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Gryffonia O.M.N.I.	Posted - 2007.07.01 16:48:00 - [1] Now lets clear something, everyone loves these new Tier 2 Battle cruisers, with their cool looking body work and insane tankability. But every ones has just forgotten the tier 1's? Seriously, since revelations i have seen probably no more than 30 Brutix, Ferox, Prophecys and Cyclones. They cant tank, the tier 2 BC can fit a full rack weapons and 2 repairs, its insane. Im a blaster person, love the DPS, so the Myrmidon seems a bit pointless. Furthermore, you ever tried properly fitting a Ferox, its darn near impossible, plus its tank is nothing compared to the drake. All im asking is that CCP gives the Tier 1 battle cruisers an extra 150 odd Power grid just to even them game between the battle cruisers. If Im being stupid please say why. Would be a picture here but I've lost the formatting.
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.07.01 16:56:00 - [2] Instead of them being evened, i'd like to see each BC take on a different role, like the brutix is a blaster boat, the myrm is a drone boat, the ferox is a rail boat and the drake a missile spammer. However, the lower tiers do need a boost in the roles they perform, as theyre a bit pants at it. (Especially the ferox.)
FarScape III	Posted - 2007.07.01 17:01:00 - [3] Agreed, but what really makes sense to me is give them some good extra speed capabilities. I little more speed could really give them cool role, either that or let them cost less to make, since they have been around for a while the Factions would be able to make them for even less from the experience. Either make them faster or even cheaper or they are not gonna be used. A Minmater City... Cool! My Skills
Sanzorz Amarr EVEfan.dk	Posted - 2007.07.01 17:46:00 - [4] Nothing wrong with Prophecy, nuff said. I used it all the time during lvl 3 missions and I didn't have trouble fitting it at all. Using 2 reppers is kinda silly aswell, when you have armor resists on ship bonus + hardner and possible EAN. I haven't tried out Harbinger yet, but I don't see a reason to either. Prophecy is also an excellent choice for a low skilled pilot due to the extra armor resists. The only huge difference from Prophecy to Harbinger is the Drone Bay imo. --- Member of the Danish Evefan.DK corp
Naomi Wildfire Amarr Stardust Heavy Industries	Posted - 2007.07.01 18:34:00 - [5] The Brutix is a very nice Tier1 BC, i also like the Cyclone
Anasur	Posted - 2007.07.01 18:40:00 - [6] The Hp boost in rev also made those t1 BCs with an armor Rep bonus instead of a resist bonus less viable for pvp. For the brutix, I suggest upping its speed 10m/s, drop mass by 10-15%, and give it a bit more pg, and take away some cpu. There, its a bit quicker than the myrm, but with fewer slots and hp, balanced. Oh, and a resist bonus instead of rep bonus like I said.
vostok	Posted - 2007.07.02 07:50:00 - [7] Originally by: Anasur The Hp boost in rev also made those t1 BCs with an armor Rep bonus instead of a resist bonus less viable for pvp. For the brutix, I suggest upping its speed 10m/s, drop mass by 10-15%, and give it a bit more pg, and take away some cpu. There, its a bit quicker than the myrm, but with fewer slots and hp, balanced. Oh, and a resist bonus instead of rep bonus like I said. i agree with whats being said, it would be a better ship if it was faster and more like the blasterboat it should be. but resist bonus instead of rep bonus isnt going to happen because that the amarr ''thing'', however it would be a much better blaster boat if it had a tracking bonus instead of the repair effectivness, this would nerf its tank completely however and as such is unlikely to happen any time soon. i think the problem is that the tier 1 BC when they came out were like bigger cruisers, they did what the cruisers did better and had the option of using a warfare link giving them that new role, however the tier 2 BC arent even competing with cruisers, they can match their counterpart BS if not do better than it. i dont think theres too much wrong with them, however i would like to see the tier 1 BC able to run level 3 missions without too much trouble.
Incantare Caldari Darkness Inc.	Posted - 2007.07.02 07:55:00 - [8] Originally by: Anasur The Hp boost in rev also made those t1 BCs with an armor Rep bonus instead of a resist bonus less viable for pvp. You're joking right? Longer combat favors ships with a rep bonus while shorter combat favors resists. That and the Brutix is the best t1 BC by a large margin.
Shaemell Buttleson Darwin With Attitude oooh Shiny	Posted - 2007.07.02 08:01:00 - [9] The biggest mistake CCP made with the ferox was giving it lots of missile points. It has a hybrid bonus and if Caldari pilots were prepared to train for them as much as they did missiles then just maybe they'd see the Ferox as the decent BC it is. Your signature was inappropriate, email [email protected] to find out why (don't forget to include a link to it) -Sahwoolo
Incantare Caldari Darkness Inc.	Posted - 2007.07.02 08:05:00 - [10] Edited by: Incantare on 02/07/2007 08:08:08 The Ferox is crap and that has nothing to do with most Caldari training missiles and everything to do with it having only five turret hardpoints. Check the thread "The Caldari gunboat problem" for details.
jaezebelle Gallente ORB enterprises	Posted - 2007.07.02 09:27:00 - [11] Originally by: Incantare Edited by: Incantare on 02/07/2007 08:08:08 The Ferox is crap and that has nothing to do with most Caldari training missiles and everything to do with it having only five turret hardpoints. Check the thread "The Caldari gunboat problem" for details. What crap! caldari dont use the ferox coz what most ppl want to do with it the drake does better and that's the only other reason apart from not wanting to learn gunnery skills.
LMAAAOOOO	Posted - 2007.07.02 10:38:00 - [12] "Im a blaster person, love the DPS, so the Myrmidon seems a bit pointless." The gank Myrmidon get's around 200 more DPS than a Gank Brutix, with a better tank. ______________________________________________ some guy telling a noob that pirates doesnt check their age before attacking "ooh! an age quip! very clever,I'm probably older than you darling! xx
000Hunter000 Gallente Magners Marauders	Posted - 2007.07.02 11:29:00 - [13] Meh, i don't like ferox cuz it's a gunship, and i'm a missilew***e CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!!
Bishop 5 Gallente Macabre Votum INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.07.02 12:45:00 - [14] Brutix is awesome, doesn't need a boost. Cyclone from what I hear is the same. Prophecy and Ferox you can fit some mean tanks to. maybe you just need more SP? :P ------------- meh
BillyBong2 Amarr Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.07.02 13:17:00 - [15] Nothing like doing level 3s in either a Prophecy or a Ferox. I use both of them as I have cross trained my caldari and amarr. Now granted the ferox should be a gunboat but it just sets up nicely for a missile spewing machine due to the 4 low slots. Both of those ships are great for mid-skill point users while they work on their support skills. I do not see that either of them needs a boost, just use what you want, and I have no desire to use a Drake or a Harbinger at this point.
DamienUPB Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.07.02 14:33:00 - [16] Ferox works great for gas cloud harvesting. 5 turret hardpoints and enough mids and lows to tank the damage, and keep the cap stable. Besides that it's a worthless ship. Oh well atleast it serves a purpose and is cheap enough I don't mind losing it in 0.0.
Manus Stuprare United Eve Directorate Ground Zeero	Posted - 2007.07.02 15:58:00 - [17] Originally by: Sanzorz I haven't tried out Harbinger yet, but I don't see a reason to either. Prophecy is also an excellent choice for a low skilled pilot due to the extra armor resists. The only huge difference from Prophecy to Harbinger is the Drone Bay imo. Hmm.. I'd call an almost 50% increase in damage output from lasers a fairly huge difference, but maybe that's just me :p -------------- Poisoning the Chalice: Smartbombs as a Counter to Nos
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.07.02 17:07:00 - [18] Tier one are supposed to be tanks and tier two supposed to be gank. So to fix this: Drake: -resistance bonus +rof bonus Mrym: -rep bonus +blaster bonus(domi reference) the other two are fine tbh and as for tier ones Ferox: -1 missile point +1 turrent point i will need to see the true dps difference between a electron and ion not enven counting neutrons for a brutix.
Incantare Caldari Darkness Inc.	Posted - 2007.07.02 17:55:00 - [19] Originally by: jaezebelle What crap! caldari dont use the ferox coz what most ppl want to do with it the drake does better and that's the only other reason apart from not wanting to learn gunnery skills. Are you dense? How does most Caldari training missiles affect how good the ship is? It doesn't, if the Ferox were good you'd be seeing more of them but instead Caldari who do have the hybrid skills train for a Brutix because it's a much, much better ship. But if you want to argue that the Ferox is on par with the Brutix or the other t1 BCs, go right ahead.
Xoduse Gallente Beasts of Burden YouWhat	Posted - 2007.07.02 18:42:00 - [20] Originally by: Vincent Almasy Tier one are supposed to be tanks and tier two supposed to be gank. So to fix this: Drake: -resistance bonus +rof bonus Mrym: -rep bonus +blaster bonus(domi reference) the other two are fine tbh and as for tier ones Ferox: -1 missile point +1 turrent point i will need to see the true dps difference between a electron and ion not enven counting neutrons for a brutix. This idea wins the thread. Exactly what I was going to post minus the ferox bit. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Kreul Intentions ([email protected])
DarkElf Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.07.02 18:50:00 - [21] Nothing wrong with them at all imo. They are a cheaper alternative to the tier 2 versions. I still see plenty of them about. The brutix is still a monster properly fitted. DE
Agent Li	Posted - 2007.07.02 18:55:00 - [22] Originally by: DarkElf Nothing wrong with them at all imo. They are a cheaper alternative to the tier 2 versions. I still see plenty of them about. The brutix is still a monster properly fitted. DE I fly a Ferox, and it's a good ship to learn in. Not expensive if you lose it. I've learned a lot about how to use rails effectively. It's also a nice ship for collecting salvage and corpses in low sec. ------------------ "Don't be afraid to take advantage of your enemy's weaknesses. Becasuse winning is everything after all."
Nicocat Caldari New Age Solutions New Age Solutions Amalgamated	Posted - 2007.07.02 19:40:00 - [23] The Cyclone is a one-man pain train when you aim it at cruisers (which, as I often remind people, is the purpose of BCs, as a gang module platform and an anti-cruiser platform). Load it with some nos in those spare highs, a skeleton shield tank, maybe some resist rigs or shield boost rigs, and 3 Gyros. Of course, the Vampyclone may be awesome just due to Nos being awesome, but I'm not complaining here. Originally by: Splagada SEED ME DADDY Down with alts! One character per account per IP!
Byzan Zwyth Dark Centuri Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.07.02 19:53:00 - [24] Originally by: Sanzorz Nothing wrong with Prophecy, nuff said. I used it all the time during lvl 3 missions and I didn't have trouble fitting it at all. Using 2 reppers is kinda silly aswell, when you have armor resists on ship bonus + hardner and possible EAN. I haven't tried out Harbinger yet, but I don't see a reason to either. Prophecy is also an excellent choice for a low skilled pilot due to the extra armor resists. The only huge difference from Prophecy to Harbinger is the Drone Bay imo. read what you said please and come back to us. The harbinger is so far superior ot the prophecy, lots more DPS and a very similar tank. Less resist but more armor and much better at using 2 MAR II because it has better fitting and an extra mid slot to fit an injector. ---------------------- Rank: Tech 1 and a 1/2 cannon fodder Pointless forum slowing bandwidth hogging signature pic inc?
Byzan Zwyth Dark Centuri Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.07.02 20:01:00 - [25] there has been lots of talk about this problem lately, lots of good ideas Ideas prophecy -1 high slot, +1 mid, -15m sig, +10m/s speed Ferox +1-2 turret, +150 grid, -10m sig Cyclone +1 turret -15m sig, +10m/s speed Brutix -15m sig, +10-15m/s speed something like this will make them a bit more fun and no so obsolite without making them overpowered. ---------------------- Rank: Tech 1 and a 1/2 cannon fodder Pointless forum slowing bandwidth hogging signature pic inc?
LMAAAOOOO	Posted - 2007.07.03 08:17:00 - [26] TBH the cyclone could use another Mid, with a mwd,web,disruptor,injector, you have 1 slot left for tank. ______________________________________________ some guy telling a noob that pirates doesnt check their age before attacking "ooh! an age quip! very clever,I'm probably older than you darling! xx
Anasur	Posted - 2007.07.03 09:05:00 - [27] You know, in all the many, many, MANY posts on the topic of t1 BCs needing some love, I have not seen a single dev post. Not suprising I suppose but a mention of what they are thinking would be nice. "Looking into it", "Fine as is", "6 months from now", "Not Changing", whatever.
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.07.03 09:14:00 - [28] Imho, the Brutix is fine, the cyclone need +30m3 drone bay, the prophecy another turret with some grid to go with it, and the ferox 2 turrets and 300-400 grid. ------------------------------------------ What is Oomph? It the sound Amarr players makes when they get kicked in the ribs.
X99 Z990	Posted - 2007.07.03 09:28:00 - [29] I think the tier 2s need changing more than anything. And that 5% shield resist bonus on the drake needs to go, its currently in league with the nighthawk + raven and thats just silly. And the myrms rep bonus needs to go also, im not quite sure why they gave it a rep bonus in the first place it should of been content with a battleship sized arsenal.
PWNERIZE	Posted - 2007.07.03 09:39:00 - [30] Edited by: PWNERIZE on 03/07/2007 09:40:47 Because the Drake is totally overpowered with its resist bonus. Oh wait, it's not. As for being in league with the raven, in tank perhaps but in dps no way. A nighthawk will slightly outdamage it and greatly outtank it, as it should. It's not a good PvP ship and you are suggesting it lose its one good bonus. Sure I'm completly behind that . Can't say I care what happens to the myrm, though.

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