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DoctorBautz
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Posted - 2007.05.22 08:23:00 -
[1]
Edited by: DoctorBautz on 22/05/2007 08:22:00
I am currently testing Minmatar Guns on Amarr Ships like the Prophecy or Apocalypse which don't give a bonus for laserturrets (like Dmg or Rof).
My first try was an Apoc:
High: 8x 800mm ACs
MId: MWD, 2x Webbers, Tracking Computer
Low: 4x active hardeners, Large Repairer, Gyrostabalizer, Tracking Enhancer
I tried this setup for ratting first but i think it could be modified to a nice close range Ship in pvp (like dual repairer with cap injector).
My second and yet not tested try is a Prophecy:
High: 6x 425mm ACs 1x medium remote armor repair
Mid: Mwd/AB, Webber, TP or cap injektor or 2nd webber
low: 2x Armor Reps, 3 Active Hardeners , gyro
I think it is quite nice to combine the Amarrian Ships which dont get bonus for Dmg or Rof ( like the Apoc and the Prophecy ) with Minmatar Guns. And you can choose your dmg type - like emp ammo vs shield tankers and so on...
I know it might be not worth to skill for large and medium t2 acs just for 2 ships but it works very good when you can only use t1 yet.
Anyone of you tested the combination and can give me a hint if it is worth it or not?
I tested the Minmatar Guns cause the lasers drained my cap quite fast ( with controlled bursts 4 and good capskills ) when i needed to run the tank and shoot at the same time.
regards DoctorBautz
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Rodj Blake
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.05.22 08:52:00 -
[2]
In my experience, projectiles pack quite a punch in PvP when fitted on the Apoc or Prophecy.
You may not have the ship bonuses of the Minmatar ships, but you can fit a larger number of bigger guns
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Keitaro Baka
Babylon Scientific and Industrial Enterprises
Babylon Project
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Posted - 2007.05.22 09:37:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Rodj Blake
In my experience, projectiles pack quite a punch in PvP when fitted on the Apoc or Prophecy.
You may not have the ship bonuses of the Minmatar ships, but you can fit a larger number of bigger guns
0_o on the remark from a PIE-er, but yeah, and don't forget the uber cap you can poor into your tank..
All the stuff above does not necessarily reflect my corp, my alliance or even me..
Drone guide.. |
El'essar Viocragh
Minmatar
FSK23
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Posted - 2007.05.22 09:49:00 -
[4]
And don't get too excited about "you can choose your damage type" if you really intend to pvp in it. More often than not, you want barrage or tremor in pvp and all advanced projectile ammo is exp/kin.
So bring EMP and Phased Plasma, but check twice if your setup works at those ranges.
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Dristra
Amarr
Shadows of the Dead
Aftermath Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.22 10:37:00 -
[5]
Autocannons on amarr ships are so much fun it should not be allowed, autocannon maller anyone?
It's great being Amarr isn't it.
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Radioactive Babe
Red Frost
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Posted - 2007.05.22 10:46:00 -
[6]
Yeh, back when v v lazors were the king of the hill, not having a damage bonus on the Apoc was not such a big problem (apart from the pact that everyone used a Geddon with loads of damage mods instead). But now with damage mods stacking nerfed and ships having lots more armour and EANM 2's fitted using lasers just isnt a good idea.
I trained projectiles specifically so I could rat with a very nice permatank ... Something that was very very hard to do with lasers (with lowish cap skills) |
Sanzorz
Amarr
EVEfan.dk
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Posted - 2007.05.22 11:52:00 -
[7]
Originally by: DoctorBautz
I tested the Minmatar Guns cause the lasers drained my cap quite fast ( with controlled bursts 4 and good capskills ) when i needed to run the tank and shoot at the same time.
If you wanna run it for pve, then it's not a problem. Just use standard crystals + burst + ship bonus and the guns don't touch your cap alot. Having 2-3 CCC rigs help alot though.
---
Currently flying a PvE geared Crusader and Prophecy |
TigerWoman
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Posted - 2007.05.23 14:18:00 -
[8]
Edited by: TigerWoman on 23/05/2007 14:16:37
Edited by: TigerWoman on 23/05/2007 14:16:21
so you cannot choose your dmg type with t2 ammo okay.
But wouldnt EMP-Amm still be more effective then t2 (on shieldtankers of course)?
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ReePeR McAllem
The Carebear Stare
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Posted - 2007.05.23 16:58:00 -
[9]
Everytime you fit anything other than a laser on our ships, babies die.
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Speed Devil
Caldari
Mean Machines
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Posted - 2007.05.23 17:03:00 -
[10]
Originally by: ReePeR McAllem
Everytime you fit anything other than a laser on our ships, babies die.
and when ya fit lasers on your ships nothing dies
or is it a stealthnerf to pirates that want to stay in highsec? |
mechtech
Entropy Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.23 17:52:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Speed Devil
Originally by: ReePeR McAllem
Everytime you fit anything other than a laser on our ships, babies die.
and when ya fit lasers on your ships nothing dies
Now thats what I call a post 
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Liang Nuren
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.05.23 19:30:00 -
[12]
I thought everyone fit AC on the Prophecy?
There just doesn't seem to be much use to putting lasers on there with the omnitank, and AC just has such nice fitting reqs. And there's no cap usage at all (which way trumps the cap reduction bonus).
Liang
My opinions are my own, and do not in any way reflect the beliefs of my corp/alliance.
I feel the need for speed! |
Judas Lonestar
Ganja Labs
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.23 19:38:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Speed Devil
Originally by: ReePeR McAllem
Everytime you fit anything other than a laser on our ships, babies die.
and when ya fit lasers on your ships nothing dies
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Billy Sastard
Amarr
Life. Universe. Everything.
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.23 20:02:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Speed Devil
Originally by: ReePeR McAllem
Everytime you fit anything other than a laser on our ships, babies die.
and when ya fit lasers on your ships nothing dies
 I LOL'd (seriously, got a funny look from my boss  )
-=^=-
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General Apocalypse
Amarr
Dark-Rising
Fallen Souls
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Posted - 2007.05.23 21:56:00 -
[15]
I use 5 neutron cannon 2 nos 1 neut mwd scram web injector 2 lars 3 hard DCII and amag stab whit 5 valkire and 5 warriors drones. Most targets wander dude whre's my cap in the 2nd neut cycle 
Thank You SkyFlyer |
xDaKewlGuyx
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Posted - 2007.05.23 22:25:00 -
[16]
You're using the wrong AC sizes. For cruisers/BCs use 220mm vulcans.
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Chavu
The Shadow Order
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.23 23:29:00 -
[17]
I love it when Amarr/Gallente ships use autocannons because then they drop loot I can use. Awesome.
I hope you guys know what you are doing, a 220mm II with barrage and good skills does about 25dps (and that's not counting falloff) It's the bonus from the ships that let minmatar do any sort of damage.
I find it amusing that the OP wants to use autocanons, but then wants to load EMP to take down shield tankers.....riiiiiiight.
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VanNostrum
Cataphract Securities
Storm Armada
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Posted - 2007.05.23 23:55:00 -
[18]
Edited by: VanNostrum on 23/05/2007 23:54:15
Originally by: Chavu
I love it when Amarr/Gallente ships use autocannons because then they drop loot I can use. Awesome.
I hope you guys know what you are doing, a 220mm II with barrage and good skills does about 25dps (and that's not counting falloff) It's the bonus from the ships that let minmatar do any sort of damage.
I find it amusing that the OP wants to use autocanons, but then wants to load EMP to take down shield tankers.....riiiiiiight.
i second that
AC doesn't have the dps of a pulse laser, it's the dmg boni of minmatar ships (double dmg boni on most T2 minny ships) that make the AC so useful on them. AC on amarr ships = no dps
Yes you have cap to tank but no dmg, how do u even kill in pvp? It's blasphemy!
edited: not to mention the optimal/falloff range bonuses t2 minny ships get on their projectiles
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Zhaine
Coreli Corporation
Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.05.24 01:01:00 -
[19]
Proph:
5 180 II
2 Med Named Nos
1 10mn MWD
1 WD II
1 Fleeting Web
1 MAR II
1 1600 RT
2 EANM II
1 DCU II
1 Gyro
5 Light Drones (Therm/Kin)
Knock it all you want, but I was beating a Hurricane and Zealot simultaneously in that set up last night (The Hurricane de-agressed and jumped in structure and the Zealot was in Half armor when a Typhoon and some other crap turned up and pwnt me :p). Were they badly set up? Perhaps. But the fact remains that I could tank them and hold them. Of course the DPS was a problem but it is on a laser Proph too and you can't fit a laser Proph like that.
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DoctorBautz
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Posted - 2007.05.24 08:55:00 -
[20]
@ chavu: the usage of emp ammo vs shild tankers is an option and i havent tried it yet.
The generall thought behind all of this is:
- using ACs dont use any cap so you can sustain your tank longer without using a caprecharger or wasting to much cap charges.
Heavy Pulse Laser 1 425mm autocannon 1
activation cost 13.33 0
Rate of fire 5.25 sec 5.63
Optimal Range 10 km 2 km
Damage Modifier 3 2.8875
Accuracy falloff 4,000 m 8,000 m
Trackingspeed 0.065 0.1056
Powergrid 210 140
Cpu 33 24
lets say you got controlled bursts on 5 and BCs on 5 and the energy reductions isnt stack nerfed (not shure if it is or not).
Cap usage per Laser 3.3325 (with MF Crystals)
Lets say you got 6 of them: 3.80 cap/s (without any Heatsinks)
Cap use of a medium armor repairer2 (Standart Values): 13.33cap/s
correct me if i am wrong but after doin the math you get cap for an extra repair cycle every 4 Seconds.
you can fit the ACs Way easier then the Pulses (cpu- and pgwise) which will give you more room to variate the fitting (like 6 of the biggest guns with dual repper cap injector and remote armor repper)
The ACs got better tracking (around 40%)
The setup is mostly for small gang pvp when you often need to last a little longer or to give remote repairs to freinds and stuff.
Your dps might not be the best you can get but in longer engagements you can shoot the whole time and repair. So your average Dps over the whole battletime might be nearly the same.
Since i am still a little low on sps in generall (playing eve since january) i am here to discuss this thing. And i am happy for your constructive posts.
Until Now the Opinions posted here go from: "Amarr with Min guns=NO DPS" to "Nice it works cool"
Since no one knows when the "OOMPH" mentioned by tux is released i still think that the topic is worth to discuss about. Maybee some more guys tested the Combination and can contribute to our discussion here.
regards doctorbautz
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Gneeznow
Minmatar
North Eastern Swat
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Posted - 2007.05.24 09:20:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Zhaine
Proph:
5 180 II
2 Med Named Nos
1 10mn MWD
1 WD II
1 Fleeting Web
1 MAR II
1 1600 RT
2 EANM II
1 DCU II
1 Gyro
5 Light Drones (Therm/Kin)
Knock it all you want, but I was beating a Hurricane and Zealot simultaneously in that set up last night (The Hurricane de-agressed and jumped in structure and the Zealot was in Half armor when a Typhoon and some other crap turned up and pwnt me :p). Were they badly set up? Perhaps. But the fact remains that I could tank them and hold them. Of course the DPS was a problem but it is on a laser Proph too and you can't fit a laser Proph like that.
I've used this setup and can confirm it is teh pwnzor
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Sokratesz
Paradox v2.0
1 Shot 1 Kill
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Posted - 2007.05.24 09:28:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Speed Devil
Originally by: ReePeR McAllem
Everytime you fit anything other than a laser on our ships, babies die.
and when ya fit lasers on your ships nothing dies
Thread Won, Next.
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TigerWoman
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Posted - 2007.05.24 21:28:00 -
[23]
question is:
when will the "OOMPH" be released?
is it worth skill something else to make some ships effective?
how long does it take for the devs to at least apply little changes to get chatacters with equal sps of different race in line with each others?
i know what i am talkin about, i started with 2 friends at the same time (me amarr one caldari one gallente) the caldari is the king of mission runnin and got a usable ecm cruiser, the gallente got the superb bcs and the good bs (even with quite low sps) and i am stuck beeing a bad mission runner and a jerk with cruisers. arbi is quite k but the rest is quite hard to fly usefull within gang pvp. my standart frigs lack slots to be a good tackler ( scan resolution is bad - most frigs only got 2 meds ) so beeing be low sp amarr is quite hard to play compared to the other races.
you are welcome to correct me but it seems that amarr is only good when you get able to use t2 stuff, but with t1 you are useless.
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