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Julius Romanus Free Space Development Cartel	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:02:00 - [31] Even if I didnt like the changes, I'd like them just for the forum whines. That's a total of 2 thumbs up.
Tassi Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:15:00 - [32] rockets lvl V, here I come :) malediction > crow Originally by: fire 59 i don't know of any bobs that have cheated
Julius Romanus Free Space Development Cartel	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:18:00 - [33] Originally by: Tassi rockets lvl V, here I come :) malediction > crow 8 hours left for me :)
ZOMGchampion	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:19:00 - [34] Originally by: Tassi rockets lvl V, here I come :) malediction > crow Far from it. Erm, now, the dps from my current malediction is almost double what I will get from this! The dps from HAMLs is pityful, like 300 dps with good skills without resistance in the equation. Cheers whoever thought missiles on amarr ships were a good idea, now CCP can you please please make the zealot like twice as good to make up for the pityful sacriledge? And damnation, well I'll just not use it.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:23:00 - [35] Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit Originally by: Kerdrak Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit Originally by: Kerdrak Sacrilege is like a short range Cerberus, and I like it. They could make is both, it wouldnt overpower it, now 95% of the sacriledge setups will have this missiles, they will be so easily guessable and all a decent pilot would need to do is stay 15KM+. Not a problem with Cap recharge bonus and 4 mid slots... MWD, web, scram, cap booster FTW This is a nerf imo, I already fit that and do more dps with my lasers. No you dont. This change represents a 25-40% increase in DPS from the previous iteration with better tracking issues, more range, and no cap use.
dalman Finite Horizon	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:28:00 - [36] Originally by: Kayosoni Khanid mk2 gets my stamp of WIN. Yea... Except, what they've done now is more or less exactly what "we" suggested 2 years ago in the earlier remake of Khanid ships. But yea, GG. Am I forced to have any regret? I've become the lie, beautiful and free In my righteous own mind I adore and preach the insanity you gave to me
Gibbal Slogspit Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:45:00 - [37] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit Originally by: Kerdrak Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit Originally by: Kerdrak Sacrilege is like a short range Cerberus, and I like it. They could make is both, it wouldnt overpower it, now 95% of the sacriledge setups will have this missiles, they will be so easily guessable and all a decent pilot would need to do is stay 15KM+. Not a problem with Cap recharge bonus and 4 mid slots... MWD, web, scram, cap booster FTW This is a nerf imo, I already fit that and do more dps with my lasers. No you dont. This change represents a 25-40% increase in DPS from the previous iteration with better tracking issues, more range, and no cap use. According to EFT I hit 193 dps with 4 focused pulse II and 2 HAML II, which is my current fit. This dps is with scorch in which I get 28K optimal in this ship. Which is almost 10KM more than what I get with the t1 heavy assualt missiles I have fitted. With the changed sacriledge I get 181 dps, bare in mind I set the rapid launch to 5 to even this dps test out. The only thing you are correct on is the cap use, I have no problem tracking destroyers upwards with my focused pulse, anything smaller I cant hit, but also anything smaller wont take much damage from unguided heavy assualt missiles either.
Deva Blackfire Citadel of dark arts	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:45:00 - [38] Originally by: dalman Originally by: Kayosoni Khanid mk2 gets my stamp of WIN. Yea... Except, what they've done now is more or less exactly what "we" suggested 2 years ago in the earlier remake of Khanid ships. But yea, GG. Unfortunately thats true :S Still good to see those changes.
Xequecal	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:52:00 - [39] Sacrilege is now 205 m/sec speed, up from 175 m/sec. Think you could nano this ship up? That should allow for some sick speeds, and you don't have to care about tracking with the missiles.
Xequecal	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:54:00 - [40] Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit According to EFT I hit 193 dps with 4 focused pulse II and 2 HAML II, which is my current fit. This dps is with scorch in which I get 28K optimal in this ship. Which is almost 10KM more than what I get with the t1 heavy assualt missiles I have fitted. With the changed sacriledge I get 181 dps, bare in mind I set the rapid launch to 5 to even this dps test out. The only thing you are correct on is the cap use, I have no problem tracking destroyers upwards with my focused pulse, anything smaller I cant hit, but also anything smaller wont take much damage from unguided heavy assualt missiles either. I find it very hard to believe that 5 missile launchers with a double damage bonus are hitting for less DPS than 4 lasers with a single damage bonus and 2 launchers with none. You're fudging these numbers somehow, either running the test with maxxed gunnery and gimped missile skills, or accounting for damage mods in one instance but not the other.
Gibbal Slogspit Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:55:00 - [41] Originally by: Xequecal Sacrilege is now 205 m/sec speed, up from 175 m/sec. Think you could nano this ship up? That should allow for some sick speeds, and you don't have to care about tracking with the missiles. Unless its mass is less than current most you can probably get out of it is about 3K with a lot of isk spent. And if the changes were there to make another decent nanoship, then I am ashamed.
Gibbal Slogspit Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:56:00 - [42] Originally by: Xequecal Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit According to EFT I hit 193 dps with 4 focused pulse II and 2 HAML II, which is my current fit. This dps is with scorch in which I get 28K optimal in this ship. Which is almost 10KM more than what I get with the t1 heavy assualt missiles I have fitted. With the changed sacriledge I get 181 dps, bare in mind I set the rapid launch to 5 to even this dps test out. The only thing you are correct on is the cap use, I have no problem tracking destroyers upwards with my focused pulse, anything smaller I cant hit, but also anything smaller wont take much damage from unguided heavy assualt missiles either. I find it very hard to believe that 5 missile launchers with a double damage bonus are hitting for less DPS than 4 lasers with a single damage bonus and 2 launchers with none. You're fudging these numbers somehow, either running the test with maxxed gunnery and gimped missile skills, or accounting for damage mods in one instance but not the other. Sorry for the double post, but if you dont beleive me, try for yourself. Quickfit and EFT are stickied on the forums.
Xequecal	Posted - 2007.07.29 21:58:00 - [43] How exactly do I use these tools to test out a test server ship? You do realize that the ship's new bonuses aren't actually entered into these tools yet, right? PLEASE tell me you didn't take the old Sacrilege bonuses, forced 5 launchers onto it, and then posted those numbers.
Deva Blackfire Citadel of dark arts	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:00:00 - [44] Originally by: Xequecal Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit According to EFT I hit 193 dps with 4 focused pulse II and 2 HAML II, which is my current fit. This dps is with scorch in which I get 28K optimal in this ship. Which is almost 10KM more than what I get with the t1 heavy assualt missiles I have fitted. With the changed sacriledge I get 181 dps, bare in mind I set the rapid launch to 5 to even this dps test out. The only thing you are correct on is the cap use, I have no problem tracking destroyers upwards with my focused pulse, anything smaller I cant hit, but also anything smaller wont take much damage from unguided heavy assualt missiles either. I find it very hard to believe that 5 missile launchers with a double damage bonus are hitting for less DPS than 4 lasers with a single damage bonus and 2 launchers with none. You're fudging these numbers somehow, either running the test with maxxed gunnery and gimped missile skills, or accounting for damage mods in one instance but not the other. He is using ****ty missile skills. New sacri is EXACTLY same as cerb with kinetic HAMs (with maxed skills). Rage HAMs (qfit doesnt have faction ones... they are tad worse than rage) do 300dps with maxed skills. Faction ones will do about 280 or so (without ANY damage mod) Here ya go mr. "my damage got gimped". Your damage went up by over 50%.
Deva Blackfire Citadel of dark arts	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:05:00 - [45] Originally by: Xequecal How exactly do I use these tools to test out a test server ship? You do realize that the ship's new bonuses aren't actually entered into these tools yet, right? PLEASE tell me you didn't take the old Sacrilege bonuses, forced 5 launchers onto it, and then posted those numbers. Use cerberus for damage calculations. Just instead of putting "any" HAM you need to use kinetic ones.
Dristra Amarr Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:07:00 - [46] I support this change 100%, no-one can really complain, the old designs where half-assed... It's great being Amarr isn't it.
Gamer4liff Caldari Metalworks THE INTERSTELLAR FOUNDRY	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:17:00 - [47] As a producer of damnations I support this movement, maybe this will get the damn things to sell.
Selene Le'Cotiere Amarr I-Omniscient-I	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:18:00 - [48] Oh those ships are sexy... Long live the Caldari & Ammaran (Calamarran?) peoples. _________ "You will be a drone in the hive of an insane Queen, existing solely to provide the ship with needs, links in a chain too complicated for you to understand." - Story: Hands of a Killer
LeMoose The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:28:00 - [49] ive got 20m sp in missiles time to train amarr frig and cruiser 5 LOL
LeMoose The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:32:00 - [50] the rocket khanid ships will have horrible range problems
Tamoko Damage Unlimited Inc	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:41:00 - [51] Originally by: Gamer4liff As a producer of damnations I support this movement, maybe this will get the damn things to sell. Congrats on your new enterprise, Gamer. Tech2 amarrian ships finally becoming useful can only be a good thing. Khanid Mk-II: http://i13.tinypic.com/688zvjk.jpg http://i11.tinypic.com/5ycekb8.jpg
HayesDuSid Wits W.A.R.P.	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:43:00 - [52] Heh 0 to WHINE in less than an hour, wtg. I had a USELESS ship before, now I have a POSSIBLY USEFUL ship, this is an upgrade guys. Stop whining if its not uber, thats reserved for caldari/gallente and minmatar... Amarrgh might get a boost later (hahahahahahahahaha) that will make this make more sense, till then I appreciate a new alternative to the scrap heaps we call khanid in tranq right now. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24,000 bytes - Tallan ([email protected])
Julius Romanus Free Space Development Cartel	Posted - 2007.07.29 22:46:00 - [53] Originally by: LeMoose the rocket khanid ships will have horrible range problems T1 rockets top out around 10km without any range based ship bonii. Dual light pulses with scorch hit the same. Medium pulses around 12km. I certainly wasnt using beams on my diction, and I dont know any vengence pilots who were either.
DeadDuck Amarr Infinite Improbability Inc Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2007.07.29 23:06:00 - [54] Need to train missiles but... I'm loving it
bldyannoyed Un4seen Development	Posted - 2007.07.29 23:15:00 - [55] The new Sac is an absolute monster. 5x HAM II MWD, injector, web, scram 2x MAR II, thermic II, 2x BCU II 2x Aux nano pump If it stays like thats its gonna be a scary scary ship. And atm it gets a HAM DAMAGE bonus only cos any other ship would get a racial damage bonus to all turrets. Cerb gets 5% kinetic bonus to HAM, assaults and heavies. Sac gets 5% damage to HAM's. The Sac, if using HAM's, can pick any damage type it likes and suffer no loss of DPS. Sounds sexeh to me. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels and filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected])
Xequecal	Posted - 2007.07.29 23:27:00 - [56] I'd plate it and screw the active tank. Active tanks are becoming crappier and crappier. Small scale engagements are decided by who has the most NOS. Active tanks are crap in the face of NOS. Large scale engagements mean you get primaried by a large number of ships and an active tank won't save you. Only a passive plated setup has a chance of getting you out.
Gamer4liff Caldari Metalworks THE INTERSTELLAR FOUNDRY	Posted - 2007.07.29 23:32:00 - [57] Originally by: Tamoko Originally by: Gamer4liff As a producer of damnations I support this movement, maybe this will get the damn things to sell. Congrats on your new enterprise, Gamer. Tech2 amarrian ships finally becoming useful can only be a good thing. Well I wouldn't call it new, I've been trying to sell these things for the better part of 2 months, but thank you!
Dristra Amarr Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.29 23:32:00 - [58] The new ships just made me train amarr frigate 5 :) anyone know if they will be nerfed to oblivion before release? It's great being Amarr isn't it.
Tamoko Damage Unlimited Inc	Posted - 2007.07.29 23:33:00 - [59] Originally by: Gamer4liff Originally by: Tamoko Originally by: Gamer4liff As a producer of damnations I support this movement, maybe this will get the damn things to sell. Congrats on your new enterprise, Gamer. Tech2 amarrian ships finally becoming useful can only be a good thing. Well I wouldn't call it new, I've been trying to sell these things for the better part of 2 months, but thank you! trying to sell them and actually getting rid of the blasted things are two different things :) Khanid Mk-II: http://i13.tinypic.com/688zvjk.jpg http://i11.tinypic.com/5ycekb8.jpg
Tamoko Damage Unlimited Inc	Posted - 2007.07.29 23:34:00 - [60] Originally by: Dristra The new ships just made me train amarr frigate 5 :) anyone know if they will be nerfed to oblivion before release? Considering we've only found out about this like 12 hours ago, and there isn't even a devblog yet, anything official-sounding at this point is just heresay. Khanid Mk-II: http://i13.tinypic.com/688zvjk.jpg http://i11.tinypic.com/5ycekb8.jpg

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