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Awox Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.25 11:13:00 - [1] CCP since you have 1. Introduced Warp To Zero, 2. Made mission-spots hard to find and 3. Implemented crazy tanks.. you haven't really given much to the outlaws. So, here are my feature requests for outlaws 1. There needs to be a "This system is High Security" warning, which should be enabled even if the "This system is Low Security" warning is turned off. 2. Stop making remote assisting a criminal a criminal act, this hinders us when we wish to fight in legitimate wars it makes logistics ships next to useless. 3. Consider revising the criminal timer system so you can actually travel without getting re-flagged. 4. Jumping into high-sec should mean you are immediately dead if you are in a frigate and -5, you should have a chance to get back to the gate, maybe a 10-15 second delay? 5. Give -10.0 secstat characters are 10% damage bonus (just kidding) BOOST OUTLAWS
Trypho Minmatar Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.25 12:37:00 - [2] /signed! ---
Alan Maher Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.25 12:43:00 - [3] Its about time the other half of EVE got a boost
Chruker	Posted - 2007.03.25 13:41:00 - [4] Originally by: Alan Maher Its about time the other half of EVE got a boost other half? more like the annoying half. I'd say make their life more difficult: - No stargates should service players lower than -1.0, let them be stuck in a system until ratting have made their sec. status high enough. - When their sec. reaches -10.0 their character should be deleted. - many more evil ideas coming ----- http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online ----- Top 3 wishes: 1: No daily downtime. 2: Updated dump of the database. 3: An update of the ingame browser, to fix ex: slow tables.
NightmareX Caldari Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.25 14:39:00 - [5] Originally by: Chruker Originally by: Alan Maher Its about time the other half of EVE got a boost other half? more like the annoying half. I'd say make their life more difficult: - No stargates should service players lower than -1.0, let them be stuck in a system until ratting have made their sec. status high enough. - When their sec. reaches -10.0 their character should be deleted. - many more evil ideas coming LMAO, best carebear reply ever. Yeah make the pirate life harder so carebears can have much much easier life in EVE, oh yeah, that sounds really cool Let's say it other ways, when characters get +5.0 in sec status, then delete the character, does that sounds fun to all of you carebears lol? But yeah, i totally agree with the OP Infinitus Odium - We Are The Bringers Of Hatred
Trypho Minmatar Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.25 15:38:00 - [6] Yeah, lets all hop into our barges in safe empire and have a nice, safe grinding environment! Awox has a good point here - something for outlaws would be in place. Frigates and cruisers for instance are useless in lowsec because they get instapopped by sentries; this means catching a smaller ship is very hard. Battleships however can tank sentries for ages. Interceptors in theory are very nice ships for piracy, but they are useless in lowsec. This should change imo. ---
Raziel Saston Deviance Cartel	Posted - 2007.03.27 05:35:00 - [7] Remote assisting definitely needs sorted
Ryas Nia Minmatar Stormriders Fimbulwinter	Posted - 2007.03.27 07:03:00 - [8] remote booster is the only one i really agree with, some of the others might be nice but they just make it too easy to be a lazy -10. Also AF's and interceptors can tank guns long enough to run from them if your quick about it... Updated Item Database thanks to Dal Rath
Awox Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.29 15:37:00 - [9] Originally by: Ryas Nia make it too easy to be a lazy -10. Because being a care-bear running missions all day isn't difficult, hell, I wish when I was pirating I had nearly impossible to probe safe spots. Originally by: Ryas Nia Also AF's and interceptors can tank guns long enough to run from them if your quick about it... Decent inty speed tackle setup can not tank sentry guns, warping off in structure doesn't count. - BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it)
Hesed Hamartia.	Posted - 2007.03.29 17:35:00 - [10] Edited by: Hesed on 29/03/2007 17:38:30 Remote repping/boosting + flagging is kinda broke. -A 3rd party remote repping should be pvpable w/ no consequences.. like being ganged. -Should get same response from guns as sniper. -Should Not generate same concordokken flagging in empire. However, fixing it will either involve adding something, or (and) breaking something else. As is, Gallente Navy comes after you with uber webs if you try to enter their space with -5.0 concord standing. They should only care if you have -5.0 Gallente standing. Concord should only respond to pvp flagging timers. It costs money and resources to move around and get setup for piracy in a new area. You cannot drag your ship through empire, only your pod. The same exact effort and risk industrialists have to take or more. Killing ships and podding people in Gallente space, either high sec or lowsec, should generate negative gallente standing -- but -- generate positive Caldari/Amarr standing. This should happen at an even 1:1 ratio. Noone should ever be barred from ALL of the empires. Half of them would be adequate. Empires shouldn't be run by carebears, but instead by self-interested parties who have a stake in the relative welfare of their regions. As far as they are concerned, industrialists could just be funding evil anti-state entities. Faction controlled gate and station sentries should just open up based on standing. Shooting npcs should have some effect I suppose, but you should be able to get by ignoring the stupid npcs too. Pirates and anti-pirates alike generally do not want to sit around and shoot stupid little red crosses that don't do anything remotely challenging. If it wasn't clear enough: NPCS SUCK
Keitaro Baka Babylon Scientific and Industrial Enterprises Babylon Project	Posted - 2007.03.30 07:08:00 - [11] Originally by: Hesed Edited by: Hesed on 29/03/2007 17:54:41 Remote repping/boosting + flagging is kinda broke. -A 3rd party remote repping should be pvpable w/ no consequences.. like being ganged. -Should get same response from guns as sniper. -Should Not generate same concordokken flagging in empire. However, fixing it will either involve adding something, or (and) breaking something else. As is, Gallente Navy comes after you with uber webs if you try to enter their space with -5.0 concord standing. They should only care if you have -5.0 Gallente standing. Concord should only respond to pvp flagging timers. It costs money and resources to move around and get setup for piracy in a new area. You cannot drag your ship through empire, only your pod. The same exact effort and risk industrialists have to take or more. Killing ships and podding people in Gallente space, either high sec or lowsec, should generate negative gallente standing -- but -- generate positive Caldari/Amarr standing. This should happen at an even 1:1 ratio. Noone should ever be barred from ALL of the empires. Half of them would be adequate. Empires shouldn't be run by carebears, but instead by self-interested parties who have a stake in the relative welfare of their regions. As far as they are concerned, industrialists could just be funding evil anti-state entities. Faction controlled gate and station sentries should just open up based on standing. Shooting npcs should have some effect I suppose, but you should be able to get by ignoring the stupid npcs too. Pirates and anti-pirates alike generally do not want to sit around and shoot stupid little red crosses that don't do anything remotely challenging. If it wasn't clear enough: NPCS SUCK As a big pirate hater, I can still be somewhat objective I feel: This one sounds ok.. if you have a -5.0 or lower sec rating (hence concord) I kinda agree the Factions might let concord know... but you should be ok to travel through a system, like have them come to check it out after 5 minutes.. means you can still travel (but if you are blinkerdyblink red players in high sec might chase you down, I know I do..), but not be an evil pirate in high sec. If you have -5.0 faction standing the faction should come after you with a decent vengeance (and yes I have -5.0 faction standing myself so stfu). And I also agree with Hesed that aiding a criminal is an act which should be punishable. Your target should get kill rights, be able to shoot etc etc. So I like this reply. All the stuff above does not necessarily reflect my corp, my alliance or even me.. Drone guide..
Hesed Amarr Hamartia.	Posted - 2007.03.30 07:19:00 - [12] Edited by: Hesed on 30/03/2007 07:17:39 I kinda like the idea of letting the players manage those with the wrong faction standings in the wrong locations. However, sentries and gate fuzz should still open up, only without the following into warp and the uberwebs. Just enough to make life unpleasant. Getting aggro flagged should normally get you popped by concordokken. This system should make it a bit harder to do suicide ganks, except in the belts of course. Well, at least they have to move around, but the faction status could change quick if the sentry hostilities were ranked low enough. One option could be the higher the security status of a system, the faster faction standing reverses course (mostly affects pvp, not npcs). Alternately, flagging + bad faction sec could result in podding. I would like if low local faction sec = free podding for player interaction though. This sort of system would make it hard for the pirates to dock, which I feel is a reasonably acceptable compromise. Carebears use POS for hiding from pirates, so Pirates might as well need their own friendly POS for storing ships. I cannot see any downsides to this. - Good. + - Bad.
Awox Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.30 13:31:00 - [13] Originally by: Hesed Edited by: Hesed on 30/03/2007 07:17:39 I kinda like the idea of letting the players manage those with the wrong faction standings in the wrong locations. However, sentries and gate fuzz should still open up, only without the following into warp and the uberwebs. Just enough to make life unpleasant. Getting aggro flagged should normally get you popped by concordokken. This system should make it a bit harder to do suicide ganks, except in the belts of course. Well, at least they have to move around, but the faction status could change quick if the sentry hostilities were ranked low enough. One option could be the higher the security status of a system, the faster faction standing reverses course (mostly affects pvp, not npcs). Alternately, flagging + bad faction sec could result in podding. I would like if low local faction sec = free podding for player interaction though. This sort of system would make it hard for the pirates to dock, which I feel is a reasonably acceptable compromise. Carebears use POS for hiding from pirates, so Pirates might as well need their own friendly POS for storing ships. I cannot see any downsides to this. Talking about low-sec here, stop derailing my bloody thread. Thankyou. - BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it)
Elain Reverse Caldari Shokei	Posted - 2007.03.30 13:52:00 - [14] I fully agree with deparate high/low sec warnings. But... any help to criminal should criminaly flag too, if they want to be involved they should be, but with all consequences, no easy peacy PVP. I would agree with 5 seconds delay after each warp before concords or navy start shooting due standing (instantly with direct agression) 10s is too much and with high sec warning they should not go accidentaly there. It will allow them to jump thru higsec if they are fast enough, but also leave some risks to them to loose ship due players involvements or lags, possible but no easy travell thru high sec. But on oposite give no sec status penalty for kiling char with -5 or lower sec. standing.
Elain Reverse Caldari Shokei	Posted - 2007.03.30 14:00:00 - [15] Originally by: Hesed Edited by: Hesed on 29/03/2007 17:54:41 Remote repping/boosting + flagging is kinda broke. -A 3rd party remote repping should be pvpable w/ no consequences.. like being ganged. -Should get same response from guns as sniper. -Should Not generate same concordokken flagging in empire. However, fixing it will either involve adding something, or (and) breaking something else. As is, Gallente Navy comes after you with uber webs if you try to enter their space with -5.0 concord standing. They should only care if you have -5.0 Gallente standing. Concord should only respond to pvp flagging timers. It costs money and resources to move around and get setup for piracy in a new area. You cannot drag your ship through empire, only your pod. The same exact effort and risk industrialists have to take or more. Killing ships and podding people in Gallente space, either high sec or lowsec, should generate negative gallente standing -- but -- generate positive Caldari/Amarr standing. This should happen at an even 1:1 ratio. Noone should ever be barred from ALL of the empires. Half of them would be adequate. Empires shouldn't be run by carebears, but instead by self-interested parties who have a stake in the relative welfare of their regions. As far as they are concerned, industrialists could just be funding evil anti-state entities. Faction controlled gate and station sentries should just open up based on standing. Shooting npcs should have some effect I suppose, but you should be able to get by ignoring the stupid npcs too. Pirates and anti-pirates alike generally do not want to sit around and shoot stupid little red crosses that don't do anything remotely challenging. If it wasn't clear enough: NPCS SUCK Well its not hard to maintain good sec standing if you dont kiling inocent people too often. For loosing any faction standing i would say no, its even too hard to not go to farr with standing for your oposite faction as it is. So Empire is only for carrebars ? Dont think so, its for everyon except criminals. If you want to fight go to 0.0 or wardec someon, no sec standing penalty but if you like ganking players mostly without any chance from them to fight back, its clearly YOUR CHOICE. Take it as in Real life, when you kill some peaple, destroy property, steal etc, you will become criminal and and cops will go after you, Cops = Concord plus faction Navy.
Aslann Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.30 19:27:00 - [16] Originally by: Awox 2. Stop making remote assisting a criminal a criminal act, this hinders us when we wish to fight in legitimate wars it makes logistics ships next to useless. Aye its so stupid that the sentries start shooting you if you rep somebody that is a criminal, even if they arent flagged :(.
Reggie Stoneloader eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.03.30 23:07:00 - [17] Edited by: Reggie Stoneloader on 30/03/2007 23:04:34 I like #1, #2 and #3. #4 is hilarious. Actually, I think the sec standing system is what's most broken. It's the cause of all these problems. I think criminal and outlaw status should not last forever. If you gank in low-sec, you're -1 in for one day. If you gank twice within an hour during that day, you're -2 for two days, then -1 for one day, then in the clear. If you gank twice within two consecutive hours during that two days, you're -3 for 3 days, then -2 for two days, then -1 for one day. You get the picture. Once you're down to -10, you've got almost two months before your standing is 0 again, and it just takes two kills within any ten hour period within ten days of your last killing spree to maintain your jolly roger. So you are what you repeatedly do, as Aristotle would have it. Aggression without a kill is a two-hour criminal flag with no change in sec. Fifteen minutes isn't even an inconvenience. You can get sec back by just keeping your nose clean, without the obligation to butcher hordes of NPCs, which is great for carebears who come to one another's rescue against undesirables, but don't make a career of whacking newbs. And get rid of positive sec standing. It doesn't mean anything, and just gives carebears an excuse to not help shoot the pirates, which makes them sissies and bores the pirates.
Lakotnik The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.31 02:07:00 - [18] 1.) OK, good suggestion. 2.) Totally stupid. Have you ever seen/heard y remote assist was made criminal act. I dont think so, or you just want to exploit this... NO, NEVER AGAIN!!!! 3.) As i currently have more any more encounters with retarder pirates that know just how to run i would acutally prevent docking or jumping to ppl with global countdown. It actually makes sense - why would empire help pirates travel, they should be prevented from doing this... 4.) goes under 1. point. You should be warned. then killed on sight... Tell me just 1 reason why would empire want piracy at their borders... I m not that for realism, but empire helping pirates seems totally stupid whatever point you look at it. (oh cept you are a pirate and want easy kills) -- Smile, tomorrow will be worse.
Horza Otho Minmatar Infortunatus Eventus	Posted - 2007.03.31 03:58:00 - [19] Originally by: Chruker Originally by: Alan Maher Its about time the other half of EVE got a boost other half? more like the annoying half. I'd say make their life more difficult: - No stargates should service players lower than -1.0, let them be stuck in a system until ratting have made their sec. status high enough. - When their sec. reaches -10.0 their character should be deleted. - many more evil ideas coming You sir are an idiot. Deactivate your subscription.
Hesed Amarr Hamartia.	Posted - 2007.03.31 04:17:00 - [20] Originally by: Awox Talking about low-sec here, stop derailing my bloody thread. Thankyou. The sec system is applied globally, and its a linear system. Whatever we do to lowsec applies to highsec as well. Also, I hijack everything. Including threads. I will be very bored if you don't try and stop me. - Good. + - Bad.
Elain Reverse Caldari Shokei	Posted - 2007.03.31 05:20:00 - [21] Originally by: Reggie Stoneloader Edited by: Reggie Stoneloader on 30/03/2007 23:04:34 I like #1, #2 and #3. #4 is hilarious. Actually, I think the sec standing system is what's most broken. It's the cause of all these problems. I think criminal and outlaw status should not last forever. If you gank in low-sec, you're -1 in for one day. If you gank twice within an hour during that day, you're -2 for two days, then -1 for one day, then in the clear. If you gank twice within two consecutive hours during that two days, you're -3 for 3 days, then -2 for two days, then -1 for one day. You get the picture. Once you're down to -10, you've got almost two months before your standing is 0 again, and it just takes two kills within any ten hour period within ten days of your last killing spree to maintain your jolly roger. So you are what you repeatedly do, as Aristotle would have it. Aggression without a kill is a two-hour criminal flag with no change in sec. Fifteen minutes isn't even an inconvenience. You can get sec back by just keeping your nose clean, without the obligation to butcher hordes of NPCs, which is great for carebears who come to one another's rescue against undesirables, but don't make a career of whacking newbs. And get rid of positive sec standing. It doesn't mean anything, and just gives carebears an excuse to not help shoot the pirates, which makes them sissies and bores the pirates. Definetly against autogaining any standing. If pirates want better standing them should work for it and killing belt rats is working well. Thay have easy life enogh as it is.
Reggie Stoneloader eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.03.31 15:47:00 - [22] Originally by: Elain Reverse Definetly against autogaining any standing. If pirates want better standing them should work for it and killing belt rats is working well. Thay have easy life enogh as it is. But pirates don't care about having low sec status. Only very rarely will a pirate "go straight". Most, like many of the posters in this thread, cherish their low security status and work to maintain it. They use hauler alts in NPC corps to do all their shopping, and suffer no ill effects at all from the -10. The people that have a real problem with low security status are the ones who aren't combat-oriented. Miners and haulers and industrialists who can't fly anything bigger than a frigate or maybe a cruiser in battle lost security for fighting in low-sec space, because a 15-minute timer isn't enough to catch and kill a pirate, and the only way to get rid of them is to attack them when they aren't flagged. A few little sec losses, maybe a podkill or two, and your sec is getting low. You don't gain sec from shooting rocks or from doing hauling missions or from refining ore at stations, so you're stuck. A carebear tackler with -1.5 sec will be yellow for years, because they don't have the option of hopping in a Raven and chugging around 0.0 belts for an afternoon. My suggestion was most to give them a chance to recover their security.
Elain Reverse Caldari Shokei	Posted - 2007.03.31 17:19:00 - [23] Originally by: Reggie Stoneloader Originally by: Elain Reverse Definetly against autogaining any standing. If pirates want better standing them should work for it and killing belt rats is working well. Thay have easy life enogh as it is. But pirates don't care about having low sec status. Only very rarely will a pirate "go straight". Most, like many of the posters in this thread, cherish their low security status and work to maintain it. They use hauler alts in NPC corps to do all their shopping, and suffer no ill effects at all from the -10. The people that have a real problem with low security status are the ones who aren't combat-oriented. Miners and haulers and industrialists who can't fly anything bigger than a frigate or maybe a cruiser in battle lost security for fighting in low-sec space, because a 15-minute timer isn't enough to catch and kill a pirate, and the only way to get rid of them is to attack them when they aren't flagged. A few little sec losses, maybe a podkill or two, and your sec is getting low. You don't gain sec from shooting rocks or from doing hauling missions or from refining ore at stations, so you're stuck. A carebear tackler with -1.5 sec will be yellow for years, because they don't have the option of hopping in a Raven and chugging around 0.0 belts for an afternoon. My suggestion was most to give them a chance to recover their security. For me much better ide is not giving sec, status penalty for killing anyon with status +5 or lower. I got 0.5 sec status in few hours just mining in belt in 0.5 system and leting drones to kill spawning rats. And if i remeber well some missions against some race (serpentis i think) give huge sec boost too.
Reggie Stoneloader eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.03.31 22:34:00 - [24] Originally by: Elain Reverse I got 0.5 sec status in few hours just mining in belt in 0.5 system and leting drones to kill spawning rats. I'm not sure I believe that. Quote: And if i remeber well some missions against some race (serpentis i think) give huge sec boost too. That's high-level combat, which requires a month or two of training that contributes absolutely nothing to your non-combat profession. You don't need to train industrial skills to loot your victims and sell the equipment, you shouldn't need to train combat skills to defend your miners. Did someone say thread hijack? I guess this is a pretty close tangent, since I still maintain that these two problems are intimately linked, and a solution to both is possible.
R osur	Posted - 2007.03.31 22:38:00 - [25] Nice idea. \signed
Awox Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.03 06:09:00 - [26] Originally by: Lakotnik 2.) Totally stupid. Have you ever seen/heard y remote assist was made criminal act. I dont think so, or you just want to exploit this... NO, NEVER AGAIN!!!! I said in low-sec. Please read my threads and stop jumping to conclusions. Stop assuming I want to exploit something, I just want to participate in CONCORD sanctioned wars with my outlaw corp to the best of my abilities. Currently I get sentried if I repair my out-law mates as they are attacking CONCORD sanctioned war targets. Originally by: Lakotnik 3.) As i currently have more any more encounters with retarder pirates that know just how to run i would acutally prevent docking or jumping to ppl with global countdown. It actually makes sense - why would empire help pirates travel, they should be prevented from doing this... Perhaps you should come to Molden Heath and see how the "retarder pirates" are. I think you'll find we'll send you packing no matter what. Originally by: Lakotnik 4.) goes under 1. point. You should be warned. then killed on sight... I'm glad you can be reasonable sometimes. Originally by: Lakotnik Tell me just 1 reason why would empire want piracy at their borders... I m not that for realism, but empire helping pirates seems totally stupid whatever point you look at it. (oh cept you are a pirate and want easy kills) I wish you would come to my system and give me a difficult kill. I'll have you know not all piracy is easy. A lot of it is difficult and sometimes it can be a real let down (for instance when you shoot at everyone and a region goes dead) - not to mention when you do you are impaired when you want to fly logistics in a valid war. - BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it)
Drizit Amarr	Posted - 2007.04.03 07:56:00 - [27] Edited by: Drizit on 03/04/2007 07:55:55 /signed I like the suggestion made by Awox. I hate pirates but they are an essential part of the Eve gameplay . The ideas are not asking for much but allow pirates to recover some from the recent nerfs they've received, especially with WTZ. However, now they must realise what it's like to be gimped like the miners have always been because of macroers. --
Awox Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.06 04:20:00 - [28] Accidental bump! - BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it)
Hori To Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.04.08 18:01:00 - [29] not beeing able to support your corpmates with remote whatever vs wartargets just seem dumb, having a hi-sec warning box would also be handy.
Stakhanov Shih Yang Tong	Posted - 2007.04.08 23:10:00 - [30] Originally , the criminal assisting flagging was made to prevent concord tanking (after the Yulai incident) but it was implemented wrong - it should only be illegal to assist someone with an active criminal flag , not an outlaw. Then modules like remote sensor boosters might actually be used.
Sakaki Karazawa The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2007.04.09 00:08:00 - [31] I agree with all of the serious points the OP mentioned, except for one. Flagging the logistics ships as criminals/WTs for assisting criminals/WTs is... logical, really. :V Even though this is a game, I'll have to use this as an example, because I can't think of anything else: A guy robs a bank, runs off with the cash, and jumps in a getaway car. While the person driving the getaway car technically hasn't committed the robbery itself, they're ASSISTING the criminal. Or, on the war side of things, a nation goes to war with another. This hypothetical nation has many allies, but none of the allies will really commit anything to the war except maybe a token force here and there. Does that mean that that country doesn't deserve being attacked by the nation that the big one with all the allies is at war with, even though they provided soldiers for the big nation's cause? --- <Pallantre> 'should i join snigg or veto'? <Pallantre> and i thought.. thats like arguing whether you should join bloods or crips
Azuse	Posted - 2007.04.09 07:27:00 - [32] Originally by: Lakotnik 1.) OK, good suggestion. 2.) Totally stupid. Have you ever seen/heard y remote assist was made criminal act. I dont think so, or you just want to exploit this... NO, NEVER AGAIN!!!! 3.) As i currently have more any more encounters with retarder pirates that know just how to run i would acutally prevent docking or jumping to ppl with global countdown. It actually makes sense - why would empire help pirates travel, they should be prevented from doing this... 4.) goes under 1. point. You should be warned. then killed on sight... Tell me just 1 reason why would empire want piracy at their borders... I m not that for realism, but empire helping pirates seems totally stupid whatever point you look at it. (oh cept you are a pirate and want easy kills) Agreed.
dodge2005 Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.10 17:12:00 - [33] The only one which I REALY REALY want is the remote rep fix. if i rep someone in my corp and in my gand and they are less than -5 i get sentrd which isnt funny, and i loose sec also.
Awox Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.11 11:36:00 - [34] Originally by: Sakaki Karazawa A guy robs a bank, runs off with the cash, and jumps in a getaway car. While the person driving the getaway car technically hasn't committed the robbery itself, they're ASSISTING the criminal. That's not what I am asking for, not at all. Your analogy would hold true if I were asking for my corpmates to be able to repair me after committing a criminal act. I'm not. I'm asking them t be able to assist me during/after a legal 100% CONCORD sancianted act. Shooting at a war target, even when you are an out-law character shoot a non-outlaw character war target is not a crime. It doesn't trigger sentries. It doesn't give you a security status hit. Here's an analogy that actually works: A registered bounty hunter attempts to detain a target with the limits of the law and is stabbed in the chest. His bounty hunter friend drives him to the hospital. Okay it's not so good. But it's better than yours. - BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it)
Aslann Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.11 15:35:00 - [35] Originally by: Awox Here's an analogy that actually works: A registered bounty hunter attempts to detain a target with the limits of the law and is stabbed in the chest. His bounty hunter friend drives him to the hospital. This is how you want it to work, but its works like this the way it is now: A registered bounty hunter attempts to detain a target with the limits of the law and is stabbed in the chest. His bounty hunter friend wants to drive him to the hospital, but the seconds he touches him, cops appear out of nowhere and shoot him in the face.
Awox Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.12 13:46:00 - [36] in the face - BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it)
Awox Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.13 10:48:00 - [37] Are any of the devs caring at all? - BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it)
Strife Phoenix Acerbus Vindictum	Posted - 2007.04.13 11:28:00 - [38] Hm.. There is a reason for it to be called "Outlaw" If you can't take the heat then get back to "carebearing" as you put it when you really mean "noob" in a bad way. Life should be hard when beeing an outlaw, and the lower secstatus you get the harder your life should be. Heck I would like to see concord donk lowsec podpilots just for beeing in .5+ space no matter what. You might not have realized that YOU make the playing experience for rookies very bad by gatecamping the few lowsec-in-the-middle-of-highsec systems. I mean it is almost impossible to travel around empire without getting your ship destroyed and even podded these days. For many new pilots like myself that is a frigging nuisance to say the least since we sometimes can't even make the lvl1 rookie agent courier runs without being killed by some i-am-so-cool-55mSP-evil-pirate-that-prey-on-newbies. If this continues I am quite certain that a lot of potential future EVE players simply just go somewhere else. It is your choice to be a badguy and you should be living in fear of getting ratted out, pursued and killed.
Aslann Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.14 21:08:00 - [39] Edited by: Aslann on 14/04/2007 21:06:48 As soon as ppl stop transporting billions worth of items in rookie ships, we'll stop shooting em (Ok we prolly wont but still). Besides, not everybody can help being below -5, we are fighting an enemy with allot of 'neutral' allies that dont have the balls to wardec us, and since we arent carebears our corp couldnt really afford to have 5+ alliance wardecced. Yet the current system still prevents us for remote repping each other when engaging wartargets.
Thor Xian Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation	Posted - 2007.04.15 04:28:00 - [40] In all honesty, I think it would be better if you could enter hi sec as an outlaw without being pwned by NPCs. Let the players be the police. _________________________ ~Thor Xian, Star Commander
Del Narveux Obsidian Angels Enterprises	Posted - 2007.04.15 05:33:00 - [41] 1. Seems fair. 2. I could agree with this provided the assister gets flagged when the outlaw does a criminal act. I just dont want to make things easier for the lazy guys who sit in .4 travel routes with boosted instalock popping shuttles all day, its lame and it makes the manly pirates look bad. And as has been alluded to remote rep has led to some massive haxploit so if flagging rules get relaxed it would need to undergo some very heavy testing (and on a related note, FFS disable remote rep on npcs). 3. Meh. 4. I dont really care if the gate npcs get nerfed, thered just be more targets for anti pirates if -5's could travel through empire. We have warp to zero, give em 5 seconds or so warning to get out it should be enough for a frig or cruiser. Another thing Id like to add is they should tweak the guns to be most effective against big slow targets. I havent experienced it myself but apparently some people have been using carriers to make their gatecamps pretty much invincible and the sentries were designed back when tier 2 bs was the top of the line tank. Likewise inties and such should die a little less quickly (but still take damage from guns) as its actually possible for a cruiser or bs to kill them in self defense, as opposed to the aforementioned carrier boosted ganksquad. _________________ [SAK] Alumnus--And Proud Of It! -- aka Cpt Bogus Is that my torped sig cloaking your base? Originally by: Wrangler Well, at least we have forum PvP..
Aslann Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.15 09:18:00 - [42] As long as you make remote repping flag you to ppl's wartargets in the same way as joining a gang with somebody does (or just transfer the flags of the person getting repped to the person repping, which would mean if you rep a criminally flagged person you get criminally flagged. If you rep somebody in a war his wartargets can shoot you aswell etc etc)
Felysta Sandorn Caldari Murder of Crows E N I G M A	Posted - 2007.04.17 21:26:00 - [43] Originally by: Awox 3. Consider revising the criminal timer system so you can actually travel without getting re-flagged. 4. Jumping into high-sec should mean you are immediately dead if you are in a frigate and -5, you should have a chance to get back to the gate, maybe a 10-15 second delay? Make it so when you jump in to a new system you get a message like 'Felysta Sandorn, criminals are not tolerated in this area of space. Move away from the Warpgate or you will be destroyed', same for a station (undocking), then give the player 30 seconds to warp off (plenty of time to align and warp after decloaking), then fire and reset timer if they haven't moved. Make a similar system for highsec, so if you jump in by accident, you get the normal message 'leave or you will be destroyed', then give the user 1 minute to reapproach gate and jump out (or have something to check if they're reapproaching). If they stay in system, by all means, kill them. One of my alliance mates dropped to -2.1 after helping me out on a gate a couple of months ago, then didn't realise and jumped in to a 1.0 security system with no warnings... Got the message 'leave or get destroyed', so he tried to MWD back to the gate to leave, but he got triple webbed and killed... Luckily only in a thorax, but was on the way to get an Astarte I think... Really sucks! Killing With Ease
Bailian Moxtain Toys R Us R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.04.17 22:26:00 - [44] Edited by: Bailian Moxtain on 17/04/2007 22:23:54 Originally by: NightmareX Let's say it other ways, when characters get +5.0 in sec status, then delete the character, does that sounds fun to all of you carebears lol[:lol: ? which means ure char would have been deleted long time ago... shame ps. stop calling ppl carebears. we all know bout u and m. corp Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels -Shufo ([email protected]) *- made in Norway -*
NightmareX Caldari Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.19 14:25:00 - [45] Edited by: NightmareX on 19/04/2007 14:24:47 Originally by: Bailian Moxtain Edited by: Bailian Moxtain on 17/04/2007 22:23:54 Originally by: NightmareX Let's say it other ways, when characters get +5.0 in sec status, then delete the character, does that sounds fun to all of you carebears lol[:lol: ? which means ure char would have been deleted long time ago... shame ps. stop calling ppl carebears. we all know bout u and m. corp LOLOL, the story about M. Corp is just funny for me now, it's long time ago, and that time i was a carebear. So today i don't care about it. And this topic is about now / the future, so the past doesn't count Infinitus Odium - We Are The Bringers Of Hatred
Juliter Minmatar Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.04.22 12:01:00 - [46] Edited by: Juliter on 22/04/2007 11:58:10 1- You only can put bounty on a -5 ss char. 2- If you npc to -1.5 ss u bounty goes to the carebear that puts it on ur head 3- I hate carebears whit 5ss and bounty yes. 4- Only outlaws can fit scramblers/disruptors
Alexei Stryker	Posted - 2007.04.22 14:13:00 - [47] signed...
Tareen Kashaar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.26 17:58:00 - [48] Originally by: Awox 1. There needs to be a "This system is High Security" warning, which should be enabled even if the "This system is Low Security" warning is turned off. This would be handy, though I think it would be obsolete if just the autopilot security treshold would work properly. "Prefer less secure" should only travel through systems with a sec rating below the one you selected on the slider, and "prefer safer" should only use those above. Right now, it's just borked. --- WTS: Forum Signatures, 30mil a piece. Evemail me!
Arekhon Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2007.05.01 09:05:00 - [49] Originally by: Awox 1. There needs to be a "This system is High Security" warning, which should be enabled even if the "This system is Low Security" warning is turned off. 3. Consider revising the criminal timer system so you can actually travel without getting re-flagged. SIGNED....!!!! proud member of [BEES] my thoughts and ideas represent your corp
flexd Caldari The League of Legitimate Nigerian Businessmen	Posted - 2007.05.10 12:30:00 - [50] Originally by: Reggie Stoneloader Originally by: Elain Reverse I got 0.5 sec status in few hours just mining in belt in 0.5 system and leting drones to kill spawning rats. I'm not sure I believe that. Quote: And if i remeber well some missions against some race (serpentis i think) give huge sec boost too. That's high-level combat, which requires a month or two of training that contributes absolutely nothing to your non-combat profession. You don't need to train industrial skills to loot your victims and sell the equipment, you shouldn't need to train combat skills to defend your miners. Did someone say thread hijack? I guess this is a pretty close tangent, since I still maintain that these two problems are intimately linked, and a solution to both is possible. Actually, us pirates DO need to train industrial skills to be able to loot stuff. You furry carebear people keep carrying more and more valuable stuff, and how the hell else are we gonna be able to move the contents of haulers/freigthers without being able to fly one of our own. So don't go complaining, it's not our fault you choosed to stare at a 'roid all day, or kill endless streams of rats.
Eleana Tomelac Gallente	Posted - 2007.05.10 13:27:00 - [51] For the 4, the navies and concord shoud scramble the player but not yet engage the target, asking you if you will leave the high secure space without fighting. Then if you want to try to cross a system, it's much luck if there is concord or navy ships at the gate. -- Pocket drone carriers (tm) enthousiast ! Happy owner of a Vexor Navy Issue and few ishkurs. The Vexor Navy Issue is much more fun than the Myrmidon !
Kala Veijo Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Cult of War	Posted - 2007.05.17 12:22:00 - [52] As a former pirate i approve this thread. Quote: 3. Consider revising the criminal timer system so you can actually travel without getting re-flagged. How can we roam in small gangs if we¦ve to stop after each kill for 15 minutes? In my opinnion, sentries should only fire if pirate aggresses someone at gate, not when pirate pops hauler on belt. Warp Wind, CSM Chapter blog.
Leonardo Sabrioski Caldari Leviathan Enterprises	Posted - 2007.05.22 02:09:00 - [53] Originally by: NightmareX Originally by: Chruker Originally by: Alan Maher Its about time the other half of EVE got a boost other half? more like the annoying half. I'd say make their life more difficult: - No stargates should service players lower than -1.0, let them be stuck in a system until ratting have made their sec. status high enough. - When their sec. reaches -10.0 their character should be deleted. - many more evil ideas coming LMAO, best carebear reply ever. Yeah make the pirate life harder so carebears can have much much easier life in EVE, oh yeah, that sounds really cool Let's say it other ways, when characters get +5.0 in sec status, then delete the character, does that sounds fun to all of you carebears lol? But yeah, i totally agree with the OP Shoot at cans in low sec 0.4? - A lot easier than ratting your way up from -10.0 ----------------------------------------------
Azirapheal Amarr Ore Mongers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.05.22 14:54:00 - [54] someone had the rather tasty idea of only allowing outlaws to fit web/scrambler - this i like. maybe their fitting in itself could be a criminal act - since they are the chief tools of piracy. i do think that the faction status idea is a very good one and that concord etc should only intervene in high sec ganking - and that the faction police should react upon their own faction standings only. just as a controversial idea - space is big, really really big have all characters greater than 2 months old instapodded in 1.0 security systems - and make every .9-.5 lowsec ? since even the great empires could only in theory protect a handful of systems - this would a)force players into losec/00 and increase fighting etc around the galaxy. at the end of the day - you carebears got wtz amongst others (as well as increased ship hp, which killed frig soloing) just remember that the harder it is to kill = more goods in circulation = drop in prices meaning you have to mine more to get the same isk. azi - proud carebear advertising agency Yarrr sig nerf Thanks, Hango Hango touched me in the night I also stole all of your socks. He gave me the clean ones. -Rauth-he lied
Franconis Gallente	Posted - 2007.05.23 17:37:00 - [55] Originally by: Horza Otho Originally by: Chruker Originally by: Alan Maher Its about time the other half of EVE got a boost other half? more like the annoying half. I'd say make their life more difficult: - No stargates should service players lower than -1.0, let them be stuck in a system until ratting have made their sec. status high enough. - When their sec. reaches -10.0 their character should be deleted. - many more evil ideas coming You sir are an idiot. Deactivate your subscription. You are my hero. _________ Gallente FTW
Letheeth Kayl Amarr Chosen Path FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.12 19:49:00 - [56] Bump hahahahahahahaha PS Awox is mean, but I want to be an evil pirate again (warp to 0 killed my interests). Carebearing sux Put down the mirror and return to live With pain With sin With despair Live with penance in God's glory Lesson of Tobias and the Mirror Scriptures Verses26-29
Dogfighter Gallente ORUS Corporate United Corporations of Eve	Posted - 2007.06.12 20:06:00 - [57] Edited by: Dogfighter on 12/06/2007 20:05:06 CAREBEARS? Ah, come on, PIRATES hunting in high-sec with smartbombs are carebear tards too by default. If you need more space to kill your prey, don't cry because your sec status is too low and you can't go anywhere. If the low-sec space is not enough for you, go to 0.0 and fight like man, covard pirates, you won't loose your precious sec status. Pirates MUST get out of high security space. This is the definition of high-sec. Let's give the noobs some space to learn the basics. You were noobs some day before being hunters. Dogfighter, UCE Diplomat.
xKillaH Minmatar Cruor Frater Coalition of Carebear Killers	Posted - 2007.06.13 18:52:00 - [58] Originally by: Chruker Originally by: Alan Maher Its about time the other half of EVE got a boost other half? more like the annoying half. I'd say make their life more difficult: - No stargates should service players lower than -1.0, let them be stuck in a system until ratting have made their sec. status high enough. - When their sec. reaches -10.0 their character should be deleted. - many more evil ideas coming lol you must be pretty ****ed as pirates. Crying like that won't change anything Need a sig? Custom made signatures for eve forums
Tiirae	Posted - 2007.06.13 21:00:00 - [59] Edited by: Tiirae on 13/06/2007 20:59:34 There are some things here that I agree with. Others I do not. Firstly, you should only get flagged if you aid a flagged criminal--sec status should have nothing to do with it. I often fly logistics to help my corp mates test their setups, and I can't help the blinky ones because of sec status. This is wrong. Again, only aiding a flagged criminal should flag you. Secondly, the WTZ option doesn't hurt pirates, it hurts griefers and blobbers. A pirate is someone that legitimately hunts his prey and ransoms/kills the target for profit. WTZ only hurts gate or station campers, which aren't pirates. As for sec status, I fully agree with having it go up toward 0 over time. I've been trying to raise my sec status for much of the past month. Right now, it's -9.1. When I entered 0.0 to rat, it was -9.6. That means that, because my sec gain will slow down as it increases, it will take about a year to get back up to 0. And that's if I don't engage in combat. Seriously, it's hard to find agents in low sec, and my sec status dropped 7.4 points in a single week. Should I have to spend more than six months ratting in order to do a stupid mission? I agree that we need a high sec warning--BEFORE we jump through a gate. Not after. even though it's hard to survive a jump into high sec, it's possible to warp out in a frig, but only if you warp just as you enter system, not wait around for about 12 seconds orienting yourself.
Camilo Cienfuegos EP0CH	Posted - 2007.06.14 00:41:00 - [60] I'm sorry, but I'm going to pretty much ignore the OP in all but spirit... but hey, you're getting a free bump! Quote: Frigates and cruisers for instance are useless in lowsec because they get instapopped by sentries; this means catching a smaller ship is very hard. Battleships however can tank sentries for ages. Stupid, isn't it? Some form of proportional response seems appropriate: Sentry guns start off pathetically, and increase their damage and/or refire rate the longer you stay on the gate. As long as you are on grid with a gun, your criminal counter will not change, thus forcing an end to permanent gatecamps but allowing all ship types to take part in lowsec camps to a degree. -- Fix Caldari \| Fix Rigs

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