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ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
1804
   |
Posted - 2016.12.29 21:40:49 -
[1] - Quote
The word "Progression" being used in this game makes me cringe.
I have been messing around with anomalies in a punisher lately ( which is an Amarr T1 frigate gunboat ) and I have been very surprised as to how much I could do in one of them.
Certainly most level 2 missions could fairly easily be done in a frigate. I am willing to bet all of them can be but some will be more challenging than others.
Years ago I read a blog by a guy who was running level 4 mission solo in a rifter and at the last I read his blog he had successfully soloed almost half of all the level 4 missions in a rifter. It was not easy mind you but he did it.
That being said you should be able to do level 2s in a frigate. A cruiser would make them easier but a frigate should be doable.
Years ago missions were said to be balanced around being soloed by:
Frigates for level 1
Cruisers for level 2
Battlecruisers for level 3
Battleships for level 4
level 5's were intended for fleets.
Each level of missions should be able to be completed by the ship class intended for the previous level if you are willing to give up easymode.
I would recommend that you start off using range to mitigate much of the damage and use your speed to break the spawns up into manageable groups.
The only way that you will know for sure is to try it. If you are worried about loosing ships send me a mail in game and I'll throw a handful of ships at you and you can insure them and loose them and make isk with each loss. |
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
1804
|
Posted - 2016.12.29 23:57:19 -
[2] - Quote
Neuntausend wrote:You can certainly stick with frigates. They are pretty useful little ships. Running level 2 missions with a decently skilled frigate is no problem at all, and frigates are useful for many other aspects of the game. There are also Faction and T2 Frigates later on, and they still use the same weapon systems. I have flown level 1 missions, the Sisters epic arc, level 2 missions, level 3 missions, the Guristas and Angels epic arc as well as level 4 missions in all sorts of frigates, and it's all doable. Level 3 is the point where it becomes quite inefficient, though, with the exception of the epic arcs, since they are balanced for Interceptors.
That being said, cruisers are pretty baller.
Great advise here... add into that Tech 2 and Tech 3 destroyers and you have a lot of very powerful ship options that open up to you without ever having to skill past small weapons.
Several years ago I spent some time running level 3 missions in a tech 2 assault frigate and I recall it being a lot of fun.
Also keep in mind that a lot of the skills are shared between all or most combat ships. Racial cruiser and the associated racial medium weapon skill trained up to about 2 or 3 should not take long at all. It really is not that big of a deal to train into cruisers and give them a try.
As a new character I can't say enough that almost certainly the best thing that you can do for yourself is just try lots of different stuff. Eve's skill training system really encourages it and having options is always great. It will also go a long way to getting a feel for the game and helping you find your personal playstyle. |
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
1806
|
Posted - 2016.12.30 18:42:07 -
[3] - Quote
Donnachadh wrote:ergherhdfgh wrote:The word "Progression" being used in this game makes me cringe. Why does this cause you to cringe? Progreression is exactly what mission are, you run level 1's until you have sufficient standing and then you "progress" into level 2 etc etc until you have standing for level 5's.
Maybe it is the baggage that comes with the word "progression" from other MMOs. I recognize that I have some type of WoW PTSD thing going on and that certain things can trigger me. I'm not saying it's right or wrong just kind of throwing it out there as a qualifier incase either I go off on some rant then someone can bring me back to reality or readers can use it as context to frame my comments and have an idea of when to take what I say with a grain of salt.
I've had the standing to run level 5's for years and I don't run them. I know people who have the skills and standing to run level 4s and 5s but still run level 3s most of the time because they enjoy them more. I know when I was missioning in null sec I stuck to level 2 and 3 missions because they could be run in cheap ships. Also the fat ass BS can just feel like an anchor slowing you down sometimes.
I guess the main thing that bugs me most is that most other MMOs are "progression" based MMOs where every aspect of the game is a form of never-ending progression. You progress in level to level cap. Then you progress through dungeons to heroics then progress to raids etc... You progress through gearscore to higher and higher, never-ending, sliding scale gear levels. You progress through rankings in PvP. You progress your crafting up through the levels etc...
Grinding for experience to level is not a thing in Eve. Power creep causing you to constantly chase after a gearscore finish line that is constantly moving is not a thing in Eve. You just play the game and get more skills as a matter of time passing. To me the Eve system feels much more like play and the progression based games much more like a job.
However I understand this is all just my opinion which is why I stated that I threw it out there more as a qualifier. To give insight on my perspective and add context within which to frame my comments. |
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
1811
|
Posted - 2017.01.01 17:22:13 -
[4] - Quote
Hakawai wrote:
@ ergherhdfgh
I hope you'll stop reacting to words this way. And allow people whose experience comes from "other MMOs" some time to get used to EVE.
I had someone misinterpret "progression" after my first post here. It wasn't justified, and I found it unwelcoming and quite annoying. Alpha clones provide an opportunity for EVE to expand fast - but it's still a high-threshold game. I think experienced players need to work at seeing the game and its forums from the perspective of new players, rather than expecting the converse.
FWIW, in my case it might have a silver lining, but that's partly because I quite like boisterous forums, and partly because the forums are actually nicer than the last time I played EVE (when the objective of many forum participants to drive new players from the game).
I thank you for your perspective on this. I will keep this in mind on future posts.
I've been working for a while on the language that I use to "help" new players realize what is different about this game from others so that they can more quickly adapt. It can be difficult to find a way to show players a way of looking at things that might be more effective without leaving them feeling "corrected". One of the beauties of Eve is that there is no wrong way to play it.
I will work better on finding ways to communicate my perspective in a manner that hopefully comes off more as being subjective. |
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
1811
|
Posted - 2017.01.01 17:51:49 -
[5] - Quote
Donnachadh wrote:
Progression really is a word that doesn't mean the same thing in Eve as other games, so NQ&A is the best place to explain the difference.
Progression means the same in EvE as it does every where else in the English speaking world so let us start with a dictionary.
Progression, you can read the definitions here, essentially it is the act of moving from one step or phase of a project or process to the next step. There is a definite "progression" to the missions structure in EvE. one starts at level 1 missions and low standings and "progresses" from mission to mission gaining standing with each one until they can "progress" into level 2 missions. Then they keep repeating this same progressive process until you reach one of the few "end game" things there is in EvE and that is level 5 missions. Yes level 5 missions are end game, there is no level 6 or higher to move on to so for mission runners level 5's are end game content.
[/quote]
I enjoy using deffinitions to help make sure that we are all starting from the same point with what we mean on a specific word. I can be very helpful and I believe is in this case.
However definitions eliminate context and emotional baggage that comes with some context.
Many other MMOs are progression based. Meaning that there are inherent mechanics in the game ( some would say the entire focus of the game ) to encourage or force you to move from one level to the next. Not just quest levels but stats and gear scores and raid difficulties etc... In those other games there is an end game as the massive difference between slight changes in level and gear etc.. make it so that characters that are only slightly different can't even play together.
In those games you must "progress" to max level to even be able to play with most other players. If you get a friend into those games they have to "work" at getting to level cap before they can even do any of the fun stuff with you.
In Eve mission levels and DED levels etc... are just a way to give the person running the site or mission an idea of what to expect so they know what kind of equipment to bring. There is no inherent mechanic in this game forcing you to move from DED 1 of 10 to DED 2 0f 10 etc... until DED 10 of 10 sites. You just know that if you are running around in a cruiser which sites that you can handle alone and which sites you'd need to change ships or bring friends.
Likewise if you are looking to do some wormhole combat and you want to solo then you are looking for a C1 or C2. If you have a small fleet of medium ships then you are looking for C3 or C4 and if you have a fleet or large ships with maybe a cap or two in the mix then you are looking for a C5 or C6.
A quantification without inherent movement in a set direction is not progression. A 12 oz cup is bigger than an 8 oz cup which both are smaller than a 16 oz cup. However you order your drink based on how thirsty that you are. You don't order an 8 oz cup the first time and then go back and order a 12 oz etc... I mean you could do that but without some inherent motivation to continue in a specific direction I don't think that it can be called progression.
Further those progression based games have infinite power creep. CCP is constantly nerfing things to make sure that there is no power creep. You can leave the game for years and come back and your cruiser will still be able to do similar stuff.
They very fact that a brand new, day one, player can come into this game and get involved in a huge sov fleet battle and show up on a KM right next to a 10 year vet in the exact same ship is an argument that this is not a progression based game and that there is no inherent progression to this game.
However I realize that we are far off into subjective territory. So I am not saying that you are wrong here. I am just pointing out that neither is Iria
Donnachadh wrote:Iria Ahrens wrote: In Eve missions(quests) are income not content. I really dislike blanket statements like this because they are not true for ALL players. You may consider missions as an income source, I know dozens of players that would disagree with you. Most would tell you that missions are a terrible income source, while others would tell you they are relaxing and enjoyable content and would continue to run them even if CCP removed all ISK and LP payouts.
There is no wrong way to play Eve. As vets all we can do is offer our perspective on what our experience has led us to. New players can take it for what it's worth and either us it or ignore it. I tend to agree with Iria on this as well however I will not claim any rightness on this. |
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