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Alias222 Caldari Provisions Caldari State 0	Posted - 2011.12.18 17:29:00 - [1] - Quote any1 got a good nightmare pve set up for ratting, complex etc ?
Kaanchana Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 49	Posted - 2011.12.18 17:52:00 - [2] - Quote battleclinic is your friend. Put some effort. And the next time you ask for something like this, give a base idea for others to comment on. Like missions or null ratting and type of npcs etc.. Post the fit you have in mind and ask for comments. That will help everyone.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 1451	Posted - 2011.12.18 21:07:00 - [3] - Quote Alias222 wrote: any1 got a good nightmare pve set up for ratting, complex etc ? http://lmgtfy.com/?q=good+nightmare+PvE+fit Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players. Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Sphit Ker Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 43	Posted - 2011.12.18 21:24:00 - [4] - Quote Alias222 wrote: any1 got a good nightmare pve set up for ratting, complex etc ? ** Nightmare. Acquire Mealstrom. I must be kidding, right? I'm not. Check this out: Nightmare has bonus to tracking and damage. It means Abaddon DPS along some kind of tracking boost. An "all 5" Nightmare with Mega Pulse turrets barely beat an average, everyday normal non-bonused 800mm AC on tracking. By "barely beat" I mean something silly like 0.002 rads. It's that dumb. You have to use Tachyons to make it count... and yet it's still funny. Nightmare cost a billion** ISK for the hull alone. Maelstrom is what? 170 mil on a bad day? Pimp out a Mael a little with a set of faction gyros and a good shield booster and boost amp. Saves ISK, rake in more ISK. Nightmare is stuck with laser DPS profile yet it have plain standard Tech 1 resist profile. Laser DPS means yo have to shoot at Sanshas and Bloods for best efficiency yet these guys also happen to shoot laser DPS at you... That nugget is stuck exposing itself to it's natural weakness. Now, let me tell you about selectable damage type of projectile turrets... and zero activation cost? Get a Maelstrom. Use the 800 mil or so you'll save on the hull alone and pimp it out a little where it counts. Maelstrom enjoys a bonus to shield boosting on top of that, Nightmare does not.
Kolya Medz Kolya Inc. 0	Posted - 2011.12.18 21:36:00 - [5] - Quote This is how you fit a Nightmare without being a gank magnet. Lows: Tracking Enhancer II Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Mediums: X-Large Shield Booster II Shield Boost amp II EM Hardener II Em Hardener II Thermal Hardener II Tracking Computer II w/ script Cap recharger II Highs: (no debate here, you want pulses? Get an apoc lol.) Tachyon Beam Lasor II Tachyon Beam Lasor II Tachyon Beam Lasor II Tachyon Beam Lasor II Auto Targeting system II small tractor beam I utility highs are personal preference Rigs: I use 3 cap control circuits Can tank ANY level 4 long enough to gank through it. Does 1070 DPS at 40km + falloff with implants.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 1451	Posted - 2011.12.18 21:47:00 - [6] - Quote Sphit Ker wrote: Alias222 wrote: any1 got a good nightmare pve set up for ratting, complex etc ? ** Nightmare. Acquire Mealstrom. I must be kidding, right? I'm not. Check this out: Nightmare has bonus to tracking and damage. It means Abaddon DPS along some kind of tracking boost. An "all 5" Nightmare with Mega Pulse turrets** Stop. NO! Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players. Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Sphit Ker Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 43	Posted - 2011.12.18 21:50:00 - [7] - Quote Malcanis wrote: Sphit Ker wrote: Alias222 wrote: any1 got a good nightmare pve set up for ratting, complex etc ? ** Nightmare. Acquire Mealstrom. I must be kidding, right? I'm not. Check this out: Nightmare has bonus to tracking and damage. It means Abaddon DPS along some kind of tracking boost. An "all 5" Nightmare with Mega Pulse turrets** Stop. NO! Don't selective quote. Read on...
Sphit Ker Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 44	Posted - 2011.12.18 22:02:00 - [8] - Quote Still wanking yourself for a Nightmare? Maelstrom 100mb/s drone bandwidth. 100m3 drone bay Nightmare only 75 on both. Go ahead and make your case. Nightmare is not good enough. Maelstrom has EMP ammo... just dandy against Bloods and Sanshas. Projective turrets have tracking bonused ammo on top of that. What's up with the tracking bonus of Nightmare already? ok. Nightmare will beat Nightmare against these exact two rat type. Then what? You're stuck there.
Kolya Medz Kolya Inc. 0	Posted - 2011.12.18 22:06:00 - [9] - Quote Sphit Ker wrote: Alias222 wrote: any1 got a good nightmare pve set up for ratting, complex etc ? ** Nightmare. Acquire Mealstrom. I must be kidding, right? I'm not. Check this out: Nightmare has bonus to tracking and damage. It means Abaddon DPS along some kind of tracking boost. An "all 5" Nightmare with Mega Pulse turrets barely beat an average, everyday normal non-bonused 800mm AC on tracking. By "barely beat" I mean something silly like 0.002 rads. It's that dumb. You have to use Tachyons to make it count... and yet it's still funny. Nightmare cost a billion** ISK for the hull alone. Maelstrom is what? 170 mil on a bad day? Pimp out a Mael a little with a set of faction gyros and a good shield booster and boost amp. Saves ISK, rake in more ISK. Nightmare is stuck with laser DPS profile yet it have plain standard Tech 1 resist profile. Laser DPS means yo have to shoot at Sanshas and Bloods for best efficiency yet these guys also happen to shoot laser DPS at you... That nugget is stuck exposing itself to it's natural weakness. Now, let me tell you about selectable damage type of projectile turrets... and zero activation cost? Get a Maelstrom. Use the 800 mil or so you'll save on the hull alone and pimp it out a little where it counts. Maelstrom enjoys a bonus to shield boosting on top of that, Nightmare does not. Megapulse for pve? Lol!!! Amarr BSs are big and slow. I hope you have a lot if isk for Scorch L. (Exception is Apoc with prop mod.) The nightmare was built for tachs, just look at the bonuses. For PVE, Auto cannons are only decent against close range rats like angels/serps/mercs, everything else will be on the edge of your falloff, severely gimping your dps. Also, autos eat ammo REALLY fast, further reducing isk per hour. My nightmare goes weeks with the same navy crystals. Yes nightmare is stuck with EM/Therm damage, just like the mael is stuck fighting in falloff with gimped dps. PVE is about isk per hour. Isk per hour is about gank, not tank. When your doing 1000+ reliable dps @40km + another 40 falloff, rats usually die before they're even in range to shoot you. So a shield tank isn't really an issue. If you are doing PVE in amarr space, get a nightmare or Paladin. Save the mael for angel cartel.
Kolya Medz Kolya Inc. 0	Posted - 2011.12.18 22:13:00 - [10] - Quote Sphit Ker wrote: Still wanking yourself for a Nightmare? Maelstrom 100mb/s drone bandwidth. 100m3 drone bay Nightmare only 75 on both. Go ahead and make your case. Nightmare is not good enough. Maelstrom has EMP ammo... just dandy against Bloods and Sanshas. Projective turrets have tracking bonused ammo on top of that. What's up with the tracking bonus of Nightmare already? ok. Nightmare will beat Nightmare against these exact two rat type. Then what? You're stuck there. What's your optimal range on that maelstrom?
Sphit Ker Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 44	Posted - 2011.12.18 23:02:00 - [11] - Quote Kolya Medz wrote: [quote=Sphit Ker](stuff)/quote] What's your optimal range on that maelstrom? Both ships are similar in agility and speed... Nightmare will tend to win out when outside standard tackling ranges. Otherwise, Maelstrom is going to mop the floor all the while not getting stuck with laser DPS and enjoying a boost to tanking and that's what it gets down to. PLEX can be hard to tank. You'll want a tank proper... Maels will win at this game.
Disdaine 40	Posted - 2011.12.18 23:22:00 - [12] - Quote Get the nightmare, or get a mach, you'll have fun with either. My friend flies a nightmare, he'd take it everytime over a paladin or tengu. I fly a mach. 1038 turret dps at 77km falloff using normal ammo. Wouldn't consider jumping back in a Mael as I don't like artillery and the Mael receives no falloff bonus.
Alias222 Caldari Provisions Caldari State 1	Posted - 2011.12.19 00:27:00 - [13] - Quote is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ?, say null sec sanctums, plexs or is it no good ?
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 141	Posted - 2011.12.19 00:30:00 - [14] - Quote Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ? No.
Varcaus Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation 5	Posted - 2011.12.19 01:07:00 - [15] - Quote Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ?, say null sec sanctums, plexs or is it no good ? Get a tengu
Kulmid SniggWaffe Band of Abos 4	Posted - 2011.12.19 02:20:00 - [16] - Quote It seems most of these people have been abuse by a nightmare
Jyla Kenij State War Academy Caldari State 0	Posted - 2011.12.19 02:28:00 - [17] - Quote Varcaus wrote: Get a tengu This. Turrets are for suckers.
egola NSFW federation 23	Posted - 2011.12.19 02:42:00 - [18] - Quote can't believe i'm the first one to suggest this: ignore everyone else and get a VINDI
Kolya Medz Kolya Inc. 0	Posted - 2011.12.19 03:07:00 - [19] - Quote The best battleships for each rat type: Blood/Sansha/RogueDrones: Nightmare/Pali Guristas: CNR/Tengu Angels: Machariel/vargur Serps: Vindi/domi/kronos/Golem (really a matter of preference)
RubyPorto Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion 158	Posted - 2011.12.19 04:34:00 - [20] - Quote [Perfect PvE Nightmare - Rhea]
Grog Barrel Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 10	Posted - 2011.12.19 05:45:00 - [21] - Quote highs: artillery meds: warp scramblers and webs lows: cargohold exp
Fix My Lasers Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 41	Posted - 2011.12.19 10:07:00 - [22] - Quote Sphit Ker wrote: Alias222 wrote: any1 got a good nightmare pve set up for ratting, complex etc ? ** Nightmare. Acquire Mealstrom. I must be kidding, right? I'm not. Check this out: Nightmare has bonus to tracking and damage. It means Abaddon DPS along some kind of tracking boost. An "all 5" Nightmare with Mega Pulse turrets barely beat an average, everyday normal non-bonused 800mm AC on tracking. By "barely beat" I mean something silly like 0.002 rads. It's that dumb. You have to use Tachyons to make it count... and yet it's still funny. Nightmare cost a billion** ISK for the hull alone. Maelstrom is what? 170 mil on a bad day? Pimp out a Mael a little with a set of faction gyros and a good shield booster and boost amp. Saves ISK, rake in more ISK. Nightmare is stuck with laser DPS profile yet it have plain standard Tech 1 resist profile. Laser DPS means yo have to shoot at Sanshas and Bloods for best efficiency yet these guys also happen to shoot laser DPS at you... That nugget is stuck exposing itself to it's natural weakness. Now, let me tell you about selectable damage type of projectile turrets... and zero activation cost? Get a Maelstrom. Use the 800 mil or so you'll save on the hull alone and pimp it out a little where it counts. Maelstrom enjoys a bonus to shield boosting on top of that, Nightmare does not. Totaly agree. Mael is way better with damage types and tracking and no cap use and tracking and shield boosting bonus and so on. Pimped out Mael performs much better then pimped out Nightmare. That's a fact. Moreover its price 10x times lower. Bring back Blaze and Lux crystals! http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12812-Blaze-L-details.html http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12832-Lux-L-details.html
Fix My Lasers Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 41	Posted - 2011.12.19 10:11:00 - [23] - Quote Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ?, say null sec sanctums, plexs or is it no good ? It is a nightmare for a Nightmare to kill guristas. They have a very high EM resist. Takes ages to kill them. Bring back Blaze and Lux crystals! http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12812-Blaze-L-details.html http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12832-Lux-L-details.html
Sven Galli Drama Inc. 2	Posted - 2011.12.19 13:29:00 - [24] - Quote I don't always fly a Nightmare, but when i do, it looks like a Machariel. I have a nightmare and a paladin and they collect dust, but that has more to do with the fact that I live in serp space.
Mike712 Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 4	Posted - 2011.12.19 13:46:00 - [25] - Quote Fix My Lasers wrote: Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ?, say null sec sanctums, plexs or is it no good ? It is a nightmare for a Nightmare to kill guristas. They have a very high EM resist. Takes ages to kill them. A good nightmare will of course use tachs which means multifrequency crystals at almost all typical engagement ranges. Multifrequency does almost a good chunk of it's damage as thermal at a ratio of 23 thermal to 32 EM damage, combine that with the epic raw damage and alpha of the nightmare and it's actually pretty damn efficient at dispatching guristas NPCs(even compared to a well fit CNR/Golem/Kronos). The only faction where the nightmare struggles is angels as they are highly resistant to both EM and thermal. For anything weak to both EM and thermal nothing competes with a nightmare for raw killing speed, not even a machariel and definitely not a mealstrom. A tach nightmare does near enough 1000 DPS with more than sufficient tracking to get excelent hit quality at ranges out to 50km, whereas by that range any autocannon ship is fighting in very deep falloff and loosing a good % of it's DPS.
Fix My Lasers Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 41	Posted - 2011.12.19 14:54:00 - [26] - Quote Mike712 wrote: Fix My Lasers wrote: Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ?, say null sec sanctums, plexs or is it no good ? It is a nightmare for a Nightmare to kill guristas. They have a very high EM resist. Takes ages to kill them. A good nightmare will of course use tachs which means multifrequency crystals at almost all typical engagement ranges. Multifrequency does almost a good chunk of it's damage as thermal at a ratio of 23 thermal to 32 EM damage, combine that with the epic raw damage and alpha of the nightmare and it's actually pretty damn efficient at dispatching guristas NPCs(even compared to a well fit CNR/Golem/Kronos). The only faction where the nightmare struggles is angels as they are highly resistant to both EM and thermal. For anything weak to both EM and thermal nothing competes with a nightmare for raw killing speed, not even a machariel and definitely not a mealstrom. A tach nightmare does near enough 1000 DPS with more than sufficient tracking to get excelent hit quality at ranges out to 50km, whereas by that range any autocannon ship is fighting in very deep falloff and loosing a good % of it's DPS. I won't be complaining, but Math better explains how things are. Since I have almost every PvE ship with perfect skills I will be judging by my stats. All are fitted with faction stuff and implants. T1 Ammo to compare. Vargur: ~960 (956) DPS with Phased Plasma, 5 + 73 km. ACs Golem: ~1030 (1026) with Juggernaut Torpedo, ~47 km. Siege Launcher Kronos: ~810 (813) with Antimatter, 49 + 51 km. Rails Nightmare: ~940 (935) with Mulifreq., 49 + 50 km. Tachs Now percentages of damage type: Vargur: TH: 85%, KIN: 15% Golem: 100% KIN, obviously. Kronos: TH: 40%, KIN: 60% Nightmare: TH: 40%, EM: 60% Average guristas BS resists on the shield and armor are: EM: 70% EXP: 60% KIN: 40% TH: 50% So the math of DPS vs Resists is: Vargur: 494 Golem: 618 Kronos: 453 Nightmare: 357 So my conclusion that Nightmare is not even close to Golem or Vargur, and ~100 DPS less then Kronos. Not really efficient against guristas at all. Bring back Blaze and Lux crystals! http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12812-Blaze-L-details.html http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12832-Lux-L-details.html
Mike712 Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 5	Posted - 2011.12.19 17:21:00 - [27] - Quote Fix My Lasers wrote: I won't be complaining, but Math better explains how things are. Since I have almost every PvE ship with perfect skills I will be judging by my stats. All are fitted with faction stuff and implants. T1 Ammo to compare. Vargur: ~960 (956) DPS with Phased Plasma, 5 + 73 km. ACs Golem: ~1030 (1026) with Juggernaut Torpedo, ~47 km. Siege Launcher Kronos: ~810 (813) with Antimatter, 49 + 51 km. Rails Nightmare: ~940 (935) with Mulifreq., 49 + 50 km. Tachs Now percentages of damage type: Vargur: TH: 85%, KIN: 15% Golem: 100% KIN, obviously. Kronos: TH: 40%, KIN: 60% Nightmare: TH: 40%, EM: 60% Average guristas BS resists on the shield and armor are: EM: 70% EXP: 60% KIN: 40% TH: 50% So the math of DPS vs Resists is: Vargur: 494 Golem: 618 Kronos: 453 Nightmare: 357 So my conclusion that Nightmare is not even close to Golem or Vargur, and ~100 DPS less then Kronos. Not really efficient against guristas at all. Pretty sure you're resist figures are way off, there are many sources but it's hard to know which are accurate. The source I'm looking at states that no guristas NPC has EM resist higher than 60%(Pith Usurper) most have an EM resist of between 12% and 30% on shields with 60% across the board on armor. Also guristas tend to orbit at 30-35km where the Vargur will actually be doing 700-750 DPS, and the Vargur, Golem and Kronos will likely be perma jammed fighting guristas meaning their DPS is actually 0...
Fix My Lasers Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 41	Posted - 2011.12.19 18:11:00 - [28] - Quote Mike712 wrote: Fix My Lasers wrote: I won't be complaining, but Math better explains how things are. Since I have almost every PvE ship with perfect skills I will be judging by my stats. All are fitted with faction stuff and implants. T1 Ammo to compare. Vargur: ~960 (956) DPS with Phased Plasma, 5 + 73 km. ACs Golem: ~1030 (1026) with Juggernaut Torpedo, ~47 km. Siege Launcher Kronos: ~810 (813) with Antimatter, 49 + 51 km. Rails Nightmare: ~940 (935) with Mulifreq., 49 + 50 km. Tachs Now percentages of damage type: Vargur: TH: 85%, KIN: 15% Golem: 100% KIN, obviously. Kronos: TH: 40%, KIN: 60% Nightmare: TH: 40%, EM: 60% Average guristas BS resists on the shield and armor are: EM: 70% EXP: 60% KIN: 40% TH: 50% So the math of DPS vs Resists is: Vargur: 494 Golem: 618 Kronos: 453 Nightmare: 357 So my conclusion that Nightmare is not even close to Golem or Vargur, and ~100 DPS less then Kronos. Not really efficient against guristas at all. Pretty sure you're resist figures are way off, there are many sources but it's hard to know which are accurate. The source I'm looking at states that no guristas NPC has EM resist higher than 60%(Pith Usurper) most have an EM resist of between 12% and 30% on shields with 60% across the board on armor. Also guristas tend to orbit at 30-35km where the Vargur will actually be doing 700-750 DPS, and the Vargur, Golem and Kronos will likely be perma jammed fighting guristas meaning their DPS is actually 0... Even with 750 DPS Vargur or Mael will outdamage Nightmare. Just a sad fact. Bring back Blaze and Lux crystals! http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12812-Blaze-L-details.html http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12832-Lux-L-details.html
RubyPorto Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion 165	Posted - 2011.12.19 19:05:00 - [29] - Quote Fix My Lasers wrote: Even with 750 DPS Vargur or Mael will outdamage Nightmare. Just a sad fact. Why insist on shooting lasers at Em/Thermal resistant rats? When I go out for a run, I have a choice between wearing Stilettos and Running shoes. Should I get to complain to the shoe store when I break my ankle running a marathon in stilettos?
Fix My Lasers Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 41	Posted - 2011.12.19 20:59:00 - [30] - Quote RubyPorto wrote: Fix My Lasers wrote: Even with 750 DPS Vargur or Mael will outdamage Nightmare. Just a sad fact. Why insist on shooting lasers at Em/Thermal resistant rats? When I go out for a run, I have a choice between wearing Stilettos and Running shoes. Should I get to complain to the shoe store when I break my ankle running a marathon in stilettos? Because someone wants to use Nightmare for killing some guristas. Why? I have no idea. Maybe because SPs are not allowing him to use any other ship. Bring back Blaze and Lux crystals! http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12812-Blaze-L-details.html http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12832-Lux-L-details.html
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE 27	Posted - 2011.12.19 21:14:00 - [31] - Quote Nightmare isn't actually all that bad vs guristas, by no means great, but better than a lot of other choices. if you only get the occasional guristas mission (like in amarr space) it is completely workable, especially since the 2 gurista missions you do get one is full of little crappy ships that get vaporized by any ship, and the other is the Assault which is easily blitzable in a nightmare. heck nightmare is probably one of the best ships for blitzing the assault, warp in and instapop the small stuff, and takes a little longer on the battleships but you do rather high base dps,no defenders, and less likely to get jammed than a marauder, but worse damage type. tengu/kronos/maybeCNR, are the ones I'd think would be better, don't remember if you have to kill the 2 elite frigs, I usually do because with guns it is very easy and they scramble. the blitz on GE probably wouldn't be too painful,
Munio J Makeanen United Starbase Systems 0	Posted - 2011.12.19 21:55:00 - [32] - Quote Sphit Ker wrote: Still wanking yourself for a Nightmare? Maelstrom 100mb/s drone bandwidth. 100m3 drone bay Nightmare only 75 on both. Go ahead and make your case. Nightmare is not good enough. Maelstrom has EMP ammo... just dandy against Bloods and Sanshas. Projective turrets have tracking bonused ammo on top of that. What's up with the tracking bonus of Nightmare already? ok. Nightmare will beat Nightmare against these exact two rat type. Then what? You're stuck there. OK usually I do not include my self in this type of debates but by coincident we did a test yesterday. Guy wanted to test out his Varg Kit on Mael hull before going in with Hull he never flew. So we had a Nightmare and a Maestrom in mission. Auto cannon pretty much same level of Faction stuff almost identical XL cap boosted fit with tracking comps faction gyros and all that bling. Enemies were actually Gallente Navy so not optimal for Nightmare but Phased plasma ammo [faction I might add]. I have less SP then the guy in gunnery and not perfect nightmare and stil l was beating him by about 30 % or bi less lets call it 20% on killing same exact name of Bships and cruisers. For Drones, Bloods, Sansha, Gal navy and that means Serps as well, Nightmare will kick the teeth out of a Maelstrom in all but tank but it can tank more then enough for lvl 4s. For Guristas Mordus and similar it is competitive and for Angels Maelstrom will beat it. Make you own conclusions Did several mission was not even competition when nightmare was killing bloods or Sansha. so to conclude 3 main points 1 Don't bother with Mael against Nightmare comparisons 2 Vargur should be the ship to compare a Nightmare agains 3 Fall off is NOT optimal :) Thanks for attention TLDR Nightmare is better then Maelstrom
Sven Galli Drama Inc. 2	Posted - 2011.12.19 23:21:00 - [33] - Quote Fix My Lasers wrote: Mike712 wrote: Fix My Lasers wrote: Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ?, say null sec sanctums, plexs or is it no good ? It is a nightmare for a Nightmare to kill guristas. They have a very high EM resist. Takes ages to kill them. A good nightmare will of course use tachs which means multifrequency crystals at almost all typical engagement ranges. Multifrequency does almost a good chunk of it's damage as thermal at a ratio of 23 thermal to 32 EM damage, combine that with the epic raw damage and alpha of the nightmare and it's actually pretty damn efficient at dispatching guristas NPCs(even compared to a well fit CNR/Golem/Kronos). The only faction where the nightmare struggles is angels as they are highly resistant to both EM and thermal. For anything weak to both EM and thermal nothing competes with a nightmare for raw killing speed, not even a machariel and definitely not a mealstrom. A tach nightmare does near enough 1000 DPS with more than sufficient tracking to get excelent hit quality at ranges out to 50km, whereas by that range any autocannon ship is fighting in very deep falloff and loosing a good % of it's DPS. I won't be complaining, but Math better explains how things are. Since I have almost every PvE ship with perfect skills I will be judging by my stats. All are fitted with faction stuff and implants. T1 Ammo to compare. Vargur: ~960 (956) DPS with Phased Plasma, 5 + 73 km. ACs Golem: ~1030 (1026) with Juggernaut Torpedo, ~47 km. Siege Launcher Kronos: ~810 (813) with Antimatter, 49 + 51 km. Rails Nightmare: ~940 (935) with Mulifreq., 49 + 50 km. Tachs Now percentages of damage type: Vargur: TH: 85%, KIN: 15% Golem: 100% KIN, obviously. Kronos: TH: 40%, KIN: 60% Nightmare: TH: 40%, EM: 60% Average guristas BS resists on the shield and armor are: EM: 70% EXP: 60% KIN: 40% TH: 50% So the math of DPS vs Resists is: Vargur: 494 Golem: 618 Kronos: 453 Nightmare: 357 So my conclusion that Nightmare is not even close to Golem or Vargur, and ~100 DPS less then Kronos. Not really efficient against guristas at all. Maybe I'm just not seeing it and i'm not sure what Guristas orbit at, but all i'm seeing here is eft numbers with out taking into account dps lost due to being outside of optimal.
Mr Floydy The Xenodus Initiative. 0	Posted - 2011.12.19 23:33:00 - [34] - Quote Yeh at 50km isn't the Vargur down from around 950 dps down to a mere 650 or so before resists? Nightmare keeps on hitting hard through brute force :) Sure there are places where the Vargur will beat the Nightmare, but its swings and roundabouts. As for the Mael? It is massively lacking in range on autocannons when compared to a Nightmare - so what if it tanks better. Anyone who has flown a Nightmare in missions knows full well it tanks enough and kills things quick enough to reduce dps to a non-problematic level. Change the Mael to arty and it still has less range and puts out less dps.
Fix My Lasers Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 42	Posted - 2011.12.20 05:27:00 - [35] - Quote Still. At 50km Vargur will be doing the same DPS to guristas as Nightmare. But mostly they orbit at 31km, which gives Vargur around ~780DPS. So as I said, Nightmare is the worst choice. edit: And about range and DPS lost: This is what you choose, to shoot at 100km or at 20. It doesn't concern calculations. Bring back Blaze and Lux crystals! http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12812-Blaze-L-details.html http://eve.battleclinic.com/item/i12832-Lux-L-details.html
ShadowFire15 BOAE INC GIANTSBANE. 46	Posted - 2011.12.20 06:50:00 - [36] - Quote Zhilia Mann wrote: Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ? No. i beg to differ. of course tanking sanctums by yourself may be a problem. not sure but the damage is still pretty good. Stan Smith had a snow storm over weekend guy was shoveling snow outside, so i shot him and mined the snow myself. concord never showed up. on an unrelated note, i have a court date next tuesday
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 1472	Posted - 2011.12.20 09:01:00 - [37] - Quote ShadowFire15 wrote: Zhilia Mann wrote: Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ? No. i beg to differ. of course tanking sanctums by yourself may be a problem. not sure but the damage is still pretty good. It gets the job done, but if you're mainly going to be shooting Guristas then you're not playing to its strengths. I'd certainly choose a CNR over a Nightmare for Guristas killing. (I can't fly Marauders but a Golem would probably be extremely good also) For agents which have a predominance of Sansha/Blood rats and resist-neutral rats like Mercs, the Nightmare is a murderboat. A 3-4 slot T2 tank is enough. One thing many people neglect to include is a good afterburner, which I would unhesitatingly recommend for a PvE Nightmare. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players. Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Brotha Umad Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 2	Posted - 2011.12.20 13:45:00 - [38] - Quote RubyPorto wrote: Fix My Lasers wrote: Even with 750 DPS Vargur or Mael will outdamage Nightmare. Just a sad fact. Why insist on shooting lasers at Em/Thermal resistant rats? When I go out for a run, I have a choice between wearing Stilettos and Running shoes. Should I get to complain to the shoe store when I break my ankle running a marathon in stilettos? Anyway it's cheating to bring an inty to a marathon.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 142	Posted - 2011.12.20 23:30:00 - [39] - Quote ShadowFire15 wrote: Zhilia Mann wrote: Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ? No. i beg to differ. of course tanking sanctums by yourself may be a problem. not sure but the damage is still pretty good. If you're going to drop 1.5 bil on a ship/fittings specifically to kill Guristas, a Nightmare is very low on the list of ships you'd choose. Off the top of my head and in no particular order, I'd rather have a Tengu, CNR, Golem, Machariel, Vargur, Rattlesnake, Nighthawk, Kronos, and perhaps either a Maelstrom or Navy Dominix. I love my Nightmare. But I know full well there are better options for killing Guristas.
Mike712 Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 5	Posted - 2011.12.20 23:57:00 - [40] - Quote Malcanis wrote: ShadowFire15 wrote: Zhilia Mann wrote: Alias222 wrote: is the nightmare any good for guristas rats ? No. i beg to differ. of course tanking sanctums by yourself may be a problem. not sure but the damage is still pretty good. It gets the job done, but if you're mainly going to be shooting Guristas then you're not playing to its strengths. I'd certainly choose a CNR over a Nightmare for Guristas killing. (I can't fly Marauders but a Golem would probably be extremely good also) For agents which have a predominance of Sansha/Blood rats and resist-neutral rats like Mercs, the Nightmare is a murderboat. A 3-4 slot T2 tank is enough. One thing many people neglect to include is a good afterburner, which I would unhesitatingly recommend for a PvE Nightmare. Nope golem is terrible for guristas, it gets perma jammed even with ECCM fitted(which means 1 less target painter). Sat in assault lv4 jammed for 20 mins, came back in CNR and finished mission, never used a marauder for guristas again, seriously you'll discover rats which you never previously knew had ECM flying a marauder lol. Back to the nightmare, no it would not be my first choice for guristas, but it works better than any marauder because it won't get perma jammed and is not that far behind a CNR/tengu, because guristas EM resist IS NOT THAT HIGH, their highest resist is EXP.
Mr Floydy The Xenodus Initiative. 0	Posted - 2011.12.21 13:25:00 - [41] - Quote Have they changed how ECM works on Guristas then? I'm sure it used to be completely random chance - whether you had ecm mods fitted or not? probably wrongly informed here
RubyPorto Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion 178	Posted - 2011.12.21 15:42:00 - [42] - Quote Mr Floydy wrote: Have they changed how ECM works on Guristas then? I'm sure it used to be completely random chance - whether you had ecm mods fitted or not? probably wrongly informed here NPC Jamming now works similarly to Player Jamming. Sensor strength matters.

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