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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.01.09 12:45:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Joshua Calvert on 09/01/2004 12:46:31
Having a shedload of trouble fitting out my Tempest!
I know how to outfit my Scorpion really easily but my Tempest is proving trickier.
I've been using 4 1400mm's and 4 launchers in hi-slots, 2 hardeners, 1 sensor booster, 2 tracking cpu's in med-slot, 3 dmg mods, 1 large armour repairer, 1 armour resistance module and 1 cap relay in lo-slots but I'm not happy with it.
Should I be going for shield more than armour on my Tempest?
Shield-tanking it is difficult due to the low CPU  *
All my gunnery skills are lvl 4/5 minimum and the same goes for navigation/engineering so I definitely have the required skills base.
Just lack the knowledge.
*Even weapons upgrades lvl 5 fails to help much.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Estios
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Posted - 2004.01.09 13:58:00 -
[2]
I would tell you where you are going wrong, but Im not going to so I can destroy you much easier 
So HMV consider Andy Williams and Dean Martin to be "easy listening" do they? Tell that to my mate Dave, he's been deaf for 20 years.
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Grut
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Posted - 2004.01.09 14:05:00 -
[3]
looks like your hitting the usual problems with a tempest... low cpu,
as far as the highs go 4x arbs and 4 x 1400 is pretty standard atm, just pray tombs nerfs dont make it to tq.
Tempests have only 1 less mid then a raven so it makes sence to shield tank it, 3 x harderners + 1 x at xl with a sensor booster for abit of extra range and speed should do the trick. There isnt much point using tracking computers, they only effect 1/2 your highs and 1400's trackings so bad they arent gonna do a hell of alot of good.
for your lows use 4-5x cprs to save a bit of cpu and get you recharge rate down, finally a dmg mod if you got the cpu
This setups still gonna be tight for cpu, so you might have to swap the xl for a large, sucky in the extreme 'cause large cant be relied upon to keep up with damage with only 3 hardeners
While you arnt gonna be doing as much dmg as the setup you've got atm you'll be unkillable 1v1 and pretty damn hard to pop 2v1. Should easily be doing enough dmg to kill an untanked bs though
Mostly harmless |
Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.01.09 14:10:00 -
[4]
armor? shields? wtf?
boost structure, i would slap on as many reinforced bulkheads and damage control mods too, that extra module HP helps a ton.
just my 2 cents.
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Jarjar
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Posted - 2004.01.09 15:19:00 -
[5]
 Quote:
armor? shields? wtf?
boost structure, i would slap on as many reinforced bulkheads and damage control mods too, that extra module HP helps a ton.
just my 2 cents.
I don't know why, but damn that was funny. 
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DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2004.01.09 16:14:00 -
[6]
Tempest is damn hard to setup yeah, im still looking for a setup that can beat an apoc 1vs1 and then i will look for another fleet setup...
Thing is that there is no standard setup, for every occasion it needs modification to be good.
__________________________
http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
Dianabolic
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Posted - 2004.01.09 16:30:00 -
[7]
Purely theoretical, as it will be a number of days before I can actually test this, I was thinking more along the lines of doing this:
as many 1400's as will fit (to take maximum advantage of the tempest ship bonus)
2 x missile launchers
2 x tracking computer
1 x sensor booster
2 x hardeners
1 x adaptive nano membrane
1 x explosive armor
That's as far as I've thought about it until I see what stats are left.
But it's all purely hypothetical, so I'll be watching this thread with interest :)
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darth solo
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Posted - 2004.01.09 16:46:00 -
[8]
As the 1400mms use little cap, i would have thought ur best option was to shield tank, as u should have alot of spare cap to run XLS and things...
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Stue
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Posted - 2004.01.09 17:39:00 -
[9]
Considering the Tempest has almost as many shield HP as the Raven (about 5500 at lvl5, Raven has 6000) and it has almost as many medium slots as well i would definately make it a shield tank. Getting resistances on shield is easiest.
However i havent ever tried to fit one so i dont know where its limits are.
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Cao Cao
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Posted - 2004.01.09 17:51:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Cao Cao on 09/01/2004 17:54:06
Shield tank the tempest. Because of the CPU you will probably need to invest in a large c5-L shield booster instead of the XL booster. It isn't that much worse.
You are on the right track using four launchers and four 1400s. Mid slots think 2x em ward, 1x thermal, 1x kinetic, and your shield booster. Do what you can with your lows, like the raven, tempest needs cpu enhancers but maybe you will have some spare to fit some power diags which I believe would help (or cap relays if you aren't having grid probs).
EDIT: think about the strengths of the tempest and the raven in being their lasting power against higher damage, "gank" ships. If you can tank out significant amount of damage, the enemy is going to get low on capacitor and be unable to heal himself while you are still dishing out damage. Only benefit with the tempest tho is that you can really pack a silly bite with the 1400s while the raven is just a really tough puppy with rubber teeth.
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.01.09 18:08:00 -
[11]
Cao Cao,
Not ingame right now but I believe your setup provides the most scope.
Gonna suck not having a sensor booster though
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Beseb
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Posted - 2004.01.09 18:19:00 -
[12]
Josh, the sensor booster is nice, but not overly critical as your Tempest already has the fastest base lock time in the game. Also consider that you aren't running any "must use first" modules (ie; dampners, scramble, etc). In fact, you'll be very surprised at how fast you lock calderi ships...
Cao Cao, I wouldn't say that your Raven was toothless, you knocked me around a good bit...
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Cao Cao
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Posted - 2004.01.09 18:25:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Cao Cao on 09/01/2004 18:26:40
Quote:
Cao Cao,
Not ingame right now but I believe your setup provides the most scope.
Gonna suck not having a sensor booster though
Well you can always drop the second EM ward and use whatever you need --- sensor booster, whatever. The sensor booster would be the best alternate module to the second em ward, in that sometimes you might find you need the extra targeting distance it provides (as opposed to the lock speed). That second EM ward is the pure tank setup that I like for larger battles. The only real problem is that in pvp you will be vulnerable to dampening and to jamming... but honestly, you can't and shouldn't sacrifice your strengths to try to counter every contingency.
Bring aboard a good 200 FoF cruise missiles, just in case. They will make short work of that blackbird trying to mess with you.
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Toulak
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Posted - 2004.01.09 18:35:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Toulak on 09/01/2004 18:36:07
Quote:
Shield-tanking it is difficult due to the low CPU
Yet you equip a large armour repairer? 
Shields all the way buddy, shields can be replenished much more easily than armour.
I would never ever rely on armour in battle, with armour repairers and their ridiculous 15sec activation time.
More cap/recharge time = more shields, especially on a tempest with 1400s and H50s. 
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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2004.01.09 18:52:00 -
[15]
Quote:
Edited by: Toulak on 09/01/2004 18:36:07
Quote:
Shield-tanking it is difficult due to the low CPU
Yet you equip a large armour repairer?
Large armor repairer only takes 90tf compared to 100tf for a large shield booster.
I'm looking at armor tanking at the moment but it's difficult to get a real idea of the effectivenes. Repair skill is at 2 atm.
Then comes the problem that armor hardeners don't provide the amount of of damage resistance as shield hardeners. And armor repairers are twice as slow as a shield booster for a cost of half as much cap.
Too many numbers to juggle. I'll just train Repair to lvl 4 and find someone to shoot me. Easier to figure out that way 
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.01.09 18:59:00 -
[16]
That's exactly why I was contemplating armouring it up - less cpu needs and an armour repairer repairs more HP compared to a large shield booster for the same amount of cap.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Cao Cao
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Posted - 2004.01.09 19:01:00 -
[17]
If I had the skill, I would honestly consider armor tanking on an armageddon or apoc. But I don't have the skills, probably never will. Let me know how your tinkering with armor tanking goes Jash I've always wondered if it would be a viable alternative to shield tanking (NOT on Caldari ships though. Lol)
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Toulak
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Posted - 2004.01.09 19:05:00 -
[18]
Quote:
Large armor repairer only takes 90tf compared to 100tf for a large shield booster.
Aye just logged on to check that, I was thinking of the powergrid not CPU heh.
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.01.09 20:32:00 -
[19]
XLarge takes 200cpu 
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Jash Illian
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Posted - 2004.01.09 20:45:00 -
[20]
Quote:
If I had the skill, I would honestly consider armor tanking on an armageddon or apoc. But I don't have the skills, probably never will. Let me know how your tinkering with armor tanking goes Jash I've always wondered if it would be a viable alternative to shield tanking (NOT on Caldari ships though. Lol)
TomB once said that's it's possible to setup a near unbeatable armor tank setup. Was in one of the CSMs.
The biggest issue comes from projectile users, of course. Titanium Sabot and Fusion ammo eat armor like Skittles. And missile users have figured out to switch to Kinetic/Explosive torps/cruise as the target gets near the tail end of their shields.
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
ProphetGuru
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Posted - 2004.01.09 21:06:00 -
[21]
Quote:
That's exactly why I was contemplating armouring it up - less cpu needs and an armour repairer repairs more HP compared to a large shield booster for the same amount of cap.
Got a bud with a tanked out apoc that is very damn impressive. Dude, go on chaos where their is always someone to shoot at ya, and test your defensive setups out, and how they effect your cap.
Evolution..... Just when you thought you were winning.
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Kaylon Syi
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Posted - 2004.01.09 21:31:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Kaylon Syi on 09/01/2004 22:02:47
5 1400mm, 1 Medium Smart Bomb, 2 Malkuth Incursions on top.
1 Quad Lif MWD ( for gaining range or retreat during combat ) or 1 Lif AB ( if your camping a gate ), 1 Large C5-L Booster, 1 30% shield booster, 1 EM ward, 1 Eutektic 2 cap recharger
1 Counter-Balance Mod, 1 Fourrier Tracking, 2 Beta : Reactor Control ( if it takes 2 for the 5 1400mm ) and 1 Named Cap Relay - ( 2 if you don't need 2 Beta : Reactors )
3 wasps and 3 ogres in the drone bay to pick off frigate pilots with big brass ballz and loads of luck.
Tempest isn't meant to be a shield tank not armor tank... Its meant for taking out apocs from afar and flying circles around them. You will get more out of a shield booster than the any other hardner besides EM. Cap recharger will let you run the MWD/AB and Large C5-L longer as does the Relay.
That setup is off the top of my head from my last Tempest setup - give or take an item or version of item - and I took Engineering lvl 5 into the loadout. I don't think you can get away with just one Reactor control but you might. Hell I would see if you could get away with a Beta : Diagnostic if you could... but Highly doubt it. The versatility of this setup can easily smoke BS NPCs from afar and PvP like a maniace.
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Kaylon Syi
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Posted - 2004.01.09 21:32:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Kaylon Syi on 09/01/2004 21:50:09
sorry dbl post arrrg
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Bhal'rog
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Posted - 2004.01.09 21:47:00 -
[24]
I don't know if this is still an issue, but the problem with tanking armor is that your structure will take some damage also.
In the past it was possible to have plenty of armor left whilst your structure goes down to zero.
And usually 0 structure is not a good thing.
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Kaylon Syi
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Posted - 2004.01.09 21:58:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Kaylon Syi on 09/01/2004 22:01:17
Quote:
I don't know if this is still an issue, but the problem with tanking armor is that your structure will take some damage also.
In the past it was possible to have plenty of armor left whilst your structure goes down to zero.
And usually 0 structure is not a good thing.
Still a problem. Thats why with a ship like Tempest you shouldn't go for tanking but for offensive, damage dealing setups. For Defensive purposes I use a Med 'Notos' Smart bomb to negate the need of armor hardners on my Battleships I use for Hunting ( NPC or PvP ) As the biggest damage you will take against your armor is usually from torpedos and cruise missiles. Many pilots don't use Armor Piercing rounds unless they are in Megathrons or Tempests using mid range/mid damage rounds...
Until then those pilots are in numbers... Smart bombs are the best way to go for keeping your ship alive in combat against other BSs. If you have multiple people shooting at you with missiles and they are in sporadic timings... then switch to defenders and use your speed with the MWD or AB to do evasive menuvers.
If it makes you feel better to have more missile launchers ... 5 1400mm, 1 A-3 for defenders, and 2 malkuth incursions. Remeber... defenders take cargo... while smart bombs take cap. And since my setup allows for decent cap recharge... I can run a Medium 'Notos' with little to no problem.
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Stoop
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Posted - 2004.01.10 00:36:00 -
[26]
Im not sure why everyone says that the tempest has low CPU. The megathron has the same CPU has a tempest, and a 425 rail takes 70 CPU stock, vs the 45 cpu of the 1400mm. With just 4 guns alone, that is 100 cpu.
I never have CPU problems on my megathron, but I only use a medium C5-L sheild booster. I can do two things, use 7 compressed/prototype 250 rails, have insane cap stamina, whilst only using 2 or 3 cap relays, saving room for a dmg mod etc and some armor hardeners. I dont mind if the damage gets into the armor at all because I can repair it. Once the enemy hits amror it gets very dificult for them to gnaw thru it, especially against Gallente and Amarr opponents.
Or, I can sit from a distance with 425 rails, em and thermal hardner, medium c5-l, and a sheild amp. Once again I have really good stamina, and can still run easily if need be. Same setup in the lows, but usually 1 more cap charger, and maybe 1 less amror hardener.
I think your problem is the XL sheild booster mainly. Sure its very good and all, but as stated before, the tempest etc are stamina ships. If you can stay alive long enough to let the enemy get drained, you are completely fine. They will soon dry up and you can then kill them off. I would also be more than happy to hop on Chaos with you and be a blow up dummy for ya. Just msg me in game.
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Deidranna
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Posted - 2004.01.10 23:32:00 -
[27]
this is a very interesting thread.
thank you guys 
some things to think about for my setup.
deidranna
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Kaylon Syi
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Posted - 2004.01.12 02:19:00 -
[28]
just looked at my old notes and I had a setup for 4/4 ( 4 1400mm and 4 malkuth incursion ) in which i used for fleet combat during the CFS/CA wars. That worked well for camping and I didn't use a relay on the low.. and i used nanofibers instead of overdrives.
That was pre-castor ofcourse but I was only around 3.5mil skill points then... and the Tempest did chain sanshas and hold gates pretty well.
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BobGhengisKhan
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Posted - 2004.01.13 13:13:00 -
[29]
Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 13/01/2004 13:39:36
Why don't any of you ****s use a warp disruptor?
Always funny to see CFS members give "help" on load-outs. Yeah, 2 medium slot cap chargers, great work
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