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Please Advise: Bowhead high-sec ganks

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Desmios Sanguis Tax-Free Foundation 40	Posted - 2017.06.06 15:18:22 - [1] - Quote Hello all, Several people I run incursions with use bowheads to transport their ships from incursion to incursion; I have been debating doing the same. However, they have given me dire warnings about how dangerous it is. So this seems to be about the general fit: https://o.smium.org/loadout/101502 What I dont understand is: https://zkillboard.com/ship/34328/ How do these bowheads die in highsec? They told me to read up on freighter ganking before I thought about flying one -- not sure where to do that though. How do bowheads get ganked in highsec? Looks like 20 - 40 catalysts and similars. How do they get that many people there that quickly? I assume it is planned out way in advance... How can I keep myself safe in a bowhead? Can anyone please advise...
Dom Arkaral The Conference Elite CODE. 1516	Posted - 2017.06.06 15:36:01 - [2] - Quote The only safe way to navigate in Highsec is to buy a mining permit for 10m isk and follow the Code. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome CCL Loyalist
Jenn aSide Shinigami Miners ChaosTheory. 16000	Posted - 2017.06.06 15:36:27 - [3] - Quote I used a bowhead to move my stuff when I did incursions and never got screwed with. 1st thing you notice about the ones that got ganked is that that are fit for speed not tank. This is a mistake, tank the Bowhead. another problem is they just chucked their fitted ships in them and went. So no tank plus billions of potential loot = gank target. also, if you have an alt, trained it to use a webbing ship. And don't be afraid to spent time. I moved my ships like this: Strip fittings, put ships in bowhead, give fittings to alt in proator (transport ship, can't be scanned.), fly to next focus. Transport alt warps and cloaks through every gate because most of the value is in the transport. Of course the transport alt gets there faster. And I kept a Gila or a Tengu in the bowhead as well, so while i would run incursions on one character, the transport alt would be in the next constellation over using drones or fof missiles to do anomalies to get escalations (drones and fof missiles require very little attention so are easy to multibox with an incursion toon).. Just put some thought into it and it's possible to be almost 100% safe.
Renee Frost Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 34	Posted - 2017.06.06 15:56:22 - [4] - Quote Yeah, this one has the correct tanking fit: https://zkillboard.com/kill/62609958/ And still got ganked on the way to the next incursion focus. Well, technically there is no way to be 100% safe since they can keep bumping you with a velator for 3 minutes while throwing tornadoes and catalysts at you.
Dom Arkaral The Conference Elite CODE. 1518	Posted - 2017.06.06 16:01:04 - [5] - Quote Renee Frost wrote: Yeah, this one has the correct tanking fit: https://zkillboard.com/kill/62609958/ And still got ganked on the way to the next incursion focus. Well, technically there is no way to be 100% safe since they can keep bumping you with a velator for 3 minutes while throwing tornadoes and catalysts at you. Nados are not used by us on freighters, they're only really good against active tanked boats or smaller haulers.. Talos is better by far at popping cherries Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome CCL Loyalist
Alaric Faelen Sabotage Incorporated Executive Outcomes 503	Posted - 2017.06.06 16:04:10 - [6] - Quote You'll find that most ganking takes place in choke point systems, especially those with lower sec status- like .5 or .6 so CONCORD doesn't spawn so quickly. First- check your map before undocking. Don't care if it's a shuttle, look at your map. If you see a ridiculous number of ships destroyed in the past hour or so...chances are good there is active ganking going on there. So avoid it. There are also a lot of intel channels available. Keep up on these and contribute to them. You can do more than click on a destination and go straight there. Use the map, plot out a route even if it takes a little longer. Extra time spent moving your stuff is much less annoying than watching it explode. Second- I agree with Jenn, move the ships in the bowhead, and any shiny mods by fast/cloaky transport. It's two trips sure, but two trips without getting ganked is better than the one trip where you did. You can always contract to get your stuff moved as well. Incursions are an isk faucet so spending a few bucks to get your stuff moved is just the cost of doing business. Put an alt into CODE or MiniLuv, and you'll be in the know on where they are active and if your ship is the one they are forming a gank fleet for. Can't beat intel from the inside.
Mr Epeen It's All About Me 11322	Posted - 2017.06.06 16:09:32 - [7] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: Can anyone please advise... Red Frog Mr Epeen
Chainsaw Plankton FaDoyToy 3131	Posted - 2017.06.06 16:19:47 - [8] - Quote looks like a lot of the bowheads that go down in highsec are from wardecs or got suspect baited. A lot of the ones that got ganked are fit for agility and/or warp speed. Compare the ones with nanos or istabs in the lows that took 74k-106k damage that got ganked by 11 bombers (20-30mil each). Now look to the full tank one that took over 200k in damage which had much higher resists thanks to the damage control they used 26 pilots to gank that. That one was worth ~15bil, it doesn't really matter if you have a tank fit if you are hauling freaking 15bil worth of loot that was easily scanned. I don't know exactly how the gankers operate, but more EHP means they need more organization and that alone can deter some ganks, although if they see a big enough target they will call up another gank group and get those pilots that likely have ships on the route. uedama and Niarja are the classic systems where a lot of big ship ganks happen. I wouldn't be surprised if some gank groups put up scouts between incursion staging systems but again that requires more organization tl;dr go for the max tank fit, don't carry too much cargo selling officer BCUs! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6872141 @ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Chainsaw Plankton FaDoyToy 3131	Posted - 2017.06.06 16:21:45 - [9] - Quote Renee Frost wrote: Yeah, this one has the correct tanking fit: https://zkillboard.com/kill/62609958/ And still got ganked on the way to the next incursion focus. Well, technically there is no way to be 100% safe since they can keep bumping you with a velator for 3 minutes while throwing tornadoes and catalysts at you. that one was very likely a wardec kill, and it definalty wasn't a suicide gank. PIRAT does mass wardecs and is very active in the amarr area. and t3cs may be a bit op, but not 30k+ damage before concord shows up OP. selling officer BCUs! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6872141 @ChainsawPlankto on twitter
DeMichael Crimson Republic University Minmatar Republic 62646	Posted - 2017.06.06 16:22:50 - [10] - Quote Well, the Bowhead might have been traveling on Autopilot which would drop the ship off 15km's from the destination gate and then slow boat the rest of the way before jumping. That would allow the gankers time to scan it, mobilize enough ships to intercept and destroy it. Hopefully manual piloting with warp to 0 / Jump option will help safeguard you from being attack by gankers. DMC 'The Plan' \| California Eve Players \| Proposal - The Endless Battle

Jenn aSide Shinigami Miners ChaosTheory. 16000	Posted - 2017.06.06 16:35:11 - [11] - Quote Renee Frost wrote: Yeah, this one has the correct tanking fit: https://zkillboard.com/kill/62609958/ And still got ganked on the way to the next incursion focus. Well, technically there is no way to be 100% safe since they can keep bumping you with a velator for 3 minutes while throwing tornadoes and catalysts at you. Other people beat me too it, but in your haste you neglected to realize that what you linked wasn't a gank. that was someone who didn't bother to see if he was war decced or a pvp'r who didn't realize he had a kill right someone could use against him. Still, anything can be ganked, the point is that some effort and thought minimizes the risks. I flew with ISN and TVP and later with Warp to Me for years and never once got ganked traveling because i followed a few simple rules.
Black Pedro Yammerschooner 3485	Posted - 2017.06.06 17:18:03 - [12] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: How can I keep myself safe in a bowhead? Can anyone please advise... Perfectly safe? You can't. DON'T FLY WHAT YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO LOSE Forgive the caps, but that is the most important lesson you need to know. Losses in Eve only hurt when you ignore this rule. Therefore, don't fly a Bowhead until you can replace it and all it's cargo at least once, if not twice (better yet 5-10 times if you want to truly be able to laugh at such a loss). If you do this you minimize the chance of yourself rage-quitting when you get unlucky and someone catches you making a mistake. But more practically, a Bowhead will most likely be ganked if they are a) using the autopilot, or b) stuffed to the gills with valuable loot. If you move cargo in the 1B or less zone, you have very little to fear. If you do so with a webbing escort (or even with a 10s-to-warp MWD fit), your shrink the window of vulnerability so much only incredibly bad luck will result in you being shot by bad people. 99.9% of Bowheads make it safely from point to point. Even the terribly fit ones and the ones carrying too much ISK or that use autopilot. To avoid being in that small fraction of a percent, you need to make yourself an unprofitable target. That means fitting tank, not carrying too much value in cargo, and paying attention with a scout and/or a webber. Spending the small amount of effort to do this will all but ensure your safety flying a Bowhead in highsec. The 8 Golden Rules of Eve Why Do They Gank?
Flharfh Lhar Star Explorers Reckoning Star Alliance 34	Posted - 2017.06.06 18:08:33 - [13] - Quote Don't fly it during a wardec. Most of the ones that get suicide ganked are speed / agility fit. [Bowhead, Bowhead fit] Damage Control II Reinforced Bulkheads II Reinforced Bulkheads II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II 500MN Microwarpdrive II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Gets over 600k EHP with the invulns overheated. Still, when you reach a certain ratio of isk value per EHP you will always become a profitable gank target, and the only limitations are whether the gankers can put together a fleet large enough to kill you. The post by Jenn about transporting modules in a blockade runner separately is great advice, in my opinion.
Magnus Jax 83	Posted - 2017.06.06 19:31:11 - [14] - Quote Simply put: they lost their bowhead because they're dumb 1) in low sec or 0.0 2) in a wardec 3) shitfit
Azomdi Nantes Brand Newbros Test Alliance Please Ignore 0	Posted - 2017.06.06 19:42:32 - [15] - Quote Nothing makes you safe, other than not undocking. Besides that the below will help you as much as possible. Proper fit Web Alt Manual pilot Don't carry more than you have to (IE, don't carry 15 bil with of shiz, esp if it would fit in a runner or something else)
Herzog Wolfhammer Sigma Special Tactics Group 8536	Posted - 2017.06.06 19:49:41 - [16] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: Hello all, Several people I run incursions with use bowheads to transport their ships from incursion to incursion; I have been debating doing the same. However, they have given me dire warnings about how dangerous it is. So this seems to be about the general fit: https://o.smium.org/loadout/101502 What I dont understand is: https://zkillboard.com/ship/34328/ How do these bowheads die in highsec? They told me to read up on freighter ganking before I thought about flying one -- not sure where to do that though. How do bowheads get ganked in highsec? Looks like 20 - 40 catalysts and similars. How do they get that many people there that quickly? I assume it is planned out way in advance... How can I keep myself safe in a bowhead? Can anyone please advise... Not to be a d!ck but wouldn't the ships you are putting into the bowhead have a better tank than the bowhead? Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Frostys Virpio KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 3372	Posted - 2017.06.06 19:54:47 - [17] - Quote Herzog Wolfhammer wrote: Desmios Sanguis wrote: Hello all, Several people I run incursions with use bowheads to transport their ships from incursion to incursion; I have been debating doing the same. However, they have given me dire warnings about how dangerous it is. So this seems to be about the general fit: https://o.smium.org/loadout/101502 What I dont understand is: https://zkillboard.com/ship/34328/ How do these bowheads die in highsec? They told me to read up on freighter ganking before I thought about flying one -- not sure where to do that though. How do bowheads get ganked in highsec? Looks like 20 - 40 catalysts and similars. How do they get that many people there that quickly? I assume it is planned out way in advance... How can I keep myself safe in a bowhead? Can anyone please advise... Not to be a d!ck but wouldn't the ships you are putting into the bowhead have a better tank than the bowhead? The proposed fit is just shy of 600k EHP. Most of it is in structure with no resist hole to use too. You won't get all that much higher of a tank on ship carried for incursion...
Skorpynekomimi 698	Posted - 2017.06.06 19:57:33 - [18] - Quote Herzog Wolfhammer wrote: Desmios Sanguis wrote: Hello all, Several people I run incursions with use bowheads to transport their ships from incursion to incursion; I have been debating doing the same. However, they have given me dire warnings about how dangerous it is. So this seems to be about the general fit: https://o.smium.org/loadout/101502 What I dont understand is: https://zkillboard.com/ship/34328/ How do these bowheads die in highsec? They told me to read up on freighter ganking before I thought about flying one -- not sure where to do that though. How do bowheads get ganked in highsec? Looks like 20 - 40 catalysts and similars. How do they get that many people there that quickly? I assume it is planned out way in advance... How can I keep myself safe in a bowhead? Can anyone please advise... Not to be a d!ck but wouldn't the ships you are putting into the bowhead have a better tank than the bowhead? You don't dump them in a ship bay for tank, you do it for convenience. OP: How not to get shot: 1. Tank your ****. 2. EHP! 3. Speed is good too. 4. Don't go out of highsec. 5. Don't go through major systems. 6. Don't fly expensive vulnerable stuff into Jita. 7. Paranoia. Change your ship name. Change your route. Change your ship. 8. GIT GUD. Tanking skills, not just for your carebear specialisation 9. Don't fly under a wardec. 10. OPSEC. Keep your fool mouth shut. Economic PVP
Chainsaw Plankton FaDoyToy 3143	Posted - 2017.06.06 20:09:22 - [19] - Quote Herzog Wolfhammer wrote: Not to be a d!ck but wouldn't the ships you are putting into the bowhead have a better tank than the bowhead? nope, full tank bowhead is a bit under 500k ehp (can go a bit over with passive tank hardwires (slots 7, 8, and 10)) this nightmare comes out to 204k (up to 221k with bulkheads instead of pds), and that is with 2 tank rigs, I have no idea what rigs they are using now. mach and vindi can have pretty similar tanks. I mean sure if you add up the ehp of a mach, vindi, nightmare, and a logi you will have more EHP, but that involves taking many trips. If you only have one ship it makes sense to just move it, and of course taking precautions like moving the shiny mods in a blockade runner make sense. heck according to osmon the fit has just under 600k ehp, eft is saying about 100k less for whatever reason [Nightmare, Incursion - Travel] Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Damage Control II Pithum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II 100MN Afterburner II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Large Remote Capacitor Transmitter II Large Remote Shield Booster II Large Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II Large Core Defense Field Extender II Large Energy Discharge Elutriation II Hobgoblin II x5 Curator II x2 selling officer BCUs! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6872141 @ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Piugattuk Lima beans Corp 636	Posted - 2017.06.06 20:18:58 - [20] - Quote The most effective way to not let this happen is to not fly a big fat whale full of goodies, if you plan on doing incursions you have to move ships by flying them yourself, unfortunately we have folks who want only to ruin your good time, it is their purpose, it gives them what they lack in life, satisfaction, satisfaction because they are angry about something in RL so this game gives them a way to pass their misery on. (ok, psycho babel done). Everyone is going to tell you don't fly what you can't lose, tank, give the risk to others, etc, all valid, but here is a rule of thumb, don't make it worth the other players time, don't faction fit, use T-1 mods, T-2, only, storyline mods are ok if they are cheap enough. Have copies of ships, if everything you have is tied up in one ship then when something happens (and it will), you will be left kicking the ground, either buy extra ships, or build them, and spread your assets across Eden, have ships in every racial space, by having assets in many places you can just jump in a shuttle or jump clone and enjoy, this is the most effective because you can be anywhere at anytime and enjoying your eve does not depend on one area, we can never be free of defectives but we can reduce their good time by being absent from their gaze.

Ima Wreckyou The Conference Elite CODE. 4139	Posted - 2017.06.06 20:29:33 - [21] - Quote Flharfh Lhar wrote: Don't fly it during a wardec. Most of the ones that get suicide ganked are speed / agility fit. [Bowhead, Bowhead fit] Damage Control II Reinforced Bulkheads II Reinforced Bulkheads II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II 500MN Microwarpdrive II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Gets over 600k EHP with the invulns overheated. This basically. The trick is to disable MWD auto-repeate. If you load system activate warp to the next gate and simply press the MWD button. When it finishes cycle you will immediately enter warp. It's also extremely fast to transport stuff that way and you need no webber. Works for Orca as well. Also, a mining permit never hurts the Code ALWAYS wins Elite PvPer, #74 in 2014
Blade Darth Room for Improvement Limited Expectations 215	Posted - 2017.06.06 20:42:34 - [22] - Quote https://zkillboard.com/kill/62096814/ cargo extender tank https://zkillboard.com/kill/62609958/ war dec https://zkillboard.com/kill/62180945/ fitted for travel speed possible the pilot was on autopilot, with offline hardeners There is no such thing as 100% safe, but its possible to get 99.9% - max tank / max agility - scout - web alt - extra caution when entering dangerous areas. check KB, hours of activity, number of pilots in space - tank to cargo value ratio - jump in after a random "sacrificial lamb". Hostiles might not even notice you. - toon in a ganking corp. You will have their gank schedule and probably set your hauler to blue anyway. And many more. Use your brain. Omen Navy Issue Tutorial
Cypherous Cypherous Corporation 250	Posted - 2017.06.06 21:39:01 - [23] - Quote Renee Frost wrote: Yeah, this one has the correct tanking fit: https://zkillboard.com/kill/62609958/ And still got ganked on the way to the next incursion focus. Well, technically there is no way to be 100% safe since they can keep bumping you with a velator for 3 minutes while throwing tornadoes and catalysts at you. That one shows as a valid war kill, they don't need to "gank" it they have all the time in the world without any concord response
Desmios Sanguis Tax-Free Foundation 40	Posted - 2017.06.07 01:01:51 - [24] - Quote Thank you all for your help. One thing Im noticing is that all the extra time / effort it seems that needs to be done to make a bowhead safe, defeats the purpose in the first place. The purpose of me flyng a bowhead is to cut down the time it takes to move ships from incursion to incursion. If I have to have a separate account webbing, constantly checking map for 24hr gank, etc. etc. -- what is the point in the first place? It is not saving me any time. Am I missing something?
Herzog Wolfhammer Sigma Special Tactics Group 8538	Posted - 2017.06.07 01:05:07 - [25] - Quote Thanks for the bowhead tank info guys. I am now educated. (note: good God all that tank and they can still get ganked) Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Avaelica Kuershin Paper Cats 359	Posted - 2017.06.07 02:34:07 - [26] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: Thank you all for your help. One thing Im noticing is that all the extra time / effort it seems that needs to be done to make a bowhead safe, defeats the purpose in the first place. The purpose of me flyng a bowhead is to cut down the time it takes to move ships from incursion to incursion. If I have to have a separate account webbing, constantly checking map for 24hr gank, etc. etc. -- what is the point in the first place? It is not saving me any time. Am I missing something? If you can run two clients and have two omega accounts, then having a scout/webber on one and the freighter on the other makes sense. For one thing, the webber gets the freighter into warp even quicker than the mwd cycle. Another alt on one account can handle the blockade runner if desired. Sisi is a good place for practicing. Freighter sideways warp... wheee!
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors Shadow Cartel 11693	Posted - 2017.06.07 02:46:59 - [27] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: Thank you all for your help. One thing Im noticing is that all the extra time / effort it seems that needs to be done to make a bowhead safe, defeats the purpose in the first place. The purpose of me flyng a bowhead is to cut down the time it takes to move ships from incursion to incursion. If I have to have a separate account webbing, constantly checking map for 24hr gank, etc. etc. -- what is the point in the first place? It is not saving me any time. Am I missing something? Indeed you are. With all the things said in this thread, at the end of the day it comes down to two things: - how much risk are you willing to accept for convenience and vice versa - use your best judgement There are times where you will be totally fine in a Bowhead/Freighter as long as you completely tank it and nothing more. There are other times where you can "max cargo" fit your Bowhead/Freighter... and all you need to be "safe" is get a friend to web you into warp at each gate. And there are other times where you can do everything right, follow all of the advice mentioned in this thread to the letter... and you will still get ganked. It is all about probabilities and guesstimations. The trick is knowing how to stack the odds in your favor, how much you can get away with, and being less desireable a target compared to the guy next to you. How did you Veterans start?
Blade Darth Room for Improvement Limited Expectations 215	Posted - 2017.06.07 03:30:08 - [28] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: Thank you all for your help. One thing Im noticing is that all the extra time / effort it seems that needs to be done to make a bowhead safe, defeats the purpose in the first place. The purpose of me flyng a bowhead is to cut down the time it takes to move ships from incursion to incursion. If I have to have a separate account webbing, constantly checking map for 24hr gank, etc. etc. -- what is the point in the first place? It is not saving me any time. Am I missing something? Weird for an indy pilot to ask that. The "purpose" is to move ships with expensive rigs for pilots that are too lazy to move them themselves. And for pilots that just can't be bothered with fitting ships and doing move ops. Those pilots will pay for the convenience you provide. Takes more time and effort? Too dangerous? Raise price. Omen Navy Issue Tutorial
Burgein Republic University Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2017.06.07 03:42:59 - [29] - Quote I really can't believe that using free throwaway alt accounts for suicide ganks has been allowed for this long. It's such an obvious way to bypass game mechanics like security status loss and kill rights. I would be fine with suicide ganks if people had the balls to do it with their main character.
Blade Darth Room for Improvement Limited Expectations 215	Posted - 2017.06.07 04:02:30 - [30] - Quote Says the person posting with an alt. "throwaway alt accounts" aka. recycling alts is against the eula and people's mains, gametime and wallet is getting pwnd by CCP if they spot this. Doesn't matter thou, with proper logistics (bowhead, ha ha) group of -10 players can continue to operate in system. Or at least I think it can, didn't do anything in the tutorial zone for years so I'm a bit out of date with current hs shenanigans. Omen Navy Issue Tutorial

Mara Pahrdi The Order of Anoyia 1656	Posted - 2017.06.07 05:25:13 - [31] - Quote Burgein wrote: I really can't believe that using free throwaway alt accounts for suicide ganks has been allowed for this long. It's such an obvious way to bypass game mechanics like security status loss and kill rights. I would be fine with suicide ganks if people had the balls to do it with their main character. Get informed. Remove standings and insurance.
Bjorn Tyrson EVE University Ivy League 717	Posted - 2017.06.07 05:40:45 - [32] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: Thank you all for your help. One thing Im noticing is that all the extra time / effort it seems that needs to be done to make a bowhead safe, defeats the purpose in the first place. The purpose of me flyng a bowhead is to cut down the time it takes to move ships from incursion to incursion. If I have to have a separate account webbing, constantly checking map for 24hr gank, etc. etc. -- what is the point in the first place? It is not saving me any time. Am I missing something? Checking the map is something you should be doing no matter what. It takes less than a minute. So no time added there. A scout/Web alt isn't strictly necessary but it makes things safer (and faster since you get into warp sooner) If your only moving one or two ships. Yeah you likely won't save much time. But if you are bringing a small armada with you (I like options) it's a massive time saver. The safety procedures might take a little more time and effort than not using them. But it's gonna be far less effort than replacing a ship.
Dracvlad Tactically Challenged Tactical Supremacy 3202	Posted - 2017.06.07 06:27:30 - [33] - Quote Jenn gave some good information on how to avoid being ganked, however I would advise using a Covert T3C instead of a transport ship as a better approach for the expensive modules. Just to be clear a webber is not going to help you if the gankers suicide a point onto your bowhead so as to get a bumper onto it, this is something that the gankers will do, so bear that in mind. When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour. Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Avaelica Kuershin Paper Cats 359	Posted - 2017.06.07 08:47:16 - [34] - Quote Burgein wrote: I really can't believe that using free throwaway alt accounts for suicide ganks has been allowed for this long. It's such an obvious way to bypass game mechanics like security status loss and kill rights. I would be fine with suicide ganks if people had the balls to do it with their main character. Hmm.... An Alpha can gank, but I still prefer to train an Omega (looks like training for Purifier could be useful)
Samwise Everquest Because ISK 228	Posted - 2017.06.07 09:13:47 - [35] - Quote Jenn aSide wrote: I used a bowhead to move my stuff when I did incursions and never got screwed with. 1st thing you notice about the ones that got ganked is that that are fit for speed not tank. This is a mistake, tank the Bowhead. another problem is they just chucked their fitted ships in them and went. So no tank plus billions of potential loot = gank target. also, if you have an alt, trained it to use a webbing ship. And don't be afraid to spent time. I moved my ships like this: Strip fittings, put ships in bowhead, give fittings to alt in proator (transport ship, can't be scanned.), fly to next focus. Transport alt warps and cloaks through every gate because most of the value is in the transport. Of course the transport alt gets there faster. And I kept a Gila or a Tengu in the bowhead as well, so while i would run incursions on one character, the transport alt would be in the next constellation over using drones or fof missiles to do anomalies to get escalations (drones and fof missiles require very little attention so are easy to multibox with an incursion toon).. Just put some thought into it and it's possible to be almost 100% safe. damn. i wonder how your sec status would be if it wasnt capped :D Pras Phil.
Ima Wreckyou The Conference Elite CODE. 4144	Posted - 2017.06.07 09:15:23 - [36] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: Thank you all for your help. One thing Im noticing is that all the extra time / effort it seems that needs to be done to make a bowhead safe, defeats the purpose in the first place. The purpose of me flyng a bowhead is to cut down the time it takes to move ships from incursion to incursion. If I have to have a separate account webbing, constantly checking map for 24hr gank, etc. etc. -- what is the point in the first place? It is not saving me any time. Am I missing something? If you use the MWD trick I described you will not only be incredibly more secure, but also a lot lot faster to transport your stuff. And you don't need a webbing alt. Try it out the Code ALWAYS wins Elite PvPer, #74 in 2014
Samwise Everquest Because ISK 228	Posted - 2017.06.07 09:21:25 - [37] - Quote Burgein wrote: yadda yadda I would be fine with suicide ganks if people had the balls to do it with their main character. As you post on your alt. Pras Phil.
Chainsaw Plankton FaDoyToy 3160	Posted - 2017.06.07 14:34:31 - [38] - Quote Desmios Sanguis wrote: Thank you all for your help. One thing Im noticing is that all the extra time / effort it seems that needs to be done to make a bowhead safe, defeats the purpose in the first place. The purpose of me flyng a bowhead is to cut down the time it takes to move ships from incursion to incursion. If I have to have a separate account webbing, constantly checking map for 24hr gank, etc. etc. -- what is the point in the first place? It is not saving me any time. Am I missing something? less than one bowhead dies a day and almost none of them have tank fits. the one that did took 9 talos (~100m each) and 15 bombers (~30m each) to gank a total of 1.35 bil, double that to get the break even loot value, and probably add another bil on top of that for the payout. Most of the time spent ganking is spent waiting around bored, if you are in it for the money you want to hit the good targets. They were worth over 15bil, more than 10 times the value of the gank ships. I scrolled back a few more pages and the only ohter full tank bowheads were carrying 40bil and 27bil which is just crazy. honestly things like checking the map are not really going to do anything they are going to keep the characters logged off or in a nearby station until they are ready to gank. Also volume killed really means nothing. most of the pro freighter gankers are looking for whales and whale only and they don't come by too often. by the time the warning signals show up on the map your ship is probably already dead. aside from events like burn jita gankers are mainly in it for the profit. And looks like code will sometimes gank cargo expanded freighters in uedama for lulz. tl;dr: use a full tank fit, carry under 2bil, 1 mwd cycle into warp, and you should be fine selling officer BCUs! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6872141 @ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Jenn aSide Shinigami Miners ChaosTheory. 16023	Posted - 2017.06.07 14:40:25 - [39] - Quote Chainsaw Plankton wrote: less than one bowhead dies a day and almost none of them have tank fits. You really could have stopped typing right there, because that's the end of this thread
Cade Windstalker 1565	Posted - 2017.06.07 14:47:23 - [40] - Quote OP, check the kills and your question will answer itself. The only bowheads that die in High Sec with any regularity are idiots who fit for speed instead of tank, and people who fly them around while wardec'd. If you use the fit you posted it'll take something like 20-30 bombers to kill you and if you do a one-cycle MWD jump when coming off a gate they'll have trouble even catching you to bump off the gate. There are literally two tanked Bowhead deaths to a gank (as opposed to a Wardec) that I can find since February. One of those was Burn Jita with over 100 Coercers on the kill, and the other died to 26 Talos and was carrying 14 B-Type Invulns in its cargo. In short OP, tank your ship and actively fly it and you'll be fine.

Revis Owen The Conference Elite CODE. 528	Posted - 2017.06.07 15:04:35 - [41] - Quote Alaric Faelen wrote: Put an alt into CODE Good advice! Most who do that will discover how much fun Code is, they'll end up quitting their old boring PvE grind. Agent of the New Order http://www.minerbumping.com/p/the-code.html If you do not have a current Mining Permit, please contact me for issuance.
Dom Arkaral The Conference Elite CODE. 1527	Posted - 2017.06.07 15:08:29 - [42] - Quote Revis Owen wrote: Alaric Faelen wrote: Put an alt into CODE Good advice! Most who do that will discover how much fun Code is, they'll end up quitting their old boring PvE grind. Jamen Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome CCL Loyalist
Bjorn Tyrson EVE University Ivy League 720	Posted - 2017.06.07 15:23:02 - [43] - Quote Dracvlad wrote: Jenn gave some good information on how to avoid being ganked, however I would advise using a Covert T3C instead of a transport ship as a better approach for the expensive modules. Just to be clear a webber is not going to help you if the gankers suicide a point onto your bowhead so as to get a bumper onto it, this is something that the gankers will do, so bear that in mind. I prefer using an insta-warp speed rigged ceptor for moving my incursion mods. most of the really expensive ones are not size specific (A type adaptives etc) or particularly large. Fit all the tank mods you can, if your transporting them may as well use them. and throw the rest in the hold (only ones that might cause problems would be officer guns... which i'm sure SOMEONE uses, but thats a pretty obscene investment for meh returns) Yes, in theory its at risk of getting caught by suicide smart-bombers, but with a decent tank its going to take 2-3 suicide smart bombers with pretty impeccable timing to catch you out. and even then they would need to know that you are coming through with bling, which would require them getting VERY lucky since even with scouts you will be on grid for only a second or two as you are jumping through the gate. and with the warp speed rigs would also need that scout to be far enough along the route (and for you to take the route they expect) for them to get the ships in position quickly enough.
Renee Frost Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 35	Posted - 2017.06.07 21:35:25 - [44] - Quote Chainsaw Plankton wrote: that one was very likely a wardec kill, and it definalty wasn't a suicide gank. PIRAT does mass wardecs and is very active in the amarr area. and t3cs may be a bit op, but not 30k+ damage before concord shows up OP. Doh, I totally miss the box that says war on the top right hand corner. Was wondering why a suicide gank would be done with a bunch of T3 cruisers lol. Bjorn Tyrson wrote: I prefer using an insta-warp speed rigged ceptor for moving my incursion mods. most of the really expensive ones are not size specific (A type adaptives etc) or particularly large. Yeah me too. Another danger with this is transporting expensive stuff to/from trade hubs without instant dock/undock bookmarks. E.g. https://zkillboard.com/kill/62449414/
Teckos Pech Amok. Goonswarm Federation 6571	Posted - 2017.06.07 22:42:23 - [45] - Quote Chainsaw Plankton wrote: Renee Frost wrote: Yeah, this one has the correct tanking fit: https://zkillboard.com/kill/62609958/ And still got ganked on the way to the next incursion focus. Well, technically there is no way to be 100% safe since they can keep bumping you with a velator for 3 minutes while throwing tornadoes and catalysts at you. that one was very likely a wardec kill, and it definalty wasn't a suicide gank. PIRAT does mass wardecs and is very active in the amarr area. and t3cs may be a bit op, but not 30k+ damage before concord shows up OP. It was a war dec kill, says so right at the top. Quote: War P I R A T vs Red Alliance "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek 8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Specia1 K State War Academy Caldari State 333	Posted - 2017.06.08 00:27:50 - [46] - Quote Ima Wreckyou wrote: Flharfh Lhar wrote: Don't fly it during a wardec. Most of the ones that get suicide ganked are speed / agility fit. [Bowhead, Bowhead fit] Damage Control II Reinforced Bulkheads II Reinforced Bulkheads II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II 500MN Microwarpdrive II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Capital Transverse Bulkhead II Gets over 600k EHP with the invulns overheated. This basically. The trick is to disable MWD auto-repeate. If you load system activate warp to the next gate and simply press the MWD button. When it finishes cycle you will immediately enter warp. It's also extremely fast to transport stuff that way and you need no webber. Works for Orca as well. Also, a mining permit never hurts /thread
Herzog Wolfhammer Sigma Special Tactics Group 8548	Posted - 2017.06.08 05:20:06 - [47] - Quote Revis Owen wrote: Alaric Faelen wrote: Put an alt into CODE Good advice! Most who do that will discover how much fun Code is, they'll end up quitting their old boring PvE grind. I suspect at least a third of AG have CODE. alts. Or is it the other way around? Those macharial ganks are going down with more efficiency than ever. Makes me wonder. Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Professor JinMine Project Fruit House Solyaris Chtonium 12	Posted - 2017.06.08 06:50:12 - [48] - Quote Liquidate bulky stuff, travel light , insta warp, and buy local. You are running incursions. You have ISK.
Macskabosszanto Surja RT. 0	Posted - 2017.06.09 17:55:03 - [49] - Quote After a long skip, I came back to play. I'm disappointed to see that there are so many pirates in high sec that it is already frustrating the beginners. It is not safe to do the initial moves and missions to earn some money because they are also pirates on the site of each mission. Concord is not worth much Against piracy.That's a ****.It would not have to get new players with omega status, but let them discover the possibilities of the new game without the need for the pirates to shoot their pods.It is also autopilot, because high in no way can be used.
Frostys Virpio KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 3395	Posted - 2017.06.09 20:49:18 - [50] - Quote If you are really ballzy, you can do as I did back when I ran incursion and just fly from focus to focus combat fit in your boat. They can't pop your Bowhead if you don't fly a Bowhead.

Blade Darth Room for Improvement Limited Expectations 226	Posted - 2017.06.09 23:13:52 - [51] - Quote Thread so far: "I want to fly cargo extender tank on autopilot and be unkillable." "Can I check map while warping? But that's sooo much effort!" "What's a war-dec?" Flying the incursion pimpboat in megatank/ pvp mode personally is one solution, there are others (and better too) but as noting in eve is served on a silver platter, I shall not help you. Omen Navy Issue Tutorial


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