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Fly like TIE fighter

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Thirlan	Posted - 2007.02.26 15:56:00 - [1] Okay this has probably been suggested a thousand times but I've got a new spin! First off what I'm suggesting is that instead of flying your ship with a click and point system it should be replaced with a flight simulator approach to it just like the old TIE fighter/X-Wing series (you know the old DOS one). This in my opinion should be applied to all ships smaller than a Cruiser (cruiser included). This makes sense since the large ships have such crappy turning they might as well be point and click. I'd also suggest that since it's a flight simulator system that those using it should have to aim to fire their weapons. To compensate for the loss of being able to auto-aim, these ships should be able play with their shield/armor system in the same way you could in TIE fighter where you could shift around the regeneration rate of your shields between your front, side and back. So if you were doing a frontal assault you could push all of it to the front armor. Logically this would mean that you'd have to have a higher regeneration rate than before. This is all outlandish stuff and probably will never be considered since it's difficult to rebalance skills like "Target tracking", but hey... the idea is cool and it makes the difference between big and small ships even bigger (sorry bad pun).
Grebbie	Posted - 2007.02.26 21:31:00 - [2] I'd like to see where this is useful! I remember the game. I'm looking at the cd-cover now. The best space sim for its age. I've also tried Star wars galaxies: Jump to lightspeed. Which is an expansion that allows you to fly around space in Star wars galaxies. They had a great start there, but wrecked it. The game could have been as good as EVE. Basically why I ended up here. That game was on manual flight. And heck yes it was fun! But the guns were mounted solid there, and weren't rotatable like they are in EVE. Therefor you HAD to go manual flight. In EVE you don't need to because of the gun's tracking. And yes manual flight would probably mess with tracking speed etc. I really don't see where this is anything more then just fun. Now I agree it would be fun! But not really very useful.
Adunh Slavy Ammatar Trade Syndicate	Posted - 2007.02.26 21:44:00 - [3] Althought it would be fun to have some FPS options, the lag this would create would be significant. Try playing Freelancer on a busy server and you'll see what I mean. -AS
Imhothar Xarodit Minmatar Wolverine Solutions Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.02.26 21:53:00 - [4] This would actually make the game semi-FPS, and those games have heavy bandwith loads. Imagine everytime you turn your ship all other players in range need to be informed. If you do this every second, and you have 20 frigs/cruisers in your fleet, it would increase lag too drastically.
Tolomea Gallente 5th Front enterprises New Eve Order	Posted - 2007.02.27 01:57:00 - [5] Go into a busy mission deadspace and turn on modules, watch closely the time lag between clicking it and it lighting up, that is how long it takes to get the acknowledge back from the server and your going to get that lag on ever single lil course alteration. EVE is just not setup as a twitch interactive system and I highly doubt it could be retrofitted now. Essentially when the devs originally created the game one of thier core approaches to lag was to not have anything that really requires a subsecond response from the server.
Altus Vespillo	Posted - 2007.02.27 21:22:00 - [6] It would be fun, but i guess the lag issues makes it a little hard to get done. Perhaps single-player missons where some kind of signal disruption disables the pod-control of the ship, and requires traditional control, or something in that direction? Wouldnt involve other players needing to register your every move trough their net atleast. I guess this is all dreaming, and that it'd all require a whole new game, but im keeping hopes up :)
Reggie Stoneloader eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.27 22:39:00 - [7] Remember, the little ships in EvE are frigates, like the medical frigate where Luke got his hand replaced at the end of RotJ. Punishers are that big. I doubt they fly those with a flight stick.
Tulisin Dragonflame	Posted - 2007.02.28 00:02:00 - [8] As much as EVE looks like singleplayer_space_sim_01, it is just an MMORPG graphical skin. EVE is not like games like Privateer (not that those aren't good games, just a different genre), advantage is gained through thinking ahead, luck (coming up against the right setups), and strategy, not reflexes.
Atrial Quartz Gallente	Posted - 2007.02.28 04:35:00 - [9] the frigates in eve are conciderably smaller. look at the size of the windows on some of them. there not massive but there not puny ither. theres no real reason that they should move like a banana slug on queludes.
AbyssStalker	Posted - 2007.02.28 06:41:00 - [10] I tell ya what ... go play SWG... they have a FPS space system just like your asking for. I'll see ya when you get back because it SUX @ss.... Along with the rest of that game...
Jack Target	Posted - 2007.02.28 22:19:00 - [11] Thirlan's right! - I remember playing Tie Fighter - it was REALLY cool! You felt as if you were really there! (Probably nothing like SWG) The tracking skill for some ships would have to be completely abolished and be replaced with the gamer's own skill. But why not?! Maybe new classes of ship could be introduced instead of current classes changed? People who prefer to pilot with an 'in the*****pit' feel could do that, and others who prefer to command like Captain Kirk could do that. Freedom of choice! This is one of the best idea I've read so far. It might draw another sort of person into the game and add variety. Maybe we would have to wait until the server technology is there, but it would be worth waiting for! PS - The Eve Online interceptors might be the equivalent of A-wings/tie interceptors perhaps?!
Jack Target	Posted - 2007.02.28 22:21:00 - [12] By the way, I did not swear above! The word I wrote was C O C K P I T !
Agent Sever Caldari ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.03.01 00:27:00 - [13] Edited by: Agent Sever on 01/03/2007 00:24:47 I would prefer to see a piloting system like that from Star Fleet Command. That system worked well with large ships and would with small ones too. The turn gauage was essential to understanding what your ship was doing and would greatly help this game too I think. Using this movement would actually be the same just with easier controls and an indicator to let you know something is actually happening. Double click is a pain and often doesn't take on the first try. A single click with a turn indicator like Star Fleet Command would allow you to actually pilot your ship rather then just click - follow or click - orbit. The select option needs to be changed to from a single click to something else. With the release of Kali, or Revelations, there are a lot more objects in space now and often when your trying to rotate your view or double click to change directions you often end up selecting an option. I and others have had several times now where I've warped to a moon or belt instead of with the fleet to a gate because I was looking around a bit and something accidentally got selected.
Mr Mozzie Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.03.12 12:02:00 - [14] I don't know how eve works, but I think it goes like this. (Please correct me if I am wrong, this is bassed on assumptions.) The ship flight paths, weapon effects, etc are all calculated on the main servers. The player only sends commands to the server such as head in this direction, activate this module etc. and the server sends info on what all of the ships weapons etc are doing to each client. Perhaps this was done this way to prevent client hacking. Perhaps it was done that way to minimise bandwidth usage. I while I really like the idea of direct control, it would involve a major rewrite of the code and a major change in game mechanics. I cant see this happening and for good reason.
Eleana Tomelac Gallente AD VITAM AETERNAM	Posted - 2007.03.12 14:14:00 - [15] Basically, Eve requires no FPS skills, adding this would totally change the playerbase, many are not used to this type of playing. It's the same reasons why stations will be places for social activities and not FPS. I've played X-Wing and W-Wing vs Tie-Fighter, most of MechWarriors, those were great games, you really need skills with your joystick to achieve anything. Also, for those realtime games, there was a limit to the number of players getting to play together, and mostly to limit the exponential amount of data transmited when the number of players increases. With the nodes being at least one system and the "one big cluster" with unlimited number of players approach, it is just impossible to do anything in realtime. You see the target, you shoot, it's no more here because enven 100ms is much for this type of games. -- Pocket drone carriers (tm) enthousiast ! Flying Vexor and Ishkur, Myrmidon was too slow, got ganked by 3 BC and a Megathron...
Revolution Rising Minmatar Venture Research and Resources	Posted - 2007.03.12 14:34:00 - [16] Originally by: Thirlan Okay this has probably been suggested a thousand times but I've got a new spin! First off what I'm suggesting is that instead of flying your ship with a click and point system it should be replaced with a flight simulator approach to it just like the old TIE fighter/X-Wing series (you know the old DOS one). Man I loved that game, what a crap idea tho. EvE just isn't that kind of game. I understand what you're looking for, I would play that kind of game too, but eve isn't it. This is an adults' tactical/strategy game. I like it for that adult part ;) RR. CEO Venture Research and Resources. VRR Homepage
Ovno ConSyquence The Plebians	Posted - 2007.03.18 16:51:00 - [17] Although i would love to be able to play eve with a joystick or freelancer style for that matter, i understand peoples objections to it, however i think a system a bit like the move command worked in homeworld would at least allow some degree of control without changing any of the underlying code it would just allow you to be a bit more accurate when stting your direction and to the servers would read the same as a double click... Also waypoints would be nice, so you can say fly to here and then turn and fly to here, it would also allow pilots to fly in formation a bit easier
Chief Judge	Posted - 2007.03.19 14:00:00 - [18] Well i am working for small game development company.. And 2nd english is not my native language so forgive me any mistakes.. Sorry to dissapoint you all.. But that cannot be done.. Yet.. There isnt a MMO game on the market which could do what you are asking.. Conan (hyborian adventures,soon going out) is advertised to be able to do that.. But they are not telling all.. I wonder how are they going to synchronize all players.. And how are they going to give realtime control to that many players.. Major problems are PING difference beetween players from around the world.. You cannot realtime synchro all the players.. Simple example.. By the time you send your course change while fling an inty to server and that server send it to enemy you are 100 of meters away from your actual position.. You see the problem? There are somewhat solution to counter this problem and they are called precognition scripts.. Simply.. they predict next move of the player depending of the sorrounding and its status and position to sorrounding,etc.. But there isnt a script in the world which is going to predict all action of an actual human being.. 2nd thing to do to decrease lag is to put all players on regional servers.. European players to european servers isolated from other players.. (even that is not enough.. you should put players from the same country on the same server and keep it isolated from other to even try to do what you are asking) BTW: I am a really big fan of x-wing vs. tie figter and all Tie series.. Broke more than a half a dozen of mouses on those..
Nerogk Shorn Caldari Royal Hiigaran Navy	Posted - 2007.03.20 04:31:00 - [19] Yeah if there was an mmorpg that worked like Freespace 2 (the best space simulator ever made) i would totally be all over it. Now, i don't think it would be possible in eve, nor do i think it is what eve should be all about. One thing i'd like to see is that manuevering or moving your ship behind something would change the gameplay. In every fleet warfare the fleet manuevering is so vital. In eve you can shoot through asteroids other ships and stations to hit your target. I would like to see a change away from the lock and press f1-fX. But i'd also like that kind of gameplay to still be possible. It would just be way more beneficial for ships, especially in fleets, to engage in tactical manuevering to give advantages over their opponents. D-F-A-A-B-A-A-S
Tolomea Gallente 5th Front enterprises New Eve Order	Posted - 2007.03.20 08:10:00 - [20] Originally by: Ovno ConSyquence Although i would love to be able to play eve with a joystick or freelancer style for that matter, i understand peoples objections to it, however i think a system a bit like the move command worked in homeworld would at least allow some degree of control without changing any of the underlying code it would just allow you to be a bit more accurate when stting your direction and to the servers would read the same as a double click... Also waypoints would be nice, so you can say fly to here and then turn and fly to here, it would also allow pilots to fly in formation a bit easier these are great idea and you should create a new thread for them, why stick flying is never going to happen the double click system does suck and could be improved tons
Drethon Gallente Knights Hospitalier Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.20 14:40:00 - [21] I think a freelancer flight style should be added into the game for both maneuvering and turrets (turrets ability to hit what you aim at would be adjusted for skills) but make both items independently optional. You can either fly like it is now, add in the ability for real free flight or add in both free flight and manual targeting.
Tyranik	Posted - 2007.03.20 14:57:00 - [22] Privateer and Privateer 2 > * UDP/IP and its nature is why you cannot achieve this in an MMO. One idea would be to use a long range sensor so you could track ships from 3 jumps away as a blip on radar. That way the game would become more FPS'ish in that you could chase, surround, hunt down etc enemies/quarry and change the mechanics of the game quite a bit. You could still use all the normal stuff like bubbles but it would add a need to split your force into squadrons in order to herd your quarry in the direction you wanted - like a dead end. Add a 15 minute log out timer (your ship remains in play for 15 minutes even after you log out in enemy space) and you have an FPS flavor - you just need less choke points (more ways from 00 to empire space) and it should work.
Silentil Caldari Xoth Inc Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.03.20 19:09:00 - [23] MMOGs and FPS style play is really not going to make people happy with high pings even with server side prediction.. Personally..I just want plain ole moving around in 3D capability, not for immediate tactical benefits, but just to fly my ship with a joystick n not click with a mouse. Nothing special combat wise just yet, just do barrel roles or something different like that :)
Aewaytor Mortis Angelus	Posted - 2007.03.20 19:45:00 - [24] If this was possible, i'd like to see all the ships that are there at the moment, stay controlled in the same way - after all, a standard frigate is probably bordering on the same size as a Corvette out of Star Wars. I would really like to see player flown fighter drones though - that would be awesome
Silentil Caldari Xoth Inc Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.03.21 00:59:00 - [25] Originally by: Aewaytor I would really like to see player flown fighter drones though - that would be awesome There's no real if about it, for just controlling your ship. Makes no difference using a mouse, keyboard, joystick, unless you want it to have a tactical impact, which I don't see the point at this stage. If you can use that headgear stuff, you can use a joystick, just let the ships move through 3D. And re the quoted bit, they already do, they are called Bantams! :P
MezX	Posted - 2007.03.23 04:58:00 - [26] I would just be happy with the ability to control frigs (not like i wouldent like to controll all types) with a joystick i dont care about aiming just more manuvarbility where it matters so you can doge missles and stuff would make so happy
Ovno ConSyquence The Plebians	Posted - 2007.03.23 11:56:00 - [27] Quote: UDP/IP and its nature is why you cannot achieve this in an MMO. So how did planetside manage it then?
Jollyreaper Gallente Ace Adventure Corp	Posted - 2007.03.24 18:34:00 - [28] Originally by: Ovno ConSyquence Quote: UDP/IP and its nature is why you cannot achieve this in an MMO. So how did planetside manage it then? "You play with the MMO you have, not the MMO you wish you had." lol I can't speak for what the backend of Planetside is like vs. EVE but just consider what you're looking at right now. Would you really want to add manual aiming and flying on top of all the other lag in the game? Don't get me wrong, I'd love to play a TIE Fighterish MMO at some point but it ain't gonna be one built like EVE.
Zaisig Murakk	Posted - 2007.04.01 11:50:00 - [29] If it was implemented I'd say the best thing possible would be to control drones like that, and just be able to control your ship as normal...
Hasiti	Posted - 2007.04.09 03:36:00 - [30] Darkspace is like that. You can transfer your shield from the side you want and you can pilot with arrows. You can also fit your ship so you have more plate to the sides, front or the back. So a cloaking ship would try to get on the back for his first shot. Applying it to EVE would be nice. You could loose shield energy every time you change it from side and skills would make you loose less energy every time or it could do the switch faster. I know it would be hard to implement, because there would be a need to calculate from where the damages came. For piloting in space, I think it could be done with the arrows with the numpad, by holding the left button on the mouse and flying like in Battlefield 1942 with planes or with a joystick.

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