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Deva Blackfire Viziam	Posted - 2007.04.05 11:57:00 - [31] OMG so SIGNED. Yes i did farm static plexes and YES i wish em to be removed. Atm who controls static plex is rich. Make it a bit harder to get ISKs rather than to be on right place in right time everyday.
Ling Xiao	Posted - 2007.04.05 11:58:00 - [32] Much as I would love it, I doubt CCP will remove these abominations, simply because they've put a lot of effort into making them in the first place. Not enough effort testing them, but hey that's par for the course with Eve __________ If you think the game is rigged, why are you still playing?
Amitabh Bachchan	Posted - 2007.04.05 13:43:00 - [33] Originally by: heheheh complexs should indeed be random, keeping them where they are is just proof that the devs favour BOB. I thought that RA and AAA were the supremo complex warriers in this game, running more complex's than every else put together
Edgars Sults LFC Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.04.05 13:53:00 - [34] Originally by: Ling Xiao Much as I would love it, I doubt CCP will remove these abominations, simply because they've put a lot of effort into making them in the first place. Well, they could just include them in the explorable plex list.
Villa Amarr Dark-Rising	Posted - 2007.04.05 13:56:00 - [35] CCP are not nubs, no doubt the instances of exploration and static plexes use the same kind of basic modelling / coding. Probably some in-house tool resulting in the same base file sets for the plexes. Moving the static plexes over to the exploration system would "in an ideal world" conisist of a drag and drop operation. On the other hand assumption is the mother of all.. well you know. Nice isk generation though, at 2 times a day a 10/10 pumps out about 7 bil a week excluding loot. included your probably up to about 12 bil. of which 7 needs to be isk sinked out of the game again. Remove them I say, would be worth it just to hear RA's crying echo through the EVE universe.
Amitabh Bachchan	Posted - 2007.04.05 14:16:00 - [36] Originally by: Villa Nice isk generation though, at 2 times a day a 10/10 pumps out about 7 bil a week excluding loot. included your probably up to about 12 bil. of which 7 needs to be isk sinked out of the game again. Remove them I say, would be worth it just to hear RA's crying echo through the EVE universe. A nerf to plex's would hurt RA more than all the years of war put together! But for the good of the game, static plex's need to be removed or at the very least, Respawn times changed or made random.
Tradiska	Posted - 2007.04.05 14:37:00 - [37] lol you just jealous... if you want the plex, take it by force intead of crying on forum... grab your guns and kill the farmer but maybe you are not able, RA looking too strong for you? BoB too? then stop whinning, if you want something in eve take it and stfu!
Lenaria Caldari Draconis Navitas Aeterna	Posted - 2007.04.05 14:42:00 - [38] Complexes are major reason why big alliances go to war. They are 0.0 _aliance_ assets like arkonor belts and moon minerals. Lets remove static asteroid belts too? Lets spawn new moon every day? Mining bring far more than any 10/10 plex - so lets nerf it too? Just get it - 0.0 plexes are NOT for private fun. They are ALLIANCE owned source of income, like outpost and arkonor.
Humpalot	Posted - 2007.04.05 14:47:00 - [39] Originally by: Lenaria Complexes are major reason why big alliances go to war. They are 0.0 _aliance_ assets like arkonor belts and moon minerals. Lets remove static asteroid belts too? Lets spawn new moon every day? Mining bring far more than any 10/10 plex - so lets nerf it too? Just get it - 0.0 plexes are NOT for private fun. They are ALLIANCE owned source of income, like outpost and arkonor. No one (I think) is saying remove plexes. They are saying to take static plexes and move them into the Exploration system. Alliances would still have access to them (as presumably CCP would leave the same number in each region) but make them despawn once completed and respawn elsewhere 12 hours later. And BTW...CCP has said they will probably move asteroid belts to the Exploration system.
El Pablo	Posted - 2007.04.05 14:55:00 - [40] Edited by: El Pablo on 05/04/2007 14:56:24 In my oppinion those 10/10 plex must be there to stay. I must agree with tradiska. That would be a Shame for EVE to become the opposite of what its was meant to be : "A world where you have to take evrything by force" dev- ToMb. If you want those plex you have to fight and mostly invest a great deal of time and coordination in getting such resource. Those static plex are the appogee of the strategic coordination, fight investment and determination for a all eve player. If you cant do the plex and are just jalous of those who can THEN FIGHT TO GET THEM and HAVE THE GUTS TO PUT EVRYTHING AT RISK TO DO SO. that's the EVE policy and that will and SHOULD forever be like this. Otherwise EvE is destined to be a barbie world where evryone is happy and dancing all day long while signing a Rob Stuwart love song like in World of Warcraft. Static plex are the incarnation of EVE they simply cant vanish like this.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.04.05 14:58:00 - [41] Originally by: El Pablo Those static plex are the appogee of the strategic coordination, fight investment and determination for a all eve player. Are you serious? You must be joking. 10/10s are extremely easy. You need one remote repper, one high-resist tank, and damage dealers. You can easily run one with two or three ships. You don't even need faction equip; hell you could probably do the entire thing without a single T2 item fitted on your ships if you were good. There are many vastly harder exploration complexes; 10/10s are a joke by comparison. CCP should at least make them much harder for the reward they give. For example, if the enemy ships switched targets, that would make it vastly harder because you couldn't simply put a ship at 95/95 resist and tank them all easily. --23 Member-- Listen to EVE-Trance Radio (back up, new address!)
El Pablo	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:02:00 - [42] Lol im talking about the way you have to take them not the way you DO them. OFF course they are easy to do DUH ! Mining is also easy to do !
Tradiska	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:09:00 - [43] Originally by: Humpalot Originally by: Lenaria Complexes are major reason why big alliances go to war. They are 0.0 _aliance_ assets like arkonor belts and moon minerals. Lets remove static asteroid belts too? Lets spawn new moon every day? Mining bring far more than any 10/10 plex - so lets nerf it too? Just get it - 0.0 plexes are NOT for private fun. They are ALLIANCE owned source of income, like outpost and arkonor. No one (I think) is saying remove plexes. They are saying to take static plexes and move them into the Exploration system. Alliances would still have access to them (as presumably CCP would leave the same number in each region) but make them despawn once completed and respawn elsewhere 12 hours later. And BTW...CCP has said they will probably move asteroid belts to the Exploration system. Move the statics plexs in the explo system will just help people who just hide and probe hours to run a plex in a region they dont own... people who are not able to fight to get the plex... people who cry on forum...
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:11:00 - [44] Originally by: El Pablo Edited by: El Pablo on 05/04/2007 15:01:41 Lol im talking about the way you have to take them not the way you DO them. OFF course they are easy to do DUH ! Mining is also easy to do and thats the same thing ! Thats not the point. The real issue is that plex are a ressources just like minerals and asteroid. If your not good enough to take em by force then just dont do them and mostly stop whining and crying because of your lack of determination. Does it really make sense that a magically respawning set of NPCs is a "resource"? Sounds like Everquest to me. It would make more sense, for example, if automated mining stations could be set up by alliances in particular areas, which could then be attacked or defended. --23 Member-- Listen to EVE-Trance Radio (back up, new address!)
Tradiska	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:20:00 - [45] Originally by: Dark Shikari Does it really make sense that a magically respawning set of NPCs is a "resource"? Sounds like Everquest to me. And the NPC in belts? different? I think thats not the point here...
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:23:00 - [46] Originally by: Tradiska Originally by: Dark Shikari Does it really make sense that a magically respawning set of NPCs is a "resource"? Sounds like Everquest to me. And the NPC in belts? different? I think thats not the point here... Belt NPCs are everywhere, so aren't really a "valuable resource" IMO; its only a valuable resource if its in short supply and only in specific places. --23 Member-- Listen to EVE-Trance Radio (back up, new address!)
Humpalot	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:35:00 - [47] Originally by: Tradiska Move the statics plexs in the explo system will just help people who just hide and probe hours to run a plex in a region they dont own... people who are not able to fight to get the plex... people who cry on forum... Huh? The valuable plexes will still be in Alliance space so if you want them guess what...going to have to fight for them just as you want. And the prober is just one piece. They will have to roam about looking for these things. Hard to catch them? Sure but just one more guy you can get after. Once a plex is found the mission ships need to drive to it. Gues what? Another chance for fights. If you want make the plex, once found by anyone, appear on the map for all to see. This would then draw more people there and get you even more fights. I fail to see your issue with this.
Kalixa Hihro	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:45:00 - [48] Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 05/04/2007 06:02:09 1) Farmers, both in empire and in 0.0, who can lock most players out of the complexes if they're good 2) Huge 0.0 alliances like Band of Brothers, Red Alliance, Dusk and Dawn, and others, who run absurd numbers of complexes for billions of ISK. Actually the only alliance players they benefit are those who can be in the game right after downtime and farm the plex. Plexes are only good for once per day. It usually doesn't benefit the alliance except through taxes. I am in an alliance and I don't get to do plexes because they are already cleaned out when I get home from work. I am 100% behind any plan that allows casual players to get a plex once in a while. -Kal /----------------------------------------------------------------------------------/ My opinion in no way represents that of my corp or anyone I am associated with, and is probably entirely wrong.
tengen GoonFleet	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:46:00 - [49] If they weren't bugged, they'd be fine the way they are. Sure, they earn you a lot of money. But that makes them a major strategic asset and a huge pvp target. They shouldn't be accessable to everyone, they should be accessable to the people willing to scrap for them and take control of the area and fight off everyone else. That's what seperates EVE from an carebear instanced MMORPG. If you think that someone running a plex doesn't "deserve it", go blow up their tank and take it for yourself. That said, the regions need to be balanced a bit better. I suggest 1 10/10 per 0.0 region, and maybe 2 or 3 of the lower level ones. This should include NPC regions. The thing with complexes is that, sure, it's a billion a day, but that's it. If you have 3 buddies that run it, it's awesome. If you have a corp of 30, you can make more ratting or mining or running level 4s.
Mangus Thermopyle Chosen Path Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.04.05 15:53:00 - [50] /signed They can still exists in the game, but as explorqation complexes. They should also not be tied to a specific region, so that every 0.0 alliance/corp gets a chance to find and do the best ones. The current monopoly of 10/10 compexes is just bad for the game.
Ovale KDM Corp Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:05:00 - [51] Originally by: Rikeka Edited by: Rikeka on 05/04/2007 06:26:12 This reminds me of the Jedi spawn points in the SWG game. Sony had to give us Dark Jedi Masters chars to counter this guys spawn points, kill them, and free the spawn. If Sony, which screwed up a game so good as Star Wars Galaxies, learned from this, I expect CCP will do too... In time, of course. It`s CCP. [EDIT] LOL, been told that it`s possible those Jedis farmers are now in EvE, and that now they know who I am. You know what? Bring it! HAHAHAHA! Greetings from Chilastra. I used to be an armorsmith before NGE drove me out. Anyway, I support the elimination of static plexes. It would probably bring more improvement to the game than any other change.
Kaaii Caldari Equilibrium LLC	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:09:00 - [52] I can hear the screams from USSR from here.... Trading 101 Kaaii-Net Research Labs
Peter Armstrong Caldari 5punkorp	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:11:00 - [53] signed ------------------------------------ "There is no avoiding war; it can only be postponed to the advantage of others"
James Snowscoran Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:23:00 - [54] The biggest conceptual flaw with 0.0 plexes, is that once you've gotten past the first locked gate you're 100% safe until the keyholder respawns. Control of plexes isn't determined so much by fighting for the system as it is by who can log in first right after downtime. I also agree with DS that the concept of farmable npc structures as a reward for controlling space is kinda immersion-breaking. Move all the plexes into exploration! -----
Tiger'ess	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:36:00 - [55] Edited by: Tiger''ess on 05/04/2007 16:37:46 Don't remove static complexes, just make them harder. Make the npc's inside the complex choose targets smartly instead of just going after the same one person. Make the complex npc's target the person who they will be able to kill fastest. This would involve some complex coding though, not sure if it's even possible to get it right. ------------------------------------------------ Originally by Flinx Evenstar no BOB POS is safe, have a nice day We only lost 50 capital ships to kill a pos, no bob pos is safe!!
Tiger'ess	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:38:00 - [56] Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: El Pablo Edited by: El Pablo on 05/04/2007 15:01:41 Lol im talking about the way you have to take them not the way you DO them. OFF course they are easy to do DUH ! Mining is also easy to do and thats the same thing ! Thats not the point. The real issue is that plex are a ressources just like minerals and asteroid. If your not good enough to take em by force then just dont do them and mostly stop whining and crying because of your lack of determination. Does it really make sense that a magically respawning set of NPCs is a "resource"? Sounds like Everquest to me. It would make more sense, for example, if automated mining stations could be set up by alliances in particular areas, which could then be attacked or defended. Does it make sense that asteroids in asteroid belts are just respawning out of thin air even though they were destroyed? ------------------------------------------------ Originally by Flinx Evenstar no BOB POS is safe, have a nice day We only lost 50 capital ships to kill a pos, no bob pos is safe!!
Tiger'ess	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:52:00 - [57] Edited by: Tiger''ess on 05/04/2007 16:49:09 What about this, every 5 seconds all complex npc's will figure out who is the weakest target and who will die fastest at that precise time and all npcs will target that person, an interceptor for example, 5 seconds later the calculation is done again and if the interceptor is still the player ship who is in position to die the quickest then the npc's will stay on him, and so on. If the interceptor goes out of npc's optimal it doesn't matter, because every 5 seconds they will figure out who will die fastest and choose the current weakest target, ------------------------------------------------ Originally by Flinx Evenstar no BOB POS is safe, have a nice day We only lost 50 capital ships to kill a pos, no bob pos is safe!!
Humpalot	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:52:00 - [58] Originally by: Tiger'ess Does it make sense that asteroids in asteroid belts are just respawning out of thin air even though they were destroyed? From a game mechanic standpoint sure. If EVE mirrored real life then an asteroid belt would be comprised of hundreds of millions of rocks. Since that would probably be hard on the server to track for 5,000+ systems they make asteroid belts small and they respawn.
Celeste Coeval The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.04.05 16:54:00 - [59] Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 05/04/2007 16:51:05 Originally by: Tradiska Move the statics plexs in the explo system will just help people who just hide and probe hours to run a plex in a region they dont own... people who are not able to fight to get the plex... people who cry on forum... wtf are you on about? "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor." -Albert Einstein Member of the [UTSFAH] corp.
Princess Jodi Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.04.05 18:56:00 - [60] Yes, please make Static Complexes into Exploration Complexes. The main problem I see with Static Complexes is that they are habitually farmed by those first able to get there after Downtime. Its the equalivalent of saying 'Those who log in at 3:00 Eve Time get a shot at a Billion isk that anyone logging in at another time can't have.' Plus, making them Exploration Complexes might mean that CCP actually FIXES the Exploration sites! Anything that puts pressure to get the Exploration sites correct gets my vote! Fix the Drone Regions!

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