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Riphlan Tor
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
0
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Posted - 2011.12.15 16:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
So, my Crow is now about 1300m/sec slower then it used to be. I can't figure out why.
Both fitting programs I use (EveHQ and EFT) say I should go about 5911 m/sec (mwd on) with my skills and implants and with the fit I have. But now I only go a little over 4600. It's as if the implant bonus is not being applied... or something. I'm baffled.
I can find no other info online, so I am posting here to see if perhaps someone else might be experiencing the same problem.
Thanks
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Korg Tronix
Heretic Army
20
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Posted - 2011.12.15 16:41:00 -
[2] - Quote
Riphlan Tor wrote:So, my Crow is now about 1300m/sec slower then it used to be. I can't figure out why.
Both fitting programs I use (EveHQ and EFT) say I should go about 5911 m/sec (mwd on) with my skills and implants and with the fit I have. But now I only go a little over 4600. It's as if the implant bonus is not being applied... or something. I'm baffled.
I checked a Stiletto, it works fine, the fitter numbers and in game performance are spot on.
I can find no other info online, so I am posting here to see if perhaps someone else might be experiencing the same problem.
Thanks
Javelin ammo loaded?
Evil: If I were creating the world I wouldn't mess about with butterflies and daffodils. I would have started with lasers, eight o'clock, Day One!
[zaps one of his minions accidentally, minion screams]
Evil: Sorry. -á |
vorneus
Hub2
11
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Posted - 2011.12.15 16:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Korg Tronix wrote:Riphlan Tor wrote:So, my Crow is now about 1300m/sec slower then it used to be. I can't figure out why.
Both fitting programs I use (EveHQ and EFT) say I should go about 5911 m/sec (mwd on) with my skills and implants and with the fit I have. But now I only go a little over 4600. It's as if the implant bonus is not being applied... or something. I'm baffled.
I checked a Stiletto, it works fine, the fitter numbers and in game performance are spot on.
I can find no other info online, so I am posting here to see if perhaps someone else might be experiencing the same problem.
Thanks Javelin ammo loaded?
Would also be my first guess. It's penalty is crippling, although I wouldn't expect it to be quite that much with only 3 launchers.
-Ed |
Riphlan Tor
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
0
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Posted - 2011.12.15 16:54:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ohhhh. Good catch.
Not Javelin, but Bloodclaw Precisions. I didn't realize they had a speed penalty. And of course, I didn't have them loaded in the fitter, hence the discrepancy.
Thanks guys! |
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
13
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Posted - 2011.12.16 01:25:00 -
[5] - Quote
Riphlan Tor wrote:Ohhhh. Good catch.
Not Javelin, but Bloodclaw Precisions. I didn't realize they had a speed penalty. And of course, I didn't have them loaded in the fitter, hence the discrepancy.
Thanks guys!
CCP hates Caldari missile ships
|
Berendas
Clandestine Vector
THE SPACE P0LICE
30
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Posted - 2011.12.16 01:54:00 -
[6] - Quote
Patri Andari wrote:Riphlan Tor wrote:Ohhhh. Good catch.
Not Javelin, but Bloodclaw Precisions. I didn't realize they had a speed penalty. And of course, I didn't have them loaded in the fitter, hence the discrepancy.
Thanks guys! CCP hates Caldari missile ships
*cough*DrakeTenguRaven*cough* |
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
13
|
Posted - 2011.12.16 02:16:00 -
[7] - Quote
Berendas wrote:Patri Andari wrote:Riphlan Tor wrote:Ohhhh. Good catch.
Not Javelin, but Bloodclaw Precisions. I didn't realize they had a speed penalty. And of course, I didn't have them loaded in the fitter, hence the discrepancy.
Thanks guys! CCP hates Caldari missile ships *cough*DrakeTenguRaven*cough*
Not sure what you mean by this, but my point is that CCP blatantly worships turret ships and has done nothing to make missile ships viable for PVP.
Drake is and has always been primarily a PVE ship. Its usefulness in PVP is not because of any interdiction by CCP but because the pklayerbase grew some balls and found a way to make it useful. This has caused CCP to openly discuss ways to nerf it.
Tengu is a great PVE ship. Full stop.
Raven is laughed at in most fleets.
T2 missiles still have all their ship penalties.
Not to mention there is no pirate ship that excels at missiles, so yeah. They hate Cadari missile ships.
|
Opertone
Signal 7
The Jagged Alliance
55
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Posted - 2011.12.16 08:55:00 -
[8] - Quote
Patri Andari wrote:
Not to mention there is no pirate ship that excels at missiles, so yeah. They hate Cadari missile ships.
Caldari is most numerous race (thanks to rabbit style). Guess how much they hate us as entire concept. But they have to deal with it.
No caldari don't have PvP boats and it is lack of hybrid platforms to blame. (we have noodle platforms) |
Lady Spank
GET OUT NASTY FACE
504
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Posted - 2011.12.16 11:43:00 -
[9] - Quote
Caldari have the most used PVP ship. The best tech III, falcons and plenty more. Stop being clueless thanks.
(a¦á_a¦â) ~ http://getoutnastyface.blogspot.com/ ~ (a¦á_a¦â) |
Luba Cibre
0
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Posted - 2011.12.16 11:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
Lady Spank wrote:Caldari have the most used PVP ship. The best tech III, falcons and plenty more. Stop being clueless thanks.
The drake is only the most used pvp ship, because of the freakin' low sp requirements.
But that doesn't make the drake any good at all. |
Vachir Khan
TriSeq Defence Group
107
|
Posted - 2011.12.16 11:52:00 -
[11] - Quote
Luba Cibre wrote:The drake is only the most used pvp ship, because of the freakin' low sp requirements.
But that doesn't make the drake any good at all.
Yes, lets forget about its EHP, good damage projection and the fact that in laggy situations high volley weapon systems are king. Those annoying facts don't matter at all.
Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
|
Opertone
Signal 7
The Jagged Alliance
55
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Posted - 2011.12.16 12:15:00 -
[12] - Quote
it goes back to long range, low dps rails. slow mo missiles. Competent pilot may warp off before they hit him.
no ability to tackle, tackle compromises shield tank.
We have no DPS, no solid tank, no tackle.
We have huge EM hole, ECM cloaky falcon, noob friendly low SP missile boats.
Concept is horrible. Our race has nothing of real value. Except PVE drake, golem and Tengu. Thrive rabbits. |
vorneus
Hub2
11
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Posted - 2011.12.16 13:03:00 -
[13] - Quote
Opertone wrote:it goes back to long range, low dps rails. slow mo missiles. Competent pilot may warp off before they hit him.
no ability to tackle, tackle compromises shield tank.
We have no DPS, no solid tank, no tackle.
We have huge EM hole, ECM cloaky falcon, noob friendly low SP missile boats.
Concept is horrible. Our race has nothing of real value. Except PVE drake, golem and Tengu. Thrive rabbits.
This is a completely moronic reply that makes no points of any value at all. Allow me to elaborate:
Opertone wrote:it goes back to long range, low dps rails. slow mo missiles. Competent pilot may warp off before they hit him.
Caldari aren't the only race with long range, low dps rails. Rail damage has also been given a blanket buff to damage in the recent patch, plus other enhancements (T2 ammo, fitting requirements) that make them a better weapon system.
Missiles are "slow" only in that they take time to travel to their target, whereas turret damage is instantly applied. You're conveniently forgetting, or purposefully ignoring, the advantages missiles can have over turrets (generally longer range, no falloff calculation, inability to "miss completely" thus always doing some damage when hitting, ability to completely select damage type, requiring no cap to fire). Yes, I am aware there are drawbacks to using missiles as well (explosion velocity and radius, T2 missile penalties, etc.) but for the most part (torps and cruises not included) missiles and turrets are nicely balanced against one another.
Your blanket statement about "competent pilot warping off before being hit" is worthless. A competent pilot can also avoid turret damage by staying out of range, or being too fast/small for turrets to track, along with being able to do many other things to avoid being killed (hence "competent pilot"). The point is a competent pilot should be able to do these things, otherwise there would be no skill involved in the game. It is not a weakness present only in missile boats.
Opertone wrote:no ability to tackle, tackle compromises shield tank.
This is almost too dumb to even bother replying to. You contradict yourself in the same sentence by saying that a Caldari ship has no ability to tackle, and then that tackle compromises shield tank. The latter statement is correct, and is not a bug nor evidence of CCP's hatred for Caldari. Compromising shield tank for tackle/ewar is part of the game, not specific to Caldari, and has its direct equivalents in armor tanking (compromising firepower/tracking/speed/etc. for tank).
Opertone wrote:We have huge EM hole, ECM cloaky falcon, noob friendly low SP missile boats.
In this sentence you seem to mix advantages and disadvantages together. The first part complains of an EM hole like it's something that cannot be fixed (EM shield hardeners much?) and again, either ignores or forgets the fact that every race has a major and minor resist hole - in T2 resists Amarr and Minmatar generally fare the best, but this statement holds true for T1 resists.
You then state "ECM cloaky falcon". Not sure why exactly, because it's a great ship that does not need any kind of boost as it's exceedingly powerful.
Then we have "noob friendly low SP missile boats". Er, how terrible..? I'm still not sure if you're complaining or saying what's good about Caldari. I would say it's a huge benefit, because the ships still scale with skills to be competitive with others (e.g. max skilled Drake vs. max skilled Cane) with the advantage that they're very accessible to lower SP players.
Opertone wrote:Concept is horrible. Our race has nothing of real value. Except PVE drake, golem and Tengu. Thrive rabbits.
This is just a mindless whine with no evidence to back it up. If you want to talk about flawed concepts I'll happily point you in the direction of a race that uses the shortest range weapon system requiring speed for hulls to get in range, which at the same time receive bonuses to active armour tanking, the rigs for which slow down the hull in question (hint: it isn't Caldari).
For the specific ship points, I'll just point out that the Drake is currently top of the list for most popular PvP ships (I've not got the link to this, could someone post it for our friend here?), the Tengu is a fantastic PvP ship, and no Marauder of any race is extensively used in general PvP due to inherent weaknesses (hull cost, low sensor strength).
Sorry for ranting, but your post had no thought whatsoever put into it and I felt like pointing that fact out to anyone willing to read all this.
-Ed |
Lady Spank
GET OUT NASTY FACE
507
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Posted - 2011.12.16 13:29:00 -
[14] - Quote
Caldari is obviously the race picked by idiots. Cry about your own ships being bad when they aren't and seemingly don't cross train anyway.
Podla nano drakes are stupidly effective, can tackle just fine and are not just for low sp pilots. I'll assume most people here don't actually have any PVP experience.
(a¦á_a¦â) ~ http://getoutnastyface.blogspot.com/ ~ (a¦á_a¦â) |
Kodama Ikari
GOOD FELLAS Inc.
2
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Posted - 2011.12.16 14:55:00 -
[15] - Quote
Lady Spank wrote:Podla nano drakes are stupidly effective, can tackle just fine and are not just for low sp pilots.
+1 |
Emperor Salazar
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
263
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Posted - 2011.12.16 15:08:00 -
[16] - Quote
Lady Spank wrote:I'll assume most people here don't actually have any PVP experience.
You mean theorycrafting in EFT doesn't qualify as PVP experience?????? |
Tarunik Raqalth'Qui
The Kairos Syndicate
Transmission Lost
8
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Posted - 2011.12.16 15:32:00 -
[17] - Quote
Lady Spank wrote:Caldari is obviously the race picked by idiots. Cry about your own ships being bad when they aren't and seemingly don't cross train anyway.
Podla nano drakes are stupidly effective, can tackle just fine and are not just for low sp pilots. I'll assume most people here don't actually have any PVP experience.
Heh.
Newsflash for those whining about tackle+tank: I have enough room for a point on my nanoCane and that has only 4 med slots to play with. The Drake has oh, 6? You guys can fit a full hardener set, prop, and a point and STILL have a med slot left over, and that's if you aren't dropping a hardener due to the Drake's resist bonus. |
Danny John-Peter
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
14
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Posted - 2011.12.16 16:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
Heavy Missile Drake:
Better damage projection
Better tank
Better damage beyond about 12km
When comparing to a shield cane which has
Improved Mobility
Better DPS at 5k
Lower Sig
Seems fair to me |
Zyress
Deaths Head Brigade
Gryphon League
8
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Posted - 2011.12.16 17:02:00 -
[19] - Quote
Berendas wrote:Patri Andari wrote:Riphlan Tor wrote:Ohhhh. Good catch.
Not Javelin, but Bloodclaw Precisions. I didn't realize they had a speed penalty. And of course, I didn't have them loaded in the fitter, hence the discrepancy.
Thanks guys! CCP hates Caldari missile ships *cough*DrakeTenguRaven*cough*
Raven? |
Ender Sai
Paladin Order
Fidelas Constans
19
|
Posted - 2011.12.19 08:34:00 -
[20] - Quote
I am just posting to get in with the vibe.
Caldari has some seriously cool boats.
But.....
Long range, poor dps rail platforms that are on the slowest ships in the game. Like what's up with that? It is stupid. Like shoot-yourself-in-the-head stupid. |
Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
142
|
Posted - 2011.12.19 10:50:00 -
[21] - Quote
Ender Sai wrote:I am just posting to get in with the vibe.
Caldari has some seriously cool boats.
But.....
Long range, poor dps rail platforms that are on the slowest ships in the game. Like what's up with that? It is stupid. Like shoot-yourself-in-the-head stupid.
Hooray for the Naga - doing rails RightGäó. |
Koen L
Galactic Defence Consortium
United Pod Service
6
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Posted - 2011.12.19 10:58:00 -
[22] - Quote
Patri Andari wrote:Riphlan Tor wrote:Ohhhh. Good catch.
Not Javelin, but Bloodclaw Precisions. I didn't realize they had a speed penalty. And of course, I didn't have them loaded in the fitter, hence the discrepancy.
Thanks guys! CCP hates Caldari missile ships
Confirming this. Look at the naga. Why caldari has to skill turrets now ?
GÖ½ When your ship gets blown to bits GÖ¬
GÖ½ And you lose your Faction fits GÖ¬
\Gÿ+/ Don't worry GÖ¬ GÖ½ GÖ¬ GÖ½
GÖ½ GÖ¬ GÖ½ GÖ¬ Be Happy \Gÿ+/ |
vorneus
Hub2
13
|
Posted - 2011.12.19 12:30:00 -
[23] - Quote
Koen L wrote:Patri Andari wrote:Riphlan Tor wrote:Ohhhh. Good catch.
Not Javelin, but Bloodclaw Precisions. I didn't realize they had a speed penalty. And of course, I didn't have them loaded in the fitter, hence the discrepancy.
Thanks guys! CCP hates Caldari missile ships Confirming this. Look at the naga. Why caldari has to skill turrets now ?
Caldari pilots don't "have" to skill turrets. They have never had to skill turrets if they didn't want to fly any of the (many) Caldari turret platforms.
There's just one extra one now. The good thing about it is that it actually works.
-Ed |
Koen L
Galactic Defence Consortium
United Pod Service
6
|
Posted - 2011.12.19 15:38:00 -
[24] - Quote
[/quote]
Confirming this. Look at the naga. Why caldari has to skill turrets now ?[/quote]
Caldari pilots don't "have" to skill turrets. They have never had to skill turrets if they didn't want to fly any of the (many) Caldari turret platforms.
There's just one extra one now. The good thing about it is that it actually works.
-Ed[/quote]
Ok, how you want fly the naga without skilling turrets ? I loved the naga on testsever with Torpedos. I miss that.
GÖ½ When your ship gets blown to bits GÖ¬
GÖ½ And you lose your Faction fits GÖ¬
\Gÿ+/ Don't worry GÖ¬ GÖ½ GÖ¬ GÖ½
GÖ½ GÖ¬ GÖ½ GÖ¬ Be Happy \Gÿ+/ |
Goose99
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
328
|
Posted - 2011.12.19 15:49:00 -
[25] - Quote
Luba Cibre wrote:Lady Spank wrote:Caldari have the most used PVP ship. The best tech III, falcons and plenty more. Stop being clueless thanks. The drake is only the most used pvp ship, because of the freakin' low sp requirements. But that doesn't make the drake any good at all.
According to CCP stats, drake is the ship that get popped the most in Eve.
...and cane is the ship doing the most popping. Winmatar wins! |
Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
142
|
Posted - 2011.12.19 17:10:00 -
[26] - Quote
Koen L wrote:Ok, how you want fly the naga without skilling turrets ? I loved the naga on testsever with Torpedos. I miss that.
Not this again. The torp Naga was a travesty. |
Aglais
Liberation Army
BricK sQuAD.
34
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Posted - 2011.12.19 17:42:00 -
[27] - Quote
Patri Andari wrote:Berendas wrote:Patri Andari wrote:Riphlan Tor wrote:Ohhhh. Good catch.
Not Javelin, but Bloodclaw Precisions. I didn't realize they had a speed penalty. And of course, I didn't have them loaded in the fitter, hence the discrepancy.
Thanks guys! CCP hates Caldari missile ships *cough*DrakeTenguRaven*cough* Not sure what you mean by this, but my point is that CCP blatantly worships turret ships and has done nothing to make missile ships viable for PVP. Drake is and has always been primarily a PVE ship. Its usefulness in PVP is not because of any interdiction by CCP but because the pklayerbase grew some balls and found a way to make it useful. This has caused CCP to openly discuss ways to nerf it. Tengu is a great PVE ship. Full stop. Raven is laughed at in most fleets. T2 missiles still have all their ship penalties. Not to mention there is no pirate ship that excels at missiles, so yeah. They hate Caldari missile ships.
Drake stopped being a pure PvE ship. It's a jack of all trades at this point.
To be honest some of the problems with Caldari missile ships is that they're hard as **** to fit. IE. Caracal. AML caracals are good to go really, and some of the gnarliest frig/destroyer killers out there. HML caracals will suffer from "can only attack at 100km or else will die in a horrible fire because it has no tank" syndrome. HAM caracals... I don't know, I've never managed to formulate a fit without loads and loads of grid mods that completely ruin the fit. Kestrel? Used to have a little more DPS than the Merlin, but the Merlin IMO is better because, like the Caracal, the Kestrel is papery thin. And also seems to suffer minor fitting issues. Hawk is borderline useless, and only sees action in the form of doing 2/10s really. Though arguably that's due to the misplaced shield boost bonus.
Drake and Tengu are exceptional, and see usage in both PvE and PvP.
Raven is slow, it's weapons move in slow motion, and it has problems applying DPS. I've also heard tales of lackluster buffer capabilities on it, outshone by... Almost everything else. For the faction whose special side-gimmick is missiles, I find it odd that the Raven is given less respect than the Typhoon.
Forgot to mention the Cerberus. Apparently, it's actually ok. Though there is something fundamentally wrong with sniping using missiles, and the Cerberus, like the Caracal, seems to be designed to have no tank. And that's dumb, because no other faction seems to have that pattern. |
Gorefacer
STRAG3S
NEM3SIS.
3
|
Posted - 2011.12.20 04:44:00 -
[28] - Quote
Without a lot of experience in other race ships I can't say definitively that the Drake is good or bad comparatively. However when I use the Drake I don't feel lacking in DPS tackle or tank for the most part or in danger or outclassed against other BCs.
When it first came out I had a great time with the torp Raven, but the only time I get to use it now is if I'm in a drunk **** it ~3man gang. I've always wanted to convince 3 or 4 others to roll my torp raven fit, each primary would get a TP a heavy neut and 1150 DPS on them with each Raven holding an OK ~105k EHP tank. Would only work in smaller close range fights most likely though.
Rails will be interesting to use with the Naga, but I wish blasters were more viable since I don't really enjoy sniping as much as close range fights where theres a bunch of warping off and cat and mouse going on blueballing me. From what I can tell the Naga folds quick when caught anywhere near close to anyone so I'd have to assume that blaster Nagas will be fairly short lived in most encounters. Someone correct me if Im wrong though please. |
Smabs
Higher Than Everest
BricK sQuAD.
8
|
Posted - 2011.12.20 05:59:00 -
[29] - Quote
Nagas have plenty of midslots. A non-awful blaster naga ought to have tank that's fairly similar to a shield-tanked hurricane. So they're not that fragile but definitely nowhere in the league of something like a drake. |
Gorefacer
STRAG3S
NEM3SIS.
3
|
Posted - 2011.12.21 01:51:00 -
[30] - Quote
Smabs wrote:Nagas have plenty of midslots. A non-awful blaster naga ought to have tank that's fairly similar to a shield-tanked hurricane. So they're not that fragile but definitely nowhere in the league of something like a drake.
Hmm OK thanks. I'm sure Ill try it out at some point. |
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