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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.18 14:49:00 -
[1]
Some great points that I have been trying to preached since the nos nerf about the pilgrim.
Now on the pilgrim and this is what really bugged me. The pilgrim gets an extra 100pg to compensate for nos nerf. And why did it get a 100pg increase? To fit a med injector because it had to used at least 2 neuts to be able to do something useful. Did people fail to mention that med injectors cost 150pg and a mid slot? Did ccp forgot about that? Did that totally forgot that the mid slot on a “recon” is extremely important? Did that also forget that recons have poor total cap that would totally hurt a ship if it had to use neuts? And did ccp also forget that the pilgrim like all recons have a small cargo hold?
Pilgrim has 5 mids, which is the lowest of ‘ALL’ recons. It has the worst EW bonus (tracking disruptors) which is tied with target painters (which works perfectly well with webs btw) and the pilgrim soul purpose was that it was a solo recon. Just like nearly all drone boats. Myrmidon, Astarte, Eos, Domi, Ishtar, Ishkur, even the Typhoon from its large drone bay alone is a decent solo ship.
CCP threw 100pg in our face and said ‘use your precious mid slot for a 150pg module’ and that what really ****ed me off. It was a very quick and a pointless broken idea, rushed so that the nos nerf could be brought in just before the pvp tourney.
Does anyone agree?
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.18 15:20:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: OwnedBy Me
Originally by: Depp Knight
Some great points that I have been trying to preached since the nos nerf about the pilgrim.
Now on the pilgrim and this is what really bugged me. The pilgrim gets an extra 100pg to compensate for nos nerf. And why did it get a 100pg increase? To fit a med injector because it had to used at least 2 neuts to be able to do something useful. Did people fail to mention that med injectors cost 150pg and a mid slot? Did ccp forgot about that? Did that totally forgot that the mid slot on a “recon” is extremely important? Did that also forget that recons have poor total cap that would totally hurt a ship if it had to use neuts? And did ccp also forget that the pilgrim like all recons have a small cargo hold?
Pilgrim has 5 mids, which is the lowest of ‘ALL’ recons. It has the worst EW bonus (tracking disruptors) which is tied with target painters (which works perfectly well with webs btw) and the pilgrim soul purpose was that it was a solo recon. Just like nearly all drone boats. Myrmidon, Astarte, Eos, Domi, Ishtar, Ishkur, even the Typhoon from its large drone bay alone is a decent solo ship.
CCP threw 100pg in our face and said ‘use your precious mid slot for a 150pg module’ and that what really ****ed me off. It was a very quick and a pointless broken idea, rushed so that the nos nerf could be brought in just before the pvp tourney.
Does anyone agree?
For a bob guy u arent that smart.. i can see why ur gonna loose the war right there.. Target painter are as good as bonus as TD ?... I dont know if i should cry and laugh
1. Wrong forum, like me and many other eve players, I am sick of all the flaming in caod, so I like to fulfil my time in constructive threads like this. Where flaming is at its bare minimum.
2. I did mention TP with webs work very well. (are you suggesting that a fat slow target doesn’t work wonders?) Also like to mention if someone had a spare mid slot, target painter’s would be used before tracking disruptor’s. Damps would be used over both though.
3. Stop hiding behind your alt
4. And you have not said anything constructive in this thread. You have just flamed others, with a hidden suggestion that your ideas are totally correct and anyone who suggest otherwise are totally wrong.
So log onto your main and troll Caod threads, dont take this away from us and I know I am not alone on this.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.19 08:19:00 -
[3]
This thread deserves a bump
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.19 12:45:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Depp Knight on 19/10/2007 12:45:55
^ Exactly, well said. If we excuse the caldari recons which are just ecm ships, the minmie recons can bring even the fastest ships to a stop while expanding their sig radius, meaning anything that’s smaller gets totally popped instantly while anything else becomes a sitting duck. Then the gal recons can scram a ship from a distance and totally defend itself with damps. The amarr recons on the other hand have sorta lost its tracking disruptor bonus. As the curse needs to defend its drones and avoid dmg it defends itself with damps while the pilgrim only has the chance to use 1 ew if it has to use mwd, scram, web, injector combo which it does need to. A tracking disruptor in web range isn’t exactly a great bonus to have.
Damps affect all ships, ECM affects all ships, Target Painters affects all ships, even webs though its not a ew, it also affects all ships however tracking distruptors has a limit affect on Minmie ships, no affect on missiles and drone boats. Just something more to continue this debate.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.20 10:42:00 -
[5]
This is my opinion on recons ratings for certain basic situations and is compared to other recons and not other ship types. Feel free to debate but remember this topic is about the pilgrim so try not to deviate from the topic.
5 = Terrible and pointless
4 = Poor and not much good will come from it
3 = Mix bag, more better than bad
2 = Great to use in that situation.
1= Excels when most ships don't.
Rapier / Huginn
Solo: 4 / 3
Duel gang: 3 / 2
Small gang: 1 / 1
Large/Fleet: 2 / 2
Arazu / Lachesis
Solo: 5 / 3
Duel gang: 2 / 2
Small gang : 2 / 2
Large/fleet: 2 / 1
Falcon / Rook
Solo: 5 / 5
Duel gang : 2 / 2
Small gang: 2 / 2
Large/fleet: 1 / 1
Pilgrim / Curse
Solo: 3 / 1
Duel gang: 3 / 2
Small Gang: 4 / 3
Large/Fleet: 5 / 5
From my ratings you can clearly see that the pilgrim is fairly average across the board. When once it was a good solo ship it now is a average solo ship.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.20 15:44:00 -
[6]
The only reason why I rated the rapier low in solo is because I feel that it doesnt have the dps to break a decent tank, where as the pilgrim can break any active tank in the game because it can clean up their cap.
But thats a pretty smart setup ill probably say that it would be a 2 in duel.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.21 01:26:00 -
[7]
See that TD's only really work with rails, beams and arty's. It has a very limited affect on AC's and avg affect on blasters and pulse and no affect on missile/ drone boats. With good skills you can bring down a ships optimal range down to 40% of its max turret range. Considering your pretty much in web range the tracking penalty it gives is a little limited if you are using 1 TD, which is in the pilgrim's case. For example, I believe a thron can hit at about 30km with antimatter with rails. 1 TD will bring the range down to about 12km. Remember your in web range and if for some reason the thron had a web, which hopefully that wont be the case cause its a rail ship, the rails would still hit you.
So you can sorta see that 2 TD's is must to use but the pilgrim doesn’t have the mid slots to support this.
The optimal range of TD's are mute for range combat as it cant affect sniping ships which in my opinion if this wasn’t the case the pilgrim/curse would get a nice boost for fleet combat by having a 150km optimal to td's. Its nos/neut bonus and drone bonus would be pointless for fleet but TD's with that range bonus would help more than some may think.
When TD's full short is when you fit more than 2 on the ship because damps and ecm are better. They counter everything except fof missiles and drones and it’s pretty easier to destroy drones if you got the target jammed or damped. Also along with that Damps and ECM increasing your flee bonus. TD’s doesn’t stop the target from scramming you. Also not to mention that TD’s can be counted by Damps and ECM as well.
If TD's were some type of missile interference as well, it may bring the EW closer to damps and ECM.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.21 10:25:00 -
[8]
How about instead of the TD skill that decreases 5% cap per level which is a waste. Really it saves like 6 cap per cycle on lvl V or something stupid like that. Instead increase optimal range by 10% per lvl.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.21 14:33:00 -
[9]
This thread had delivered some good arguments. Keep it up and we might get a new and improve pilgrim.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.22 02:35:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Aaron Mirrorsaver
ok depp, mistake on your part?
Quote:
How about instead of the TD skill that decreases 5% cap per level which is a waste. Really it saves like 6 cap per cycle on lvl V or something stupid like that. Instead increase optimal range by 10% per lvl.
[/quote
from your post. The bonus is 5% strength per level to TD's.
http://www.eve-online.com/itemdatabase/EN/skills/electronics/3434.asp
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.23 14:59:00 -
[11]
I can see this thread going to "omg new amarr frig suck"
And ill put my hand up and say that this is correct. How is a frig that will neut 100 cap max per neut at a cost of 50 every 6 seconds going to cause a bs to shiver.
It does make the pilgrim look even worse but it also suggest how bad nos is these days. Especially small.
Its joke. Thankfully I have gal and caldari frig lvl V as well. :D
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