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Aaron Mirrorsaver
TARDZ
Gods of Night and Day
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Posted - 2007.06.23 16:34:00 -
[1]
Being gallente and often involved in alot of PVP. After exploring the advantages/disadvantages of the drake, I have decided it would be very worthwhile to train it and fly it with a passive shield tank.
Firstly looking at the offense side. Missiles don't use cap, and range isn't an issue as long as your within range, close or far they do the same damage of course depending on ship size/ size missile.
Secondly comparing an armor tank to a passive tank even a basic one, a bare minimum passive tank will beat the armor tank hands down each time and still have slots for a web + scrambler or a scrambler + mwd/AB whatever.
An MAR II repping 320 every 9 seconds = 35.5/second armor repaired. A duel MAR 2 setup = 70/s.
I've decided the best use for the passive tank is to compliment a gang, you'll have no point, but you can tank like a mofo and combined damage with gang mates is good enough to take out the opponents. Or you could always drop one mid slot fitting for that valuable point if you solo or the gang is small and your scramble point is needed.
Currently as per my powergrid cpu issues. Ive explored the following fitting in quickfit.
6x arb launchers
3x LSE II, 2x Invul Field II, Photon Scattering field
4x SPR II
it gives me resists of 75/83/75/69 without shield compensation skills. Total shield hp = 16012 at 119 recharge a second. Which is 2/3 better than a dual rep MAR II setup.
If you've got isk you could put on 3 core defense field purger and get 254/s which is prolly the equivelant to dual LAR II reps on a Hyperion with 3 nano pump rigs. (rep amount)
Greater Love hath no man than this; that a man lay down his life for his friends |
Sokratesz
Paradox v2.0
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.06.23 16:42:00 -
[2]
DPS of a wet paper towel?
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Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
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Posted - 2007.06.23 16:46:00 -
[3]
Plz train it hehe It's a cool ship but you are crazy thinking it's the best ship ever 
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I'm a nice guy!!
and OMG I love Team Tuxford for the speedbalancing... |
Aaron Mirrorsaver
TARDZ
Gods of Night and Day
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Posted - 2007.06.23 16:47:00 -
[4]
100 and slight with my skills. But like I said. imagine 20 of these things together with a couple tacklers. It is bad dps yes, I said that. OR the inability to fit other useful modules in mid slots.
Greater Love hath no man than this; that a man lay down his life for his friends |
Securion Wolfheart
Caldari
Dark-Rising
Fallen Souls
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Posted - 2007.06.23 16:48:00 -
[5]
Its a good gangship to add firepower, but completely worthless solo.
But if ya wanna add firepower there are better alternatives, maybe a droneboat...?
-----====-----
Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.
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LMAAAOOOO
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Posted - 2007.06.23 16:50:00 -
[6]
Edited by: LMAAAOOOO on 23/06/2007 16:57:32
Why not go for a passive Myrmidon? Double the dps, same tank, or if you go with a nos fit, you still have around 50% more dps than a drake sucking around 40 cap a second, i see no reason to train for Drake if you have good hybrid + drone skills ( considering your gallente )
And the drake is an extremely boring ship to fly ( believe me, i know)
______________________________________________
*some guy telling a noob that pirates doesnt check their age before attacking*
"ooh! an age quip! very clever,I'm probably older than you darling! xx |
Liang Nuren
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.06.23 16:51:00 -
[7]
Its a great ship, tbh. The Drake really shines when you drop some of its tank in favor of damage. The question you *really* need to ask yourself is whether or not you need that much tank.
Also, has your quickfit been upgraded to know about the Drake nerf?
Liang
 Originally by: Dianabolic, of BOB, referring to MSN
the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knoweldge?
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Incantare
Caldari
Darkness Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.23 17:33:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Incantare on 23/06/2007 17:42:07
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Its a great ship, tbh. The Drake really shines when you drop some of its tank in favor of damage. The question you *really* need to ask yourself is whether or not you need that much tank.
Also, has your quickfit been upgraded to know about the Drake nerf?
Liang
LMAO!
A fully passive tanked myrm deals about 450 dps from ogres, while having a stronger tank than a full out passive drake. A full gank drake (4* BCU II) deals 550 from missiles, while having a weak tank. The Drake doesn't shine as a damage dealer, in fact it's the worse damage dealer of the t2 bcs.
Stick to a Myrm, save yourself the pain. Unless you'll be using it for mission or gatecamps, that is.
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KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.06.23 18:29:00 -
[9]
yeah man, your myrmidon can get the same range with its drones. IT also mounts a stronger passive tank. Its also more agile and quicker to warp. It also does more damage. Point being, there is no reason to fly the drake.
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Rohnda
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Posted - 2007.06.23 18:55:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Pinky Denmark
Plz train it hehe It's a cool ship but you are crazy thinking it's the best ship ever
Not the best ship ingame... and not worth training for a gallente pilot unless he's seriusly planning on training the 6 mill sp for caldari xD
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.23 21:19:00 -
[11]
As many other Caldari ships, the Drake really shines in PvE and medium-sized gangs.
Unlike most other Caldari ships, it is extremely versatile.
Most other Caldari ships excel at a single role, the Drake can boast with two, maybe three.
In PvE, groups of it can be insanely effective due to each ship's ability to tank massive amounts of damage, and the outbound DPS simply adds up, so the larger the gang, the faster the mission, and even solo (albeit slowly) it's pretty safe in all but the most extreme cases.
In PvP, you have TWO (more like, two and a half or three) alternatives.
You can set it up as a very hardened fire-support target, with massive HP/resists (think plated BS level) and minimal firepower, yet at a decent range (heavies go to 80km with nearly maxed skills and no rigs), making you one of the last ships to fall, most likely to survive in an encounter.
You can also set it up as a balanced mix of firepower and passive tank, and even add a bit of EWar to that, it's still tougher as most ships around. That's kind of "option one and a half".
And finally, you can set it up as a heavy gank platform, with minimal active tank.
In case you missed it, with maxskills, you CAN bring this baby up to around 640 DPS, unimplanted, unrigged, with high-damage HAMs.
Sure, you have an awful range (around 13km at max skills and no rigs), and you have trouble fiting all that (especially since MWD+injector is almost mandatory), and also have a wet paper towel tank... but it is doable.
In closing, the Drake is one of the better ships around, in the hands of a capable pilot.
Sure, the Myrmidon is much stronger overall, and even MORE versatile, but that's not the issue here, or is it ?
_
New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |
Aaron Mirrorsaver
TARDZ
Gods of Night and Day
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:14:00 -
[12]
as always, it is very wise to other opinions. :)
Noting what people have said about the Myrmidon, I don't see how repping 70/s can compare to the drakes tank... I won't argue the dps issue or the fact that the tank is still good on the myrm with great dps...
Greater Love hath no man than this; that a man lay down his life for his friends |
Maeltstome
Minmatar
Caldari Navy Raiders
Praesidium Libertatis
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:16:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Aaron Mirrorsaver
Being gallente and often involved in alot of PVP. After exploring the advantages/disadvantages of the drake, I have decided it would be very worthwhile to train it and fly it with a passive shield tank.
Wrong, you cant fit tackle gear with a passive tank - GL killing anything.
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AnKahn
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:26:00 -
[14]
Going from the top of my head you'll need the following to fly a Drake.
Missile projection, missile bombardment, rapid launch, warhead upgrades, heavy V, heavy missile specialize all to 4. I suggest 3 LSE II and 2 Purger rigs and 1 bay loading rig. Photon scat, invuln.
At least one BCU II, DCU II if you can fit (I cant). There's cpu penality on the purger rigs.
That tank is insane. Works fine completely nossed. I would keep the photon scat, but other 2 mids are open to play with. MWD a tight fit unless you have the skills.
With the skills above and maybe a ROF implant your DPS is whatever, but its damage over time, not at all chance/range/tracking dependant. And your going to be there a long time.
You can shoot drones. It called the fof missile. Train it also to V. You can also target drones but I'm to lazy. Sure they dont get a bonus from your BCU but they get all the R.O.F. skills and warhead upgrades and the ROF diff between heavy missile launcher I vs II (12 sec vs. 10 sec.). Does a good fourth of july impression.
Pesky frigates? Precision missiles.
Nerf? swing and a miss.
Did I mention fully NOSsed it works the same. Any other skills please suggest. Thanks
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:29:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Akita T on 24/06/2007 02:30:50
Originally by: Aaron Mirrorsaver
as always, it is very wise to other opinions. :)
Noting what people have said about the Myrmidon, I don't see how repping 70/s can compare to the drakes tank... I won't argue the dps issue or the fact that the tank is still good on the myrm with great dps...
That's because you don't use an active armor tank on a pewpewmydon, you use a Drake-style passive tank (almost on par TBFH), drones for damage (beats the hell out of heavy missile drake) and full NOS for extra pwnerizing overpowered goodness.
Yes, I know, Myrm has bonus to active armor tanking.
Still doesn't matter, passive shieldtank is better.
Even after the recent nerf.
Sure, no tackle gear on that one (or minimal tackle gear: MWD+scram and less omgpwn tank), but who cares... with the damage of a nosdomi and the same sucktion from hell (just at roughly half the level), you just can't beat the Myrmidon.
Just like the Dominix, Myrmidon is invincible 
_
New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |
AnKahn
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:37:00 -
[16]
Did anyone get the memo? YOU CAN SHOOT DRONES. The myrm is vinsible
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:41:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Akita T on 24/06/2007 02:41:29
Originally by: AnKahn
Going from the top of my head you'll need the following to fly a Drake.
Missile projection, missile bombardment, rapid launch, warhead upgrades, heavy V, heavy missile specialize all to 4. I suggest 3 LSE II and 2 Purger rigs and 1 bay loading rig. Photon scat, invuln.
At least one BCU II, DCU II if you can fit (I cant). There's cpu penality on the purger rigs.
That tank is insane. Works fine completely nossed. I would keep the photon scat, but other 2 mids are open to play with. MWD a tight fit unless you have the skills.
With the skills above and maybe a ROF implant your DPS is whatever, but its damage over time, not at all chance/range/tracking dependant. And your going to be there a long time.
You can shoot drones. It called the fof missile. Train it also to V. You can also target drones but I'm to lazy. Sure they dont get a bonus from your BCU but they get all the R.O.F. skills and warhead upgrades and the ROF diff between heavy missile launcher I vs II (12 sec vs. 10 sec.). Does a good fourth of july impression.
Pesky frigates? Precision missiles.
Nerf? swing and a miss.
Did I mention fully NOSsed it works the same. Any other skills please suggest. Thanks
You, sir, should not be trying to GIVE advice, but actually SEEK advice.
Where to start. Oh, I know, I know.
"1 bay loading rig "
That was the first "WTF" moment.
NO, you never ever fit any weapon rigs on any ship except you really, really can't get anything else.
The only choices for a Drake are purger/extender rigs.
"There's cpu penality on the purger rigs."
No, there's no CPU penality on the purger rigs.
"That tank is insane. Works fine completely nossed."
Not with an invul in your fit it doesn't.
"they [F.o.F.] dont get a bonus from your BCU"
Yes they do.
Other than that, overall ok.
Originally by: AnKahn
Did anyone get the memo? YOU CAN SHOOT DRONES. The myrm is vinsible
Lack of a kill is not a loss.
You merely force the Myrm to disengage, if fight was at long range, and you can't kill the drones at short range if the pilot is at the helm AND SCOOPING THEM UP as they are getting damaged.
_
New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |
Kua Immortal
RSP Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:44:00 -
[18]
Incorrect advice FTL  .
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Drazin DawnTreader
The Elear
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:59:00 -
[19]
Akita knows whats what.
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AnKahn
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Posted - 2007.06.24 04:39:00 -
[20]
Akita thanks for the corrections.
Yea the bay loader has the cpu penality, purgers sig radius. Again "off the top of my head" FTL?
Min/Max theory, hmmm? has to be 3 purger rigs. Tank not quite strong enough. Why I wonder do peeps with more experiance than I wish the Ferox and Drake had a ROF bonus rather than a the one they have? (flame shy of the bonus cause im not cross-referencing, but I think they have a velocity bonus)
Which does the Drake need more help with DPS or Tank?
I would agree that 3 purger rigs more important if you want to free up more mid slots but then giving up DPS means longer ratting times. Drakes strong suit is versility. Rigs can't be shuffled around. I only own one ship. Let's agree to disagree.
I fly Drake exclusively and have shuffled the modules around for months. I'm always willing to learn. But I'm going to voice my opinion even with imperfect knowledge. Server was down and all.
Thanks again for the correction. I'll let you know when I lose a duel and why when I do.
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AnKahn
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Posted - 2007.06.24 04:44:00 -
[21]
And scooping kinda hurts your DPS a little I'll bet.
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KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.06.24 05:25:00 -
[22]
Quote:
Noting what people have said about the Myrmidon, I don't see how repping 70/s can compare to the drakes tank... I won't argue the dps issue or the fact that the tank is still good on the myrm with great dps...
Greater Love hath no man than this; that a man lay down his life for his friends
Yeah, I think your kinda missing the point here. The mymridon mounts a stronger PASSIVE SHIELD TANK  Kinda sad, but its true. So if you really want to get into the passive shield tank fad, myrmidon is the way to do it. The slot layout is amazing. 6 low slots means an insane recharge rate. It also doesnt need low slot modules for damage and hence does more damage.
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Ling Xiao
Prism Project Technologies
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Posted - 2007.06.24 06:38:00 -
[23]
You're all missing the main issue: the Myrmidon is 100x better looking than the flying piece of folded cardboard that is the Drake.
__________
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Drazin DawnTreader
The Elear
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Posted - 2007.06.24 06:41:00 -
[24]
Originally by: AnKahn
Which does the Drake need more help with DPS or Tank?
I would agree that 3 purger rigs more important if you want to free up more mid slots but then giving up DPS means longer ratting times. Drakes strong suit is versility. Rigs can't be shuffled around. I only own one ship. Let's agree to disagree.
I fly Drake exclusively and have shuffled the modules around for months. I'm always willing to learn. But I'm going to voice my opinion even with imperfect knowledge. Server was down and all.
I went with 3 Purger Rigs because it allows more versatility when fitting the ship for different roles.
If I want more DPS I can swap out SPR II's for BCU II's very easily.
I can either go with a 282 hp/sec regen with great resists and 290 DPS... or a weaker regen and 400ish DPS very easily. This really helps my corpmates in missions where I need to be the main tank or just help with some DPS.
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OrangeAfroMan
Minmatar
Queens of the Stone Age
Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.06.24 06:50:00 -
[25]
Gate guns > Myrmidon.
Drones die = good luck getting a kill.
Nos - Time for a Change |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.24 07:33:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Akita T on 24/06/2007 07:38:03
Originally by: AnKahn
Which does the Drake need more help with DPS or Tank?
I would agree that 3 purger rigs more important if you want to free up more mid slots but then giving up DPS means longer ratting times. Drakes strong suit is versility. Rigs can't be shuffled around. I only own one ship. Let's agree to disagree.
Purger rigs have a sigradius non-penality, are not stacking-nerfed with anything.
Missile Damage/RoF rigs only affect ONE of two attributes, have a CPU penality to launchers AND ARE STACKING-NERFED together with BCUs. One missile damage rig AND one missile RoF rig ALMOST equals one BCU-II. Almost. But not quite. Basically, you're slapping on your ship slightly less than half of a BCU, while sacrificing a potentially 25% higher tank.
a) 4 SPR-II + 2 purger I + 1 missile rig I
-vs-
b) 3 SPR-II + 1 BCU-II + 3 purger I ?
Both have ALMOST the same tank. (b) has 6-7% lower tank as (a)
But (a) has a lousier cap recharge, and an output DPS around 10% lower as (b)!
A three-purger setup and an extra BCU allows you MORE DPS for only slightly less tank as a two-purger + missile damage or RoF rig. That's regardless of how many SPRs you swap for BCUs.
If you fill all 4 lows with BCUs, due to stacking-nerfs, the damage will be nearly identical for both rig setups, yet the 3-purger version will have a 25% better tank... while the purger version will have no trouble fiting anything, the damage rig version will struggle, heck, you probably can't even fit 4 BCUs on it at all with full T2 fit in mids/highs.
So, still think anything but purgers are a good idea on a passive Drake ?
Originally by: OrangeAfroMan
Gate guns > Myrmidon.
Drones die = good luck getting a kill.
Wardecs or 0.0
I personally wouldn't waste time gatecamping lowsec.
_
New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |
errorist
Caldari
Free Mercenaries Union
FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.24 08:44:00 -
[27]
Originally by: AnKahn
And scooping kinda hurts your DPS a little I'll bet.
Actually it hurts dps for like 2-3 sec depending on how laggy the battle is, my oppinion, drake does not stand a chance vs a myrm cause it simply does not have the dps to take down a skilled myrmidon pilot, he might be able to tank if the drake has passive hardners.
Myrmidon> all other bc
If Somethings hard doing its not worth doing,
But get going anyway :twisted: |
James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates
Betrayal Under Mayhem
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Posted - 2007.06.24 10:28:00 -
[28]
Drake tanks quite nicely, but it really does suffer for damage. The Myrmidon does more, damage, and actually if you passive tank it, has a better tank too.
... and then it can fit some guns, just for a laugh.
Don't get me wrong, the Drake's a nice ship, but it's niche really is PvE.
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Sokratesz
Paradox v2.0
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.06.24 11:24:00 -
[29]
A skilled drake pilot with precision heavies will two-volley heavy drones from the myrm. Good luck scooping those in time.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.24 17:38:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Sokratesz
A skilled drake pilot with precision heavies will two-volley heavy drones from the myrm. Good luck scooping those in time.
Since we're playing rock-paper-scissors anyway... dual damps on M then
Good luck targetting those drones 
_
New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |
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