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Ibutho Inkosi
Irubo Kovu
212
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Posted - 2016.03.02 20:01:42 -
[31] - Quote
An unfortunate fact of inequity in the real world is, affluent nations get games like these. "Developing" nations do not. It's like affluent nations get Cadillacs. "Developing" nations get Cadillacs on blocks. It is the nature of economic disparity. Trying to solve economic disparity by some charity foundation in a video game will only work out to getting PLEX for your buddies, but the remainder of the "developing" countries populations will still be going without.
Anyone really interested in the fact their friends can't afford this sort of leisure activity due to economic imbalances is better off not playing any game, and working their lives away struggling for equity. It's the fact this struggle is now seen as futile or only pursued by suckers that the working population now lags further behind and out of the main economy than it has since the days of empires and kings.
The kind of EVE I want has so much to do with the self-contained, Euro-centric western civ model there isn't any room for those who don't have ten dollars to feed themselves being accommodated at all. That's the nature of a winners and losers social paradigm. When developing countries decided to emulate the leaders in this "game" of economics, they preordained their own fates, and the money-grabbers laughed as they stood by and watched...then grabbed all the money.
It's rather strange for us to try to discuss this in this venue. You might as well be asking for a charity back nine at the local country club. It ain't gonna happen. The whole point of the country club is to luxuriate in the perks of winning. In a sense I do sympathize with your friends. However, as I said, if they're in a place so strapped economically that the ups and downs of macro-economics takes food from their tables, they have better things to do than play this game...more pressing things.
It takes someone of affluence to even propose this issue in this venue in this way. Like the guy in Platoon said, "You have to be rich to talk like that."
If you think all this is unfair and inhumane...you have no business partaking in this perk of affluence. You should be out trying to effect a major shift in paradigm yourself...or it's just more "liberal" talk. Weep for the losers while you eat the peeled grapes.
As long as the tale of the hunt is told by the hunter, and not the lion, it will favor the hunter.
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2607
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Posted - 2016.03.03 01:18:35 -
[32] - Quote
Ibutho Inkosi wrote:... Trying to solve economic disparity by some charity foundation in a video game will only work out to getting PLEX for your buddies, ... "PLEX for good."
"The world needs dreamers and the world needs doers. But above all, the world needs dreamers who do." - Sarah Ban Breathnach
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
I will be voting for Xenuria because...
EVE is becoming shallow and childish; it will not satisfy either crowd.
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Nerokor
Machiavellian Empire Fidelas Constans
0
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Posted - 2016.03.03 03:19:30 -
[33] - Quote
So if these said people can't afford to pay for said eve subscription. Then how do they afford to buy a computer to play eve on. If they can't afford a $15 subscription and have to worry about paying for food instead, they shouldn't be worried about eve honestly. I like you idea OP but, it's just not realistic. |
Chopper Rollins
Lantean Empire
1262
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Posted - 2016.03.03 03:31:28 -
[34] - Quote
zluq zabaa wrote:A thing I would like everyone to consider is real-life economics..
*RECORD SCRATCH*
Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
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Rin Vocaloid2
DUST University Ivy League
4
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Posted - 2016.03.03 03:40:02 -
[35] - Quote
Or you could just... you know... donate PLEX directly yourself? If a player is rich enough to just hand out ISK and maybe PLEX like candy to help a fellow player in need, let them but I don't think we need to add any more features for that since we already have the tools to do just that. |
Jacques d'Orleans
The Scope Gallente Federation
2644
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Posted - 2016.03.03 04:39:44 -
[36] - Quote
zluq zabaa wrote: Hard work alone doesn't make people more wealthy, having a good head-start (money, education, country, social class) does.
Having a good head start, gives you a better chance to get wealthy, sure, but the lame excuse "i'm poor and i had no good head start" and the always popular " It's societies fault that i'm poor" becomes boring pretty much, specially when you made it yourself out of that environment.
If you're poor, you have to pull yourself out of the dirt, no knight in shiny armor will come to safe you, it's you and nobody else who can end your poverty! And no Plex from others will change that, it just sends the signal "Why changing anything myself, when others give me...", it's the social security system in a nutshell!
The beginning of the End
Skill injectors? Attempting to give a shyte: 0.5%
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Indahmawar Fazmarai
4832
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Posted - 2016.03.03 07:33:00 -
[37] - Quote
EVE is a luxury, EVE is cheap and EVE can be paid for by playing it.
The OP just set a new record in wackiness. Or trolling.
CCP Seagull: "EVE should be a universe where the infrastructure you build and fight over is as player driven and dynamic as the EVE market is now".
62% of players: "We're not interested. May we have Plan B, please?"
CCP Seagull: "What Plan B?"
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Mr Mieyli
Hedion University Amarr Empire
256
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Posted - 2016.03.03 08:18:49 -
[38] - Quote
On the point of collectivism, we have always existed as part of a society and hence as a collective you can't just choose to be involved or not. It is only relatively recently (50-90 years ago) that we started to believe we were all unique special snowflakes and individualism took off. Individualism can be blamed for most first world problems we see today in truth, big business and government does what it wants because there is no strong voice to tell them no. Another problem with individualism is that it becomes impossible to fix systemic problems when you blame individuals, just look at the mass shootings in the states. We have all seen in EvE the power there is in working together as a group and the reverse is also true; isolating yourself as an individual means you have very limited ability.
Individualism is still going strong (especially in the USA) but with the rise of the internet,and especially social media, more and more people are realising that we're all human. Sure we all have little differences that make us who we are but we have more in common than not. We all have the same drives and for the most part our decisions are only based on outside pressure and past experiences. A little more education on how the brain actually works would make a big change to how we see the world. (Extreme) Social injustice is something that really does have no reason to exist in our man-made world. I'd also like to point out that our world economy is capable of providing food, housing and healthcare for everyone already if we'd just make that our priority instead of aiming for 2% growth each year.
For many people they cant afford to play through no fault of their own (it's a lie that your success is your doing), and I'm sure that plenty already do unsub now and then when bills get too much. HOWEVER I see PLEX as the solution and it already exists so I don't know what more needs done.
-1 OP
A case for more AoE in EvE
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Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2551
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Posted - 2016.03.03 10:26:34 -
[39] - Quote
Bumblefck wrote:Lan Wang wrote:zluq zabaa wrote:Thanks mate, good shortening skills, although not totally accurate in this case. Anyway since you're probably rather rich in-game, maybe you could give a tiny amount once in a while. For 200% of the average amount you might get to even include the "FETID is recruiting" thingy as an advertisement. How bout that eh? im far from rich but ill happily give isk to people who refer possible recruits over to me I would like to refer myself to FETID, can I get a bonus?
ofcourse bumble, you get the bonus of associating with me
FETID now recruiting pvp pilots & corporations | lowsec pvp & piracy - Join FETID
Loyalist to Angel Cartel & Serpentis
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Max Fubarticus
The Scope Gallente Federation
92
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Posted - 2016.03.03 11:15:00 -
[40] - Quote
"Any ideas? Anyone likes to join?"
Yes. Spare everyone the "Social Justice Warrior" speech. Put on the big boy pants and earn your way through life.
No.
"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime"
Civil discourse is uniquely human. After all, when is the last time a pride of lions and a herd of water buffalo negotiated SOV over a watering hole? Never.
Someone either gets their ass kicked or eaten. At the end of the day someone holds SOV.
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Remiel Pollard
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
7546
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Posted - 2016.03.03 11:15:54 -
[41] - Quote
As someone that's been unable to afford my own subscription from time to time, I'm entirely against this idea. Let me tell you why.
The world is fair, by virtue of being unfair. What's that, I hear you ask, the world contradicts itself?
No, it doesn't, it gives you goals to strive towards and better yourself. EVE Online subscription fee is a goal; national financial stability is a goal; LIMITATIONS ARE GOALS, things to be overcome in order to achieve legitimate self-improvement. If you give a homeless guy money, how is he going to learn to earn his own? If the system is what's keeping him down, then giving him some money is little more than a bandaid. Your suggestion that we pay to support other people to play is a bandaid to problems that we cannot solve, and it's an unsustainable system as a result. The actual solutions to the problems are, in the case of legitimate systemic problems, systemic solutions, and in the case of individual problems, the solutions themselves are individual.
Now, I have another point as well. EVE Online is not a necessity. The human body has no need for it, our inalienable human rights do not cover access to it, and there isn't a single social welfare system or private charity on the face of the planet that will cover it. It is a luxury. Which again brings us back to what makes it a goal. If someone really wants to play it, but can't afford it, suddenly they have a goal, and a limitation to overcome. That is on them, and no one else.
As for the idiot above expatiating social relativistic propaganda, political opinions and commentary aren't welcome on these forums, thank you. And PLEX for good is not for political things either, Jenshae, but for non-partisan disasters only, like natural ones.
GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'.
Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥
- Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
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Remiel Pollard
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
7546
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Posted - 2016.03.03 11:19:46 -
[42] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Social Inequality? I could have sworn I typed https://forums.eveonline.com/ a second ago. But some how by the looks of this thread, I ended up at Tumblr....
FTFY.
GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'.
Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥
- Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
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Remiel Pollard
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
7546
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Posted - 2016.03.03 11:22:20 -
[43] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:...and R 800 for a maid to clean and do laundry two mornings a week.
The fact you could afford a maid automatically disqualifies you from complaining about the cost of living, sorry.
GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'.
Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥
- Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
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Beta Maoye
94
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Posted - 2016.03.03 11:49:25 -
[44] - Quote
While I don't think poor people should have to work 12 hours a day without any entertainment, EVE is just too expensive for them if they cannot afford the monthly subscription. There are many other choices available:- read a good book, play a basketball game, play other free online games, watch news from CNN, RT, Euronews, CCTV to know what is happening outside, even watch what Trump is talking about is interesting for me. Do what you can afford to do. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
2612
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Posted - 2016.03.03 12:21:11 -
[45] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:...and R 800 for a maid to clean and do laundry two mornings a week. The fact you could afford a maid automatically disqualifies you from complaining about the cost of living, sorry. Forum ate my post, so the salient points:
- Social responsibility - People with very little or no education - Sold TV, Hi-Fi, microwave and toaster at one point to ensure we paid our servant.
The one servant we had for many years and came to us with the clothes on his back and a pregnant wife had a house with eight rooms (he rented four), had a corner shop, electrician, plumbing and tree felling businesses when we left.
They become your dependants and you help them if you have them for the right reasons.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
I will be voting for Xenuria because...
EVE is becoming shallow and childish; it will not satisfy either crowd.
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2646
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Posted - 2016.03.03 13:53:25 -
[46] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Remiel Pollard wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:...and R 800 for a maid to clean and do laundry two mornings a week. The fact you could afford a maid automatically disqualifies you from complaining about the cost of living, sorry. Forum ate my post, so the salient points: - Social responsibility - People with very little or no education - Sold TV, Hi-Fi, microwave and toaster at one point to ensure we paid our servant. The one servant we had for many years and came to us with the clothes on his back and a pregnant wife had a house with eight rooms (he rented four), had a corner shop, electrician, plumbing and tree felling businesses when we left. They become your dependants and you help them if you have them for the right reasons.
Those people exist in first world country too and it does not mean a luxury product like EVE Online needs to have it's cost setup according to this. Remember, it's a luxury product. If you consider it to be essential, you have a much bigger problem than the price of the game. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
2612
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Posted - 2016.03.03 14:11:03 -
[47] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Those people exist in first world country too and it does not mean a luxury product like EVE Online needs to have it's cost setup according to this. Remember, it's a luxury product. If you consider it to be essential, you have a much bigger problem than the price of the game. Forget what ever you have latched onto in the original post.
We the players can help other players. Quietly and without embarrassing them.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
I will be voting for Xenuria because...
EVE is becoming shallow and childish; it will not satisfy either crowd.
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Jenn aSide
Shinigami Miners Test Alliance Please Ignore
13759
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Posted - 2016.03.03 15:09:51 -
[48] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:...and R 800 for a maid to clean and do laundry two mornings a week. The fact you could afford a maid automatically disqualifies you from complaining about the cost of living, sorry.
Now now Remi, lets not stop his ranting about nonsense, especially now that he's in full "white man's burden" mode.
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Remiel Pollard
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
7548
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Posted - 2016.03.03 15:21:21 -
[49] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Remiel Pollard wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:...and R 800 for a maid to clean and do laundry two mornings a week. The fact you could afford a maid automatically disqualifies you from complaining about the cost of living, sorry. - Social responsibility
One does not focus on social responsibility at the expense of personal responsibility. My social responsibility is fulfilled by my taxes, my job, the people I train to take over my job when I retire, and the various other contributions I may choose to make to society, such as things I might learn and/or discover and pass on to other academics. My personal responsibility is to prioritise my life in such a way that I can fulfill my own needs first, my own desires second, and my optional social contributions last.
The fact that you felt you had to sell some of your basic things like your television so you could afford your maid was your own failure to prioritise, or alternatively, your own choice of prioritisation. A maid is entirely optional, and it is not your responsibility in any writ of law, or by any social expectation, to employ other people when you cannot afford to employ them. You cannot use someone else's personal responsibility to earn their living as a shield for your own failure of personal responsibility to prioritise your own finances. That is entirely your own fault, and your own choice to hire a maid over having a television.
Don't try to play this social collectivist bullshit with me. I'm Australian, I'm pretty damned socialist already. The difference is, I understand the importance of a healthy balance between personal and social responsibility, just as I understand a healthy balance between socialist and capitalist economies. That healthy balance only occurs when the people living in and participating in that economy also understand their personal and social responsibilities in balance.
At the end of the day though, it is not nor will it ever be my responsibility to help someone else afford a video game. And there is little I find more detestable than someone who tries to shame me with the expectation that I should be responsible for someone else's own failures.
My original comment stands though. The fact you can afford a maid disqualifies you from complaining about the cost of living. That is not debatable. If you think it is, why don't you head on over to, say, Zimbabwe, or Somalia, and tell them all about how you're struggling so much you had to sell your tv so you could afford to keep a maid on your payroll.
GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'.
Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥
- Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
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Lulu Lunette
Savage Moon Society
295
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Posted - 2016.03.03 15:28:39 -
[50] - Quote
#feelthebern
@lunettelulu7
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2646
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Posted - 2016.03.03 15:33:45 -
[51] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Those people exist in first world country too and it does not mean a luxury product like EVE Online needs to have it's cost setup according to this. Remember, it's a luxury product. If you consider it to be essential, you have a much bigger problem than the price of the game. Forget what ever you have latched onto in the original post. We the players can help other players. Quietly and without embarrassing them.
Who the hell is embarrassed by the fact they can't afford a luxury like EVE online? Most poor people I had contact with were too proud to even accept a free meal without giving me back some of the change they had gotten out of begging during the day and you are telling me embarrassing someone for begging for a damn luxury is bad? |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2552
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Posted - 2016.03.03 15:39:27 -
[52] - Quote
43mil a day for a month and you got a plex, not hard to make that much really is it?
FETID now recruiting pvp pilots & corporations | lowsec pvp & piracy - Join FETID
Loyalist to Angel Cartel & Serpentis
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Remiel Pollard
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
7548
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Posted - 2016.03.03 15:44:35 -
[53] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:43mil a day for a month and you got a plex, not hard to make that much really is it?
Yeah but my maid costs so much that I had to sell my DED ship to afford her.
GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'.
Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥
- Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
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Jenn aSide
Shinigami Miners Test Alliance Please Ignore
13759
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Posted - 2016.03.03 15:51:56 -
[54] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:43mil a day for a month and you got a plex, not hard to make that much really is it?
There are only 1410 minutes in a standard EVE day (23.5 hours). How dare you suggest people spend 43 minutes flying AFKing an ishtar and killing rats or doing TWO lvl 4 missions in high sec in that same time span in exchange for the other 1367 minutes!?! Lan Wang is heartless to space-poors!
I mean really, the obvious solution to the tragic injustice of people who can't afford 50 cents (U.S.) per day for frivilous entertainment (and yet by some miracle have a computer and internet connection) is handouts. Handouts do so well in real life, why not in EVE?
p.s. F--- your sarcasm meters if they just exploded, I meant to do that.
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2620
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Posted - 2016.03.06 04:12:57 -
[55] - Quote
I pity whom ever is around you guys if your bubbles ever burst.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
I will be voting for Xenuria because...
EVE is becoming shallow and childish; it will not satisfy either crowd.
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Celthric Kanerian
Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation
695
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Posted - 2016.03.06 09:20:13 -
[56] - Quote
In my corp we got a guy from Greece who has a hard time paying for game-time, so what we did was that we gave him ships and ressources so he can grind isk for PLEX. |
Payne Dakara
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.03.07 16:17:52 -
[57] - Quote
Quote:One of the most common posts in the recent downtime-threads was: "I payed, so I want it to work right naooo (+ include random rant here)". I found this, while partly understandable, an extremely unfriendly behaviour towards the people who work for CCP. It's a sad reality of the service sector that people who pay some kind of money, as little as it might be, suddenly feel as if - for once in their lifetime - they're little kings and queens and have the right to treat others like their subordinates. I never quite decided weather I find this more funny, as in embarrassing for the people who behave this way or plain bad, because it can not feel good to hear that too often (and not even being allowed to smack back, because it is your job to deal with assholes).
Why not CCP created a perfect game for people to give grief to each other, one that thrives on peoples grief what is the problem if their own subscribers return a little bit of that grief to CCP?
Quote: because it can not feel good to hear that too often (and not even being allowed to smack back, because it is your job to deal with assholes)
Try smacking back when your ganked in the game nope you can't beating and ******* are non returnable events. :D |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2651
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Posted - 2016.03.07 16:31:28 -
[58] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:I pity whom ever is around you guys if your bubbles ever burst.
What bubble? |
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
1071
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Posted - 2016.03.07 16:55:35 -
[59] - Quote
Socialism is for pussies. Man the **** up.
Not today spaghetti.
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zluq zabaa
Inhumanum Legionis AXIOS.
7
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Posted - 2016.05.27 12:22:40 -
[60] - Quote
If Socialism is for pussies: - it's where I want to be - is capitalism for dicks?
If by "man up" in this context you mean that being a man means - to learn accept getting ****** over - to not use strenght to help yourself and others - to only to beat down on the weak, not resist the strong - striving for the quietness in injustice rather than for risk and adventure in liberation Well... What a pitiful, cowardly, servile existence you desire. Poor you.
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