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NEONOVUS
Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us
990
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Posted - 2016.03.22 23:56:49 -
[31] - Quote
Dani Gallar wrote:Killwitch wrote:Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Long answer: Hell no, I don't want to discuss that
You post in a forum because you DONT want to discuss something? I think it's more about this discussion is old and the idea that F2P EVE have been discussed over and over ... if this game where to become F2P the entire core concept would have to change first and then EVE would die horribly. I also think the main reason why one does not want an MMO to become F2P is that it draws the F2P-crowd which means LOADS of entitled kids who demands the bar to be lowered and in a game that thrives on it's difficulty it would obviously be a very bad thing. Defenitely this. I've gotten a number of bans for pointing out that people are crap and doing an F2P wrong down to the very basic controls, in as civil as we will discuss here. Not violating any of the rules, and multiple times been cited for violating profanity by using different words. With about as you expect no profanity intended or other issues.
Meanwhile, half the fun in EVE is using Mat in a cloaked ship in the drone regions and seeing what happens.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mat_(Russian_profanity)
Seriously, hijinks will be had.
The real problem is that F2P are supposed to be funded by microtransactions and arduous grind. What is the grind in EVE that would account for killing 100 million bears for 12 asses? We don't have that, we have an economy superior to several real countries.
Do we tell them get gud scrub? Well, uh Hells ******* yes? Welcome to die scrub, harden the **** up and come out of the station. Also the appropriate mating call to summon hordes of 1400mm slavoes in Jita. Please note, copulation with 1400mm shells has been found by D.E.D. and the SOE to be inimical to the health of the participating capsuleer, and notable improvements in the health of surrounding ones. |
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
1292
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Posted - 2016.03.23 01:35:09 -
[32] - Quote
I do play Eve, its been F2P since 2008, and so I dont understand the question, even a little bit.
internet spaceships
are serious business sir.
and don't forget it
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Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
97
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Posted - 2016.03.23 06:02:30 -
[33] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote: /thread
A signature :o
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Hello Meza
Applied Anarchy ChaosTheory.
4
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Posted - 2016.03.23 07:05:01 -
[34] - Quote
Killwitch wrote:I guess I should have also stated what I thought was the obvious :P :
You could limit the skills these accounts can train, just like trial accounts work currently.
Them putting up all sorts of orders in the market etc could be an issue, I guess you could again address that by not allowing these accounts to make advanced orders and just insta-sell/insta-buy?
If you want to just "enjoy Eve" with a "low skill character" as you put it in the OP, you can just log into your 180m SP char and pretend to only be able to fly rookie ships.
Or is the having to pay for that bit the issue? That isn't a design problem. |
Hello Meza
Applied Anarchy ChaosTheory.
4
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Posted - 2016.03.23 07:07:40 -
[35] - Quote
Aiwha wrote:I could make SO MANY PI alts. SO MANY CYNO ALTS! A cyno in literally every system I ever need in EVE!
Yeah. Lets do this. I want cynos everywhere.
I actually wouldn't mind a cyno in every system because that particular restriction really annoys me but if everyone did that, it would probably break the game. |
xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers EVEolution.
440
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Posted - 2016.03.23 08:50:30 -
[36] - Quote
Killwitch wrote:Like a lot of other people, I play Eve on and off, and usually lurk in the forums in between.
I know I would definitely keep the game installed and login If I had a permanent low skill pilot for fun activities.
I assume that would create problems with botters etc, guess you could limit that by restricting the amount of ISK the character can send to other players?
The 3 mil SP is of course just a number, could be anything.
you've not lurked enough around here to understand that this F2P shite has been raised before.
you want a low skilled char to play around with,,, sure it will somehow keep you logged in and playing ??????
here's a crazy idea,, make one,, you've 3 char slots.
oh you want a free alt,, or many free alts. No!
No now!
No Tomorrow!
No always and forever! |
Sustrai Aditua
Intandofisa
27
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Posted - 2016.03.23 09:01:10 -
[37] - Quote
Free to play EVE would purely suck. The chronically unemployed or the "deserving" among us should find another game and badger them about money...or lack thereof. I think this fine establishment deters a certain element other games have to deal with by not totally becoming something mommy can carry with her VISA card for her ten year old computer game hero.
Even the subject line of this thread makes me nauseous. |
Conrad Makbure
Trident Expedition
95
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Posted - 2016.03.23 09:22:00 -
[38] - Quote
Probably not that bad an idea, hold them to trial account rules though. |
Sequester Risalo
Semiki Minerals and Missiles Company Ltd.
191
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Posted - 2016.03.23 09:54:49 -
[39] - Quote
Yes, it would. |
Memphis Baas
1366
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Posted - 2016.03.23 10:13:54 -
[40] - Quote
Conrad Makbure wrote:Probably not that bad an idea, hold them to trial account rules though.
Trial account rules: - most of the "advanced" skills cannot be trained - you can only have 1 of your "army of alts" logged in (on each computer)
However, whether we like or dislike the idea, I believe from CCP's point of view OP is asking for more server load (more characters logging in) with no extra income to CCP (it's all F2P). So I believe they have no incentive to implement this.
Personally, I'm against the concept of F2P, because "F2P" just means "you pay a lot more via microtransactions to unlock things to make the game playable" and I hate being nickel-and-dimed. The rest of the playerbase hates microtransactions with a passion, so, OP, your idea is going nowhere fast. |
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Indahmawar Fazmarai
4950
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Posted - 2016.03.23 14:31:47 -
[41] - Quote
Killwitch wrote:Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Long answer: Hell no, I don't want to discuss that
You post in a forum because you DONT want to discuss something?
See, I was the first to bring to the forums the risk of CCP considering or even making EVE ready for F2P. I was also the first to hint at how could be implemented as a "extended trial", with trial restrictions in place (or some more), no skilling past the first 30 days and ability to use skill injectors.
So it's not about EVE stop being a subscription game, but adding F2P as a way to play it, and adapt EVE to a model based on monetizing acitvity versus the current model of monetizing access.
Adding F2P would call in the people filtered out by the subscription model. How many people is that, and who are they, is the key of the move.
If they're the usual F2P crowd, their numbers would overwhelm and destroy the new player resources provided by players. If they are too few people, F2P will not sustain itself.
And no matter who comes to EVE with F2P, veterans will be alienated.
CCP Seagull: "EVE should be a universe where the infrastructure you build and fight over is as player driven and dynamic as the EVE market is now".
62% of players: "We're not interested. May we have Plan B, please?"
CCP Seagull: "What Plan B?"
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Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
13815
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Posted - 2016.03.23 14:56:36 -
[42] - Quote
There is simply nothing good about 'free to play' to me. Companies who make f2p games love it because it makes them money. But it's the how of it all that sucks.
In a F2P game most people are free riders (or mostly free except for the odd impulse purchase) who do little or nothing for the game's community other than make any kind of local/global chat a cess pit. The money is made from abusing the few "whales" willing and capable (or sick enough) to pump outrageous amounts of real money into the game. It's borderline abusive, it's taking advantage of weak willed gamers the same way that intentionally planting a liquor store next to an AA meeting house would be.
"Pay for access only" games are much less immoral with regards to their relationship with their players. It's one of the things I loved about CCP all these years, with the exceptions of the greed is good fiasco (and more recently, skill trading), they seemed to be the more 'fair trade/ you get a good game, we get to make a decent living but we won't gouge you' type in character, as opposed to the 'squeeze every bit of money out of you that we can before we discard you and shut down all the servers of the game you like' character of other game companies I've had the displeasure of experiencing in my 23 years of this form of gaming.
Players that advocate EVE going more f2p to 'keep up with the times' are imo just responding to a kind of anxiety (better known as 'EVE is dying"). Anxiety caused by the idea that EVE (with it's outdated payment model) will die, thus taking with it all the time and money they 'invested' into it. That fear/desperation leads them to think that something that could (in theory at least) bring more players to the game and more money to CCP would prevent the dying, without considering that the same thing could be responsible for and even accelerate the actual death of the game (by pushing away the loyal customers who play the game because it's not f2p, while at the same time failing to attract enough f2p 'whales' to compensate). |
Pandora Carrollon
Kingsman Tailors
123
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Posted - 2016.03.23 15:31:39 -
[43] - Quote
You could do F2P with 1 character (no alts), no skill training at all just basic skills, and make everything ala Carte pay for improvement. You want that Level 5 skill, it will cost you $X amount of money. Pure money based account. It could be done, but would it be worth it? Likely not.
Be Positive GÇó Change yourself first, New Eden will come later GÇó EVE is Awesome GÇó CCP isn't the enemy GÇó Players are people too GÇó Where're the clothing blueprints GÇó Yeah, I'm still learning this game
-- Pandora's Rules to EVE by
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Agondray
Avenger Mercenaries VOID Intergalactic Forces
326
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Posted - 2016.03.23 17:00:40 -
[44] - Quote
they could introduce a account limit since there are people basicly paying for free with 60+ accounts all because others want quick cash and don't want to grind for it
"Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mind." -Dr. Smith
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DaReaper
Net 7
2816
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Posted - 2016.03.23 18:20:39 -
[45] - Quote
F2P eve would be bad for it. It should never go F2P. If they needed to do that, i would rather they kill eve and start over in an EVE 2 that is better. But i believe we are about to be in a period of stablitly followed by rebound in subscription numbers. So eve will be fine and doens;t nee dot be F2P ever
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
Yes i am optimistic about eve.. i'm giving it till dec 31st 2016 before i doom n gloom
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Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
11384
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Posted - 2016.03.23 18:38:26 -
[46] - Quote
Threads by Killwitch are, on the basis of this one, a bad thing.
Got a HoleySheet1 corpse? I'll buy it for 200m!
Bumble's Space Log
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Killwitch
Dissident Aggressors Mordus Angels
4
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Posted - 2016.03.23 22:24:10 -
[47] - Quote
Bumblefck wrote:Threads by Killwitch are, on the basis of this one, a bad thing.
I guess you ran out of threads to throw smart-ass replies for internet likes and attention, so here you go, I filed a complaint about you with the devs ;)
To all those who made the effort to give an insightful response, thanks. I guess some things like cyno alts could be too much of an issue. Others, to me at least, not so much. From my experience, restrictive F2P models dont usually retain players, they either convert them to paying customers or just lose them. When I made the thread I mostly had in mind the people who play EVE on and off (such as myself), it could make us feel more involved if we could fool around or login more often.
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Sustrai Aditua
Intandofisa
28
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Posted - 2016.03.23 22:26:23 -
[48] - Quote
Killwitch wrote:Bumblefck wrote:Threads by Killwitch are, on the basis of this one, a bad thing. I guess you ran out of threads to throw smart-ass replies for internet likes and attention, so here you go, I filed a complaint about you with the devs ;) To all those who made the effort to give an insightful response, thanks. I guess some things like cyno alts could be too much of an issue. Others, to me at least, not so much. From my experience, restrictive F2P models dont usually retain players, they either convert them to paying customers or just lose them. When I made the thread I mostly had in mind the people who play EVE on and off (such as myself), it could make us feel more involved if we could fool around or login more often. Go ahead and file a complaint about me, too. I agree with Bumblefck rarely, but in this case, whole-heartedly. Like I said earlier, even the subject line of this thread makes me nauseous to read. Or, did you read my first response at all?
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DaReaper
Net 7
2816
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Posted - 2016.03.23 22:43:21 -
[49] - Quote
i will say this, a limited SP char that had perma death, or eve on hard mode, might be fun.but no to f2p
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
Yes i am optimistic about eve.. i'm giving it till dec 31st 2016 before i doom n gloom
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Indahmawar Fazmarai
4951
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Posted - 2016.03.23 22:55:38 -
[50] - Quote
Killwitch wrote:Bumblefck wrote:Threads by Killwitch are, on the basis of this one, a bad thing. I guess you ran out of threads to throw smart-ass replies for internet likes and attention, so here you go, I filed a complaint about you with the devs ;) To all those who made the effort to give an insightful response, thanks. I guess some things like cyno alts could be too much of an issue. Others, to me at least, not so much. From my experience, restrictive F2P models dont usually retain players, they either convert them to paying customers or just lose them. When I made the thread I mostly had in mind the people who play EVE on and off (such as myself), it could make us feel more involved if we could fool around or login more often.
That could be resolved with time vouchers.
Buy a voucher for 30 days for 24 USD/EUR. One day of the voucher is spent each time you log in and then you can log in freely (without spending more days) for the next 24 hours. Once the 24 hours pass, you will need to spend another day whenever you log in again.
Vouchers are non refundable and they are deactivated when you add 30 days via subscription or PLEX.
And that's all. |
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Epic Name
The Lost. SpaceMonkey's Alliance
149
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Posted - 2016.03.24 01:09:09 -
[51] - Quote
This would make some people will cry |
ISD Buldath
ISD STAR
349
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Posted - 2016.03.24 06:52:59 -
[52] - Quote
Quote: 5. Trolling is prohibited.
Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive, and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.
I have removed the offending content, and those Quoting it.
~ISD Buldath
Commander
Support, Training and Resources Division
Interstellar Services Department
I do not respond to EVE-Mails regarding forum moderation.
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Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders
4334
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Posted - 2016.03.24 08:02:24 -
[53] - Quote
With skill extractors, EVE is already F2P if you forfait character SP progression.
You just have to first accumulate 5M SP on an account.
That's roughly 3 months of training, which with the buddy system and the usual new player promotions can cost you close to nothing in RL cash.
Then, you just extract all your SP over 5M, sell it, buy PLEX, fund your account. You may have to add 1-2 hundred mil ISK per month but that's very easy to make.
The only real difference with the OP's proposal is that currently CCP continues to make money (PLEX sales), which is better for everybody imho.
Make space glamorous!
Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
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Indahmawar Fazmarai
4951
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Posted - 2016.03.24 14:51:23 -
[54] - Quote
ISD Buldath wrote:Quote: 5. Trolling is prohibited.
Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive, and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote. I have removed the offending content, and those Quoting it.
You deleted a bit too much, since my post suggesting to use time vouchers for players who play EVE in a discontinuous way (as an alternative to F2P) was not trolling.
Just for the record, I suggested to sell 30 days time vouchers for 24 USD/EUR. A day from the voucher would be spent when login in and would allow to log in for free (not spending more days from the voucher) for 24 hours, after which any further login (or staying logged in) would spend another day from the voucher. This way a player could pay for the time as he uses it, rather than pay 30 days in advance and be stuck with spending them, playing or not playing. |
DaReaper
Net 7
2817
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Posted - 2016.03.24 15:54:03 -
[55] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:With skill extractors, EVE is already F2P if you forfait character SP progression.
You just have to first accumulate 5M SP on an account.
That's roughly 3 months of training, which with the buddy system and the usual new player promotions can cost you close to nothing in RL cash.
Then, you just extract all your SP over 5M, sell it, buy PLEX, fund your account. You may have to add 1-2 hundred mil ISK per month but that's very easy to make.
The only real difference with the OP's proposal is that currently CCP continues to make money (PLEX sales), which is better for everybody imho.
No, not really. The skill injectors don;t make eve free to play, that gives you an option to get things done a we bit faster. But as skill points in essence don;t mean jack **** anyway, its not a huge deal. And the Fact that eve allowed legal charictor training form nearly day one means its not free to play, or play to win, or whatever bull crap you want to label it as. The skill injectors could be seen as the start of the path towards F2P, or just as a means to supplement eve income.
The ops propsole is not the same as what you are suggesting by a long shot. but think what you will, you are just incorrect
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
Yes i am optimistic about eve.. i'm giving it till dec 31st 2016 before i doom n gloom
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Iain Cariaba
2837
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Posted - 2016.03.24 16:09:54 -
[56] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:F2P until 3M SP? I'm sure any number of CODE people will be along shortly to voice their support for this gankers wet dream. Mr Epeen I certainly wouldn't use this to train 10 catalyst alts and go on a ganking spree. Honestly, I wouldn't.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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sci0gon
Kaira Innovations Superior Eve Engineering
34
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Posted - 2016.03.24 17:02:41 -
[57] - Quote
Killwitch wrote:I assume that would create problems with botters etc, guess you could limit that by restricting the amount of ISK the character can send to other players?
I just want to point out that it would invite more isk sellers to the game and even if the amount of isk for those characters had limits set on how much they could transfer they could still bypass that with other means.
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Dani Gallar
University of Caille Gallente Federation
7
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Posted - 2016.03.24 18:52:46 -
[58] - Quote
Killwitch wrote:I assume that would create problems with botters etc, guess you could limit that by restricting the amount of ISK the character can send to other players?
One huge problem with trying to create artificial barriers in EVE is that the player base have shown to be quite 'creative' before and it's to be expected in a game where activities/behaviour that would never be tolerated in other games are not only tolerated but seen as central to the game's atmosphere.
If one where to allow F2P under certain 'arbitrary conditions' I can almost guarantee that we would see a destructive form of cat & mouse game between the Dev's and the players that could be interesting but is not in the interest of either.
EVE:s main 'thing' compared to other MMO:s is that almost anything goes and that the economy is completely player driven and none of these factors would be possible in a F2P game ... out of all reasons to not go F2P I would say these factors are the most important. |
Ivanpaneriai
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
7
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Posted - 2016.03.24 19:29:28 -
[59] - Quote
Stupid idea. Just close it. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
14877
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Posted - 2016.03.24 19:31:32 -
[60] - Quote
ISD Buldath wrote:Quote: 5. Trolling is prohibited.
Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive, and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote. I have removed the offending content, and those Quoting it. ehh the op's still there.
Better the Devil you know.
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