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Acix
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Posted - 2003.12.19 01:58:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Acix on 19/12/2003 02:02:15
well i went toe to toe with a black bird in my black bird last night. I had on 2 Y-S AB's each 10MN in strength. First off the 10MN ab's added about 80m/s each to my overall speed. That really sucked!!!! so i was going around 400 or so and it took forever and a day to get there and when i did my cap was gone.
Anyway back to the battle. I had 3 425 scouts and 2 malkuth light missile launchers (heaevy missiles in the bays) mounted for offense. Along with 2 warp disrupters a web and a sensor booster and the previously mentioned ab's. Bottom slots were 2 mano fiber 1's. Well needless to say the shield booster missing really hurt. But I was going out to just do hauler killing anyway. The battle was not planned but I ran into another blackbird and started to get targeted, I knew that I had no chance to get out with torps heading my way as I tried to turn the heap of junk so i started to fire back. I lost it but oh well I have a bunch more.
I did learn one lesson. A blackbird with torps is a very good cruiser killer still. I took the guys shields and started into his armor but the whole taking forever to align to warp made it so he got within range to warp scramble me as i was aligning (warp scrambler 10k range). I think he had on a MWD because he couldn't really turn just like me but he made up ground rather quickly.
The only thing I will be using the blackbird for now is gate sitting where I know haulers of the bad guys will be moving (even tho gate sitting is the most boing thing to ever do, i used to live for the thrill of the chase but that is no more with the blackbird). Other than that its a really horrible ship now. I think that my rifter will be a better ship to use to kill haulers with to tell you the truth. |
Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2003.12.19 12:47:00 -
[32]
 Quote:
Yoni:
Doesn't CCP get the fact that agility and speed = fun for us? so if something needs to be balanced, they should do it by making other ships better instead of reducing quality of something we already own and worked hard to get.
Wrong, never nerfing would make balancing the different ship classes too much to handle. And secondly, every item in game that is destructable and every single weapon/ammo would have to be boosted with the ships.
You really think CCP should have made everything BUT the BB better to compensate for its ³berness ? (which was partly due to a bug anyway)
_______________________________________________
Yes yes, blogging is passÚ I know.
Rod's Ramblingz on Eve-Online
Solutions to your issues. |
drunkenmaster
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Posted - 2003.12.19 14:17:00 -
[33]
Despite what has happened to it, I still use the bb(s) as my primary cruiser. Travel, missions, piracy - blackbird. kill missions - thorax 
1 MWD and 2 AB's will have me hitting the gates at around 1.6km/s (max 2.4) admittedly, it's not as good as 0-6km/s in 3 seconds, but anyone who witnessed that and *didn't* think it was a mistake, needs examining. 
It's still a fantastic ship, and the best cruiser for EW bar none.
See it for what it is, rather than for what it was..
.
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Mon Palae
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Posted - 2003.12.23 15:38:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Mon Palae on 23/12/2003 17:09:09
Quote:
1 MWD and 2 AB's will have me hitting the gates at around 1.6km/s (max 2.4) admittedly, it's not as good as 0-6km/s in 3 seconds, but anyone who witnessed that and *didn't* think it was a mistake, needs examining.
It's still a fantastic ship, and the best cruiser for EW bar none.
See it for what it is, rather than for what it was..
Sorry...I just don't see it as a fantastic or even middle-of-the-road ship anymore.
So you can make the gate doing 1.6km/sec and that's cool. Have a lot of cap left when you do? After stringing 3 or 4+ jumps together do you find yourself only able to warp 20au due to a drained cap?
I don't know, maybe you have uber-skills or maybe you're willing to burn cap boosters while transiting or maybe you have ultra-sweet, rare fittings that make this possible. My skills are good but not tops, my fittings are almost all 'basic' stuff. I put on two Power Diags (all that can fit as the BB only has 2 low slots) to boost the capacitor and its recharge rate...it helps but not a great deal. I tried fitting a 100mn AB on my ship but it creamed my cap so fast I never even saw top speed. Just so you know my skills aren't pure crap though there is room for improvement. I put a 10mn and a 1mn AB on my Tristan (frigate) and hit around 1400 m/s and can run the two for a good long while. What's more, my Tristan can warp farther in one go now than my Blackbird can...nearly twice as far.
What clinched it for me was putting 2 10mn ABs on my Iteron Mk-III hauler and moving faster than my Blackbird does with 3 10mn ABs fitted. Not only is my hauler faster, its cap lasts longer, it warp jumps further, accelerates MUCH faster and is about as agile (seems more agile actually but that is hard to tell...sometimes ships snap around and others they don't). Except for combat (naturally) my crummy Mk-III outperforms my BB across the board. That is akin to an ocean-going cargo freighter outperforming a navy AEGIS Cruiser. Could be just me but that makes no sense.
As it was my insurance was about to expire on my Blackbird. My choice of whether to re-invest another 1.5 mil (or more) to insure that ship again or simply collect on the policy running out was all too easy and my ugly-bird is just a memory now (and I have an even uglier bird now in the form of a Moa).
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Mon Palae
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Posted - 2003.12.23 15:58:00 -
[35]
Drunkenmaster:
I also might add that given the Corp you are a member of I can only assume you find the Blackbird still useful given what I assume to be your style of play in PvP.
The Blackbird can still be useful as a camper pouncing on ships that come by. You can keep your MWD inactive so as not to take the penalties and jam people long range. If someone comes after you then simply activate your MWD and jet out of there.
That is all fine and good but consider trying to use a Blackbird to chase someone down. To try and close a 50km separation so you can get within warp scramble distance or stasis distance. Just not really workable. Even if you do get close your cap will be burnt getting there, you'll probably get pounded on the way in and you'll have trouble keeping many ships in range if you do succeed in hitting them with a web or scrambler. Now consider what life will be like for you if CCP nerfs jammers as they have been suggesting they might and give them a range like weapons do as well. Still a good ship in your eyes?
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Jerrod Syn
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Posted - 2004.01.05 18:12:00 -
[36]
I trained up the skill for the Caldari Cruiser JUST to pilot a Blackbird for agent missions. I had it outfitted with 2 scout 250s, a mining laser, and a light launcher in the highs. The med slots were 5 afterburners, and a med shield booster. The lows changed depending if I needed speed more than cargo. It was great to be able to multi-outfit it for being able to handle almost any agent mission.
Now with Castor, my Blackbird is gathering dust. I would have to re-outfit every changed mission. I would have to kite NPC rats when doing a mineral or kill mission or outfit with lighter guns.
I have been using my Thorax for a general purpose agent ship. With the drones, I don't have to worry at all about the lighter NPC pirate spawns when I'm mining, the speed isn't great, but I can sustain a better clip in the Thorax than I can with the Blackbird.
All in all, CCP really hurt the Blackbird with their changes. For a light, maneuverable cruiser, it handles like a brick.
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Cao Cao
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Posted - 2004.01.05 18:31:00 -
[37]
blackbird is great for agent missions if you fit 2x 10MN MWDs and 4 medium cap batteries  otherwise it is crap now, and I loved that ship.
I still use it but really, the nerf is a bit extreme on the blackbird.
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Cirle
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Posted - 2004.01.05 20:48:00 -
[38]
If you are going to two mwd and cap battery route, depressingly the Osprey works much better for almost all but the higher level kill missions, and it has the cargo capacity for the occasional large volume deliveries you get thrown.
Cirle |
EvilDoomer
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Posted - 2004.01.05 22:11:00 -
[39]
I agree the BB was my favorite of all cruisers and Ihave jammed alot of the Bad CA guys with it. And it was one of if not the fastest cruiser around.
But now I use it like a shuttle with more cargo space and not for jamming.
Shame you killed my favorite Ship.
For that I whine whine whine. 
Thanks
EvilDoomer
Chicago Mobsters
** Ghost Fleet Pilot **
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.01.06 02:45:00 -
[40]
CCP decided to make Caldari ships useless instead of just simply fixing midslot EW modules.
Dumb move.. it's not modules, not the ships CCP. Change Caldari ships back to how they were, fix ECM modules, that simple.
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Domaru
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Posted - 2004.01.06 04:29:00 -
[41]
I think it would be simpler to just move on. Your cheese just moved. :-)
-Domaru
www.mentatalliance.com |
Karol Kei
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Posted - 2004.01.06 07:46:00 -
[42]
It is just part of the great Caldari nerf. Caldari ships being useful for PvP was a huge discontinuity, as they always were useless for everything else. Now it has been corrected and people that wanted a well rounded ship that is also top of the line in PvP can be happy. The minority that wanted choices and variation in the game - shut up.
It is not a developer thing in my opinion, by the way. It is a player thing, and that is why it is the same in every game. People want best of all worlds instead of choices and variation, even with the price of a worse game overall.
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Fester Addams
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Posted - 2004.01.06 13:00:00 -
[43]
In the original post Mon Palae compared a BB with a MOA.
Im not sure if anyone has already informed of this but the MOA is a high lev cruiser and the BB is a low lev one.
Im not sure what the current prices are but the MOA is worth atleast twise the isk that the BB is and you want them to compare on equal grounds?
If you wish to point out flaws in the BB compare it with equivalent ships from the other races, I would guess the minmatar equivalent is ither the scythe or bellicose, nither of wich stands a chance against a rupture.
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Soulstinger
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Posted - 2004.01.06 14:41:00 -
[44]
Mon Palae, just want to say your original post was tactfully done and well said. HAvnt read thru subsequent ones, but I for one finished reading with a care for the fate of the Blackbird. Hope this is rectified, and your baby restored to you : )
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Luc Boye
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Posted - 2004.01.06 14:56:00 -
[45]
Quote:
In the original post Mon Palae compared a BB with a MOA.
Im not sure if anyone has already informed of this but the MOA is a high lev cruiser and the BB is a low lev one.
Im not sure what the current prices are but the MOA is worth atleast twise the isk that the BB is and you want them to compare on equal grounds?
If you wish to point out flaws in the BB compare it with equivalent ships from the other races, I would guess the minmatar equivalent is ither the scythe or bellicose, nither of wich stands a chance against a rupture.
the fact that Moa is more expensive has nothing to do with mass of blackbird.
--
2004.12.29 23:33:40combatMining Pollution Cloud hits you, doing 140.0 damage. |
Hanns
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Posted - 2004.01.07 04:15:00 -
[46]
i flew the black bird ALOT before i got my scorpion, i tried it after the patch, all i can say is, im never going to fly that cruiser again if it stays like this, i **** you not!
CCP stop being idiots and leave things alone! THERE WAS NOTHING WRONG WITH THE BLACK BIRD WHY CHANGE IT?? its not like EVERYONE was flyuing around in BB's Kicking the crap out of every other ship in the game!
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TheWise
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Posted - 2004.01.07 11:15:00 -
[47]
full Agree, the BB is too heavy wighted after the patch!
But u forgot one thing, it has also one of the biggest signatures. Bigger as the MOA or any other Cruiser if i remember right (can't check it atm)
The Blackbird should be a light, stealthy Hightec Cruiser, like the Scorp should be a the same as BS.
When the missles get nerfed, too ....
..and maybe the Gallente will be the EW Race..
mhm... these ships will be nothing but flying med-slot!
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JimmySav
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Posted - 2004.01.07 16:44:00 -
[48]
i think that post patch the BB is now too slow and too clumsy.
Its described as a fragile and manouevrable ship. HAH! not any more.
It was over powered before, hence it was the only cruiser anyone flew. But now its been hit hard enough to make me start looking at some other choices..
Jim'll Fix it For You. ( and you and you!)
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.01.07 17:14:00 -
[49]
Case in point, Caldari ships in general got HOSED when it comes to signature radius, scanning resolution, and mass.
They are by FAR the worse ships in these regards.. not by a little, but by a TON.
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Pitt
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Posted - 2004.01.07 18:18:00 -
[50]
The main thing is this, all Caldari ships have been brought down from their former glory. I can't say i disagree with the changes(or agree completely). For the longest time the only two ships worth having were the BB and Scorp. They were cheap and the best at everything, except mining. Everyone had one and used them for everything and loved them. Now they have been brought down and everyone hates it. They are not useless ships now, they just aren't uber great anymore. Although i do agree with Jim's first post, ccp didn't fix the ew problem, they just nerfed the hell out of the BB and Scorp. But they are still fine ships and i plan on contiuing to pilot them, cheers.
Lack of preparation on your part does not constitute greifing on mine |
Acix
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Posted - 2004.01.09 22:03:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Acix on 09/01/2004 22:07:46
Edited by: Acix on 09/01/2004 22:05:42
The blackbird is a very funny ship to fly now. I took one out last night to hold a gate in order to slow the economy of a specific alliance. I had the best nanofibers that I could get my hands on in the low slots and it still lumbers like a clumsy teenager. I tried to overcome that by pointing my ship to a planet to speed up the exit process in case i was jumped by a battleship. Well I found out that the blackbird takes just as long to turn and warp as it does to just warp to a planet that it is pointed directly at. A scorp with no sensor boosters jumped in right next to the gate (not warped) I knew I would be no match for the scorp by myself so I decided to flee. Well inside of the time it took to warp to the planet that was directly ahead of me the scorp targeted me and warp scrambled me. The lock time on the scorp was 8 seconds.
I took a second one out to test the warp time with. With level 4's and 5's for almost all of my ship flying skills (nav, high speed manuvering, etc.) It took aprox 9 to 9.5 seconds to warp to a planet or other spot that the ship was pointed straight at.
With the exiting ability of this ship in such bad form now I will not be using it in solo missions like last night again.
The night previously I had a thorax with the same two modules in the low slots. It would exit in 3 to 4 seconds if pointed in the direction of travel. It still beat the time of the blackbird (pointed at the object) if it was traveling at top speed in the oposite direction of its object to warp to.
There is still use of this ship, but it would involve having a force big enough to take down anything that they encountered. Sort of a support ship now. Also I do understand that a MWD would be able to get you out of range of almost anything if you had sensor dampeners to drop thier targetting range. 3 dampeners should suffice 4 if you want to be safe.
All in all the nerf ends up making the best solo ship for PVP the worst ship to ever run from an overwhelming force. The fleeing aspect of PVP is a big part unless you like to loose ships and pods a lot.
Its stand off capabilities are still good, but the chasing of another ship is also just a hope and a prayer now.
EVE Dev's please take a second look at the blackbird. I am not asking that it be the best but at least allow it to compete with the other ships in its catagory. |
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