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Loan request for Rattlesnake dualboxing

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Jax Bederen Dark Horse RM 332	Posted - 2017.04.11 06:12:18 - [31] - Quote Jerry T Pepridge wrote: would like pledge 20b Thus we've come to the end of the road.
cisea Royal Amarr Transportation Mordus Angels 1	Posted - 2017.04.11 07:09:14 - [32] - Quote Yea the hostile attitude, repeated insults "u guyz dunt know", lack of planning, poor numbers, no collateral and the proverbial "I have in game offers but want to keep asking here" makes this a no brainer. Meh, who knows, someone might take a chance but I dont see the likelyhood. You might as well just go with Jerry T Pepridge's offer.
Manbun Scarfbeard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2017.04.11 07:37:57 - [33] - Quote cisea wrote: Yea the hostile attitude, repeated insults "u guyz dunt know", lack of planning, poor numbers, no collateral and the proverbial "I have in game offers but want to keep asking here" makes this a no brainer. It's easy to get on the bandwagon I suppose, but my attitude reflects the attitude of the post I'm answering to, the planning is good, the numbers are correct and I don't know what else to tell you, I do have offers, but the request was open-ended, hence the thread stays open. If you are interested and have legitimate questions, shoot me a message and I'll go over them with you. Otherwise, I'm not really interested in your snobby attitude.
lanyaie Nocturnal Romance Cynosural Field Theory. 1234	Posted - 2017.04.11 13:41:55 - [34] - Quote Manbun Scarfbeard wrote: cisea wrote: Yea the hostile attitude, repeated insults "u guyz dunt know", lack of planning, poor numbers, no collateral and the proverbial "I have in game offers but want to keep asking here" makes this a no brainer. It's easy to get on the bandwagon I suppose, but my attitude reflects the attitude of the post I'm answering to, the planning is good, the numbers are correct and I don't know what else to tell you, I do have offers, but the request was open-ended, hence the thread stays open. If you are interested and have legitimate questions, shoot me a message and I'll go over them with you. Otherwise, I'm not really interested in your snobby attitude. Just out of curiosity...after reading this thread I'd like to raise a few points 1.) "10-20 man rescue fleet" out of all those people, no individual has any money spare for you? Why do you assume asking for a loan here on an NPC character with no incentive to pay back will result in a better answer than asking your corp for money? 2.) "1.8b is still a lot of time" - if it's a lot of time, how do I know you won't just send ISK to main character and biomass? You're not losing anything after all. 3.) Why haven't you accepted the offers you have received so far? I don't see anything positive in this thread, I don't know how you yourself assume better offers will come forward from the discussion that has been conducted in this thread. Honestly, like...it was worth a shot, I suggest you get back to the drawing board and come up with something believable. Pay attention to the details and when replying, don't reply with something that can be used against you such as "20 guys can come rescue me but can't loan me money" Spaceprincess People who put passwords on char bazaar Eveboards are the worst.
Manbun Scarfbeard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2017.04.11 14:00:12 - [35] - Quote lanyaie wrote: Just out of curiosity...after reading this thread I'd like to raise a few points 1.) "10-20 man rescue fleet" out of all those people, no individual has any money spare for you? Why do you assume asking for a loan here on an NPC character with no incentive to pay back will result in a better answer than asking your corp for money? 2.) "1.8b is still a lot of time" - if it's a lot of time, how do I know you won't just send ISK to main character and biomass? You're not losing anything after all. 3.) Why haven't you accepted the offers you have received so far? I don't see anything positive in this thread, I don't know how you yourself assume better offers will come forward from the discussion that has been conducted in this thread. 1.) They might, but like I said in several posts above, I'd like to solve this without my corp. The emphasis was on the "I don't want to" part, and I told you why. 2.) I can't say anything that would make you believe I wouldn't, so I don't see the point in asking. Nature of the beast when it comes to uncollaterized loans from non-MD regulars. You either take a chance with me or you don't, I can't give you anything but my word. 3.) I have an interview set up for tomorrow with one of the people who offered the best terms. I have my phone to answer questions from, I don't see a reason to lock the thread. I'll post here if we've come to an agreement. I won't react to the rest of your post, have a nice day.
Xylem Viliana another shell corp mk3 399	Posted - 2017.04.11 14:14:58 - [36] - Quote I dont want to dishearten you. MD can be a bit aggressive sometimes but we have seen basically every type of scam loan IPO and everything inbetween. people want to aggressively question to provoke mistakes. Ones that you have either intentionally or unintentionally left yourself open to. If you get the loan, congrats, someone took a risk and there is a very strong possibility they dont expect it to be successful but it can happen. (more often that not private agreements are made with alts to farm reputation so if you need another loan in the future you may wish to be prepared for that) If you dont get the loan, then dont kick a fuss, just get the funds through farming over time or as has been suggested speak to other alliance members. if there is a 10-20 man defense fleet willing to try to bail you out risking their own ships im sure borrowing from them would be managable should you opt to go that route in future. I read this when it was posted and simply dismissed it as scam fodder, try as you may to say it isnt, you cannot change what another person believes, you can make counter claims but without evidence to back the claims up its 1v1 and no clear winner. Collateral is always a game changer. people will look for collateralized loans because they are more secure, uncollateralized is balanced by interest, more interest more people may consider it and the more will be put off due to the interest. its finding a balance of attracting interested parties without scaring them away as the collateral is so high it screams scam. Should you try again for a loan, set out the terms you would like, provide as solid a business plan as you can, if possible have collateral. solid business plan is not dualboxing wh sites and 10-20 people will come save me.
Manbun Scarfbeard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2017.04.11 15:23:17 - [37] - Quote Xylem Viliana wrote: -stuff- Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. I didn't expect the hostility I got, but I guess it's understandable. If I had assets of value I could do without, I would have definitely gone for that option. Xylem Viliana wrote: Should you try again for a loan, set out the terms you would like, provide as solid a business plan as you can, if possible have collateral. solid business plan is not dualboxing wh sites and 10-20 people will come save me. To be honest, I'm a pretty risk-averse person when it comes to PvE. If there's a slight possibility that I could get blown up, I don't really undock my PvE boats. There's no real risk/reward when it comes to blue loot - you won't make more if you start ratting with 5 neutral ships on dscan. I tried to give the impression that I know when it's safe and when it isn't, but I guess it's hard to put yourself in my shoes as an investor if you haven't lived with a large wh corp before. Anyways, thanks for the advice.
Areen Sassel 190	Posted - 2017.04.11 18:12:35 - [38] - Quote Manbun Scarfbeard wrote: 1.) They might, but like I said in several posts above, I'd like to solve this without my corp. The emphasis was on the "I don't want to" part, and I told you why. That's the part that makes no sense. Who knows your main? Who already has to trust you? Who knows these Rattlers and ratting setup actually exist? Who knows the arrangements for security of the hole are good? Who will benefit themselves to a degree if you get this cash? Your corpmates. They're so obviously the first choice to borrow the money from that "I don't want to" doesn't really cover it.
Obsidian Blacke Oberon Confederation 4	Posted - 2017.04.12 05:26:09 - [39] - Quote Manbun Scarfbeard wrote: I'm not trying to scam anyone. 1.8b is still a lot of time i'd have to put in if i were to farm that much with only 1 rattler. I've answered every question thrown at me that wasn't just the author being a smartass - I'm sorry if uncollaterized loans have a bad rep. Me posting from an alt has to do with opsec in general, we have strict rules regarding posting with an in-corp toon. Seems like a good idea in hindsight with all the hate i'm getting. I don't mean to pile on, but 1.2-1.8 billion ISK is not a lot of time that you'd have to put in to farm with 1 rattler when you state you can make 200m-250m an hour solo. Further, it is quite strange that you refuse to ask your friends for help. Even if you don't want to ask them for actual ISK, you could still ask one of them to duo with you and let you keep the loot and salvage with a promise to pay them back after you use the money to train up your second rattler. That way your time is maximized as you want it to be, and you get the ISK to fund your second Rattler. I can't think of too many people who wouldn't be willing to spend 3 hours helping out a corp mate in that fashion. Hell if you can get more than one person in your corp who likes you enough to help you, it wouldn't even take 3 hours.
Saveritas Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc. 7	Posted - 2017.04.12 05:58:06 - [40] - Quote You're stating you can farm for 4 to 5.5 hours in the weekends. You also stated you can make 200-250m solo. This is kind of basic math, right? Farm for a weekend. Buy your rattlesnakes. Profit.

Manbun Scarfbeard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2017.04.12 07:26:11 - [41] - Quote This is to confirm that I (the Borrower) have accepted a ISK 1.8 billion uncollateralized loan from JitaPu (the Lender), with the following terms: - Principal: ISK 1.8 billion - Repayment Date: 7 May 2017 (prior to EVE downtime) - Interest: 5% (ISK 90 million) per week, payable each Sunday prior to downtime (each an Interest Payment Date), with first the payment due on 16 April 2017. - Early prepayment: if the Borrower wishes to repay the loan ahead of the Repayment Date, he may do so on any Interest Payment date, however, prepayments within the first 4 weeks of the loan term are subject to a make-whole provision, requiring the Borrower to pay the Principal plus 20%, less any Interest already paid. - Extensions: maturity extensions require consent of both the borrower and the lender. - Collateral: nil.
JitaPu Random Strategies 4	Posted - 2017.04.12 07:29:49 - [42] - Quote I confirm the above. ISK 1.8 billion sent to Manbun Scarfbeard.
Manbun Scarfbeard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2017.04.12 07:32:14 - [43] - Quote Isk recieved, biomassing shortly. Thank you for choosing Oruze Cruze Scamlines. Edit: JitaPu is a legitimately nice guy. I'm sorry man.
JitaPu Random Strategies 4	Posted - 2017.04.12 07:33:42 - [44] - Quote Well done sir.
Saveritas Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc. 7	Posted - 2017.04.12 08:06:58 - [45] - Quote Well, that was obvious. You should've gone for more.
cisea Royal Amarr Transportation Mordus Angels 1	Posted - 2017.04.12 09:02:53 - [46] - Quote That was a lot of stupid work for less than 2 bil. Also, it was rather clear from all the posts here this would happen. Live and let learn.
Manbun Scarfbeard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2017.04.12 09:53:00 - [47] - Quote I'm more than happy with the amount I got, I was hoping the small ask price would make people more willing to risk. Thinking back on it, with the numbers I presented, I should have went into the 3b range to make things more believable (it came up often in this thread as well), but that's a conclusion I made after the die was cast, so I rolled with it. An API check was the thing I was most afraid of. I could have talked myself out from showing transaction history (opsec), but I couldn't talk my way out of having no assets to speak of ("But they are on my main" - "Contract them over so i can see them"), nor not having the SP that I talked about in my original post ("I haven't injected them yet" - "Inject so I can see/Transfer the injectors over so I can see"), nor being an alpha clone. To be honest, uncollaterized loans from unknowns will always be scams if the receiver thinks things through. No reputation to lose, everything to gain. Even if the client is reputable, reputations can be manufactured, and if the price is right, can be thrown away the same way. Hell, if you are famous enough, people won't even mind, you'll be a legend (but this is more applicable to third partying). To be honest, MD regulars pick apart these loan schemes from the wrong angle. I could write you the most believable fairy tale (I think I did good) when I have f* all to back it up with. The story isn't important, it's the nature of the loan itself that provides 0 safety to the lender. Anyways, I had a lot of fun. This social aspect is what got me into EvE, and is what I stay for to this day (the spaceships are cool too). Fly safe o7
Areen Sassel 190	Posted - 2017.04.12 10:55:41 - [48] - Quote Well, well done. I'd say I don't know how Jita Pu fell for that, but having fallen for an obvious-in-retrospect Sabriz alt a few months ago, I can't talk. :-)
JitaPu Random Strategies 5	Posted - 2017.04.12 11:47:09 - [49] - Quote Hi guys, I thought I would add a bit of colour around how I fell for this. I made some pretty basic mistakes, primarily due to lack of RL time to do proper research. Hell, I did not even read the posts in this thread over the past few days before I spoke to Manbun earlier today. In hindsight, a lot of things should have rung my alarm bells. I was thinking about asking for APi keys but honestly could not be bothered to waste all this time on a 1.8bn loan. Key lesson for the future is to pass if I simply don't have the time to do proper background checks. As for Manbun's work, he did a pretty good job. His backstory seemed plausible, though I was a bit confused as to why he would not reveal the name of his wormhole corp to me... In summary, mistakes are learning opportunities (and hazing opportunities for all neutral observers ). I have learned my lessons, so feel free to pile in with your comments.
William Ormono Regional Rat Control Ltd. 12	Posted - 2017.04.12 13:57:25 - [50] - Quote Lol, you seem pretty proud of yourself Manbun Scarfbeard wrote: MD regulars pick apart these loan schemes from the wrong angle. I could write you the most believable fairy tale (I think I did good) when I have f* all to back it up with. You think you did good? As in, you think your story was good? I mean, granted, the scam was successful (so congrats for that), but leading up to that there are two pages filled with MD regulars poking holes in your story. No part of it made sense and no one was falling for it. And when questioned, your answers just created more questions and further demonstrated how flawed your story was. Manbun Scarfbeard wrote: If the scammer did his homework, he'll be able to talk himself out of questions regarding the backstory. You sound like a person who thinks they were able to successfully talk themselves out of the questions they were asked. Granted, you fooled JitaPU, but I hope you haven't convinced yourself that you fooled anyone else. Again, see first two pages of this forum thread.

Zanar Skwigelf Boa Innovations Brothers of Tangra 149	Posted - 2017.04.12 14:55:56 - [51] - Quote Manbun Scarfbeard wrote: I'm more than happy with the amount I got, I was hoping the small ask price would make people more willing to risk. Thinking back on it, with the numbers I presented, I should have went into the 3b range to make things more believable (it came up often in this thread as well), but that's a conclusion I made after the die was cast, so I rolled with it. At 3b I still would have told you to go buy Plex you filthy poor.
Alexi Stokov State War Academy Caldari State 144	Posted - 2017.04.12 16:04:50 - [52] - Quote JitaPu wrote: Hi guys, I thought I would add a bit of colour around how I fell for this. I made some pretty basic mistakes, primarily due to lack of RL time to do proper research. Hell, I did not even read the posts in this thread over the past few days before I spoke to Manbun earlier today. In hindsight, a lot of things should have rung my alarm bells. I was thinking about asking for APi keys but honestly could not be bothered to waste all this time on a 1.8bn loan. Key lesson for the future is to pass if I simply don't have the time to do proper background checks. As for Manbun's work, he did a pretty good job. His backstory seemed plausible, though I was a bit confused as to why he would not reveal the name of his wormhole corp to me... In summary, mistakes are learning opportunities (and hazing opportunities for all neutral observers ). I have learned my lessons, so feel free to pile in with your comments. You can't claim he did a good job when you just admitted to not reading anything in the first 2 pages.
Potato Chip Lady Jita Trade Association 0	Posted - 2017.04.12 20:00:13 - [53] - Quote Wow. I've heard so much about how jaded and cynical Eve players are. I didn't realize scams like this were still a thing - I didn't think anyone trusted anyone by this point. Glad to see that assumption is wrong (although sad to see someone get scammed). I'm too new to the game to not see 1.8 Billion ISK as $27.00 (I can't PLEX my accounts yet, so I gotta buy them), but I'm glad to see the person who got scammed is OK with it. I have a feeling I wouldn't be taking it as well. You Eve players are alright
Jax Bederen Dark Horse RM 335	Posted - 2017.04.12 22:03:02 - [54] - Quote Not sure why you trusted that looser, weak character was pretty easy to read. Seriously some of you have to much cash.
JitaPu Random Strategies 5	Posted - 2017.04.12 22:50:57 - [55] - Quote Hi guys, you all make fair comments. The one thing I would say here is, when you consider making uncollateralized loans, it is effectively like playing roulette. It is gambling. It is not investing. You may fool yourself into thinking that a loan gone well was a "good investment" but you really just got lucky. Please note, I am not saying this applies to collateralized loans. So the questions are, do you like gambling, do you like the thrill of it, can you afford a total loss, how will it affect your mood if you lose/get scammed. Everyone has to answer these questions for themselves. Alexi Stokov wrote: You can't claim he did a good job when you just admitted to not reading anything in the first 2 pages. With regards to Alexi's comment, Alexi is right, in hindsight, I should have known, had a I actually read the full thread before making my decision, but I did not and part of the reason for that, other than lack of RL time, was Manbun's performance on the call, which you guys obviously did not hear. He did very well. To those who think that he put in too much effort for what turned out to be a pretty small profit (he probably could have made that money had he spent all that time actually ratting), I can see how his satisfaction does not come from the amount scammed but from the fact that he did manage to pull off a successful scam at all. As someone who has never scammed anyone, I can to some degree relate this to other activities in EVE, such as ganking ratters / miners in cloaky ships, where the hunt leading up to the kill provides more satisfaction than the actual kill. Personally, I hold no hard feelings over this. Manbun created content. A sandbox like EVE would be boring as hell if it was not for people creating content, in whatever shape and form. This is not a moral endorsement of scamming, but just a practical view of life in EVE.
KenFlorian Jednota Inc 45	Posted - 2017.04.13 01:56:48 - [56] - Quote Jax Bederen wrote: Jerry T Pepridge wrote: would like pledge 20b Thus we've come to the end of the road. Thread incomplete until Bumblefeck bids!
Areen Sassel 190	Posted - 2017.04.13 02:12:25 - [57] - Quote JitaPu wrote: Personally, I hold no hard feelings over this. Manbun created content. A sandbox like EVE would be boring as hell if it was not for people creating content, in whatever shape and form. This is not a moral endorsement of scamming, but just a practical view of life in EVE. That's the spirit, but let's go further; it's completely moral to scam in EVE, just as it's moral to lie in Illuminati or betray a trust in Diplomacy. We're playing a game, and this is part of the game.
Sabriz Adoudel Move along there is nothing here 5961	Posted - 2017.04.13 08:34:08 - [58] - Quote JitaPu wrote: Hi guys, I thought I would add a bit of colour around how I fell for this. I made some pretty basic mistakes, primarily due to lack of RL time to do proper research. Hell, I did not even read the posts in this thread over the past few days before I spoke to Manbun earlier today. In hindsight, a lot of things should have rung my alarm bells. I was thinking about asking for APi keys but honestly could not be bothered to waste all this time on a 1.8bn loan. Key lesson for the future is to pass if I simply don't have the time to do proper background checks. As for Manbun's work, he did a pretty good job. His backstory seemed plausible, though I was a bit confused as to why he would not reveal the name of his wormhole corp to me... In summary, mistakes are learning opportunities (and hazing opportunities for all neutral observers ). I have learned my lessons, so feel free to pile in with your comments. It's not the most expensive lesson. Better to make this mistake than to get screwed for 20 billion on something bigger. But you should learn a lesson here: when it comes to talking about trust, listen to me, I'm always right. I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com Sabriz's Rule: "Any time someone argues for a game change claiming it is a quality of life change, the change is actually a game balance change".
Professor Sternu Tarantoga The Futurological Congress 89	Posted - 2017.04.13 13:35:38 - [59] - Quote So this was a chrade and JitaPU is Manbun's alt or 1,8 Bil. aren't worth any kind of background check? Anyway, preparer for a lot of "me-too"s.


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