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Sabahl
Minmatar
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
   |
Posted - 2007.05.30 09:12:00 -
[1]
WARNING - OLD FART ALERT
When I first started playing Eve over four years ago, one thing I found notable was the maturity of the playerbase, both emotionally and agewise. We had what must have been one of the most grounded player bases of any action-based MMORPG in existance at the time, with an average player age in the late twenties/early thirties. I believe that this was because the bugginess of the game forced most youngsters away before they could really scratch the surface, leaving us old fogies to hopefully await the improvements which would realise Eve's full potential whilst manually warping across the galaxy (no autopilot, y'see).
Well, the improvements have come and the game turly is living up to its potential. But as the game has been made more userfriendly the accessibility has led to an overall decrease in the age of the players who are in the game. The average age now appears to be college level and I do believe that this has led to a degredation in the overall playing experience as the maturity of the playerbase has been eroded with the new influx of players.
Maybe this is just the view of an old-school, hardcore believer who is finding it hard to adjust to the rather immature events he sees unfolding in the player-side of the game he's spent years playing. I'd be interested in hearing from other old timers though to find out if you agree or not.
Sabahl - Age 35 |
Sabahl
Minmatar
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 09:16:00 -
[2]
I should explain, the title of this thread was chosen because you no longer need to be lean, agile and sharp in order to play the game, in my opinion. Anyone can jump right in and start playing. Good thing or bad? Arguments for both, I guess. |
TOTALHELLDEATH
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:17:00 -
[3]
your title matches the CCP Developers xD
DONT PUNISH ME CCP ; ((((( I'AM NO GOON !
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Niccolado Starwalker
Shadow Templars
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:22:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 30/05/2007 09:21:26
As with everything else in our world today: everything is prone for changes. Everything changes! Either by the nature itself, but mainly human changes. People adapt, and people improve, and some of the improvements, even if they make life easier is not good for mother nature. Cars, factories etc. So what is good for us today might not be good in the very long run: generations. But it still happends. It have to happend because nothing ever stays the same.
So is it with eve. Eve gets new features. We want it! CCP wants it! But for any change, good or not, we all dreams and look back on how it was before. ask any person above 60 years, and they will tell you the world have changed. some say to the better. Some say to the worse.
Its human nature.
 Originally by: Eldo Davip
PORTRAITS OMFG WOOT.
WE R GONIG FOR MROE BREEE!!!!11
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Nimdok
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:22:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Nimdok on 30/05/2007 09:22:01
I fully agree sir, who do these psuedo-intellectual college students think they are? Perhaps we could let graduate students working on their doctoral degrees play, but even that may be stretching it.
Nimdok - Age 63.
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MellaRinn
Exit 13
Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:28:00 -
[6]
I miss the good old days as well, Sabahl. I only started when exodus hit TQ, but it was a whole lot of difference back then. I had DawgByte (now in his mid-60ties) and his son (then getting married) in my corp. Game experience was different back then even, so I can appreciate your point.
MellaRinn, age 22 (runx ? :( )
My Vids - Click |
Erik Amirault
Gallente
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 09:33:00 -
[7]
It's a good thing that Nate Hammertown (age 65 and president of the American Association of Retired Persons) is taking charge of Eve. Finally we can have some good old fashioned, old person fun.
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Lardarz B'stard
Amarr
Dark Knights of Deneb
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:34:00 -
[8]
Are you implying there's something wrong with being fat, lazy and stupid?
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CrestoftheStars
Perkone
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:38:00 -
[9]
well... i kind of think that it is bad, because it's just destroying eve as i see..
the bookmarks with warp to 0 did that too only in high sec you should be able to get closer to a gate then 15km.
the weapons for destroyinf warping have become too powerfull all in all, it's trying to do the game on easy mode...
well all in all it's like they want everything that attacts idiots too be set to easy mode..
my view on it...
___________________________________________
Humans take everything that is beautiful and sweet and turn it into something horrifying and ugly.
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Sabahl
Minmatar
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 09:41:00 -
[10]
I think a couple of people are missing my point. I wasn't talking about the actual improvements to the game which, without exception, I believe have all been positive enhancements.
What I am talking aboiut is the reduction in the maturity of the player base. Anyone who thinks that, for instance, autopilot or the inter-stellar highways were bad ideas needs their head examined! |
Vincent S
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:49:00 -
[11]
no you see the problem is that your alliance is full of cheaters
that's the problem
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James Duar
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:51:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Sabahl
I think a couple of people are missing my point. I wasn't talking about the actual improvements to the game which, without exception, I believe have all been positive enhancements.
What I am talking aboiut is the reduction in the maturity of the player base. Anyone who thinks that, for instance, autopilot or the inter-stellar highways were bad ideas needs their head examined!
EVE-O has never had a mature playerbase it's just had one wound up in it's own cultural identity, an identity I've never really cared for. You see it everywhere - the damn forums have been spammed with "moar targets" and :twisted: smiley's all over the damn place and ridiculous comments on "good fights". It's high level hypocrisy, very much similar to the victorian era IMO but it's not maturity.
I also think you make a poor assumption that the playerbase was ever mostly older then college aid though.
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Niccolado Starwalker
Shadow Templars
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:53:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Vincent S
no you see the problem is that your alliance is full of cheaters
that's the problem
please tell me, how is it that you are sitting on evidence which CCP dont have? Because if you can PROOVE someone have cheated, in a no-fake way, ccp would most likely act on it.
if you cant prove it STFU. There is enough trash on the forums.
Originally by: Eldo Davip
PORTRAITS OMFG WOOT.
WE R GONIG FOR MROE BREEE!!!!11
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Erik Amirault
Gallente
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:55:00 -
[14]
The best part of the thread are his suggestions for making the game better.
Hint- there were none.
NATE
H
A
M
M
E
R
T
O
W
N
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Sabahl
Minmatar
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:56:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Vincent S
no you see the problem is that your alliance is full of cheaters
that's the problem
Either this is a wonderfully crafted piece of humour or else you are merely proving my point.
I laughed, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt. |
Dufas
Amarr
Dark-Rising
Fallen Souls
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Posted - 2007.05.30 09:56:00 -
[16]
amen brother Sabahl
signed: a fellow 4 yr player
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Gaia Thorn
Infestation.
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Posted - 2007.05.30 10:01:00 -
[17]
This is excatly how i feel.
Goes well with my rants i sporadically post on theese forums.
I feel eve is being dumbed down to the point that u dont need flippin undock from stations( which btw u soon can walk around in ).
WTZ, remote pos managment is just a few exampels of things being brought into the game to make life easier for us players.
I rather have warp to 15km as before and remove all possibilty to do bookmarks around gates and stations.
This will lead to in my opinion a better game people would have to start using mwd to move to gates.
Scouts would play a even larger role in moving/fighting.
Ships would behave as intended, freighters should take flipping long time to move since they are massive.
BS needs to be escorted and scouted for.
Hell we might even see a drop in POS warfare since the hauling is gonna take longer with out bookmarks.
Well thats my regular monthly rant take it or leave it.
Ill adapt to change and move on but at some point we are gonna hit rockbottom.
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Valan
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Posted - 2007.05.30 10:04:00 -
[18]
Problem with annoying oiks in EVE you can't grab hold of them and give them a thump to remind them they're being an idiot.
If half these people went gobbing off like in my local they would be spitting teeth.
Things change but the smack talking eweenies just wind me right up.
/start sig
I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game three years' when I know their account has been sold on.
/end sig |
Frug
Zenithal Harvest
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Posted - 2007.05.30 10:05:00 -
[19]
I haven't been playing eve for that many years, but I think it's safe to say that there has been a very recent, very sudden drop in the intelligence, maturity, and skill level of the eve community.
It's quite unfortunate.
- - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - -
If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO
BOOO!! - Ductoris
Neat look what I found - Kreul
Hey, my marbles |
Adoro
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 10:06:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Sabahl
Originally by: Vincent S
no you see the problem is that your alliance is full of cheaters
that's the problem
Either this is a wonderfully crafted piece of humour or else you are merely proving my point.
I laughed, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt.
Dont need to say any more...
Vincent S, proof or stfu
--------
Originally by: Lavinrac Krad
You're either one of us or a Minmatar! What about Amarr? Bah, ha ha ha ha, Amarr, lol...
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Gaia Thorn
Infestation.
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Posted - 2007.05.30 10:08:00 -
[21]
hmm well threatning physical violence isnt exactly a mature solution either.
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Roy Batty68
Caldari
Immortal Dead
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Posted - 2007.05.30 10:11:00 -
[22]
I wasn't around 4 years ago but I'm willing to bet there was immature and whiney players back then as well. You only remember the "good old days" it seems when it comes to MMOs. It's a recuring theme I've seen again and again over 4 different titles.
However, in just a year, I've noticed a trend as well. I think in the last year as Eve ballooned a bit, a new vocal crowd has sprang up that doesn't really know what it's talking about, while at the same time the old crowd has become more and more subdued. So many of the old farts I used to see posting here all the time no longer do. Off to SHC? Quit? Forum banned? I don't know. But in just the year I've been playing, it has been a noticeable change.
In my oppinion, alot of the old farts have themselves to blame. They need to get back here and defend Eve as they used to. Help sway "popular opinion" on what Eve is and should become.
I think it's an easy to spot trend, the new users coming to the game and being shocked that their hands aren't held as they are in other games. They react poorly to this alot of the time and come here to demand changes. "Make the game more like what I'm used to" they more or less say. It's inconcieveable to many of them that they might have to change to fit better into the game. It's that very subtle difference in Eve that makes it stand out. Yet it is the one thing that people can't seem to grasp. They want to "fix" the game by changing that. And, imo, by "fixing" that they would remove what makes Eve special.
The old-school people need to get more active on the forums. There is a difference in the new people. And if the old ones give up or grow tired of covering the same old ground over and over again, we will lose that Eve spirit. People will continue fighting to bend Eve to their comfort zone instead of using their brains. It's lazy human nature. Someone has to keep the old ideas alive. Someone has to play continuity.
You old dogs can't just sit around and complain about things changing if all you're doing is sitting on the sidelines reading posts and shaking your head.
-------------------
Say What? |
Erik Amirault
Gallente
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 10:14:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
hmm well threatning physical violence isnt exactly a mature solution either.
Hey, we are having a serious conversation here about how the game we used to play years ago is the REAL eve and players today are immature. People I know are mature and people I dislike are immature so they shouldn't play eve.
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Gaia Thorn
Infestation.
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Posted - 2007.05.30 10:17:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Erik Amirault
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
hmm well threatning physical violence isnt exactly a mature solution either.
Hey, we are having a serious conversation here about how the game we used to play years ago is the REAL eve and players today are immature. People I know are mature and people I dislike are immature so they shouldn't play eve.
So when someone in this thread says that if he would meet any of theese immature players that are smacking he would punch there teeth out is a mature solution to the problem at hand ?
Then sir in that case consider yourself amongst the immature player base cause i sure will put you in that category.
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Erik Amirault
Gallente
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 10:19:00 -
[25]
I was being sarcastic. I try my best to get my message across clearly but I am not Nate Hammertown. I am not blessed with his razor sharp wit and control of the English language.
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Major Stormer
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 10:25:00 -
[26]
Interesting topic.
I might take a seperate stand on it, and agree with you, but put in place blame against several things
1) Empire space. Its amazingly easy to make cash in empire now, even more so then even 0.0! I always considered empire to be "noob space" and 0.0 to be for when your ready to earn some real cash and play with the big boys. Now you can earn more real cash then in 0.0!
2) Pet alliances. Noone has to bother fighting for their space anymore, when you can just rent it. This is brought in a ton of carebears and all that into 0.0, people who do not really belong there, and the lazy ones who can but cant be arsed to fight for space. I remember when 0.0 was worth while, and it was kill or be killed. Not anymore.
3) The boring 0.0 blob pvp and POS warfare. why fight over space when it sucks to do so.
Its just a game. Get over yourselfs. |
Valan
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 11:25:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Erik Amirault
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
hmm well threatning physical violence isnt exactly a mature solution either.
Hey, we are having a serious conversation here about how the game we used to play years ago is the REAL eve and players today are immature. People I know are mature and people I dislike are immature so they shouldn't play eve.
So when someone in this thread says that if he would meet any of theese immature players that are smacking he would punch there teeth out is a mature solution to the problem at hand ?
Then sir in that case consider yourself amongst the immature player base cause i sure will put you in that category.
To a certain extent yes but i see them like those kids that hang around on street corners. people ask them to keep the noise down and all you get is abuse in return. There is nothing wrong with the old parental clip around the ear.
You know as well as I do that these people wouldn't say these things to people real life exactly for that reason. They sit there being offensive knowing full well nothing is going to happen to them.
Discussing the point is a no go, you either call the police or give someone a slap. Police have better things to do.
/start sig
I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game three years' when I know their account has been sold on.
/end sig |
Gaia Thorn
Infestation.
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 11:43:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Valan
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Erik Amirault
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
hmm well threatning physical violence isnt exactly a mature solution either.
Hey, we are having a serious conversation here about how the game we used to play years ago is the REAL eve and players today are immature. People I know are mature and people I dislike are immature so they shouldn't play eve.
So when someone in this thread says that if he would meet any of theese immature players that are smacking he would punch there teeth out is a mature solution to the problem at hand ?
Then sir in that case consider yourself amongst the immature player base cause i sure will put you in that category.
To a certain extent yes but i see them like those kids that hang around on street corners. people ask them to keep the noise down and all you get is abuse in return. There is nothing wrong with the old parental clip around the ear.
You know as well as I do that these people wouldn't say these things to people real life exactly for that reason. They sit there being offensive knowing full well nothing is going to happen to them.
Discussing the point is a no go, you either call the police or give someone a slap. Police have better things to do.
Then what makes you better then thoose kids ?
You dont respect law nor order.
Seems to me you are just as bad if not worse then the kids seeing that they dont have a double standard.
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Drizit
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.05.30 11:54:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Major Stormer
1) Empire space. Its amazingly easy to make cash in empire now, even more so then even 0.0!
What a load of bull!
I have mined in highsec and lowsec and when my corp has some decent fighters trained up, we'll be moving to lowsec where the better ore is. Even mining Jaspet is far more profitable than Kernite. So according to you, there is Mercoxit, Bistot and Arkonor in highsec that miners are making a fortune with.
Where are all the lvl5+ agents in highsec then? I have seen one lvl4 in my region but nothing higher.
10/10 complexes are common in highsec are they? Cosmos missions are also available in highsec are they? Gas clouds are prevalent in highsec too I guess.
Maybe you should think a bit harder before coming out with garbage like that.
--
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Nero Scuro
Jejaikaro Corporation
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Posted - 2007.05.30 11:55:00 -
[30]
If you dumb a game down expect the dumb to play it.
And if WTZ and buying ISK with your CC isn't dumbing things down I don't know what is.
---------
CLICK HERE to see how to keep an idiot busy |
Major Stormer
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 11:57:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Drizit
Originally by: Major Stormer
1) Empire space. Its amazingly easy to make cash in empire now, even more so then even 0.0!
What a load of bull!
I have mined in highsec and lowsec and when my corp has some decent fighters trained up, we'll be moving to lowsec where the better ore is. Even mining Jaspet is far more profitable than Kernite. So according to you, there is Mercoxit, Bistot and Arkonor in highsec that miners are making a fortune with.
Where are all the lvl5+ agents in highsec then? I have seen one lvl4 in my region but nothing higher.
10/10 complexes are common in highsec are they? Cosmos missions are also available in highsec are they? Gas clouds are prevalent in highsec too I guess.
Maybe you should think a bit harder before coming out with garbage like that.
I have a small amount of contacts in eve, with quite a few friends.
1 has made over 10 billion in the last 2 months trading in high sec.
another runs lvl4s and has made around 5 billion.
Of course you cannot make as much money in high sec has you do in 0.0 when it comes to mining, complexs, but mission running etc is much more profitable, even more so when you factor in you are playing for no risk at all.
Drizit, I know you disagree with me, however, you do not have to resort to insults to get your opinions across.
Its just a game. Get over yourselfs. |
Judge Ment
ECMI
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 11:58:00 -
[32]
I haven't played the game long at all. Matter a fact I don't think its been a full Yr just yet. But after watching a lot of folks pointing fingers and seeing a lot of crying going on.
I think OP is correct with his assumption and I'm going to agree with this.. Somewhat.
But I don't know! 
I have seen older guys in there later 50s act less immature then some of college guys in my corp - maybe less then the 16 yr I have in corp!
But do I believe that EvE is becoming FAT, LAZY and Piece of crap game? I hate to say this BUT YES for more reasons then your pointing out.
Sorry - I'm trying to stick to the thread.. 
|
Malachon Draco
eXceed Inc.
INVICTUS.
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 12:06:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Sabahl
WARNING - OLD FART ALERT
When I first started playing Eve over four years ago, one thing I found notable was the maturity of the playerbase, both emotionally and agewise. We had what must have been one of the most grounded player bases of any action-based MMORPG in existance at the time, with an average player age in the late twenties/early thirties. I believe that this was because the bugginess of the game forced most youngsters away before they could really scratch the surface, leaving us old fogies to hopefully await the improvements which would realise Eve's full potential whilst manually warping across the galaxy (no autopilot, y'see).
Well, the improvements have come and the game turly is living up to its potential. But as the game has been made more userfriendly the accessibility has led to an overall decrease in the age of the players who are in the game. The average age now appears to be college level and I do believe that this has led to a degredation in the overall playing experience as the maturity of the playerbase has been eroded with the new influx of players.
Maybe this is just the view of an old-school, hardcore believer who is finding it hard to adjust to the rather immature events he sees unfolding in the player-side of the game he's spent years playing. I'd be interested in hearing from other old timers though to find out if you agree or not.
Sabahl - Age 35
Well mix unethical behaviour being encouraged in a game with shadowy goings on and entrenched interests of older players and you have a mix that is extremely explosive. The way EVE is structured, functioned and is policed by CCP (allowing metagaming and such, not referring to the latest bouts of censorship on the forums here) will inevitably lead to a rapid decline of etiquette and an increase in vitriol and anger, particularly with a growing userbase without personal connections to most of Eve's social structures.
signature removed - please contact us to find out why (include the URL of your sig) - Jacques([email protected]) |
Selena 001
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Posted - 2007.05.30 12:17:00 -
[34]
Personally I just think more and more people are arriving at the conclusion that 'x' Euros/Dollars a month is worth what they're getting from EVE. It stands to reason some kids/teenagers in addition to the 'old gits' are also going to arrive at this conclusion...
I personally wouldn't pay what I do now, for what was available then (not talking content... refering more to the rustic U.I, lack of features we take for granted now, etc). Maybe thats why there were a greater proportion of older players back at release than there are now.
___________
NATIONAL SARCASM DAY!! |
Nero Scuro
Jejaikaro Corporation
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 12:25:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Selena 001
Personally I just think more and more people are arriving at the conclusion that 'x' Euros/Dollars a month is worth what they're getting from EVE. It stands to reason some kids/teenagers in addition to the 'old gits' are also going to arrive at this conclusion...
I personally wouldn't pay what I do now, for what was available then (not talking content... refering more to the rustic U.I, lack of features we take for granted now, etc). Maybe thats why there were a greater proportion of older players back at release than there are now.
There's more to a game than mechanics. An MMO IS the players, without them it's just an extremely crappy singleplayer RPG.
And I'd trade a decent UI for a non-powergaming, non-metagaming playerbase any day of the week.
---------
CLICK HERE to see how to keep an idiot busy |
Umit Davala
Corpus PCG
The State
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Posted - 2007.05.30 12:26:00 -
[36]
I've only been playing Eve for just over a year, but I kind of agree with the OP. I think the problem, on the forum at least, lies with the fact that people seem less inclined to listen to what people are actually saying and just sink threads under a deluge of "waaaa, buh hoo, go play WoW" style comments rather than contributing in a more constructive manner.
I've not noticed any change ingame - its still fun there 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
This post was brought to you in association with Amateur Dramatics Forum Whoring, and Quafe Ultra: in the heat of the moment. |
Nito Musashi
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 12:39:00 -
[37]
I tried to get a buddy to play the game other week when i came back and saw the 2 week trial, he could not even figure out how to rotate the camera.....and could not seem to follow the tutorial of the game, but i chalk it up more to laziness than pure out and out stupidity since he is a generally smart guy, but noes not like scifi much or space games so in the back of his head he just decided he was going to put 0 effort into it, and would just complain to me about how hard the game was.
There is alawys some dumbing down of games especially when they have been out a long time, after all the end goal for any game is to attract customers not scare them off, once you have a good base of players it is only natural to want to draw some new blood into the game.
Old schoolers always lament the good old days, or in the case of eq1 people are just sadists that want the most difficult unplayable game that only the most hardcore would love, to heck with having more than 1000 people that would play the game.
I beta tested vanguard and the beta forums were chalked full of old eq1 players that wanted, no maps, no quest hinters, permanent xp/item loss, no compass, generally nothing in game that would in the lest make the game playable for the average user nevermind the mentally challenged. If they had their way there would would have been a server with 1500 old school hardcore sadists that like wandering around lost for hours on end.
Morel of the story do not turn into a everquest one player.
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Serutan
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Posted - 2007.05.30 12:42:00 -
[38]
Greetings. Well let me just say I am amazed by your sweeping generalization. I am 17 years old. I play this game and I love this game. Guess what I do for my corp? This is actually my alt but on my main I recruit noobs into my corp and me and my corp mates help them learn more about the game (although we are a pvp, mining, industrialist corp). Whenever we get defeated we respond with "good game" and the sort. I don't understand what the point of this thread is. I don't see that much immaturity on this game at all. I myself am a noob and all people have done is try and help me.
According to you age makes maturity? I have seen PLENTY of immature adults my friend. Oh and in addition to that if you REALLY want to see immaturity then go play runescape or WoW.
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Elve Sorrow
Amarr
Shinra
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Posted - 2007.05.30 12:51:00 -
[39]
Well, from my POV:
Started playing EVE when i was 13, waaay back in Beta. And err, if you behaved like an idiot or a child at the time, you'd get a good slap in the face by other people. And you'd get ignored untill you started making sense. Noone would go "Back to WoW!" or such things, you'd just get ignored. Which is way worse for your average spotty teenage nerd.
Now, you get flamed to hell and back. Which is not achieving its goal of scaring these people away, but is attracting them. So here i am, nearly 19. Old fart? Nah.
Anyway, that's just regarding the whole maturity argument, which i agree with. But it's not just the influx of more players thats causing it, it's all the players. Which was my point.
Regarding the dumbing down of EVE and all, im not sure. In a way, it's true, but you can still die if you blink at the wrong moment, or make a single error. Had this happen to me quite recently, and the guys who ganked me were surprised to see that i congratulated them and not whined. Why? Because the fact i died is why i play EVE. It's a harsh world, screw up and you die.
PS. o/ Sab :P
EVE-O Forums Rules summary:
If the thought of doing something makes me giggle for more then 15 seconds, I am to assume I'm not allowed to do it. |
Aaron Rex
Caldari
The Fated
|
Posted - 2007.05.30 13:00:00 -
[40]
I'm a 27 year old who's been playing 4 years now. I remember the old times, and yes, the forums and local did feel a lot more mature than they do now (whether they actually were more mature or if it's just my imagination, I don't know) But things have changed, some for the worse, some for the better. It's a catch 22 situation, let's take a look:
Back in the day Eve was struggling to get 8k players in the evenings. This made the Eve universe quite empty at times (except for Yulai). Sure, the community felt more tight knit than it does now, but the low amount of players and thus, the low amount of devs our subscriptions could pay for meant less QA, less frequent patches and less content.
Now we're seeing 25k+ online. This means there are more targets for the pvp'ers to shoot at and more ships and mods for the industrial guys to build and sell. This also has had a dramatic effect on CCP employment, and we're seeing things the dev's could only dream about back in the day. The cost is less player cohesion.
Faced with the question, which would theoretically be better, still have 8k users, but probably be 2-3 "Big Patches" behind and have a buggier game, yet still have the cohesion of old times. Or have our present Eve. I don't know the answer. But I have a feeling, that if Eve haddn't grown, the old timers would have left and Eve would have died.
So sure, I miss the old times, but they're gone. Fortunatly I am lucky enough to play with a group of old timing freinds so I am less aware of the newcommers, except when I brave these forums.
Aaron Rex - Remember the Scordite...
The Fated |
Spartus Raile
Gallente
Serenity Inc
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Posted - 2007.05.30 13:04:00 -
[41]
Interesting points, however you say because someone is younger they are 'less' of a player? You seem to forget that the influx of new players stops the game becomming stagnant. Without new players to snap up carcals and T1 mods the market would crash, just like any real economy, EVE needs growth to sustain itself, alts alone would not suffice. I don't think maturity (or age as you use it in this context) has a great deal to do with the quality of a player base. It's down to the attitude of the indivdual. My 9 year old brother plays EVE on trial accounts (he can't afford the subscription  ) and he shows far more maturity and manner than the vast majority of the people posting in this thread, perhaps more so than myself 
Regardless, you owe the preservation of your game to these rapscallions.
Oh and I am 19, just so you know.
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Alski
Gallente
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.30 13:21:00 -
[42]
Eves maturity and ease with which it can be picked up and played is a good thing imo, it still has a very hardcore learning curve that all those who have been playing for a while have forgotten about.
As for maturity of the player base, and of the forums in particular... yeah it has gone downhill a bit even in the last year, in what way is hard to define, but generally: more flameage, more trolls, more i-am-the-1337-PvPr wannabes, more over zealous fanboys, and lots of whineage, the whineage is probably normal though I guess. 
Personally I think that its mostly contained to the forums and doesn't represent the playerbase as a whole.
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Zothike
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2007.05.30 13:23:00 -
[43]
What Malacon Draco say is true
I dont think it's a loss of maturity but i must admit that since one year reading COAD is nearly pointless, before it was important and interesting to read, now you have to read 15 thread and go threw 154 post to find something of interest, all you find is hate/flaming/trolling/chest beating/e-peen
I think it's not a question of less mature ppl it's more a question of 'hate' the current political state of the game is 2 sided : the BoB side + 'allied' against anti-BoB side
the recent event made BoB suspected of having beeing helped by some CCP employee and eventually still is, true or false , the anti-BoB side see it as rather true (and as anti-BoB myself i must say i have this tendencie too even if it really start to reach too big dimensions)
Many ppl that have being kiked from 0.0 by BoB(ex ASCN member myself) consider that they have been victims of collusion between CCP and BoB, and that made them furious, that explain all the hate in forums
I would not say that the maturity of the player base is lower , i would rather say that the politic struggle in eve have evolved (unfortunatly) from 'ppl that dislike each other' from 'ppl that hate each other'
and unfortunatly i think it will stay the same for months and even perhaps (at worst) for year(s)....
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Saladin
Minmatar
Eternity INC.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.05.30 13:25:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Sabahl
WARNING - OLD FART ALERT
When I first started playing Eve over four years ago, one thing I found notable was the maturity of the playerbase, both emotionally and agewise. We had what must have been one of the most grounded player bases of any action-based MMORPG in existance at the time, with an average player age in the late twenties/early thirties. I believe that this was because the bugginess of the game forced most youngsters away before they could really scratch the surface, leaving us old fogies to hopefully await the improvements which would realise Eve's full potential whilst manually warping across the galaxy (no autopilot, y'see).
Well, the improvements have come and the game turly is living up to its potential. But as the game has been made more userfriendly the accessibility has led to an overall decrease in the age of the players who are in the game. The average age now appears to be college level and I do believe that this has led to a degredation in the overall playing experience as the maturity of the playerbase has been eroded with the new influx of players.
Maybe this is just the view of an old-school, hardcore believer who is finding it hard to adjust to the rather immature events he sees unfolding in the player-side of the game he's spent years playing. I'd be interested in hearing from other old timers though to find out if you agree or not.
Sabahl - Age 35
Come on Sabahl, if you want to complain about ths goons just come out and say it. You don't need to create a veiled thread like this. And in the old days you had people, while not as bad as the people you elude to, behaved with absolute immaturity. Its easy to get nostalgic but you forget about Homo erectus, sutty, HavokTBP, Redon and others. People often say that people in BoB are immature teens with lots of time on their hands, so you can see that making the same assumptions about others may not prove true either.
Even the most mature players are capable of acts of immaturity (including myself). We all recall that one Sunday CCP broadcast a message through the game telling us we were close to smashing the '10k' online record and asking us to log as many alts as we could in. We enjoyed EvE as always back then, but we were also desperate to see the game succeed. What you are complaining about is the price of success.
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr
Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United
Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.05.30 13:26:00 -
[45]
If EVE has become fat, lazy and stupid, then i must've become EVE and i demand you give me a whole lot of ISKies!
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Diana deVos
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Posted - 2007.05.30 13:31:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Sabahl
WARNING - OLD FART ALERT
Maybe this is just the view of an old-school, hardcore believer who is finding it hard to adjust to the rather immature events he sees unfolding in the player-side of the game he's spent years playing. I'd be interested in hearing from other old timers though to find out if you agree or not.
Sabahl - Age 35
Coming from someone from BoB, I find this to be laughable.
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Ma'Kur Pridar
Slacker Industries
Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2007.05.30 13:33:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Sabahl
WARNING - OLD FART ALERT
When I first started playing Eve over four years ago, one thing I found notable was the maturity of the playerbase, both emotionally and agewise. We had what must have been one of the most grounded player bases of any action-based MMORPG in existance at the time, with an average player age in the late twenties/early thirties. I believe that this was because the bugginess of the game forced most youngsters away before they could really scratch the surface, leaving us old fogies to hopefully await the improvements which would realise Eve's full potential whilst manually warping across the galaxy (no autopilot, y'see).
Well, the improvements have come and the game turly is living up to its potential. But as the game has been made more userfriendly the accessibility has led to an overall decrease in the age of the players who are in the game. The average age now appears to be college level and I do believe that this has led to a degredation in the overall playing experience as the maturity of the playerbase has been eroded with the new influx of players.
Maybe this is just the view of an old-school, hardcore believer who is finding it hard to adjust to the rather immature events he sees unfolding in the player-side of the game he's spent years playing. I'd be interested in hearing from other old timers though to find out if you agree or not.
Sabahl - Age 35
Personally i think you were just around a bunch of older guys, i was 19/20 when i first started playing eve. That was back in beta :)
Eve is just as sharp as it has always been, there are just a lot more idiots in the game now.
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Relaed
FireStar Inc
FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.30 13:42:00 -
[48]
Only one person came near to a reason; the changes made in the not too distant passed that allowed characters a much better creation format to come out of the box able to fly an interceptor and or T2 guns in a few short days, has allowed more kids to look at the game and say, "Gee, I don't have to wait 6 months before I can actually fly a decent ship that won't die in two seconds." Thus, Eve has evolved.
The real bad developments have been in nerfing modules so that combat is more even across fighting platforms; there are no advantages to ECM specialists, Nano-phoons, Recons, etc. The only ship left that can still control itself in combat is the Vagabond, because even with the nano nerfs, it can still move very fast and get away. He who wins is he who travels in packs of rabid mobs, with interdictors, 40km webber ships, and warp stab nerfs, the only thing left is operating with a cloak all the time....and everyone wants to take that away too.
Eve is becoming like WoW....NPC all day, try not to fight anyone, because it's all about numbers in combat, not the combat itself.
Good Luck,
Good Night
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Koi Yokuma
Praetorian BlackGuard
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Posted - 2007.05.30 14:10:00 -
[49]
Damn, I thought EVE had turned into my wife and I was gonna browse for suggestions.  LOVE YOU BABY! (hope she never sees that!  )
At any rate, CCP's goal is to make money, fun is just a byproduct of their business plan. They're trying hard to ensure they get more players regardless of age. The age issue, which wasn't the case 4 years ago, is something all games have to endure now. PCs are more and more affordable as are fast connections. Ergo more and more people are playing online games. There's an increase in players of all ages, but you know the old adage about the squeaky wheel. You only notice the influx of the loud obnoxious people. Which tend to be the younger crowd. I personally enjoy the h3ll out of it. I've seen some chat logs that made me pee my pants!
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DiuxDium
Free Mercenaries Union
FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.30 14:15:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Sabahl
WARNING - OLD FART ALERT
When I first started playing Eve over four years ago, one thing I found notable was the maturity of the playerbase, both emotionally and agewise. We had what must have been one of the most grounded player bases of any action-based MMORPG in existance at the time, with an average player age in the late twenties/early thirties. I believe that this was because the bugginess of the game forced most youngsters away before they could really scratch the surface, leaving us old fogies to hopefully await the improvements which would realise Eve's full potential whilst manually warping across the galaxy (no autopilot, y'see).
Well, the improvements have come and the game turly is living up to its potential. But as the game has been made more userfriendly the accessibility has led to an overall decrease in the age of the players who are in the game. The average age now appears to be college level and I do believe that this has led to a degredation in the overall playing experience as the maturity of the playerbase has been eroded with the new influx of players.
Maybe this is just the view of an old-school, hardcore believer who is finding it hard to adjust to the rather immature events he sees unfolding in the player-side of the game he's spent years playing. I'd be interested in hearing from other old timers though to find out if you agree or not.
Sabahl - Age 35
I'm inclined to agree, and disagree. First, there's ALWAYS going to be an element of the 'immature' in a video game. While true, eve was spared their full wrath (ala wow), until the goons graced us with their full presence. Eve like any most other online games eventually gains enough popularity to interest the "WoW" level player.
The solution is fairly simple, stay within your Guild/Clan/Alliance/Corp/Etc. You already have very little -need- to associate with those outside your immediate 'family', so simply ignore the elements you find irritating.
The great thing about eve though, is unlike other games, in this one you can effectively destroy that element which you dislike.
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[En] - So....I think the devs don't like me. |
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