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So we're Dev Hacking Skill Injectors into existence now?

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Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34065	Posted - 2016.07.01 10:15:21 - [1] - Quote I just want to make sure we're all in agreement that it's okay to create SP from thin air, RE: the reward for Iceland winning the Euro football championship (go Iceland, yay football!) OR will the Injectors be bought from the market using seized funds, in order to preserve the market instead of trampling it? If the plan is to magick the Injectors into everyone's redeeming queue and we're okay with it, that means we've come full circle from the original reasoning that all SP will be generated by subscribed players. And I'm just curious if that has finally happened. Boiling frogs, man. Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
chelly Dian Mosquito Squadron The-Culture 56	Posted - 2016.07.01 10:28:00 - [2] - Quote Much like PLEX given away in Frost sites and once that CCP injected a large number of PLEX to stabilise market - they come from banned accounts for RMT.
Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34065	Posted - 2016.07.01 10:30:40 - [3] - Quote do you know how many characters you'd have to extract to provide an injector to every active account Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Neadayan Drakhon Heuristic Industrial And Development AddictClan 299	Posted - 2016.07.01 10:33:51 - [4] - Quote Rain6637 wrote: do you know how many characters you'd have to extract to provide an injector to every active account 1 per active account of course
chelly Dian Mosquito Squadron The-Culture 56	Posted - 2016.07.01 10:37:09 - [5] - Quote Aprox 160k I would say My number might be wrong. Also CCP was beting on something like - if Trump wins and then decides to gove away his wealth and go live in Tibet as a monk we ill give out injectors. Not out of realm possible. Just amazingly unlikely. I understand youre logic - its not the bet, its that they were ready to make SP out of thin air. I would argue they wouldnt make it out of thin air, more likely take a "loan" in SP that would be covered by future RMT bans.
Yarosara Ruil 394	Posted - 2016.07.01 10:55:30 - [6] - Quote Here's hoping Iceland wins the Euro then! Just to annoy you guys. I'm more hyped about Quafe SKINs though!
Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34066	Posted - 2016.07.01 11:06:07 - [7] - Quote Yarosara Ruil wrote: Here's hoping Iceland wins the Euro then! Just to annoy you guys. I'm more hyped about Quafe SKINs though! I totally hope Iceland wins. I am American and impartial, because not EU and our football is different (and I'm sure Iceland could field a HUGE american football team). I could also really go for an Injector per account. I will use them just like everyone else. I'm just curious if we've fully accepted SP as something that can be given out on this scale. Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34066	Posted - 2016.07.01 11:09:52 - [8] - Quote chelly Dian wrote: Aprox 160k I would say My number might be wrong. Also CCP was beting on something like - if Trump wins and then decides to gove away his wealth and go live in Tibet as a monk we ill give out injectors. Not out of realm possible. Just amazingly unlikely. I understand youre logic - its not the bet, its that they were ready to make SP out of thin air. I would argue they wouldnt make it out of thin air, more likely take a "loan" in SP that would be covered by future RMT bans. I suppose 45 billion SP doesn't seem so crazy. I have more than 1.5 billion SP across my characters. CCP have you seized 45 billion SP in characters? Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Elinara Yamamoto Latex Entosis Insignificant Others 42	Posted - 2016.07.01 11:15:22 - [9] - Quote They will not win the final so do not worry, I hope they do get there though, to play Germany, the country I was born in :)
Mephiztopheleze Republic University Minmatar Republic 765	Posted - 2016.07.01 11:17:12 - [10] - Quote Rain6637 wrote: CCP have you seized 45 billion SP in characters? i'm gonna go out on a limb here and say: yes they probably have over the years. Occasional Resident Newbie Correspondent for TMC: http://themittani.com/search/site/mephiztopheleze This is my Forum Main. My Combat Alt is sambo Inkura

Neadayan Drakhon Heuristic Industrial And Development AddictClan 299	Posted - 2016.07.01 11:34:47 - [11] - Quote Rain6637 wrote: Yarosara Ruil wrote: Here's hoping Iceland wins the Euro then! Just to annoy you guys. I'm more hyped about Quafe SKINs though! I totally hope Iceland wins. I am American and impartial, because not EU and our football is different (and I'm sure Iceland could field a HUGE american football team). I could also really go for an Injector per account. I will use them just like everyone else. I'm just curious if we've fully accepted SP as something that can be given out on this scale. CCP giving out SP gifts (such as they sometimes do for extended server outages), fine Skill trading in any form, no. This will never be ok.
Felix Judge Regnum Ludorum 46	Posted - 2016.07.01 11:40:51 - [12] - Quote I endorse the original question. CCP claimed that no SP would be created out of thin air when they introduced Skill Injectors. Unless they get those SP from somewhere where they were created in the so-far only-acceptable way, they would turn their backs on that claim. And the question is not only academic, given Iceland's chances to win the UEFA cup - if CCP are ready to do it here, they may be ready to do it on some other occasion, too.
Neadayan Drakhon Heuristic Industrial And Development AddictClan 299	Posted - 2016.07.01 11:55:11 - [13] - Quote Felix Judge wrote: CCP claimed that no SP would be created out of thin air when they introduced Skill Injectors. Unless they get those SP from somewhere where they were created in the so-far only-acceptable way, they would turn their backs on that claim. They already made a lie out of that claim with the SP dailies.
Memphis Baas 1670	Posted - 2016.07.01 12:10:37 - [14] - Quote It's moot; PB accounts are out of the game, so it's still "from thin air." Just assume they've changed the stance to "yes it's ok to give free skillpoints," because just like with PLEX it's not a black-and-white issue; rather, it's another tool they can use to correct and control the economy. Injectors are replacing PLEX as the de-facto high-roller currency, and adding skillpoints from thin air controls the price of injectors. Also the "free sample" can drive up sales, as people get a taste and get hooked. It's all economics. They've finally figured out how to prevent "burn Jita" events: introduce the controversial stuff slowly, in chunks that are small enough to be acceptable.
Daemun Khanid Kameiran Order Team Amarrica 576	Posted - 2016.07.01 12:22:44 - [15] - Quote The sp that has dissapeared into thin air from extractors I've used on myself and injectors bought on the market and used on my alt more than cover any "free" sp I'm likely to recieve EVER. And imagine that same vanished sp accumulated across all injector use easily covers a free injector for each account. But ultimately wgaf? Ppl making isking off sp trading arent gonna go bankrupt over a single injector per character. Hell, even a huge percentage of that "sp from thin air" is gonna vanish right back into thin air. Daemun of Khanid
Shae Tadaruwa Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 547	Posted - 2016.07.01 12:42:49 - [16] - Quote Rain6637 wrote: I just want to make sure we're all in agreement that it's okay to create SP from thin air, RE: the reward for Iceland winning the Euro football championship (go Iceland, yay football!). It's just CCP teasing because this won't happen.
Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34068	Posted - 2016.07.01 12:58:03 - [17] - Quote look at all the euros itt Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Memphis Baas 1670	Posted - 2016.07.01 13:46:19 - [18] - Quote Shae Tadaruwa wrote: It's just CCP teasing because this won't happen. Seriously, it's only been 2 years since Germany completely humiliated Brazil and beat Argentina in the last World Cup. Even if Iceland beats France, then they'll be in the exact same position as Brazil during the World Cup, vs. Germany in the semi finals. CCP may as well promise 100 million skillpoints to everyone; it won't happen.
Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34070	Posted - 2016.07.01 14:13:20 - [19] - Quote hey so I kind of feel like out-of-game stuff discussions should be in OOPE. This thread is about ethics in video game XP Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Keebler Wizard Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 9	Posted - 2016.07.01 14:20:58 - [20] - Quote Quote: So we're Dev Hacking Skill Injectors into existence now? 1 - Dev's dont 'hack'. 2 - Are we? Where's your source? 3 - Other SP giveaways magik too? 4 - Elitist goon with too much money complaining about giveaways? This thread is so full of holes I could drive a bus through it. I don't follow sports either.

DeODokktor Dark Templars The Fonz Presidium 60	Posted - 2016.07.01 14:28:14 - [21] - Quote Will it even make a big difference? It is hard to know how many accounts are "Active", but even assuming that 160k then there's not "that" much being added to the system. A lot of players will inject this item as it is something they cant afford so they will just be happy and inject. And as another poster said... How much "Server SP" has been eaten by the losses? Just the top players on eveboard seem to have eaten about 14 billion SP (losses taken into account!).. Going by how many has been sold/resold then it looks like probably a good 300 billion SP has been taken out of play, so them giving 25-30 billion back out to players will not make much of a difference at all, on top of that they would have done some maths behind it I am sure... Perhaps the math is more like a drug dealer "First hit free", but It's not going to be enough to destroy the game. The key thing here is that everyone will get it, so the only people who will be at a disadvantage are those people that do not have active accounts. My accounts were not active during the recent "Free SP" giveaways that they had due to server issues, that would be nice to have but its not a big deal as my accounts were not active. My question would be, if your using MCT do you get the gift for all characters in active training, or is it just one gift max per account. They should reward players with MCT too, else it makes MCT look a little useless.
Robert Sawyer Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 111	Posted - 2016.07.01 20:38:20 - [22] - Quote As an avid Iceland supporter, I am absolutely positive that it can make it to the finals. Anyways, CCP should consider giving us 500k SP in case of a win, that would be very nice. And about skill trading... I sink money into skill injectors from time to time, but I agree that it is a practice that makes the game unbalanced and pay-to-win. Some guy made a new character and dumped $7,000 to max out all skills so ayyy, not fair. "And when, at last, the moment is yours, that agony will become your greatest triumph."
Tyberius Franklin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 1971	Posted - 2016.07.01 21:12:55 - [23] - Quote A bit late for this reasoning isn't it? Freely created SP by CCP predates skill injectors. We've received a few unplanned downtime compensations over the years in SP form. Also, as someone who argued from that side when this came up these feel like 2 different concepts you're conflating. One being the issue of direct sale of SP negating the value of training rather than trade strengthening that value, the other being the ability of CCP to hand out gifts on certain occasions, which while they arguably have a similar effect, the latter does so on a muuuuuuch lower scale and only once per incident of giving. I doubt confiscated accounts has any bearing here since it's a gift rather than a market adjustment or in game event.
Frostys Virpio Yet another corpdot. 2951	Posted - 2016.07.01 21:18:02 - [24] - Quote I really like the "narrative" people have where SP coming out of thin air is SOOOOOOOOOOOO bad but completely forgetting every single god damn SP in the game is effectively coming out of thin air...
Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34076	Posted - 2016.07.01 21:45:22 - [25] - Quote Hey guys, I feel like there's a difference between 500k unallocated and a Skill Injector. One would be a free week of subscription time benefit, which has been done for quite a few years like you have mentioned. Gifting a SKill Injector, however, is different because there's a recent in-game market for those, and one of the guarantees for its stability was that Injectors would only come from subscribing players. Giving unallocated also requires the consumption of Skill Extractors which would at least maintain the relationship between AUR, PLEX, and Skill Injectors, and preserve the process of having to extract SP. CCP I hope you agree that directly awarding Injectors trashes an in-game market needlessly. Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
KaarBaak Squirrel Team 370	Posted - 2016.07.01 21:50:24 - [26] - Quote Maybe this belongs in Market Discussions? Sounds like someone invested some isk speculating the injector market and is worried about a glut. Personally, I'd rather see straight SP rather than an injector. KB Dum Spiro Spero Not getting SP for not killing a rat is like not getting ore for not mining an asteroid.
Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34077	Posted - 2016.07.01 22:24:15 - [27] - Quote They'll find none of my characters have Injectors, and I've only used four total to transfer SP between them. Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Rain6637 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 34078	Posted - 2016.07.01 22:45:20 - [28] - Quote Market discussion: Will giving a Skill Injector to each account #rek the Skill Injector market? Yes How much? A lot probably. /thread so now can we continue with this one Help, I can't download EVE President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
KaarBaak Squirrel Team 371	Posted - 2016.07.01 22:50:34 - [29] - Quote Rain6637 wrote: Market discussion: Will giving a Skill Injector to each account #rek the Skill Injector market? Yes How much? A lot probably. /thread so now can we continue with this one So, if it's not about the market, then what's the big deal? Some folks get isk...some get sp. Sounds like a win-win. (or is it a win-win-win?) No...No...definitely just a win-win. KB Dum Spiro Spero Not getting SP for not killing a rat is like not getting ore for not mining an asteroid.
Roenok Baalnorn Sadistically Sinister 144	Posted - 2016.07.01 23:06:37 - [30] - Quote even if i got one injector per account i would still be in the negative for what i bought and what i actually injected. in fact i would be in the hole enough to supply another injector or two. some players have injected all the way to 500 mil sp. from start. Those alone would probably nearly cover everyone in jita right now. So i think its safe to say that ccp will of "created" less sp than was lost since skill injectors came out with this.



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