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ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.20 08:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
I like how all "Gallente need buff" whine threads always come down to "We want Minmatar speed and fitting but to still keep our significantly larger tanks and higher dps." Like any sane dev is going to do such a thing. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.20 09:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
Mr Hyde113 wrote:Who asked for Minmatar speed and fitting?
Blasters can be left as they are, but without a platform capable of bringing them into their effective range, they are USELESS.
But I guess the potential threat to minmatar pvp dominance would be too much for all the pilots who just let the superiority of their race win all the battles for them. Imagine if you actually had to manage your range, take damage, and god forbid commit to a fight!
No DEV in their right mind would re-introduce skill and cajones back into pvp, no way.
It looks like you have flown a lot of Amarr this month.... and nothing 6 months or so prior. Why not get used to the changes before bitching? Or try flying those ships you are bitching about and learn how wrong you are. :) |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.21 04:27:00 -
[3] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:
-2 tes, 1 gyro, and 2 nanos. DC isn't worth the slot on a kiting fit, it's got no structure. Don't stack gyros,
You have absolutely no idea what you are doing, do you? |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.21 05:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
Mr Hyde113 wrote:Nice of you to de-rail the debate with an ad-hominem attack.
A) Not my gallente specced character, so yes I have tried the new blasters. I have been flying a brutix around on this char. Also took a break due to school.
B) Been flying since 05 and these problems have been evident for atleast the past 2 years.
C) Seems like you are pretty desperate to maintain the status quo...I wonder what you fly?
Make up your mind, either you've been pvping with your Gallente toon all this time or your were taking a break?
I'm sorry, from your post I thought it was pretty aparent that you had absolutely no idea what you were talking about. I was atributing this to never flying the ships you were discussing, instead I will just toss it up to you being terrible at flying those said ships on this "alt" of yours.
And all you have to do is look at any killboard to see what I fly. It's easy. I can draw you a picture if it would help.
Goose99 wrote:
-Vaga won't get held down, not by a Diemost that's 1km/s slower anyway.
-Vaga will always keep range, it's 1km/s faster than Diemost. When will the Diemost catch up, by going slower?
-Diemost doesn't need to be plated to lose. It's 1km/s slower unplated, with 2 nanos.
-Nano Diemost is 1km/s, or 50%, slower than nano Vaga. No amount of "luck" will save it.
A Deimos pilot who is going 2k vs a Vaga pilot who is going 3k can get out just as quickly from point range to warp away as the Vaga pilot can. Any pilot who knows how to fly nano is capable of this. It's called skill. If you are having problems with this, maybe you should work on that part of it. The Deimos can chose its targets when nano just as well as the Vaga. If you don't think you can perform up to par against the Vaga, don't engage. There are plenty of ships that can do the job, yes, even Gallente ships. Hell, if you're smart, you might even have a wing man or two there to catch the vaga so that you can apply your massive win dps. Hell, you could even do this with an all Gallente fleet.
Rapier + Vaga would lose to a Arazu + Deimos.
Eve isn't a 1v1 game. MMO, you know? If you die too much flying your Gallente ships, most likely it's not the ship that is causing it. You may want to take some pvp classes or start flying with some mates that can keep this from happening. The answer is not forum whining about how underpowered your ship is or how overpowered someone elses ship is. That just makes you look like a whiney forum *****. Instead, get out and pvp. Have fun. Leave the forum whoring for those of us stuck at work.
If you are, however, stuck at work. Maybe read up on some guides on pvping, or check out some other forums on pvp tactics on how to best those ships that are giving you problems. You will see plenty of well skilled pvp pilots who can take out most any ship in what you would call and underpowered ship. Watch some of Kil2's videos where he rapes small gangs in a solo blaster brutix. And this was beffore the blaster buff.
I know that it's easier to cry nerf than to learn to fly better, but in the end, it will be a much better game experience for you and your friends. You can come here and bittervet about all the terrible people whining instead of learning to fly and your friends can have an experienced wingman to fly with. :) It's a win win situation!
Sorry for the rambling. Work makes the mind go numb. :D |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.21 05:29:00 -
[5] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:I heard some people, instead of nanoing the vaga, fit a dc for the 700 more hull hp, and stack gyros instead of tes for less dps at point range. Do you plate your vaga too? 
Or you could post with your main so we can see all your hulk losses in high sec. :) I find it hard to take anyone serious who won't post with their main. It screams, "I R EFT HOR, LISTIN TOO ME!".
However, that aside, please share with us your optimal Vagabond fit so that we may learn from your infinite wisdom.
Don't forget your required excuse on why you can't post with your main to deflect from any true reasons. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.21 05:39:00 -
[6] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:U MAD BRO?  I, faceless alt, flies Winmatar in those forums. Google "Winmatar kiting fits," lazy tard. 
Aw, you just need a friend. I see that now. Show us where the mean Minmatar touched you to give you so much hate in your heart towards them. We'll listen. Promise. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.21 06:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
Smabs wrote:If you use 2 damage rigs how do you fit a neut?
It's doable if you use 1 lse and 1 invuln. It's still a terrible fit though. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.21 06:26:00 -
[8] - Quote
Smabs wrote:Yeah true. Although then you have 1m 26s of cap and 21k ehp even with it overheated.
I think the diemos outdamages it at 22km and under so there's no conceivable way that his vaga could win that fight.
Yah, like I said, terrible fit. It's why I'm finding it hard to take anything he has to say seriously. Well, that and just about everything he's said so far in this and other whine threads has been crap, crap, and more crap. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.21 07:09:00 -
[9] - Quote
Hungry Eyes wrote:no one is arguing gallente arent great small gang brawlers. rails need to be buffed so that gal ships can be used for everything else 
There are a few choice nerfmatards in this thread that are arguing JUST THAT! lol Inconcievable! ;) |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.21 08:43:00 -
[10] - Quote
Sebastian N Cain wrote:Yes, i-¦m arguing JUST THAT!
You and anyone else are free to refute my arguments anytime, but you have to prove that
capfree weapons, the fastest and most agile ships, multiple damage types and utility highs aren-¦t optimizations for close combat and
you have to prove that Gallente ships and weapons have characteristics like that which are making them especially suited for close combat.
If you can-¦t do that, i am right and you are wrong.
Just crying the fanboi no isn-¦t going to cut it.
lol
I'm still waiting for you to prove your side of the argument. Until that happens, there is no point in having a discussion with you. You crying that you are right and we are wrong just because you say so is just as asinine.
You have yet to explain how the higher damage output at brawling ranges and higher tank makes Gallente a subpar brawler compared to Minmatars weaker tank and weaker damage at brawling range. (See what I did there?) |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
|
Posted - 2011.12.22 03:03:00 -
[11] - Quote
Everyone keeps complaining that Gallente needs to be buffed and the two arguments that they keep using seem to be the Deimos vs Vagabond and the Brutix vs Hurricane.
OK, so here's the plan.... everyone now should compare the Tempest vs Megathron and the Ishtar vs Munin.
Personally, I think that the Megathron has the advantage over the Tempest. With similar armor setups the Tempest has 106k ehp and puts out 800 dps while the Megathron has 120k ehp and puts out 1190 dps. This is of course using short range ammo on both of them. Faction. The Tempest would have a slight advantage being able to use 2 heavy neuts to the Throns 1 heavy neut. Luckily the Thons heavy neut can neut at lr point range which the Tempest would probably be using since it can also use 2 webs. This fight would entirely depend on the Tempest being able to keep enough range, however, since their speed difference is only about 10m/s, it would also entirely depend on where the fight started at. If at range, the thron would easily be able to get out of point range considering the close speed range, if at close range, the thron would **** the Tempest with much higher dps, tracking, and a scram to shut off the mwd.
Person opinion of course.
I'll let someone else go over the Munin vs Ishtar. Since I can't think of their stats off hand at work. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.22 04:02:00 -
[12] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:ElCholo wrote:With similar armor setups Armor Tempests are rare. There are much heavier Armor Ships out there and you want to take advantage of Minmatar Speed. Now days they are Shield Nano Autocannon fit like a Big Cane for Skirmishing, In Fleets Shield Artillery Fit in a with 1400mm Cannons for Alpha. Though the Maelstrom is the preferred Fleet Arty Minmatar Battleship choice the Tempest still sees heavy use.
While I disagree that the Armor Pest is rare, feel free to compare the Shield Pest to the Megathron in whatever way that you like. I'm just trying to keep the comparisons at same tier so people don't whine about tiers not being matched, etc... |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.22 07:22:00 -
[13] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Or, you can compare ships of the same tier that are actually used outside of station games and the blob. You know, bc and cruiser sized hulls. 
Because nobody flies Battleships in 0.0 unless in a Blob....  |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.22 23:07:00 -
[14] - Quote
Tsubutai wrote:I love how on one side of this argument you have people who are posting with their mains and generally have long killboard histories, and on the other you have a bunch of shitposting NPC corp forum alts. You might say there's something of a credibility gap.
Quoted for Truth.... All the way. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.23 02:47:00 -
[15] - Quote
Naomi Knight wrote:It is only good for we can see how your blaster eagle failed horribly:P
I wonder why you stopped useing hybrid ships :D
noob learn pvp
Confirming that you can take one loss that equals about .1% of my pvp experience in a 10/1 kill/loss recond and use it as a summary for pvp skills compared to a faceless alt with zero stats. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
|
Posted - 2011.12.23 04:02:00 -
[16] - Quote
Julius Foederatus wrote:The truth is, if you had been in a Brutix, the drake and cane would have just moved away from you and you'd have been killed while chasing after them in vain, without you even having to fit a speed mod on your cane. That is the reason why most blaster ships are still fail even after the buff.
I love it when people start of sentences with, GÇ£The truth isGÇ¥. Implying that what they are saying is the only truth on the matter and that people who agree with them are correct and anyone elseGÇÖs opinion on the matter is just that, an opinion, a wrong opinion to be precise.
You sir, are incorrect. What you are stating is merely your opinion on a situation which could have gone several ways. By trying to label your situation correct and any other situation incorrect, you are showing the weakness in your argument by forcing others to try to see that your way is the only right way, when it is fact, not.
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ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
|
Posted - 2011.12.23 05:05:00 -
[17] - Quote
Mfume Apocal wrote:
naomi doesn't pvp, but when he does, he loses T3s to 2x t1 cruisers and gate sentries.
Everyone has their moments. lol
Mine was making the mistake of going through OMS to catch up to a fleet of Beagles that some friends of mine and I put together to go have some lols. Since everyone will engage an Eagle. They managed to have the fun, I died enroute. |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.23 05:54:00 -
[18] - Quote
Julius Foederatus wrote:I challenge all of you who say the Brutix or other blaster ships are fine to fly them exclusively for 2 weeks and then come back and tell me that it's competitive with a straight face. Take careful notice of how many of your kills involve friends in other ships, cloaky alts, or dumb luck. I have a feeling you'll come to the same conclusion I have with regards to how balanced blaster ships are to the rest of the Eve line up.
Obviously you've never watched any of Kil2's videos... And those were pre-blaster buff. If you have seen them, then you are a troll. If you haven't seen them, I suggest you go watch them and see how mean a solo active tanked Brutix can be. Not even nano, active armor tanked.
http://www.club-bear.com/ |
ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
|
Posted - 2011.12.23 06:12:00 -
[19] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Hungry Eyes wrote:Tsubutai wrote:I love how on one side of this argument you have people who are posting with their mains and generally have long killboard histories, and on the other you have a bunch of shitposting NPC corp forum alts. You might say there's something of a credibility gap. not at all. the main vs. alt argument is a pointless one. many people post on alts to protect their corps from their personal opinions. you can have all the kb history in the world, and still be disconnected from reality. and the reality is that the top two trolls in this thread (Liang and Cholo) dont actually fly the ships theyre arguing about, whereas someone like me has flown nothing but Gallente ships since 2006. you dont have to believe it, and i dont care. but i know when MY ships are not considered viable in fleets. See definition of ad hominem: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem] They resort to it because: 1) They have nothing else 2) They're uneducated enough to embarrass themselves through using such logical fallacy, and fails to realize it means automatic loss in formal debate.
You forgot;
3) The alt poster has no actual PvP history to back his side of the argument and knows it. Thus, hiding behind a faceless alt and making wild claims of conspiracy against the alts of Eve when posters with actual combat history, who aren't afraid to hide their kills and losses, make sensible and logical arguments that are backed up with proven experience.
Real World:
Would you take a class in horsemanship from a person who hides who they are GÇ£to make sure the person who trained them is safe from their opinions on trainingGÇ¥ or the championship rider who shows his medals on the wall and whom you can look up their defeats in the ring?
No brainer for me.
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ElCholo
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
26
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Posted - 2011.12.23 07:25:00 -
[20] - Quote
Julius Foederatus wrote:I'm going to try and watch those vids when I get back to my main comp, this mac is a POS. I went on his youtube channel and saw him get killed by a cane in his dual rep brutix and kill a few frigs with a thorax. Hardly evidence that blaster ships are fine but I'll wait til I can see the proper stuff.
LOL
I'm going to guess that you are refering to the video on his youtube site called "solo brutix fail" where he engages a Cane, a Rapier, and a third shipt I can't identify on my work pc. Maybe not the best one to judge the Brutix on considering the title. |
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