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DNSBlackknight
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:26:00 -
[1]
It is sad when you purchase a ship and can not insure it properly. invention is not doing enough to bring the market price of T2 ships down to the insurance replacement cost. Shouldnt the insurance replacement value be based on the market value of a ship and not on the mineral cost to build it. With only a certain few building ships with T2 BPO's and the invention system so costly and so many hoops to jump thru to even get BPCs the market cost will never come into line with true cost of the ships.
Something needs to be done either make the insurance system based on current market value or make it so these ships can be build by more people ( Not sure how to do this) to bring the market into check. As it stands now both the insurance and T2 ship production is wacked.
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Price Checka
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:29:00 -
[2]
First to lawl at the op!
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Janu Hull
Caldari
Order of Z Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:32:00 -
[3]
Never fly a ship you can't afford to lose. Period. The End.
This is my sig, there are many others just like it. With me, my sig is worthless. Without (or with even) my sig, I am worthless... |
slothe
Caldari
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:35:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Janu Hull
Never fly a ship you can't afford to lose. Period. The End.
what this guy says.
if you cant afford to lose it fly something else.
There is a good answer why t2 insurance is like it is, but the above applies more.
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Brisi
Veto.
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:36:00 -
[5]
Insurance is fine. And no, I'm not an uber rich tech II BPO owner.
Tech II ships are a luxury, and should be treated as such. If you got full insurance on them, nobody would bother flying tech I ship anymore, and it would just create a new gap between vets and new players.
Resistance is Fertile. |
Scrutt5
Profiteers of War
CUTTHROATS OF THE DARK SKIES
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:38:00 -
[6]
T2 have never and will never be insurable.
They are so vastly superior to T1 there has to be a downside, thats downside is cost.
You think prices are bad now, I remember paying 250mil per cerb, add fitings and your closer to 400mil for a gang pvp ship.
Simple answer is you need to make more isk.
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DNSBlackknight
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:39:00 -
[7]
Again I can afford to fly these ships. That is not the issue. Then why not just do away with the insurance idea anyway. The fact is the market on T2 ships is cornered and there is a service you can pay for that will replace your ship if it is destroyed. Why not fix it to meet the market value of the ship based on an average. It is like buying a expensive car and insuring it on the material cost LOL.
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Winterblink
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:42:00 -
[8]
Originally by: DNSBlackknight
Again I can afford to fly these ships. That is not the issue. Then why not just do away with the insurance idea anyway. The fact is the market on T2 ships is cornered and there is a service you can pay for that will replace your ship if it is destroyed. Why not fix it to meet the market value of the ship based on an average. It is like buying a expensive car and insuring it on the material cost LOL.
Sounds like my stupid insurance company, actually.
Anyway if money is no problem for you, then why the whinge about insurance payouts? Shouldn't matter, right?
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Auron Blade
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:48:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Auron Blade on 04/05/2007 16:44:49
Originally by: DNSBlackknight
....Why not fix it to meet the market value of the ship based on an average...
Unfortunately, T2 producers could then just insure and destroy the ships and earn a tidy profit.
Also, they could put items on the market at insanely high prices and drive the average up to increase that profit margin. 
*edited for schpeeling
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Janu Hull
Caldari
Order of Z Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.04 16:53:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Auron Blade
Edited by: Auron Blade on 04/05/2007 16:44:49
Originally by: DNSBlackknight
....Why not fix it to meet the market value of the ship based on an average...
Unfortunately, T2 producers could then just insure and destroy the ships and earn a tidy profit.
Also, they could put items on the market at insanely high prices and drive the average up to increase that profit margin.
*edited for schpeeling
Give ze man ze cee-garrr!
Nailed it in one.
This is my sig, there are many others just like it. With me, my sig is worthless. Without (or with even) my sig, I am worthless... |
Moraguth
Amarr
Rangers
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Posted - 2007.05.04 17:01:00 -
[11]
T2 ships are meant to be a luxury, not common place. They're not meant to be easily replaceable. You fly them for their added capabilities, not for their financial safety.
Once you get over that FACT, you'll see that things are fine. In fact, they're much better now than they've EVER been.
good game |
SiJira
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Posted - 2007.05.04 17:18:00 -
[12]
if it was based on market value then most people (see veterans and those who buy researched BP) would be able to build a ship and destroy it for profit
____ __ ________
_sig below_
the jet cans are made so that people that dont mine can get free ore
miners ritually donate the ore to anyone wishing to take some |
VanNostrum
Cataphract Securities
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Posted - 2007.05.04 17:29:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Auron Blade
Edited by: Auron Blade on 04/05/2007 16:44:49
Originally by: DNSBlackknight
....Why not fix it to meet the market value of the ship based on an average...
Unfortunately, T2 producers could then just insure and destroy the ships and earn a tidy profit.
Also, they could put items on the market at insanely high prices and drive the average up to increase that profit margin.
*edited for schpeeling
There is a difference between couple millions profit and 3-5 times the building cost profit. But as invention chances are so screwed up it hardly is profitable considering the failed attempts. Imo T2 invention chances should be slightly increased.
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Marquis Dean
Energy.
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Posted - 2007.05.04 18:10:00 -
[14]
Originally by: VanNostrum
Originally by: Auron Blade
Edited by: Auron Blade on 04/05/2007 16:44:49
Originally by: DNSBlackknight
....Why not fix it to meet the market value of the ship based on an average...
Unfortunately, T2 producers could then just insure and destroy the ships and earn a tidy profit.
Also, they could put items on the market at insanely high prices and drive the average up to increase that profit margin.
*edited for schpeeling
There is a difference between couple millions profit and 3-5 times the building cost profit. But as invention chances are so screwed up it hardly is profitable considering the failed attempts. Imo T2 invention chances should be slightly increased.
You seen the price of a Cerb or Vaga recently? They used to be 250/270 mil. Invention arrived, now they are 100mil and 130mil. Less than half what they used to be.
And you think Invention is broken?
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Originally by: Tista
i dont like you much but i'm going to agree with you on that.
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DNSBlackknight
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.05.04 18:12:00 -
[15]
The system just dosn't fit the game. Here are some ideas
1. Make insuring ships part of the game. Make it so people can make insurance a business or skill, part of the game and not controled by CCP. The player can base rates on each other player and how well they are at not getting killed.
2. If ccp remains in contorl. You could make the insurance based on each player and incidents like in the real world. This would prevent insuring and destroying for profit. Your insurance cost go up with each claim you make on a blown up ship. That way you wont be reckless with your ship and you prevent abuse. Then getting your ship blow up can have double the risk. You can get your market value for your ship back but it will drive up your cost to insure the next ship. It could be like the security staus system.
I just think that the present system could be so much more with a little effort. The insurance should be based on the players death rate and not on the cost of the material to build a ship.
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Bistot Kid
The First Thing You'll Ever See
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Posted - 2007.05.04 18:15:00 -
[16]
I want a quote for a "refit package", where I get cash paid out to refit my ship.
I have buildings and contents insurance on my house, so why not my ship?
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Hold my calls and sack my cook
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Sokratesz
Paradox v2.0
1 Shot 1 Kill
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Posted - 2007.05.04 18:17:00 -
[17]
can i insure my implants too?
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uNtOldPAIN
Minmatar
Blaine Institute for Advanced Research
Apoapsis Multiversal Consortium
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Posted - 2007.05.04 19:06:00 -
[18]
My T2 drones want some medical.
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Korizan
Oort Cloud Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.04 19:13:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Korizan on 04/05/2007 19:10:27
Originally by: Brisi
Insurance is fine. And no, I'm not an uber rich tech II BPO owner.
Tech II ships are a luxury, and should be treated as such. If you got full insurance on them, nobody would bother flying tech I ship anymore, and it would just create a new gap between vets and new players.
I have to agree with this and other like replies T2 is luxury.
Insurance is a ISK sink and always has been.
Well at least be thankful that EVE's Insurance is not totally like RL.
Otherwise there would be a TON of people with NO insurance because of frequent losses and getting dropped by the insurance company
Or for that matter last I heard RL insurance companies don't pay for suicides either
I am sorry but as the State destroyed your ship do to an infraction with the law.
We have a Concorded clause that states we are not liable for any and or all losses do to illegal activities.
In other words we are sorry to report your son is dead because he was stupid and we are not paying
Have a Nice day
Wouldn't that put a dent in things
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DNSBlackknight
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.05.04 19:34:00 -
[20]
See now that is what iam talking about. Why not insure those things on a monthly basis you could have POS insurance and all kinds of stuff LOL. The clause factor I didnt even think about LOL ( fine print love it). It would be fun I mean eve need legit thiefs.
Production services
Lawyer (escrow lawyers)
Trucking services
Thiefs
Scammers
Military
diplomats
Inventers
CEO's
Why not insurance salesmen. Its just something to think about and dont tell me you havnt been having fun reading this post and considering it. Glad to see everyone has a good sense of humor. But it could work.
Black
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Blind Man
Kemono.
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Posted - 2007.05.04 19:35:00 -
[21]
invention is actually working better than a lot of people had expected, I never thought I'd see a cerb for under 100m again 
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Scrutt5
Profiteers of War
CUTTHROATS OF THE DARK SKIES
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Posted - 2007.05.04 19:49:00 -
[22]
Personally I only fly T2 and the fact its uninsurable generaly (unless I have that stella artois in stock) makes me more careful with the ship. T2 make sure you pick your targets wisley and dont rush in knowing your gonna get a good portion of ya hard earned back.
Keep it the way it is, noticed how your the only person in this thread actually looking at the other side of the fence?
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Shameless Avenger
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Posted - 2007.05.04 20:14:00 -
[23]
Insurance doesn't pay for my modules. Modules > Ship. I don't insure ships. |
Lord WarATron
Amarr
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.04 20:57:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Lord WarATron on 04/05/2007 20:54:06
Lets build a hac for 20mil. lets sell it on the market for 1 billion. I will get my alts to buy it to skew market average.
Now I will just self destruct them all and get 1 billion insurance per hac I built. Do you see the problem?
Thats why insurance is baised on build cost. And the build cost on a hac is very different from the market price :)
Anyhow I assume your post is a joke to fire up replies so hope you had fun.
--
Billion Isk Mission |
Vantoth
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.04 21:01:00 -
[25]
Originally by: DNSBlackknight
The system just dosn't fit the game. Here are some ideas
1. Make insuring ships part of the game. Make it so people can make insurance a business or skill, part of the game and not controled by CCP. The player can base rates on each other player and how well they are at not getting killed.
Quote:
I doubt this would work. As what's keeping someone from creating an "Insurance Company" getting the payments from folks, but never paying out or transferring the money to thier main and deleting the alt insurer. Also the way it works now you make 1 payment for much less than the value of the payout. Then they would have to send a copy of the 'Kill mail" as proof they lost the ship. So if someone was insane enough to become an insurer they would never make any money, they would lose money, unless you have the person you were insuring send payments like we do in RL. Because sooner or later you will get blown up. And what you payed for insurance is no where near enough to cover the payout.
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Riddick Valer
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Posted - 2007.05.04 21:04:00 -
[26]
Insurance has real reasons to be based on base costs, which I won't rehash.
However, some changes should be made to insurance.
1) No payment if killed by concord. What insurance agency would every insure you for being shot by the police for committing a crime?
2) No payment if killed in 0.0. Who would insure someone in the middle of a war?
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The yzzergirl
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.04 21:06:00 -
[27]
T2 insurance is the base price of every ship, thierfore it colates with every other ship in game.
As said above, dont fly what you cant afford to lose.
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Dream that you will live forever...
Live as if you will die today..
The choice is yours.
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Tkar vonBiggendorf
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.04 21:08:00 -
[28]
Real insurance companies have clauses about military and wartime action. How'd you like your ship insurance to be voided if your corp gets war decced? Or if you venture into low-sec space? Or if you fit weapons modules and run missions or go ratting? These conditions all increase the likelihood of your ship being destroyed, and a real insurance company would increase your premium or void your contract accordingly.
It's a game. Play. Have fun. Get over it.
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Selena 001
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Posted - 2007.05.04 21:54:00 -
[29]
Do people not understand the concept of the "Mean" Average system?
You dont throw 1 on the market at 1 billion, buy it, then make a massive profit.... you'd have to flood the market with thousands upon thousands to drive the mean upto even 500 million, and it would NEVER EVER EVER reach 1 billion... EVER.
I'm fairly sure that people who actually wanted to make and sell them for a normal profit would also just put them on the market... you know... at normal prices and make some money from it, slowly driving the average back down.
OFC, there would always be a few who just sit there night and day passing the same ship back and forth on the market to improve the mean price... These people should be allowed to do it, seeing as they dont have real lives and it would be a shame to rain on their market PvP attempts 
___________
NATIONAL SARCASM DAY!! |
Derovius Vaden
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Posted - 2007.05.04 22:45:00 -
[30]
When a military tests a new prototype aircraft, they understand the risks that if the equipment decides to go kaboom, they will lose money. EVE should be no different, T2 are suppose to be cutting edge, if not prototypes, and they are a "use at your own risk" so of deal.
If everyone could insure their T2 as they did their T1, there would be no feasible reason to use T1 ever again. Sometimes it pays to go cheap, insurance or not.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.05.04 23:00:00 -
[31]
Make it like the OP says.
How else will he insure his Failboat?
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You keep using that word . . . I do not think it means what you think it means |
Del Narveux
Obsidian Angels Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.05.04 23:02:00 -
[32]
T2 insurance is fine. If they werent just purely more uber than T1, and actually had some weaknesses instead of across the board stat boosts compared to T1 counterpart, yeah maybe then I could see making them insurable but as it is now, t2 ship >>> t1 ship so you should at least have to give up something for that ability.
_________________
[SAK] Alumnus--And Proud Of It! -- aka Cpt Bogus
Is that my torped sig cloaking your base?
Originally by: Wrangler
Well, at least we have forum PvP..
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