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evil penguin Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.04.20 16:20:00 - [1] I tried these out yesterday, the DPS was good comapred to heavies but I just couldnt find a decent setup to accomodate them. I was using a Drake and they just seem more hassle than theyre worth because its so slow. My normal Drake setup: 7x heavies 3x named large extender, 3x hardeners (usually 2x invul + 1 EM) 1x PDS, 3x BCS The HAM setup I tried: 7x HAM 2x named large extender, 3x hardeners, 1x named AB 2x PDS, 2x BCS Any suggestions? How about using them on other ships? Caracal doesnt seem to ahve th grid for them. Also take into account my skills arent that great.
Marquis Dean Indigo Fade	Posted - 2007.04.20 16:31:00 - [2] You're really going to struggle to find a use for HAMs to be honest. As a weapon system, they work kind like the short range systems of the other races, except when mounted on Caldari ships which are slow, heavy and fat, it's like putting a rack of ions on a Brutix, then adding four 1600mm plates to it. Stick wit HML until the Caldari get a dedicated HAM boat. --- Indigo Fade is now selling jumpclones for superb prices, please see Marquis Dean's bio and/or evemail/convo him ingame.
Haniblecter Teg F.R.E.E. Explorer EVE Animal Control	Posted - 2007.04.20 16:41:00 - [3] Heavies are just too frickin expensive lately. Would stnd sized assaults be worthwhile I wonder? ---------------------------------------- Friends Forever
Marquis Dean Indigo Fade	Posted - 2007.04.20 16:47:00 - [4] Assault Launchers do a fraction of the dps of HMLs. So no. --- Indigo Fade is now selling jumpclones for superb prices, please see Marquis Dean's bio and/or evemail/convo him ingame.
Raeff Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.04.20 16:58:00 - [5] invention has helped the market for other mods .. just give it some time for the HML IIs
Hannobaal Gallente Utopian Frontier	Posted - 2007.04.20 17:05:00 - [6] Originally by: Haniblecter Teg Heavies are just too frickin expensive lately. Would stnd sized assaults be worthwhile I wonder? Only against frigates and such. ------------------ "If you ever need anything, please don't Hesitate to ask someone else first."
Rathyn Mercer	Posted - 2007.04.20 17:22:00 - [7] Im personally a friend of the Cerberus.. A dedicated Hams boat. with its bonuses to missles it will chew up and spit out almost anything, with a good pilot behind the pod of course. Setup: 5 x HAMS 1 x named or t2 LSB 1 x named or t2 SBA 1 x LSE 1 x 20km scram 1 x named MWD 2 x t2 overdrive injector RIGS: 1 x dmg rig 1 x vent rig
Cursed Ra Suffoco Noctis Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2007.04.20 19:16:00 - [8] Edited by: Cursed Ra on 20/04/2007 19:15:04 Javelin HAMs + Cerberus = good. Originally by: Rathyn Mercer Im personally a friend of the Cerberus.. A dedicated Hams boat. with its bonuses to missles it will chew up and spit out almost anything, with a good pilot behind the pod of course. Setup: 5 x HAMS 1 x named or t2 LSB 1 x named or t2 SBA 1 x LSE 1 x 20km scram 1 x named MWD 2 x t2 overdrive injector RIGS: 1 x dmg rig 1 x vent rig Just don't fly them without T2 HAMs
Doodmann	Posted - 2007.04.20 19:29:00 - [9] Originally by: Cursed Ra Edited by: Cursed Ra on 20/04/2007 19:15:04 Javelin HAMs + Cerberus = good. Originally by: Rathyn Mercer Im personally a friend of the Cerberus.. A dedicated Hams boat. with its bonuses to missles it will chew up and spit out almost anything, with a good pilot behind the pod of course. Setup: 5 x HAMS 1 x named or t2 LSB 1 x named or t2 SBA 1 x LSE 1 x 20km scram 1 x named MWD 2 x t2 overdrive injector RIGS: 1 x dmg rig 1 x vent rig Just don't fly them without T2 HAMs What range to expect with this setup?
Alyth Gallente Ma-Ven Industries Phobos Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.20 19:45:00 - [10] Originally by: Doodmann What range to expect with this setup? Quickfit estimates about 17km I think with both range skills and HAC skill at 4. With Javelin HAMs its more like 100km. This would be my setup: Cerberus Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Javelin Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Javelin Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Javelin Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Javelin Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Javelin Assault Missile] Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I Phased Muon Sensor Disruptor I Phased Muon Sensor Disruptor I Phased Muon Sensor Disruptor I Faint Warp Prohibitor I Domination Stasis Webifier Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Power Diagnostic System II Rigs : Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I \ Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I \ 2419 shield, 6.22/s, E/T/K/Ex=0/79/69/59 1495 armor, E/T/K/Ex=59/86/62/10 1338.7499392032623 cap, +13.38/s, -11.61/s 211.0 m/s 299.04 DPS or 333.3 DPS with Rage HAMs
Scordite	Posted - 2007.04.21 11:05:00 - [11] HAMs don't know it yet, but they were made with 1 purpose only - Fitting on the sacrilege once it gets changed to a missile boat ----------------------------------------------- The only legitimate use of the BLINK tag: Schr÷dinger's cat is [BLINK] not [/BLINK] dead.
Tamoko Amarr Artificial Horizons YouWhat	Posted - 2007.04.21 11:23:00 - [12] I <3 coupling HAM launchers with my 220mm Vulcan AutoCannons on Ruptures and Stabbers. But they might not be ideal for Caldari ships, but their a match made in heaven for ships that fly 2500m/s and are optimal at 2000 meters. I've seen the long-range T2 HAMs used on active-tanked(/vomit) drakes with great effectiveness, though. In fact, one such ship managed to wax my noob arse in both a Ferox and Brutix without going into armor. I tried QuickFitting a decent HAM Drake, but even with Engineering V and AWU III, I couldn't squeeze on enough modules to make it work right. Going overboard with my fitting skills, I was able to squeek this by. It's not a cheap ship though. I chose to active tank it because the microwarp will be ineffective as hell with shield relays. HI SLOTS: (7) 'Arbalest' Heavy Assault Missile Launcher I MID SLOTS: (1) Large Shield Booster II (1) 'Copasetic' Particle Field Amplifier I (2) Invulnerability Field II (1) 10MN MicroWarpdrive I (1) Warp Scrambler I LOW SLOTS: ** (3) Power Diagnostic System I If you do happen to get a HAM Drake to work somehow, reply in this forum. I'd like to try one out myself, just to be different. xxx
Hannobaal Gallente Utopian Frontier	Posted - 2007.04.21 12:17:00 - [13] I'm liking HAMLs on my new Drake. It can be a bit difficult getting in range, but the dps is just so much better. ------------------ "If you ever need anything, please don't Hesitate to ask someone else first."
Aegis Osiris Gallente Demonic Retribution Pure.	Posted - 2007.04.21 14:24:00 - [14] To use HAML's effectively, you need to fit a MWD, unless using the T2 javelins, those are rather nice actually. Can also be effective in gate camps, as everything is fairly close already. ________________________________________________ This thread does not exist Sig in process....
Matiaj	Posted - 2007.04.21 20:52:00 - [15] Edited by: Matiaj on 21/04/2007 20:54:01 Finished training HAM 5 yesterday, I'm gonna try following setups : 1] Sitting drake : 7x HAML T2 w/ javelin (60km range approx.) 2x LSE, 2x inv field, 2x damp (or 1x inv + 3x kin/th/em hardeners if mad tank preferred, but a heavy launcher drake w/ 3x LSE and some SPR in lows would just perform better here) 3x BCS, DCU 2] Mwding drake : 7x HAML T2 /w T1 or rage 10mn MWD, 2x LSE, 2x inv field, 20km disruptor 3x BCS, RCU
DiuxDium Loot	Posted - 2007.04.21 21:12:00 - [16] Originally by: Matiaj Edited by: Matiaj on 21/04/2007 20:54:01 Finished training HAM 5 yesterday, I'm gonna try following setups : 1] Sitting drake : 7x HAML T2 w/ javelin (60km range approx.) 2x LSE, 2x inv field, 2x damp (or 1x inv + 3x kin/th/em hardeners if mad tank preferred, but a heavy launcher drake w/ 3x LSE and some SPR in lows would just perform better here) 3x BCS, DCU 2] Mwding drake : 7x HAML T2 /w T1 or rage 10mn MWD, 2x LSE, 2x inv field, 20km disruptor 3x BCS, RCU In the first setup, do you simply ask your opponent to sit still? And with the second, what are you going to outrun in a drake without a web? Quote: Also, he didnt even have a Scrambler, so the POS would have gotten away anyway.
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.04.21 21:55:00 - [17] Originally by: DiuxDium Originally by: Matiaj Edited by: Matiaj on 21/04/2007 20:54:01 Finished training HAM 5 yesterday, I'm gonna try following setups : 1] Sitting drake : 7x HAML T2 w/ javelin (60km range approx.) 2x LSE, 2x inv field, 2x damp (or 1x inv + 3x kin/th/em hardeners if mad tank preferred, but a heavy launcher drake w/ 3x LSE and some SPR in lows would just perform better here) 3x BCS, DCU 2] Mwding drake : 7x HAML T2 /w T1 or rage 10mn MWD, 2x LSE, 2x inv field, 20km disruptor 3x BCS, RCU In the first setup, do you simply ask your opponent to sit still? And with the second, what are you going to outrun in a drake without a web? Lets say not all fights are 1 on 1? tacklers? huggins? _________________________________________________ Breetime A killmail!11!1 omgrawr: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Matiaj	Posted - 2007.04.21 21:57:00 - [18] Originally by: DiuxDium In the first setup, do you simply ask your opponent to sit still? And with the second, what are you going to outrun in a drake without a web? First setup is obviously not for soloing. Actually none of them are as I wouldn't use a Drake for that.
Eardianm	Posted - 2007.04.22 01:34:00 - [19] Posted this before, but for solo HAM work, I've been using Drake 7 Arby HAMS (no T2 yet), 1 small nos Web MWD 20k Scram 2x Invul 2 LSE II 2x BCU II PDU II DC II Use an EM and Thermal resist rig (oops, those aren't in Akira's "use these or ur a noob" Drake rigs) to finish patching up resist holes. If you put a grid rig on, you could fit a medium nos instead, but I'm too cheap for those
Tamoko Amarr Artificial Horizons YouWhat	Posted - 2007.04.22 02:49:00 - [20] Originally by: Eardianm Posted this before, but for solo HAM work, I've been using Drake 7 Arby HAMS (no T2 yet), 1 small nos Web MWD 20k Scram 2x Invul 2 LSE II 2x BCU II PDU II DC II Use an EM and Thermal resist rig (oops, those aren't in Akira's "use these or ur a noob" Drake rigs) to finish patching up resist holes. If you put a grid rig on, you could fit a medium nos instead, but I'm too cheap for those This is probably the most realistic setup I've seen yet. Durable, and unleashes a great, big can of nasty on anything inwards of 10km. Though, with my present skills, QuickFit tells me I'd only generate about one quarter of the shield/second that a Large Shield Booster II would give me. That worries me a bit. xxx
Trisha Banks	Posted - 2007.04.23 07:53:00 - [21] Ok, before i post this setup please repeat after me: Caldari are not solo wtfpwn machines. Caldari ships excel in gangs. Ok? Drake Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Empty Slot Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I [0xCap Booster 800] Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I Heat Dissipation Field II Invulnerability Field II 'Anointed' I EM Ward Reinforcement Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Reactor Control Unit II Power Diagnostic System II Rigs : Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I \ Core Defence Operational Solidifier I \ Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I \ 6890 shield, 20.08/s, E/T/K/Ex=75/78/75/77 4687 armor, E/T/K/Ex=59/44/25/10 2657.8123793005943 cap, +12.65/s, -76.284/s 1045.0 m/s 279.0 DPS tanks avg 390 dps, throwing out 279 dps under 13km, 314 w/rage up to 12km, 237 dps w/jav upto 55km. All with rapid fire V, HAM spec and all other missile skills at 4. Hobgob II's with decent skills(IV's across the board) will yield another 65 dps, bringing the close range dps up to 380.
MrRookie Caldari Dark and Light inc. D-L	Posted - 2007.04.23 09:46:00 - [22] Originally by: Trisha Banks Ok, before i post this setup please repeat after me: Caldari are not solo wtfpwn machines. Caldari ships excel in gangs. Ok? Drake Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II [50xTerror Assault Missile] Empty Slot Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I [0xCap Booster 800] Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I Heat Dissipation Field II Invulnerability Field II 'Anointed' I EM Ward Reinforcement Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Reactor Control Unit II Power Diagnostic System II Rigs : Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I \ Core Defence Operational Solidifier I \ Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I \ 6890 shield, 20.08/s, E/T/K/Ex=75/78/75/77 4687 armor, E/T/K/Ex=59/44/25/10 2657.8123793005943 cap, +12.65/s, -76.284/s 1045.0 m/s 279.0 DPS tanks avg 390 dps, throwing out 279 dps under 13km, 314 w/rage up to 12km, 237 dps w/jav upto 55km. All with rapid fire V, HAM spec and all other missile skills at 4. Hobgob II's with decent skills(IV's across the board) will yield another 65 dps, bringing the close range dps up to 380. Nice to see some good sugestions for Drake fittings with Hams. All I ever see posted regarding hams is crap remarks. I'm always alitle sceptical when it gets to resistance rigs but that seems like a good setup Sig removed. Please email us at [email protected] if you would like to know why. -Conuion Meow May I have pink next time plz?
Akita T Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.04.23 10:55:00 - [23] Originally by: Eardianm Use an EM and Thermal resist rig (oops, those aren't in Akira's "use these or ur a noob" Drake rigs) to finish patching up resist holes. If you put a grid rig on, you could fit a medium nos instead, but I'm too cheap for those "AkiTa" Well, resist rigs are fairly cheap (compared to CCC/SMC rigs), so for all intents and purposes they're reasonaby cost-effective ones. Well, not for passive tanks, there Purgers are a must no matter how you put it... even extender rigs are overall better as resist rigs there. On active-tanking injected ships (especially on those with capless weapons), CCCs/SMCs aren't all that great either, so you might even be better off with cap Saf'guard (shield) rigs too, not only resists rigs. Still, I really wouldn't use 2 EM rigs, 1 em hardner and one invul field in the whole scenario... you have almost identical end-effects as with only one EM rig, so better put a different resist there, or some other rig (or no rig at all, if you're interested in a cheap setup. _ MySkills \| Module/Rig stacknerfing explained
Matiaj	Posted - 2007.04.23 11:19:00 - [24] Edited by: Matiaj on 23/04/2007 11:22:19 Originally by: Trisha Banks Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I [0xCap Booster 800] Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I Power Diagnostic System II Your active setup has 6890 shield and 60/s active boost. A passive setup with LSE II + LSE II + DCU II (pdu not needed anymore) has 12862 shield, with 12.5% better resists due to DCU this makes 14699, and no more active boost. So the active tank needs AT LEAST (14699-6890)/60 = 2mn10s of PERMA-boosting to catch up with the passive tank. And this is ignoring : - Passive shield recharge increase - Armor resistance increase - Structure resistance increase So yeah a cap inj is always handy but is it really worth it to go active ? PS : Quickfit makes the DCU stacking-penalized with the Invul fields. But it's a bug, isn't it ? Quite sure the DCU aren't stacking penalized with anything...
Mathias Orsen	Posted - 2007.04.23 11:35:00 - [25] Originally by: Trisha Banks 6890 shield, 20.08/s, E/T/K/Ex=75/78/75/77 4687 armor, E/T/K/Ex=59/44/25/10 2657.8123793005943 cap, +12.65/s, -76.284/s 1045.0 m/s 279.0 DPS Maybe that's just due to having alot of lower skills but the Damage output is rather low for something that you gotta work so hard to use. HAMs are hard to fit, and almost as hard to use with the range limits. 279 DPS is far from enough to be able to "gank" anything. Considering that that damage is mostly crap, I'd find it best to sticking with a good passive tank, atleast then it's good for something. With a full rack of t2 Heavies, it puts out around 250 DPS I do believe. Dont remember if that was with scourge or fury scourge though. The Drake has it's uses.... PVP not being one of them. Unless a drake pilot just wants to go spectate in PVP while tossing pebbles at the actual fighters. -------------------------------------- ---"What's in your wallet?"--- "There are two kinds of respect, fear and admiration.... I'll take what I can get"
Matiaj	Posted - 2007.04.23 11:45:00 - [26] Originally by: Mathias Orsen Maybe that's just due to having alot of lower skills but the Damage output is rather low for something that you gotta work so hard to use. Actually, with NaughtyBoy spreadsheet (more reliable than QuickFit when it comes to dps calculations, imo), 7x HAML T2 with 3 BCS T2 = 450 dps w/ T1 kin missiles and 540 w/ Rage kin missiles. With 2 BCS T2 it's 400 and 480. Hobgoblin II's add 100 dps on top of that. But that's with full maxed skills afaik.
Gee Lok	Posted - 2007.04.23 12:43:00 - [27] Edited by: Gee Lok on 23/04/2007 12:41:35 Originally by: Mathias Orsen The Drake has it's uses.... PVP not being one of them. Unless a drake pilot just wants to go spectate in PVP while tossing pebbles at the actual fighters. Drakes are good for small gang PvP
Trisha Banks	Posted - 2007.04.23 16:38:00 - [28] Originally by: Mathias Orsen Originally by: Trisha Banks 6890 shield, 20.08/s, E/T/K/Ex=75/78/75/77 4687 armor, E/T/K/Ex=59/44/25/10 2657.8123793005943 cap, +12.65/s, -76.284/s 1045.0 m/s 279.0 DPS Maybe that's just due to having alot of lower skills but the Damage output is rather low for something that you gotta work so hard to use. HAMs are hard to fit, and almost as hard to use with the range limits. 279 DPS is far from enough to be able to "gank" anything. Considering that that damage is mostly crap, I'd find it best to sticking with a good passive tank, atleast then it's good for something. With a full rack of t2 Heavies, it puts out around 250 DPS I do believe. Dont remember if that was with scourge or fury scourge though. The Drake has it's uses.... PVP not being one of them. Unless a drake pilot just wants to go spectate in PVP while tossing pebbles at the actual fighters. I was going to write something about the importance of microwarps, the simplicity of living in 0.0 and having cheap cap charges stocked in multiple outposts, and some other stuff. But since the drake isn't a PVP ship(and neither is the raven, dont bring that to pvp missiles are slow!. Leave the scorp at home because ECM has been nerfed. Rokh has the crapiest sniper damage of any ship dont use that! Haha. Someone used a ferox in pvp? worst dps ever. And what was anyone thinking flying a caracal, no dps, no tank no nothin. Moa's a joke compared to a thorax/rupture/vexor. Please everyone, stop trying to PVP in caldari ships what the h*** were you thinking? Trisha
Trisha Banks	Posted - 2007.04.23 16:49:00 - [29] Edited by: Trisha Banks on 23/04/2007 16:48:40 Originally by: Matiaj Edited by: Matiaj on 23/04/2007 11:22:19 Originally by: Trisha Banks Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I [0xCap Booster 800] Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I Power Diagnostic System II Your active setup has 6890 shield and 60/s active boost. A passive setup with LSE II + LSE II + DCU II (pdu not needed anymore) has 12862 shield, with 12.5% better resists due to DCU this makes 14699, and no more active boost. So the active tank needs AT LEAST (14699-6890)/60 = 2mn10s of PERMA-boosting to catch up with the passive tank. And this is ignoring : - Passive shield recharge increase - Armor resistance increase - Structure resistance increase So yeah a cap inj is always handy but is it really worth it to go active ? PS : Quickfit makes the DCU stacking-penalized with the Invul fields. But it's a bug, isn't it ? Quite sure the DCU aren't stacking penalized with anything... For one look at the rigs, reduces the C-5L cycle time to 2.72 secconds, or 70.6shield/s with a peak passive of 20/s that brings it to 90.6. I whiped together a passive drake setup with MWD, 2xlse 1xspr 1xpds, some hardeners, came out to 101 shields/sec at peak recharge with 13.5k shields(double active setup). passive significantly better vs explosive, active significantly betterbetter vs thermal. em/kin 10% better dps tanked by the passive. The 7k extra shields do yield some extra time, but you wont be able to burn your mwd often, and a single small nos will be enough to upset your cap recharge at head twords 0. Everyone i fight seems to love nos and at least in my situation this is rather important. To get an idea of where i come from i love medium gang warfare with at least a dozen ships per side in 5+ minute battles, thats what i look for. For passive tanking i have fit a nossing myrmidon with heavy drones. Tanks way more dps, so i dont feel bad leaving the mwd off and calling it a "home defence bait ship" trisha
Tista	Posted - 2007.04.23 17:01:00 - [30] hurricane + 6 425mm II+ 2 hams II = dps heaven cerb with HAMs = mass dps tank + 40km range killer things -------------------- My sig was stolen from some website.. leet! The true Industrial capital ship!

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