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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.19 13:52:00 -
[1]
"damage no longer leaking in your structure while your armor is still intact."
... How's that different from how it is now?
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.19 14:00:00 -
[2]
"Currently it's fully possible to go pop with large amounts of armor left. I've started taking structure damage with 60% armor left before.
Makes armor tanking insanely dangerous."
Aye, i know... just the original description made it sound that the damage leak doesn't happen only as long as there's no armour breach at all ^^;
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.19 14:37:00 -
[3]
"Can we get Shield Extenders with similar stats/requirements then also?"
Aye, would be nice. Currently it's:
1600 hp of armour for 800 MW and 60 tf
vs
500 hp of shield for 1250 MW and 100 tf
(the size difference nonwithstanding, try to find that much of free grid on Caldari ship with those few low slots they have :/
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.19 14:41:00 -
[4]
"what module gives you 2000 armour?"
1600mm Reinforced Titanium Plates I: 1920 hp
1600mm Reinforced Crystaline Carbonide Plates I: 2080 hp
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I: 2240 hp
dunno if any of those drops, though.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.19 15:26:00 -
[5]
"Armor tanking does not work like shield tanking and a flat comparison isn't valid. 6 guns shooting on armor will strip a ship fast. Simply can't keep up with the incoming damage."
... Are those hits against 'bare' armour or one with multiple hardeners, though? I don't think many people bothered so far with armour hardening at all, so it might be quite different when they actually use some of those numerous low slots for that. o.O
(for reference -- was shooting armour-reinforced Megathron, using blaster cannons and explosive cruise missiles. By the time his structure collapsed he still had 40% armour left, and we were both running out of cap at that point... so if it wasn't for the structure, he'd win easily -- my shield hardeners would simply stop working, while reinforced armour doesn't use the cap so it'd still be effective against my weapons...)
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.19 17:16:00 -
[6]
Edited by: j0sephine on 19/01/2004 17:18:03
"With the skill requirementa for 1600mm plating being a level 5 that gives 5% per level extra hitpoints stock standard 1600mm Reinforced Steel gives you 2000 armor per unit."
... Does the Hull Upgrades skill affect also the armour plating, not just the base armour hp of the ship?
If so then... omg. 2700+ hp from the 'rare' 1600 plate. o.o;
(and there's Advanced Hull Upgrades skill possibly coming, too...)
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.20 12:20:00 -
[7]
"Anyways, I don't like armor tanking, I think it's good it bleeds into structure, that's the way it should be. Shields should always been your first line of defense, IMO."
I think the damage bleed is quite natural, as it simulates the situation where the armour is breached, and the following shots hit the no longer protected structure underneath. The part that doesn't make sense is structure getting damaged worse that armour.
If possible, i'd like to see similar situation also between shield and armour. As in, once the shield is damaged the armour is likely to start taking hits, and once armour is breached the structure receives hits as well... Just there should be limitation that the armour damage cannot get worse than shield damage at the given moment, and structure can't be damaged worse than the armour. Which would prevent the problem with structure collapse... o.o;
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.21 04:17:00 -
[8]
Edited by: j0sephine on 21/01/2004 04:23:15
"Those complaining about shield extenders forget that you can reduce the cpu needs of shield extenders by a skill, something that can't be done with armor plating. If worst comes to worst you can always just fit on a cpu, something you can't do when you are armor tanking."
... I think you are forgettting Scorpion has four low slots. Good luck squeezing in there the enhancement of CPU array, of the power grid (which is actually the bigger problem because Caldari ships have weak power grid and no skill reduces usage of it for shield extenders) and cap recharge boost efficient enough to keep everything running. (can't use middle slots for it as those are used already for shield tanking)
edit: wait, am dumb. the Shield Upgrades skill says it reduces power needs, not cpu. So with skill at lvl.5 we're down to 100 cpu, 937.5 of grid. Versus 60 cpu and 800 MW for armour extender...
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.21 04:45:00 -
[9]
"Sorry that was my bad, i mixed up the bonus of the skill. But besides that as you mentioned cap chargers, no they don't actualy boost it efficiantly enough as you have to fit one web/warp scrambler on your ship giving you 3 mid slots and that's not enough to constaly run your armor repair unit."
... Uhmm but then doesn't that go exactly against what you said just couple of posts above, how 'in essence a scorpion is the best armor tank in the game' because it can recharge with just its middle slots? ^^;
(btw, checking quickly it looks like it's actually possible to put together quite useful Scorpion with enough room left for the large shield extender... if that's actually extension of shield base, it'd mean one could extend the shield to ~7.3 k quite easily, and to ~8k maxed... hmm. :s
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