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The Size of Mining Crystals

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Jon Greyburst PILGRIMS The Serenity Initiative 4	Posted - 2016.04.07 13:10:44 - [1] - Quote Hey Everyone, I'm not sure if this is a glitch or the way things are supposed to be for some reason (I'm not a miner and rarely partake), but I noticed that each mining crystal take up 6 m3 of space in the cargo hold. This seems a bit excessive to me and perhaps something that should be reduced. When I first noticed it I assumed that was the way things should be, though I couldn't imagine a gameplay reason for why this was. then I had an actual look at the strip miners themselves and discovered that they only take up 5 m3 of space. This seems fairly absurd to me. This is the first case I've noticed where the ammo for a module is larger than the module itself. Feedback? I would particularly like to know why this is the case if it isn't an oversight.
Iain Cariaba 2896	Posted - 2016.04.07 13:15:20 - [2] - Quote This is not a bug. It is quite common in EvE for things to have larger capacities than they have volume. EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid. I couldn't have said it better. Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
Jon Greyburst PILGRIMS The Serenity Initiative 4	Posted - 2016.04.07 13:47:34 - [3] - Quote Iain Cariaba wrote: This is not a bug. It is quite common in EvE for things to have larger capacities than they have volume. Could you name another module who's ammo is larger than the module itself?
Iain Cariaba 2896	Posted - 2016.04.07 14:42:08 - [4] - Quote Jon Greyburst wrote: Iain Cariaba wrote: This is not a bug. It is quite common in EvE for things to have larger capacities than they have volume. Could you name another module who's ammo is larger than the module itself? Does it really matter? So what if the crystal is larger than the mining beam. I mined for five years before I got sick of it. Knowing that the mining crystals are larger than the mining lasers didn't matter then, and it doesn't matter now. Perhaps you should post an actual suggestion or idea here. All I see is what's called a rant thread about the disparity in size between the sizes of mining crystals and mining lasers. As I'm sure you've been told numerous times in your life, size really doesn't matter. EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid. I couldn't have said it better. Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
Jon Greyburst PILGRIMS The Serenity Initiative 4	Posted - 2016.04.07 15:19:56 - [5] - Quote Iain Cariaba wrote: Jon Greyburst wrote: Iain Cariaba wrote: This is not a bug. It is quite common in EvE for things to have larger capacities than they have volume. Could you name another module who's ammo is larger than the module itself? Does it really matter? So what if the crystal is larger than the mining beam. I mined for five years before I got sick of it. Knowing that the mining crystals are larger than the mining lasers didn't matter then, and it doesn't matter now. Perhaps you should post an actual suggestion or idea here. All I see is what's called a rant thread about the disparity in size between the sizes of mining crystals and mining lasers. As I'm sure you've been told numerous times in your life, size really doesn't matter. Perhaps if you don't care about mining you should consider leaving the thread to the people it does matter to? As far as your suggestion that this was a rant thread, if you read carefully rather than looking through threads for people to criticize to enhance your own sense of superiority you might have noticed that I suggested that perhaps the crystal size should be reduced. This would allow for a greater number to be carried (since I seem to have to spell that out for you). Any other 'constructive' points you would like to make besides "some things in the game are known to carry bigger things" (but not any ammo for modules) and "who cares about crystals, I hate mining, and since I hate mining I'm going to be a troll"?
Frostys Virpio KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 2725	Posted - 2016.04.07 15:32:27 - [6] - Quote Jon Greyburst wrote: Iain Cariaba wrote: Jon Greyburst wrote: Iain Cariaba wrote: This is not a bug. It is quite common in EvE for things to have larger capacities than they have volume. Could you name another module who's ammo is larger than the module itself? Does it really matter? So what if the crystal is larger than the mining beam. I mined for five years before I got sick of it. Knowing that the mining crystals are larger than the mining lasers didn't matter then, and it doesn't matter now. Perhaps you should post an actual suggestion or idea here. All I see is what's called a rant thread about the disparity in size between the sizes of mining crystals and mining lasers. As I'm sure you've been told numerous times in your life, size really doesn't matter. Perhaps if you don't care about mining you should consider leaving the thread to the people it does matter to? As far as your suggestion that this was a rant thread, if you read carefully rather than looking through threads for people to criticize to enhance your own sense of superiority you might have noticed that I suggested that perhaps the crystal size should be reduced. This would allow for a greater number to be carried (since I seem to have to spell that out for you). Any other 'constructive' points you would like to make besides "some things in the game are known to carry bigger things" (but not any ammo for modules) and "who cares about crystals, I hate mining, and since I hate mining I'm going to be a troll"? What if the crystal didn't fit inside the module but was just attacked to it? Would you be happy now?
Jon Greyburst PILGRIMS The Serenity Initiative 4	Posted - 2016.04.07 15:47:35 - [7] - Quote Actually that's an explanation I would find more acceptable. Here's my main concern regarding this: the crystals for the largest beam weapons in the game take up 1 m3 of volume when compared to their equivalent module which takes up 4,000 m3 of volume. I understand that this may be a bit like apples and oranges but then when you talk about a mining crystal that goes in a module only 5 m3 being 6 times the size of that crystal the disparity is still a bit extreme. My question is simply "why is this the case?", and if there is no legitimate reason wouldn't it make more sense to bring these crystals in line with other ammo in the game in terms of size. I am not suggesting that a strip miner should be able to hold more than one crystal any more than a beam laser should be able to hold more than one crystal. But in terms of transport this seems to take up an unnecessary amount of space.
Serendipity Lost Repo Industries 1918	Posted - 2016.04.07 16:10:44 - [8] - Quote You guys are just plain silly. Have you ever handled a mining crystal personally? I don't mean giving a command from your pod, I mean actually going down to the cargo bay and getting all covered in dust and grime. A couple of things you elitist snobs that never leave your pods obviously didn't know. 1 - Mining crystals are fragile - There is a lot of bubble wrap involved, and the inertial dampeners to keep them from breaking every time you go into and out of warp don't use space magic - those things are big. 2 - pod pilots demanded the quick swap feature so they could just swap on the fly and do it now. The quick change assembly takes up room too. Bubble wrap + inertial dampeners + quick change assembly = large package for a small crystal. You noobs need to get down to the cargo bay and see what's actually going on. sheeesh
Iain Cariaba 2897	Posted - 2016.04.07 16:31:12 - [9] - Quote Serendipity Lost wrote: You noobs need to get down to the cargo bay and see what's actually going on. sheeesh Pfff, manual labor is for mortals. Going down to the cargo bay to see what's going on makes as much sense as going out into the field and munching on grass with the cattle. EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid. I couldn't have said it better. Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
Paranoid Loyd 8836	Posted - 2016.04.07 16:37:30 - [10] - Quote The volume of things is determined by the logistical impact of said size. It has nothing to do with realism. CCP through some magical algorithm determines how many of said thing they want you to be able to carry in a certain situation, they then have the option of tweaking both the size of the ship's cargo bay and the size of the thing you are trying to move to what they perceive as balance for not just one but multiple situations. If you really want an RP reason, the volume of the strip miner when packaged for sale or transport is considerably smaller then the actual volume of space the module occupies when it is fully assembled. Fix the Prospect! New Server Hardware!
Serendipity Lost Repo Industries 1919	Posted - 2016.04.07 16:43:29 - [11] - Quote Paranoid Loyd wrote: The volume of things is determined by the logistical impact of said size. It has nothing to do with realism. CCP through some magical algorithm determines how many of said thing they want you to be able to carry in a certain situation, they then have the option of tweaking both the size of the ship's cargo bay and the size of the thing you are trying to move to what they perceive as balance for not just one but multiple situations. If you really want an RP reason, the volume of the strip miner when packaged for sale or transport is considerably smaller then the actual volume of space the module occupies when it is fully assembled. Dude, it's totally the bubble wrap. It's clear to me that you hate bubble wrap and puppies. Shame on you.
Celthric Kanerian Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation 713	Posted - 2016.04.07 20:18:53 - [12] - Quote That is what Barges and exhumers capacity is for... What else do you put there? Ore? Wrong slot.
Frostys Virpio KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 2725	Posted - 2016.04.07 22:01:21 - [13] - Quote Serendipity Lost wrote: You guys are just plain silly. Have you ever handled a mining crystal personally? I don't mean giving a command from your pod, I mean actually going down to the cargo bay and getting all covered in dust and grime. A couple of things you elitist snobs that never leave your pods obviously didn't know. 1 - Mining crystals are fragile - There is a lot of bubble wrap involved, and the inertial dampeners to keep them from breaking every time you go into and out of warp don't use space magic - those things are big. 2 - pod pilots demanded the quick swap feature so they could just swap on the fly and do it now. The quick change assembly takes up room too. Bubble wrap + inertial dampeners + quick change assembly = large package for a small crystal. You noobs need to get down to the cargo bay and see what's actually going on. sheeesh T2 crystals are even more of a PITA to handle so you need 10m3 of wrapping and handling tools with each.
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 3135	Posted - 2016.04.07 22:01:57 - [14] - Quote Jon Greyburst wrote: My question is simply "why is this the case?", and if there is no legitimate reason wouldn't it make more sense to bring these crystals in line with other ammo in the game in terms of size. I am not suggesting that a strip miner should be able to hold more than one crystal any more than a beam laser should be able to hold more than one crystal. But in terms of transport this seems to take up an unnecessary amount of space. The why is to limit the number of crystals you can carry in your cargo bay to cause trade offs and limitations. A bit like 800 cap boosters being limited by volume.
Daichi Yamato Xero Security and Technologies 3173	Posted - 2016.04.07 23:04:27 - [15] - Quote So you cant carry crap loads of every crystal and have a meaningful choice to make before you go mining. Cap charges are massive, but the cap boosters they go in are small. This is also for game balance. Maybe modules flat pack and they expand when they are fitted. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided" Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Sobaan Tali Caldari Quick Reaction Force 882	Posted - 2016.04.07 23:11:00 - [16] - Quote It's not meant to make sense from a realistic standpoint, but from a game design standpoint. The same reasons many items in the game take up rather unusual or wildly unrealistic cargo space. You sound like that guy that had a problem with Citadels fitting inside a ship's cargo bay yet being many dozens of times that ship's physical size. "Tomahawks?" "----in' A, right?" "Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each." "----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 26110	Posted - 2016.04.08 05:11:58 - [17] - Quote Daichi Yamato wrote: Maybe modules flat pack and they expand when they are fitted. Modules by Ikea. Civilized behaviour is knowing that violence is barbaric, but paying other people to do it is business. Nil mortifi sine lucre.
Khan Wrenth Ore Oppression Prevention and Salvation 538	Posted - 2016.04.08 05:15:07 - [18] - Quote IIRC, mining crystals used to be bigger. Back a while ago when exhumers got rebalanced, someone convinced CCP to drop the crystal size a tad. At least I think so, I remember a discussion around it, but I don't mine so I never really had to keep track. Let's discuss overhauling the way we get intel in EvE.
Iain Cariaba 2899	Posted - 2016.04.08 05:57:59 - [19] - Quote Khan Wrenth wrote: IIRC, mining crystals used to be bigger. Back a while ago when exhumers got rebalanced, someone convinced CCP to drop the crystal size a tad. At least I think so, I remember a discussion around it, but I don't mine so I never really had to keep track. Yes, they did used to be larger. When they had just changed the barges, I couldn't carry the crystals for more than 2 different ore types in the cargo bay of a hulk. EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid. I couldn't have said it better. Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
Praal Bearded BattleBears I N F A M O U S 52	Posted - 2016.04.09 07:45:55 - [20] - Quote Jon Greyburst wrote: the crystals for the largest beam weapons in the game take up 1 m3 of volume when compared to their equivalent module which takes up 4,000 m3 of volume. I understand that this may be a bit like apples and oranges but then when you talk about a mining crystal that goes in a module only 5 m3 being 6 times the size of that crystal the disparity is still a bit extreme. But do XL weapon crystals tractor in the chunks of enemy you damaged to your hold? Nope. But really, I'd have no issue with the mining turrets themselves being bumped up to 10-20m3.
Kiddoomer Deep Space Exploitation Federal United Battalion of Armed Renegades 108	Posted - 2016.04.09 12:38:39 - [21] - Quote Actually these mining crystals could even get a little bigger than they are, if choices of what to mine is the reason of their size. I can put 3 different fit + mobile depot in my cargohold and still quite a good bunch of differents crystals, + drones with that, with all that crap enough crystals for 2-3 ore types and 2 replacements for each turret would be just fine. We're recruiting !
Cristl 393	Posted - 2016.04.09 20:40:14 - [22] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Daichi Yamato wrote: Maybe modules flat pack and they expand when they are fitted. Modules by Ikea. I wonder how many of those crappy dowels an "Astrah++s" comes with?!
Ncc 1709 Fusion Enterprises Ltd Phoenix Company Alliance 274	Posted - 2016.04.09 23:01:22 - [23] - Quote crystals used to be 50 m3...
Iain Cariaba 2906	Posted - 2016.04.09 23:13:36 - [24] - Quote Cristl wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Daichi Yamato wrote: Maybe modules flat pack and they expand when they are fitted. Modules by Ikea. I wonder how many of those crappy dowels an "Astrah++s" comes with?! 215,366,321,448,886,321,157.3 according to the info I found. EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid. I couldn't have said it better. Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
Dimitrios Bekas Bearded BattleBears I N F A M O U S 8	Posted - 2016.04.10 20:17:55 - [25] - Quote Serendipity Lost wrote: You guys are just plain silly. Have you ever handled a mining crystal personally? I don't mean giving a command from your pod, I mean actually going down to the cargo bay and getting all covered in dust and grime. A couple of things you elitist snobs that never leave your pods obviously didn't know. 1 - Mining crystals are fragile - There is a lot of bubble wrap involved, and the inertial dampeners to keep them from breaking every time you go into and out of warp don't use space magic - those things are big. 2 - pod pilots demanded the quick swap feature so they could just swap on the fly and do it now. The quick change assembly takes up room too. Bubble wrap + inertial dampeners + quick change assembly = large package for a small crystal. You noobs need to get down to the cargo bay and see what's actually going on. sheeesh :) exactly this !!!!!
Dimitrios Bekas Bearded BattleBears I N F A M O U S 8	Posted - 2016.04.10 20:24:10 - [26] - Quote Sobaan Tali wrote: It's not meant to make sense from a realistic standpoint, but from a game design standpoint. The same reasons many items in the game take up rather unusual or wildly unrealistic cargo space. You sound like that guy that had a problem with Citadels fitting inside a ship's cargo bay yet being many dozens of times that ship's physical size. OK now you are talking stupid Bullshit :D The GAME DESIGN Point is, to NOT HAVE YOU load shitTONS of Crystals in your Cargo bay while mining. (The Example with the Cap Boosters fits perfect here). And you also got a STANDPOINT from a realistic point of view. At the end i can only tell/ask you WHY ? WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS ? :D I thought it is all about ideas here and not complaining, but the last 3 threads were about "Name Changes" and "afk ratting optimizations" and this :) i will write now a totally cool idea at the top, be ready !!!! No lets stop joking,...some things may look crazy in eve, but they have a deeper meaning...from a gameplay perspective. Maybe you find something else that is really "broken" in the game and you have a nice idea.... bb cya

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