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I didnt get the memo

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Teeta Sabes Constructive Influence	Posted - 2007.03.31 12:04:00 - [31] Originally by: Dielon 4. tally up the overall numbers in the surrounding areas, figure the odds (10:1 for the FT battle)and give the lesser fleet x amount of players they can choose to fight in the system. example: bob has 500 coaltion has 5000. so bob gets approx: 65 players (chosen by bob) to the coalition's (chosen by coalition) 650 players in the one system. this would make the arena finally fair and hopefully less trippy for the combatants. HAHAHAHA as i said, you guys start crying like little babies when you dont have the numbers of 10:1 at least. didnt your accliance leadership tell you to STFU on the e- forums?
Mattduk Gallente Universal Army	Posted - 2007.03.31 12:13:00 - [32] Originally by: Dielon now. ccp. i have some suggestions to make, i dont now much about servers/computers etc He got one thing right :P I think the coalitions biggest mistake here was in broadcasting what they were planning to do on these very forums at least 24 hours before they did it. BOB don't spend their entire game time in that system. There is a slim chance that the attackers could have filled that 700 player limit before BOB could amass their defense. It's a shame at the end of the day that tactics really boil down to this kind of game mechanic manipulation, and not real military strategy, but we can only use the tools afforded us. gf both sides. Mattduk (Neutral Party)
Draahk Chimera Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.03.31 12:24:00 - [33] Defending systems will be easy now. Make sure you have 699 alts in system about 1 hour before pos comes out of reinforced and the attackers have to come in 1 and 1 in a line. I hope the 700 pilot cap dont only apply to bob systems?
Noel Edmonds Deal or No Deal	Posted - 2007.03.31 12:58:00 - [34] This is BS......so you couldnt get your ships in.......neither could BoB and co. STFU and stop whining.
Kcel Chim Caldari Arcane Technologies The Five	Posted - 2007.03.31 13:02:00 - [35] Originally by: Verite Rendition ... good reply m8 and i didnt call you a fanboy to start with. However every game has a limit to what is possible. Be it in starcraft where u have a unitlimit, be it Dawn of War where u got a unitlimit and any other game there is. Even cs.s has a limit per max players per team. In eves case this limit is 700, far from "only small scale operations allowed". As i stated in my posts above you simply dont know if there was a cap limit for defenders aswell. So any assumption "it will be easy for 699 defenders vs 1 attacker" is just that, a baseless assumption. Aslong as CCP doesnt lay out rules we will not know what the case was and how it will be handled in the future. I personally would trade anytime of the week a "fight with equal numbers" (even if there is a caplimit) against a lagfest with 1000 nodecrashes and 3h blackscreen. Thats just me tho. P.S. there is -no- game out there atm which can handle unlimited players in one spot without lag. Not the praised WoW can do that neither can any other game ive tried or looked into.
Draahk Chimera Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.03.31 16:18:00 - [36] Since it has been proven once that BoB did in fact have a pocket gm it would be very very foolish indeed for the gm's to cap a system at 700 when BoB's assets are at risk but not for anyone else. Not that I think BoB has a second pocket gm but for the fact that if no one else get that sort of help, then rumour will start that they probably do. I know 4 people who canceled their subscribtions when the first one was revealed, if a second one should pop up I believe hundreds will quit EVE. I for one would cancel both my accounts at once. No fun playing Monopoly if one of the players has the bank in his knee and can take all the money he wants. So to recap for clarity: I dont think BoB has a second pocket gm, but the gm's should thread lightly so there is no question of their integrity. Now read the last sentence again before replying.
Trillian Budou Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.03.31 16:22:00 - [37] Originally by: Dielon I may not have gotten the memo for the 700 person system cap. either there was some thread about it or it suddenly showed up during the lag fest that happened thursday. im not sure but let me look at it from 3 points of veiw: CCP: 5000ish players in one system?! no way, we need to save the node, system cap this i can understand since you dont want huge crashes etc. the play will still be 98% lagged and bugged anyways though. BOB: 700 cap?! yay! our 400 defenders can now hold down the fort from a horde that could kill all the poses! and they cant do anything about it! yay. Coalition:W....T....F.... i bring everyone i can out for a huge bob desctrution rally and now i find out that i need to go against 4-3 odds. i came prepared for a war and all i get is a skirmish/lag kamikaze fight. now. ccp. i have some suggestions to make, i dont now much about servers/computers etc but heres what you could do to make the epic fleet battles you constantly talk about a reality. 1. Buy a new server that can accomodate constellations etc. have people in the constellation with the battle log into the seperate server while that battle takes place. then move the constallation back to Tranquility once everyones done. this doesnt need to be a huge 30K server, just a 6k one. 2. Turn off jita, give that system the jita node. 3. turn off lowsec, and other regions from the major alliances like branch (d2) and others like branhc that would be vacant. give server support to the overloaded sytstem. 4. tally up the overall numbers in the surrounding areas, figure the odds (10:1 for the FT battle)and give the lesser fleet x amount of players they can choose to fight in the system. example: bob has 500 coaltion has 5000. so bob gets approx: 65 players (chosen by bob) to the coalition's (chosen by coalition) 650 players in the one system. this would make the arena finally fair and hopefully less trippy for the combatants. just suggestions, but to have an even fight when we have 5 times more people is out of the question. and brings back the tinfoil hattery for me since BoB def got the upper hand agian due to a direct result of CCPs handiwork. yes we destroyed the pos but i dont think we wouldve gone about it in the same way if we had been able to fight a fleet battle. these are my opinions, not my alliance's. just a quick rant about fleet battles. spelling and english arent my greatest concerns when writing this, comment if you must grammar proffesors. i again know very little about servers/technical computer stuff. flame away. I love a man in tears.
Doddy Omega Fleet Enterprises Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2007.03.31 16:30:00 - [38] Originally by: Bienurdau Hywoaf There is a blog in August of Last Year by Oveur that lists a limit. However that limit was never used before until the big BoB Capital Fleet battle. It was not previously used in LV1V. Though certainly more than the limit was in local on occasion during that battle. It was very poorly handled by CCP. It is clear that they are too distracted by K to be getting down to real business. They could easily have used a blog after the LV1V battle, explained what they felt went wrong and what steps they were taking but instead they seem hung up on blogs that at best are inflammatory and at worst defamation. Instead we keep getting a bunch of poor us blogs about the actions of someone they won't even name thus giving more credence to that individual. What I'd like to know is if BoB knew about the change in limit enforcement before the battle started, their defensive setup suggests they did, and if so then once again they benefited from DEV/GM misconduct. OK, if BoB knew about the limit why were their support fleets jumped out of system before the attack? They had just as much difficulty getting into the system as coalition forces. BoB tried to engage the coalition fleets outside the system, why would they do that if they knew of the cap? The BoB fleet i was in started heading back to system when the cynos started popping, and i know the vast majority of us didnt make it (there was 3 min lag and 5-10 min jump queues even before i started trying to load the system itself) In the end i crashed, and somehow logged straight back in with 0 lag, but ofc all the dreads were dead or gone by then I fail to see how BoBs defensive set up suggests they knew? can you explain?
Jin Steele Port Royal Independent Kontractors Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.31 16:33:00 - [39] Edited by: Jin Steele on 31/03/2007 16:29:40 Originally by: Teeta Sabes Originally by: Dielon 4. tally up the overall numbers in the surrounding areas, figure the odds (10:1 for the FT battle)and give the lesser fleet x amount of players they can choose to fight in the system. example: bob has 500 coaltion has 5000. so bob gets approx: 65 players (chosen by bob) to the coalition's (chosen by coalition) 650 players in the one system. this would make the arena finally fair and hopefully less trippy for the combatants. HAHAHAHA as i said, you guys start crying like little babies when you dont have the numbers of 10:1 at least. didnt your accliance leadership tell you to STFU on the e- forums? didnt yours? Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected])
DeltaH NOBODY Inc.	Posted - 2007.03.31 16:36:00 - [40] Originally by: jamesw Coalition needs to change tactics. a fleet of 1000 people is not going to work with the present state of gaming, and its not going to work in the near future. With the numbers they had in the F-T operation, they could easily be taking down POS in 4 or 5 systems simultaneously (5 x 200 man fleets). Try and defend that. I disagree. The only reason this POS was important was because it had a capital ship array. A normal POS costs 1B or so and can easily be replaced. If you had 5 fleets worth 50B each (20 dreads and support) seiging a structure worth 1B all BoB would have to do is pick a single system to make a stand. The other 4 fleets would live and cause a few billion in damage but even a single fleet being wiped out makes it a loss. Look to the east for good examples of losing a dozen POS but making one of them hurt! The game is all about POS atm. Not saying that as a whine, I just think POS aren't a very good system to build a game around :)

Kaeten Hybrid Syndicate	Posted - 2007.03.31 16:59:00 - [41] I personally feel the limit cap was ridiculous. Now I'm not on the coalitions side but seeing it from their point of view that was just bull****. Bob's point of view. The perfect window. If CCP wanted to make it fair they would of at least allowed 50% bob and 50% Coalition OR they should of just stayed out of it. They can't jsut do something with this without warning. Also why didn't this happen at LV's shipyards. Just what I get out the whole picture. Pwnage PvP Recruitment \m/ Metal Head \m/
Boci The Legion. Requiem-Aeternam	Posted - 2007.03.31 17:40:00 - [42] Edited by: Boci on 31/03/2007 17:37:57 Originally by: Kaeten I personally feel the limit cap was ridiculous. Now I'm not on the coalitions side but seeing it from their point of view that was just bull****. Bob's point of view. The perfect window. If CCP wanted to make it fair they would of at least allowed 50% bob and 50% Coalition OR they should of just stayed out of it. They can't jsut do something with this without warning. Also why didn't this happen at LV's shipyards. Just what I get out the whole picture. Conflict is never fair. Ten bucks say it was a simple matter of CCP being overconfident of server capability before JV, and decided to enforce an already in place limit (check the blog from last year) once they saw the 2 day forum spam/hype of the upcoming fight. If that was the case, then why WOULD they announce that they would enforce it, that would only have lead to a situation like so many people are whining about now, 600+ from one side, almost noone from the other. Instead they let things go as they should: the side with the most expedient time line would have the advantage, as it should be.
FlailofFury Slanik Corp	Posted - 2007.03.31 17:50:00 - [43] Originally by: Draahk Chimera Since it has been proven once that BoB did in fact have a pocket gm it would be very very foolish indeed for the gm's to cap a system at 700 when BoB's assets are at risk but not for anyone else. Not that I think BoB has a second pocket gm but for the fact that if no one else get that sort of help, then rumour will start that they probably do. I know 4 people who canceled their subscribtions when the first one was revealed, if a second one should pop up I believe hundreds will quit EVE. I for one would cancel both my accounts at once. No fun playing Monopoly if one of the players has the bank in his knee and can take all the money he wants. So to recap for clarity: I dont think BoB has a second pocket gm, but the gm's should thread lightly so there is no question of their integrity. Now read the last sentence again before replying. Everyone was aware of the 700 cap limit. It all depends on how ignorant you were.
Yirra Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.03.31 18:00:00 - [44] Quote: It was not previously used in LV1V. Though certainly more than the limit was in local on occasion during that battle. I was at JV1V the entire night, and I never saw local go above 500. I saw Evil Thug post in the other thread about 1200 people in the system and that is just crazy. If you are gonna use JV1V in any kind of argument, please use the correct numbers.
Kaeten Hybrid Syndicate	Posted - 2007.03.31 18:00:00 - [45] I remember when 100 man fleets where BIG AND PWN.. The old days. Pwnage PvP Recruitment \m/ Metal Head \m/
Draahk Chimera Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.03.31 18:13:00 - [46] Originally by: FlailofFury Everyone was aware of the 700 cap limit. It all depends on how ignorant you were. I werent there. Im talking about the next cap ship yard or station take over. If 700 is the limit for BoB then 700 is the limit for everyone. Make sure you have 699 (of witch 550 could be alts in shuttles) in system and the enemy can only jump in 1 at the time.
Ras'lot Caldari Infinite Style Incorporated Chorus of Dawn	Posted - 2007.03.31 18:51:00 - [47] Originally by: Dielon I may not have gotten the memo for the 700 person system cap. either there was some thread about it or it suddenly showed up during the lag fest that happened thursday. im not sure but let me look at it from 3 points of veiw: CCP: 5000ish players in one system?! no way, we need to save the node, system cap this i can understand since you dont want huge crashes etc. the play will still be 98% lagged and bugged anyways though. BOB: 700 cap?! yay! our 400 defenders can now hold down the fort from a horde that could kill all the poses! and they cant do anything about it! yay. Coalition:W....T....F.... i bring everyone i can out for a huge bob desctrution rally and now i find out that i need to go against 4-3 odds. i came prepared for a war and all i get is a skirmish/lag kamikaze fight. now. ccp. i have some suggestions to make, i dont now much about servers/computers etc but heres what you could do to make the epic fleet battles you constantly talk about a reality. Epic Fleet battles doesnt equal 5k people... If you grabbed enough people so that gms had to add a server cap, with the knowledge that nods are unstable arent you abusing the same systems weaknesses you constabtly whine at BoB for doing? <SIG IS HERE!> I fight for the honor not for the price.
BobGhengisKhan Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated	Posted - 2007.03.31 20:36:00 - [48] Originally by: Dielon I may not have gotten the memo for the 700 person system cap. either there was some thread about it or it suddenly showed up during the lag fest that happened thursday. im not sure but let me look at it from 3 points of veiw: CCP: 5000ish players in one system?! no way, we need to save the node, system cap this i can understand since you dont want huge crashes etc. the play will still be 98% lagged and bugged anyways though. BOB: 700 cap?! yay! our 400 defenders can now hold down the fort from a horde that could kill all the poses! and they cant do anything about it! yay. Coalition:W....T....F.... i bring everyone i can out for a huge bob desctrution rally and now i find out that i need to go against 4-3 odds. i came prepared for a war and all i get is a skirmish/lag kamikaze fight. now. ccp. i have some suggestions to make, i dont now much about servers/computers etc but heres what you could do to make the epic fleet battles you constantly talk about a reality. 1. Buy a new server that can accomodate constellations etc. have people in the constellation with the battle log into the seperate server while that battle takes place. then move the constallation back to Tranquility once everyones done. this doesnt need to be a huge 30K server, just a 6k one. 2. Turn off jita, give that system the jita node. 3. turn off lowsec, and other regions from the major alliances like branch (d2) and others like branhc that would be vacant. give server support to the overloaded sytstem. 4. tally up the overall numbers in the surrounding areas, figure the odds (10:1 for the FT battle)and give the lesser fleet x amount of players they can choose to fight in the system. example: bob has 500 coaltion has 5000. so bob gets approx: 65 players (chosen by bob) to the coalition's (chosen by coalition) 650 players in the one system. this would make the arena finally fair and hopefully less trippy for the combatants. just suggestions, but to have an even fight when we have 5 times more people is out of the question. and brings back the tinfoil hattery for me since BoB def got the upper hand agian due to a direct result of CCPs handiwork. yes we destroyed the pos but i dont think we wouldve gone about it in the same way if we had been able to fight a fleet battle. these are my opinions, not my alliance's. just a quick rant about fleet battles. spelling and english arent my greatest concerns when writing this, comment if you must grammar proffesors. i again know very little about servers/technical computer stuff. flame away. Get a ***** clue! Change and adapt is the name of the game. If bringing OVER NINE THOUSAND ;) people to one system isn't going to work TRY SOMETHING ELSE! FFS all you lot seem to do is ***** whine whine whine.
Inflexible Shokei	Posted - 2007.03.31 20:46:00 - [49] Originally by: Dielon 4. tally up the overall numbers in the surrounding areas, figure the odds (10:1 for the FT battle)and give the lesser fleet x amount of players they can choose to fight in the system. example: bob has 500 coaltion has 5000. so bob gets approx: 65 players (chosen by bob) to the coalition's (chosen by coalition) 650 players in the one system. this would make the arena finally fair and hopefully less trippy for the combatants. Counting T1 frigate and capship equal? I'd call this system GoonBoost.
Audri Fisher Caldari VentureCorp Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.31 23:07:00 - [50] Originally by: Kerkar I am certain CCP are working hard to try and resolve the problem, but its not just as simple as "More powah". Of note, flying with bob, i had no idea of a system cap untill about 11pm by which time the POS had died. The Coalition knows that the nodes cant handle the number of people they have, yet they continue to insist on bringing massive fleets to a single system when, as pointed out, multiple fleets hitting various other systems would be much more effective. We shall see how things go. please explain, how would multiple fleets spread accross multiple systems help kill the Pos in f-t?

Shamis Orzoz Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.03.31 23:40:00 - [51] Originally by: jamesw Coalition needs to change tactics. a fleet of 1000 people is not going to work with the present state of gaming, and its not going to work in the near future. With the numbers they had in the F-T operation, they could easily be taking down POS in 4 or 5 systems simultaneously (5 x 200 man fleets). Try and defend that. They will just destroy 1 or 2 of those gangs separate. Bob blobs up hard, the only way to beat them is to blob them back, but the server doesn't allow an equal size blob with the GM's protecting bob's interests.
HankMurphy Minmatar Pelennor Swarm R i s e	Posted - 2007.03.31 23:46:00 - [52] this is an outrage! i really am enjoying all this. just please dont wear a hole in the carpet running around in circles
Kriger Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.04.01 00:05:00 - [53] how come all the coalition does these days is moan "xploit, devs helping 'you know who'" etc? yeah the op does it ever so subtle in this post, but face it - the 700 cap is _old_ news.. dont blame the rest of EVE for your leaders being out of the loop. Did the cap help 'you know who'? it most likely did.. but unless you want to argue that CCP has a crystal ball that ages ago told them the 700 cap would help 'you know who' this weekend, then plz.. for the love of god.. stop your constant moaning. 'you know who' spammed these forums with rubbish. you r doing the same and quite frankly hurting the game in the process by the constant inuendoes. yes im aware im spewing flames atm.. my appologies.. but listening to this lately is just becoming a joke.. whenever something doesnt go the way the coalition wants it to, they come in here ***ing and moaning, more or less directly calling ppl cheaters, playing unfair etc, even if everything was done by the book. Get over it. As to all the suggestions. If it works, fine. But i think its safe to assume that CCP didnt introduce the 700 cap limit because they hadnt thought of possible alternatives... its safe to assume it was the best compromize. .:: Kriger's gfx Factory ::.**
Ifni Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated	Posted - 2007.04.01 00:07:00 - [54] Originally by: Shamis Orzoz Originally by: jamesw Coalition needs to change tactics. a fleet of 1000 people is not going to work with the present state of gaming, and its not going to work in the near future. With the numbers they had in the F-T operation, they could easily be taking down POS in 4 or 5 systems simultaneously (5 x 200 man fleets). Try and defend that. They will just destroy 1 or 2 of those gangs separate. Bob blobs up hard, the only way to beat them is to blob them back, but the server doesn't allow an equal size blob with the GM's protecting bob's interests. snip If, as you seem to think, the game is stacked to allow BOB to win, just quit your subscription now and let someone else have your spot in the 700 unit limit. snip Don't resort to personal attacks and flamebait -Eldo ([email protected]) You take what is offered. And that must sometimes be enough.
Shamis Orzoz Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.04.01 00:38:00 - [55] Originally by: Ifni If, as you seem to think, the game is stacked to allow BOB to win, just quit your subscription now and let someone else have your spot in the 700 unit limit. I have no intention of quitting. It'll just be that much more satisfying when they lose.
ElweSingollo The Vanyar	Posted - 2007.04.01 03:23:00 - [56] Originally by: Mattduk Originally by: Dielon now. ccp. i have some suggestions to make, i dont now much about servers/computers etc I think the coalitions biggest mistake here was in broadcasting what they were planning to do on these very forums at least 24 hours before they did it. Yes because obviously the coalition was able to control when the POS came out of re-inforced so they could ninja the POS whenever they wanted... something this big that had a defined time and date (decided by the defender BoB) was never going to stay a secret. CCP and Eve Online... It's not a bug, it's a feature
ElweSingollo The Vanyar	Posted - 2007.04.01 03:26:00 - [57] Originally by: FlailofFury Originally by: Draahk Chimera Everyone was aware of the 700 cap limit. It all depends on how ignorant you were. The cap Limit was mentioned more than 6 months ago JV has been and gone since then and NO cap limit was applied there and since that battle no mention has been made that the GM's/dev's are now going to enforce that limit. So why should anyone think that dev Blog still stood as active. CCP and Eve Online... It's not a bug, it's a feature
FlailofFury Slanik Corp	Posted - 2007.04.01 05:33:00 - [58] Originally by: ElweSingollo Edited by: ElweSingollo on 01/04/2007 03:24:44 Originally by: FlailofFury Everyone was aware of the 700 cap limit. It all depends on how ignorant you were. The cap Limit was mentioned more than 6 months ago JV has been and gone since then and NO cap limit was applied there and since that battle no mention has been made that the GM's/dev's are now going to enforce that limit. So why should anyone think that dev Blog still stood as active. Why should people assume it wouldn't. The biggest problem is the *****ing and moaning that ccp put this in to help bob when in reality it has existed for 6 months. Think logically they realized it failed at JV1V and enforced it now (or does the collation want a hollow victory?) the situation could have been reversed entirely.
Mecinia Lua Galactic Express Frontier Trade League	Posted - 2007.04.01 06:04:00 - [59] Originally by: ElweSingollo Edited by: ElweSingollo on 01/04/2007 03:24:44 Originally by: FlailofFury Everyone was aware of the 700 cap limit. It all depends on how ignorant you were. The cap Limit was mentioned more than 6 months ago JV has been and gone since then and NO cap limit was applied there and since that battle no mention has been made that the GM's/dev's are now going to enforce that limit. So why should anyone think that dev Blog still stood as active. Exactly. That's the problem. CCP failed everyone. After JV1V they as others have said should have come out and explained that the servers could not handle battles of that size. They should have pointed to the Aug 2006 blog of Oveur's and said, "We hate to do this and we had hoped to avoid it, but in light of these events we have no choice but to cap the limit of ships in a system. This is so that we can keep the server up and running. We will look into ways to make this as fair as possible and keep you updated as to our progress." But that's not what they did, like so many things they were just silent and hoped it would fix itself. Clearly the servers need a limit. What we need is a workable solution something that enables battles without overwhelmingly favoring one side. It is clear in light of the recent battle that the cap favors the defenders tremendously. Noone can argue that. So their needs to be a cap in place. The cap needs to be split into two, friendly and enemy. An even split might be easier and I'm not sure it wouldn't give to much advantage to the defender but I think CCP should consider it. Problem is identifying friend and foes, since that is not always clear in EVE. They hopefully will address this situation though with a blog to help us all better understand, and hopefully they will refine the system more to everyone's benefit. Galactic Express Recruitment Post Thoughts expressed are mine and
Kriger Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.04.01 07:28:00 - [60] Originally by: Mecinia Lua Exactly. That's the problem. CCP failed everyone. After JV1V they as others have said should have come out and explained that the servers could not handle battles of that size. They should have pointed to the Aug 2006 blog of Oveur's and said......... Yet another "CCP should have read my mind and done this and done that" post. And because they didnt they are obviously helping BoB.. god what rock solid logic.. hindsight ftl... now some1 else posted this.. CCP introduced the cap limit a long time ago.. and if JV1V confused you, what kept you from asking? If CCP introduces a limitation, they _will_ let you know when its no longer in effect. So its all based on the coalitions lack of planning, and now they come in here (again) ***ing and moaning "devs helping BoB".. its a joke, plz if you rly think this is the case.. go play a different game.. enough already.. .:: Kriger's gfx Factory ::.**



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