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Cao Cao
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Posted - 2004.01.21 03:41:00 -
[1]
 Quote:
Lotta> Raven_DeBlade> One reason many arent fighting or are afraid of fighting with smaller ships are that they have implants, and that implants are VERY expensive. Do you have plans on solving this by releasing basic implants on BPs etc?
hellmar> We have discussed a change to the CONCORD response system so that there are some systems were ship destruction is OK but not podding
hellmar> that would be a play ground for the excellent frigate sparring we have seen videos of
hellmar> We are more inclined to allow for frigate sparring like that than allow players to remove implants
hellmar> we are also looking at allowing for the insurance of implants which only work for certain security levels
hellmar> i.e. the insurance contract is only valid if you are killed in a system with certain rating.
hellmar> Basically we are all for frigate sparring but not for removing death penalty in general (which implant removal would be)
Change needs to be made for how missiles kill pods on killing blow on the ship. It needs to be changed or once again Caldari ships, which rely on missiles, will be shafted up the rear end!
Specifically, a delay of perhaps a second of two from when a ship is destroyed to where a pod appears in space would solve this issue... I understand the importance of splash damage but it shouldn't automatically kill a ship, especially if you haven't been targeted!
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Naz Farooq
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Posted - 2004.01.21 06:30:00 -
[2]
I dunno. It's the easiest way to podkill someone, would be a shame to take it out just to let frigate spar-ers use real missiles. Anyone get podkilled from splash damage from light missiles or rockets?
Sure, everyone supports saving Einstein's brain, but when you put it in the body of a Great White Shark, suddenly you've "gone too far". |
ProphetGuru
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Posted - 2004.01.21 07:18:00 -
[3]
I really wish this would change too. 95% of the time after a battle all the loot is blown up, and the corpses.
Evolution..... Just when you thought you were winning.
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xeno calligan
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Posted - 2004.01.21 07:28:00 -
[4]
Quote:
Change needs to be made for how missiles kill pods on killing blow on the ship. It needs to be changed or once again Caldari ships, which rely on missiles, will be shafted up the rear end!
Specifically, a delay of perhaps a second of two from when a ship is destroyed to where a pod appears in space would solve this issue... I understand the importance of splash damage but it shouldn't automatically kill a ship, especially if you haven't been targeted!
I completely agree. Even if your ship gets destroyed by missiles, you ought to have a chance to survive. Insta-podding certainly doesn't help to make frigates more popular.
Rather than using invunerability timers, how about this solution:
- Make the ship explosion similar to (at least) a smartbomb, effectively destroying all missiles within a certain radius.
- Let the pod fly off in a randomly chosen direction at max speed (seeing as the pod is intended as an escape pod
 ). The pod is assumed to have provisions for avoiding the blast.
Being ejected away from the exploding ship would mean that the pod would be slightly harder to track rather than being a sitting duck (which would to some extent help in laggy situations) and that the pod would move away from incoming missile fire targeted at the the ship.
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INkog
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Posted - 2004.01.21 08:00:00 -
[5]
Quote:
Rather than using invunerability timers, how about this solution:
Make the ship explosion similar to (at least) a smartbomb, effectively destroying all missiles within a certain radius.
Let the pod fly off in a randomly chosen direction at max speed (seeing as the pod is intended as an escape pod ). The pod is assumed to have provisions for avoiding the blast.
Being ejected away from the exploding ship would mean that the pod would be slightly harder to track rather than being a sitting duck (which would to some extent help in laggy situations) and that the pod would move away from incoming missile fire targeted at the the ship.
Damn good idea.
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Mon Palae
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Posted - 2004.01.21 08:00:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Mon Palae on 21/01/2004 08:12:25
My ship was caught in a JIP camp post Castor with 16 drones and 2 battleships and lagged so badly I can only guess 1 frame per 15 seconds (not really kidding about that either...truly horrendous and I have a fairly speedy comp) with missiles adding to the overall misery.
I lost implants in that. Not pleased. But the REAL problem there was the horrid lag caused mostly by the drones (lag started before a missile was fired but they of course added to it all) and not the pod getting zapped. I would have at least liked a chance to get away which I did not have due to lag (and believe me...I was all over moving and warping away before and after my ship was gone).
That said how are you supposed to kill pods? They take a long time to lock and jump to warp nearly instantly. Yes losing implants stinks but that is part of the game. Stay in 0.5 space if you do not want to lose them. There should be a chance to nail a pod and near as I can tell missiles or maybe an sbomb are the only way to really have a chance at it barring someone sleeping while you attack them (or lag podkill).
I hated losing my hard earned implants but I knew the possibilities when I ventured where I did and accept the consequences (miserable as it is). Podkilling should be a real possibility.
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Mon Palae
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Posted - 2004.01.21 08:09:00 -
[7]
WHAT AM I SAYING!!!
Considering I am far more often the hunted rather than the hunter I think you all should forget my post above. 
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Atea
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Posted - 2004.01.21 09:07:00 -
[8]
- much higher signature radius of pods
- spawn the pod 4 km away from the ship, that should take care of any missile splash.
would also take care with the annoying podkills in empire space.
xxx
Atea. |
Beringe
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Posted - 2004.01.21 11:10:00 -
[9]
Quote:
- spawn the pod 4 km away from the ship, that should take care of any missile splash.
would also take care with the annoying podkills in empire space.
Yes, eject the pod farther away from the ship. That makes nothing but sense.
Multiple torpedoes could still pod you, but it will be less likely.
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"My main griveance with the Caldari state was that once I had finished my work for them, they wanted me dead."
"No, it's none of your business." |
Kin Hanyerec
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Posted - 2004.01.21 12:46:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Kin Hanyerec on 21/01/2004 12:50:35
you can warp instantly with a pod, just keep clicking on a planet just before your ship explodes.
the flaw of those ideas is that podkilling people will be really hard, unless it's a newbie who stays watching there... it's more like not having death penalty at all 
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Grut
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Posted - 2004.01.21 13:42:00 -
[11]
Quote:
- much higher signature radius of pods
- spawn the pod 4 km away from the ship, that should take care of any missile splash.
would also take care with the annoying podkills in empire space.
rather then spawn the thing a couple of km away it'd be nice to give it a one off mwd bump, like an ejection seat to get it up to a few kms for a second or so. That way if your ships being hit constantly by missiles theres still a chance you could get podded but you'd only be in splash range for 1/10 of a second.
Mostly harmless |
GeoNoSiS
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Posted - 2004.01.21 13:47:00 -
[12]
These are all nice ideas, BUT!
all podkilling will die... no one will ever be podded if they insta-warp or are invulnerable for 10 seconds...
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(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world |
Admiral IceBlock
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Posted - 2004.01.21 15:08:00 -
[13]
i was in a Thorax and tried to engage a Apoc and BB (god knows why), the Apoc fired 2 Torps and fired its tachyons, when the torps was like 5km away, the apoc killed me with its tachyons, and since u eject when ur ship is dead and the ship starts to blow about 3/4 secounds after ur actully dead the torps hit the Thorax and i got poded by Splash Damage!!!
"We brake for nobody"
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Wizard
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Posted - 2004.01.21 16:47:00 -
[14]
I agree, somthing needs sorting on this.
I recently became victim to 4 players in ravens( corp1 ) who fired god knows how many cruise at me in my appoc, i knew i had no chance , couldnt align for warp cos of all the missiles hitting chucking me off direction, and as soon as my ship was destroyed i apeared as my clone.
Didnt even get a chance to try to warp in my egg.Not very amused when i loose 4 implants cos of this 
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.01.21 16:52:00 -
[15]
5-10 second invulnerability timer on pods perhaps?
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Cao Cao
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Posted - 2004.01.21 17:17:00 -
[16]
Couple of things..
1. Implants. A few people mentioned stuff to the effect that if you don't want to lose implants stay in 0.5 and above, la dee da. I agree, whatever, I don't give a rat's behind about implants. I've lost many implants, that wasn't the point of the thread.
The point of the thread is that Hellmar's proposed change IS TO ALLOW SHIP DESTRUCTION IN CERTAIN SECURITY RATING SYSTEMS BUT NOT ALLOW POD DESTRUCTION. If pods are insta-ganked by splash damage, CONCORD will be all over your ass in a hurry.
2. It will eliminate podding. Well maybe right now, but also in this DEV chat they mentioned that deep space scanning is going to be in very soon(tm) with elite frigs. That is, you will be able to scan a system and locate / warp to a person who is at a mid-space bookmark. Moreover, if you have a couple frigates in support of your battleship fleet, you'll be able to lock pods a LOT quicker.
Sure, podding with battleships is tough. Get a friend into a griffin with a sensor booster and you will lock that thing in plenty of time to waste it.
3. Solution. I like Jim's idea of a 5 second invulnerability timer FROM DAMAGE. Note that if the invulnerability timer prevents ships from begining to lock the pod then you have a problem. But yes, an invulnerability timer from damage is definitely the way to go.
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Admiral IceBlock
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Posted - 2004.01.21 17:49:00 -
[17]
yeah, 5 sec invulnerability is a good idea! would also be cool if the explosion of ur ship did some dmg, like a smartbomb...
"We brake for nobody"
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.01.21 18:06:00 -
[18]
It also would be more realistic if when your pod ejects, it's in motion. I mean, if you eject why is it sitting there stationary? Shouldn't it be like shooting out of your ship to avoid death?
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Mon Palae
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Posted - 2004.01.21 18:13:00 -
[19]
5 second invulnerability I think would be too much. They warp so fast as is that giving them 5 free seconds will see them all bolt before you can get them.
I like the idea of the exploding ship causing damage in say a 10km radius. Enough to kill any missile but not really enough to seriously harm any nearby ships much. That'd give any pod a 3.75 second window minimum to get a move on (and that time is only if an incoming missile was just outside of the explosion radius from the dying ship). Likely you would get your 5 seconds this way as a repreive from incoming missiles. Up to you at that point to move it or lose it.
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SwitchBl4d3
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Posted - 2004.01.21 20:30:00 -
[20]
disagree keep splash damage, invulv time would just make for no one getting podkiled ever.
if you actually eject before your ship goes down you will be 250m at least from your ship providing it's moving and miss the splash. thats providing your ships actually moving, maybe torps will get u but there hardly the finishing blow material. If someones in a 1v1 they'll fire EMP then switch to defenders and cannons. It's only when people blow there cool and activate every single module on a ship at that given time. thsi brings into perspective how many modules should you be able to fire at once?. but thats a differnt story, of course it would spice up battles no end.
"Teh lord of Nonni"
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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.01.22 01:28:00 -
[21]
I think the idea about your pod get ejected with speed is a good thing.
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Vacuole
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Posted - 2004.01.22 05:00:00 -
[22]
Hmm..
To me, 'invulnerability timers' are goofy, topical solutions when nothing else better has been coded yet.
They go against intuition and I personally think they should be avoided in this game whenever possible.
The idea about pods actually *EJECTING* away from the destruction (and splash of torpedoes) is great. Makes sense, and seems like it would solve the problem.
That alone would give the pilot a few valuable seconds to warp somewhere, instead of just frying in the intense splash of many torps and missiles.
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