to wtfpwn any frigate with small guns...i mean, that's the point of the ship class right? As for bigger ships with small guns, if they're hitting you hard enough to matter, you should easily be able to get away. Sure, if you get caught and webbed a few times, you're gone - but that's no different than any interceptor. Not that much different that an AF for that matter, although of course an AF would last a bit longer. With ANY ship, no matter the size, if you get blobbed you're gonna pop. The point is, it would seem like a dictor should be able to fill the role of BOTH interceptor AND assault frigate (speed + damage + decent tank) for half-price. So either 1) nobody has discovered the potential of these ships (other than for spheres); 2) People are too comfortable with their normal frig, cruiser, BC, or BS ship types to worry about a dictor; or 3) I'm really just reading too much into the ship stats when in reality they're just average. I'm sure it's probably #3, but if anyone out there is a die-hard dictor pilot I'd love to hear from you!
Marquis Dean Repo Industries	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:19:00 - [11] To be fair, they are still very effective in anti-frig operations. I fight all my PvP in hisec, and everyone's tactics are interceptor-heavy, and my Flycatcher is absolute murder on any interceptor. With 6 x standard launcher IIs, a mwd, 2 x web and an iStab. It is significantly slower than a ceptor, it won't catch one that is trying to get away, but if you warp into the middle of a fight where an interceptor is pinning someone down, you can lock them in about 2-3 seconds and if you can web them, they're screwed. Plus as the model is visually small, if the view is at all zoomed out, people won't see what you're flying and so won't know what to do for a few crucial seconds. ------ ------ Originally by: Crag Heyder I'm not talking FPS here, it's SPF.
Harotak Legion of Lost Souls Ivy League	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:21:00 - [12] Would be nice if they added a tier2 elite destroyer that lost the warp disrup probe ability and instead had assault ship resists.
Rod Blaine Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:53:00 - [13] I'd say no, with exceptio of the sabre, which would be a good intykiller anyway seeing how it's just as fast and has loads more firepower and better defense. Old blog Originally by: Vriezuh Naz: John is a realist
Nian Banks	Posted - 2007.01.23 02:44:00 - [14] The viability of a T2 Destroyer at this moment has nothing to do with wether it can kill all kinds of frigs t1 & t2 and even cruisers, its all to do with been called primary on the gate camp. Often people are afraid that the enemy will know they are there and will try to kill them first, simple as that! Beyond that with a properly equiped sabre your talking extremely high speeds with nasty anti frig long range artillery thats well outside webber range. So if your willing to risk getting poped and your corp friends don't mind you getting killed once in a while and needing a new interdictor then go right ahead, I am sure you will enjoy it, When not called primary that is... One last point to make, I do so hope they make a new tier2 tech1 destroyer and a tier2 tech2 of the tier2 tech1 destroyer thats only for combat. Let it exceed assault frigates damage and tank!
Celedris Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.01.23 03:55:00 - [15] Hrmmm.... Flycatcher as damp-tackler? 6x Standard Launchers 2x Utility/Salvager MWD 2x Phased Muon damps Warp Disruptor II Micro Cap Booster Inertial Stab
Ryysa North Face Force	Posted - 2007.01.23 06:13:00 - [16] Sabre.... convo Andreya ingame, he'll give you an hour long lecture why. Jamming & Logoffski
Tunajuice Convergent Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.01.23 06:19:00 - [17] Originally by: Marquis Dean Plus as the model is visually small, if the view is at all zoomed out, people won't see what you're flying and so won't know what to do for a few crucial seconds. lols who would not kill a ship because the model is small? You been fighting privateers again?
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2007.01.23 06:53:00 - [18] Originally by: Patryn Xar Well, honestly the only ones i would consider using in lowsec or empire would be the Eris and the Heretic - both of which are about half-price of what their interceptor counterpart is. More utility, damage, tank, and almost the speed for half-price. And it looks like both (if not all) ships' setups are long-range, which means even if small guns COULD track it, you are probably far enough away to avoid getting hit (not to mention the 3500m/s transversal). Even if you COULD get hit you should be able to wtfpwn any frigate with small guns...i mean, that's the point of the ship class right? As for bigger ships with small guns, if they're hitting you hard enough to matter, you should easily be able to get away. Sure, if you get caught and webbed a few times, you're gone - but that's no different than any interceptor. Not that much different that an AF for that matter, although of course an AF would last a bit longer. With ANY ship, no matter the size, if you get blobbed you're gonna pop. The point is, it would seem like a dictor should be able to fill the role of BOTH interceptor AND assault frigate (speed + damage + decent tank) for half-price. So either 1) nobody has discovered the potential of these ships (other than for spheres); 2) People are too comfortable with their normal frig, cruiser, BC, or BS ship types to worry about a dictor; or 3) I'm really just reading too much into the ship stats when in reality they're just average. I'm sure it's probably #3, but if anyone out there is a die-hard dictor pilot I'd love to hear from you! Do not engage tech I destroyers. they can track you, and dish out a huge amount of dps. The only 'dictor that is worth It's salt is the minnie one, and you have to use autocannons becuase of pg restrictions. I also would not attack a blaster harpy, as I have roasted several 'dictors that thought I was easy pickings. I have blown through a minnie dictor with a 400mm tugnsten plate and gotten the pod, while under fire from both the dictor and a 3 BC gate spawn. Really, 'dictors are gimped because of PG restrictions.
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2007.01.23 06:54:00 - [19] Originally by: Harotak Would be nice if they added a tier2 elite destroyer that lost the warp disrup probe ability and instead had assault ship resists. as long as the caldari one is a gunship.
Deva Blackfire Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.01.23 08:04:00 - [20] Sabre and flycatcher as anti-ceptor platforms (i prefer not to use em as tacklers against larger targets if possible - too easy to kill).
Andreya	Posted - 2007.01.23 13:32:00 - [21] WOOOO My favorite subject :D:D:D:D .. I strictly use a interdictor, with the odd inty here and there... I used to pirate in low sec all the time. I primarily use a Sabre, but use the flycatcher on occasion. With a sabre, because of its speed you take on almost any tech 1 cruiser or battlecruiser,,, and of course, any frigate of any shape or size. for larger ship hunting, a flycatcher or sabre with artilleries works beautifully.these are reffering to solo kills with my flycatcher, ive taken out non missile cruisers. with my sabre, i have taken out a brutix, countless cruisers, and have never even flinched to a tech 2 frigate of any sort. when using a dictor you just have to play smart, and be more careful than if you were in an inty. but you have the firepower to do so much more than an inty. against most ships, ei. all t2 frigs, caracals, stabbers, and other crap cruisers, you have just use brute force, lotsa autocannons sheild tank and just beat the hell outta them. against battlecruisers and other things like vexors/thorax/maller type ships, just fit a tracking disruptor. and then you have two options, artileries? or autos? both work. both are very risky.. with autos, if you dont get that orbit properly at 500m your gonna die very quickly. they will web you, you web them.. they still miss, every time. with arties, against missiles... get into your fastest orbit, they dont hurt at all.. if its something like a brutix, just stay out of nos range.. get caught by nos to any ship, your dead... go out of scram range, he runs. so its risky as sabres arent as mobile as a inty. with the flycatcher, same theory, tracking disruptors ftw, just watch out for missiles if your nav skills arent uber. when using the arty/missile setups. run from battlehsips (NOS) curse's (nos) drakes (tank too tuff, and missile eventually hurt)... and watch out for T2 projectile users (long falloff) and droneboats (just kill the donres then your laughing) as for autos on a sabre, they outdamage most cruisers. can break a battleships tank.. just takes a whlie.. like any othewr small ships. kill the drones, and start pounding away
Andreya	Posted - 2007.01.23 13:33:00 - [22] and yes, a combat t2 destroyer would be GREATLY appreciated... also. fix the bubble launcher refire rate as CCP broke it when kali came out, literally... and fix logoffskis in my bubbles!!!!
Nian Banks	Posted - 2007.01.24 06:17:00 - [23] Edited by: Nian Banks on 24/01/2007 06:16:04 Heres a 2nd option for a tier2 destroyer. Minmatar. The idea been a minor damage bonus but two good tanking bonuses. Due to only been able to fit one gang module and at tech2 a bonus for skirmish warfare link modules you need a greater bonus (4%) than a command ship that gives 3% per level, thats because the command ship is able to fit all three skirmish warfare link modules at once. You don't want one commans ship to do the entire fleet and have no need for the destroyers performing wing support. so three tech2 tier2 destroyers are greater than a tech2 tier1 command ship for gang assist. Ofcourse as you can only have one gang leader you would put the command ship there because it has three gang modules and gives the bonuses to everyone, where as the destroyer only allows for one module. Tier2 Destroyer Destroyer Skill Bonus: 5% bonus to Small Projectile Turret rate of fire and 5% bonus to all shield resistances per level 99.5% reduction in the CPU need of Warfare Link modules. Tier2 Tech2 Destroyer Destroyer Skill Bonus: 5% bonus to Small Projectile Turret rate of fire and 5% bonus to all shield resistances per level Wing Support Skill Bonus: 7.5% bonus to shield boosting per level and 4% bonus to effectiveness of Skirmish Warfare Links per level What do you think guys?
Litus Arowar Amarr Obsidian Asylum Pure.	Posted - 2007.01.24 08:20:00 - [24] your t2 variant of the destroyer and your t1 version of it are both higher damage than the ones currently in game hell, your tech 1 tier 2 version does more damage than a sabre right now... sabre gets range and tracking yes, but for raw damage your new destroyer is higher damage... what's the point of even proposing that? Albert Anastacia> Like they say, adapt or die. I adapted and now I get to Iwinbutton all over everyones face.
Nian Banks	Posted - 2007.01.24 10:03:00 - [25] Yes your correct, the damage is higher because of a rof however I did not deny that, however as this ship has no range bonus its going to be using AC's and it rightly should with two tank bonuses. Its in the thick of things, anyway the sabre is meant to be an artillery boat. So what do you suggest? a tracking bonus? Put in some input or stop complaining. Now if all you want to pick on is the turret bonus I assume you don't mind the rest of the ideas I put forward?
Donna Divine Gilded Goose Brokerage	Posted - 2007.01.24 11:56:00 - [26] Edited by: Donna Divine on 24/01/2007 11:52:42 I nearly always fit autos on my sabre. No problem with the range at all. It also tanks nicely for an interdictor btw, just not in the traditional way. Also, don;t the tech1 dictors get that -50% rof penalty that the t2 ones don't ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Gilded Goose Brokerages Trading to order.
Vathar Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.24 12:03:00 - [27] Careful, without manoeuvrability mods, ceptors fly fast, but don't handle as well ... can be tricky to orbit fast enough to dodge bullets ... But the heretic whorks quite well with beams and light missiles, I kinda like it that way ... Originally by: Radeberger If you plan to make your alliance combat based, recruit pvpers with mining alts rather than miners with pvp alts
Nian Banks	Posted - 2007.01.24 12:04:00 - [28] Thats fair, I have heard of players using the increased range to their advantage and fitting high dps low range ammo, its not a bad idea and probably works quite nicely yet the sabre probably was meant to be a sniping ship. I won't argue either way tho as its only my own opinion. Anyway your right on the -25% rof for the thrasher and perhaps a nerf to my idea would be valid, perhaps a -25% falloff?

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