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Thank you CCP Keridwen for the deimos changes on sisi

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Kagura Nikon Minmatar Guardians of the Dawn Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.03 10:58:00 - [61] Man CCP is really working now. They jsut need now to correct the Apoc (give it a role, give a damage bonus or give enough PG to fit tachyons easily). And make the bellicose be soemthign worth flying. If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Pan Crastus	Posted - 2007.08.03 11:03:00 - [62] Crappy changes, you could already have more than enough PG on the Deimos with Rigs (what are they for otherwise?). Why don't they give it a 125m¦ Drone bay and reduce its mass to that of a Vagabond as well ... this is a free post provided to you by a member of the EVE community.
Plave Okice Naughty 40 Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.03 11:05:00 - [63] Originally by: Pan Crastus Crappy changes, you could already have more than enough PG on the Deimos with Rigs (what are they for otherwise?). Why don't they give it a 125m¦ Drone bay and reduce its mass to that of a Vagabond as well ... Even as a maxed skilled Deimos pilot I'd say no to that I hope you're joking
Aramendel Amarr Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2007.08.03 11:06:00 - [64] That ship already exists anyway, its called ishtar
Khorian Gallente Excidium.	Posted - 2007.08.03 11:06:00 - [65] Originally by: Pan Crastus Crappy changes, you could already have more than enough PG on the Deimos with Rigs (what are they for otherwise?). Why don't they give it a 125m¦ Drone bay and reduce its mass to that of a Vagabond as well ... Drones are for Ishtar.
Cedric Diggory Perfunctory Oleaginous Laocoon Mugwumps	Posted - 2007.08.03 11:07:00 - [66] Quote: It's 205 base, or was last night on SiSi. Whoops! reading comprehension for the win... If that's the case, I fully endorse this change. Now give the Eagle an extra turret slot, and we're cooking with charcoal!
Pan Crastus	Posted - 2007.08.03 11:09:00 - [67] Originally by: Plave Okice I hope you're joking Obviously... As a Minmatar HAC pilot I can't even fit a tank or MWD together with the Muninn's intended Weaponry (PG issues) but if it was a Gallente ship, the crybabies would have got CCP to give it PG to fit MWD, dual medium reppers and 2 HML ... this is a free post provided to you by a member of the EVE community.
ArmyOfMe Exotic Dancers Club	Posted - 2007.08.03 12:21:00 - [68] Originally by: Jim McGregor I think I see the plan now. Nerf all the speedy minmatar ships, but boost some of the gallente ones so they become speedy, and with twice the dps. I figured the tradeoff for having strong dps was being slow, but seems that no longer should apply. Changes like these makes me wonder if the balancing devs fly anything but gallente. dont worry jim, in a week ill be done with minni cruiser 5 so i can start to whine about minni ships needing a boost as well
Kagura Nikon Minmatar Guardians of the Dawn Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.03 12:30:00 - [69] Man minmatar pilot whining on deimos new speed? this is pathetic!! Any HALF good vagabond pilot will still be way faster than it, and still have far superior range. A deimos vs vaga duel would end same end they always ended. But now deimos is useful for other things, since it can get close to targets pretty fast in gangs and pull some nice damage. If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2007.08.03 12:37:00 - [70] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 03/08/2007 12:43:39 Originally by: Kagura Nikon Man minmatar pilot whining on deimos new speed? this is pathetic!! Any HALF good vagabond pilot will still be way faster than it, and still have far superior range. A deimos vs vaga duel would end same end they always ended. But now deimos is useful for other things, since it can get close to targets pretty fast in gangs and pull some nice damage. You are comparing the wrong ships. Muninn is a better Rupture and Deimos is a better Thorax, so those two should be compared. I just had a look at those two ships at the test server. Deimos has less mass and higher top speed than the Muninn now. Also it has one more low slot than the Muninn, not to mention twice the drone space so it can field 5 medium drones (muninn can field 5 lights). Its also interesting that the blaster deimos has 10 km longer targeting range than the artillery Muninn, and Muninn gets bonuses to projectile optimal (instead of falloff which would be much more appropriate) but whatever... At least the Rupture and the Thorax is still balanced. Wonder when that will change as well. Originally by: ArmyOfMe dont worry jim, in a week ill be done with minni cruiser 5 so i can start to whine about minni ships needing a boost as well I usually try to stay out of balancing discussions, so I wont be whining much more after this thread. I just think the balancing decisions are wrong sometimes, but not much to do. --- Originally by: CCP Wrangler You're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, thats what hello kitty online is for.
Kunming The Coalition Of Buccaneers Mercenary Services	Posted - 2007.08.03 12:37:00 - [71] Oh man cant believe this finally happened, hope they also really implement it onto TQ. A big thx to CCP.. at least now if I die my ghost wont haunt you Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
Trind2222 Amarr Celestial Pillagers	Posted - 2007.08.03 13:03:00 - [72] Thank you ccp. I have invested a in deimos now.
Kagura Nikon Minmatar Guardians of the Dawn Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.03 13:05:00 - [73] Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 03/08/2007 12:43:39 Originally by: Kagura Nikon Man minmatar pilot whining on deimos new speed? this is pathetic!! Any HALF good vagabond pilot will still be way faster than it, and still have far superior range. A deimos vs vaga duel would end same end they always ended. But now deimos is useful for other things, since it can get close to targets pretty fast in gangs and pull some nice damage. You are comparing the wrong ships. Muninn is a better Rupture and Deimos is a better Thorax, so those two should be compared. I just had a look at those two ships at the test server. Deimos has less mass and higher top speed than the Muninn now. Also it has one more low slot than the Muninn, not to mention twice the drone space so it can field 5 medium drones (muninn can field 5 lights). Its also interesting that the blaster deimos has 10 km longer targeting range than the artillery Muninn, and Muninn gets bonuses to projectile optimal (instead of falloff which would be much more appropriate) but whatever... At least the Rupture and the Thorax is still balanced. Wonder when that will change as well. Originally by: ArmyOfMe dont worry jim, in a week ill be done with minni cruiser 5 so i can start to whine about minni ships needing a boost as well I usually try to stay out of balancing discussions, so I wont be whining much more after this thread. I just think the balancing decisions are wrong sometimes, but not much to do. And you are trying to use munin in a role it was not made to. Use it as a support sniper ship, taking out frigates and e-war cruisers. A deimos have no chance of being as effective as a Munin on that role. Munin is simply NOT a solo ship. Its a support ship. If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2007.08.03 13:13:00 - [74] Originally by: Kagura Nikon And you are trying to use munin in a role it was not made to. Use it as a support sniper ship, taking out frigates and e-war cruisers. A deimos have no chance of being as effective as a Munin on that role. Munin is simply NOT a solo ship. Its a support ship. But dont you think its funny that while the Deimos has the perfect bonuses and slot layouts for being a blaster ship, Muninn doesnt get anything to help it work as a artillery ship? If I were to design it as a perfect artillery ship, I would give it bonuses to falloff range, tracking, rof and damage. And I would give it 6 turrets so it has a chance of inflicting good damage from that range. Instead it has the usual crappy launcher/turret mix and not enough drone space to even use medium drones for defense. --- Originally by: CCP Wrangler You're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, thats what hello kitty online is for.
ChalSto The Galactic Empire	Posted - 2007.08.03 13:13:00 - [75] /me hughs Dash R and the Dev and starts crying... Thank ya man...thank ya... Evil will allways triumph, becouse Good is dumb
Kagura Nikon Minmatar Guardians of the Dawn Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.03 13:43:00 - [76] Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 03/08/2007 13:25:02 Originally by: Kagura Nikon And you are trying to use munin in a role it was not made to. Use it as a support sniper ship, taking out frigates and e-war cruisers. A deimos have no chance of being as effective as a Munin on that role. Munin is simply NOT a solo ship. Its a support ship. But dont you think its funny that while the Deimos has the perfect bonuses and slot layouts for being a blaster ship, Muninn doesnt get anything to help it work as a artillery ship? If I were to design it as a perfect artillery ship, I would give it bonuses to falloff range, tracking, rof and damage. I would give it good range. And I would give it 6 turrets so it has a chance of inflicting good damage from that range. Instead it has the usual crappy launcher/turret mix and not enough drone space to even use medium drones for defense. Why to falloff? Nonsense. falloff is for AC. Arties have range> falloff, so range bonus is better. Munin is excelent ship. the only thing it could have extra is move one high to mid slot. If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
ArmyOfMe Exotic Dancers Club	Posted - 2007.08.03 13:44:00 - [77] Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 03/08/2007 12:43:39 Originally by: Kagura Nikon Man minmatar pilot whining on deimos new speed? this is pathetic!! Any HALF good vagabond pilot will still be way faster than it, and still have far superior range. A deimos vs vaga duel would end same end they always ended. But now deimos is useful for other things, since it can get close to targets pretty fast in gangs and pull some nice damage. You are comparing the wrong ships. Muninn is a better Rupture and Deimos is a better Thorax, so those two should be compared. I just had a look at those two ships at the test server. Deimos has less mass and higher top speed than the Muninn now. Also it has one more low slot than the Muninn, not to mention twice the drone space so it can field 5 medium drones (muninn can field 5 lights). Its also interesting that the blaster deimos has 10 km longer targeting range than the artillery Muninn, and Muninn gets bonuses to projectile optimal (instead of falloff which would be much more appropriate) but whatever... At least the Rupture and the Thorax is still balanced. Wonder when that will change as well. Originally by: ArmyOfMe dont worry jim, in a week ill be done with minni cruiser 5 so i can start to whine about minni ships needing a boost as well I usually try to stay out of balancing discussions, so I wont be whining much more after this thread. I just think the balancing decisions are wrong sometimes, but not much to do. I have to agree with you that the muninn needs a buff, even tho i still feel its more of a close range ship then anything else. One of the problems with the muninn imo is that it doesnt have the pg and range to become a very good sniper and it needs better res all over to compete at close range.
Rastigan Caldari Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.03 13:45:00 - [78] Originally by: Jim McGregor But dont you think its funny that while the Deimos has the perfect bonuses and slot layouts for being a blaster ship, Muninn doesnt get anything to help it work as a artillery ship? If I were to design it as a perfect artillery ship, I would give it bonuses to falloff range, tracking, rof and damage. I would give it good range. And I would give it 6 turrets so it has a chance of inflicting good damage from that range. Instead it has the usual crappy launcher/turret mix and not enough drone space to even use medium drones for defense. Doesnt the Munnin get rof,damage,tracking AND optimal range bonuses ? Not even an Astarte with 7 guns has its alpha strike. It also has 5 guns the same amount as the Deimos. Nobody is forcing you to put launchers in those last two high slots btw..
Trind2222 Amarr Celestial Pillagers	Posted - 2007.08.03 13:51:00 - [79] Muninn Minmatar Cruiser Skill Bonus: 5% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret rate of fire and 5% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret damage per level Heavy Assault Ship Skill Bonus: 10% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret optimal range and 7.5% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret tracking speed per level
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2007.08.03 14:58:00 - [80] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 03/08/2007 14:59:08 Originally by: Trind2222 I agree whit jim fix this ship to add a turret slot remove a Launcher slot. They can remove all launcher slots for all I care. Launchers on a artillery sniper ship is like giving the Deimos less turrets and some launcher slots as well. They only serve to make the ship less focused and more difficult to skill for. Even though the Deimos will probably become very popular with nanos now, so maybe launchers would be perfect for it... --- Originally by: CCP Wrangler You're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, thats what hello kitty online is for.
SkyEstaLimit	Posted - 2007.08.03 15:39:00 - [81] Hell yeah, my Deimos finally can actually move ! He's gonna be good for a ride now ! And i finally won't get insta nossed to death with the NOS nerf ! Oh wait, what's locking me ? A neut boat ! /me can't wait this hits TQ To everybody comparing Muninn-Vaga to the Deimos ... Deimos nanoed orbiting out side web range will hit like a velator, but yeah drones will still hit, as long as no ones figures to pop em. Deimos fights at 1km in its role, Vaga fight outside web range and Munnin from far off in most cases. I guess it only figures it needs some sort of capabilty to fit defense. Also, the number of vagas and munnin i fought compared to the number (single) of Deimos i fought tells a lot. Thanks, make this TQ stuff !
oniplE NED-Clan R i s e	Posted - 2007.08.03 15:44:00 - [82] Originally by: Jim McGregor Even though the Deimos will probably become very popular with nanos now, so maybe launchers would be perfect for it... Nonsense. Why would anyone nano a deimos, blasters wont hit outside webrange, an ishtar can do the same job with 3 times more DPS.
SkyEstaLimit	Posted - 2007.08.03 15:45:00 - [83] Originally by: oniplE Nonsense. Why would anyone nano a deimos, blasters wont hit outside webrange, an ishtar can do the same job with 3 times more DPS. Exaclty, and where do you want me to fit the mag stabs with all those nanos stuffed in the lows ? =D
Abdullah al'Weyouni	Posted - 2007.08.03 15:58:00 - [84] Now just change the ship's visual shape to something less disturbing and everyone will be happy.
lyrenna Caldari The Renaissance The Makhai	Posted - 2007.08.03 15:59:00 - [85] good job ccp keep your good works going! === when you armor tank a raven god kills a kitten. ===
Eela Valu	Posted - 2007.08.03 16:02:00 - [86] Originally by: Trind2222 Edited by: Trind2222 on 03/08/2007 14:02:38 Muninn Minmatar Cruiser Skill Bonus: 5% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret rate of fire and 5% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret damage per level Heavy Assault Ship Skill Bonus: 10% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret optimal range and 7.5% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret tracking speed per level 3 Launcher slots 4 Turret slots 7 High 3 med 6 lows I agree whit jim fix this ship to add a turret slot remove a Launcher slot. Ehm. My Muninn is currently setup with 5x 720 Artys. It has 5 Turret slots.
bldyannoyed Un4seen Development	Posted - 2007.08.03 16:16:00 - [87] Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 03/08/2007 13:25:02 Originally by: Kagura Nikon And you are trying to use munin in a role it was not made to. Use it as a support sniper ship, taking out frigates and e-war cruisers. A deimos have no chance of being as effective as a Munin on that role. Munin is simply NOT a solo ship. Its a support ship. But dont you think its funny that while the Deimos has the perfect bonuses and slot layouts for being a blaster ship, Muninn doesnt get anything to help it work as a artillery ship? If I were to design it as a perfect artillery ship, I would give it bonuses to falloff range, tracking, rof and damage. I would give it good range. And I would give it 6 turrets so it has a chance of inflicting good damage from that range. Instead it has the usual crappy launcher/turret mix and not enough drone space to even use medium drones for defense. Dude. Have you ever actually flown a Muninn? I have. A lot. And they are absolutely phenomenal artillery ships. And what do you mean it cant do good damage? I would say my average volley damage with Rep fleet EMP M and 720 II's is between 1500-2000, against a tanked ship. And it can go from a 20KM alpha monster to a 130km Sniper just by changing ammo types. There is nothing wrong with it. Deimos on the other hand is just crap. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels and filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected])
Issle Gallente VentureCorp	Posted - 2007.08.03 16:17:00 - [88] Mmm. I knew there was a reason to hang onto that dusty thing. Some good blasters and faction ammo, and it'll be more fun on fleet ops.
Malena Panic Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.08.03 16:25:00 - [89] Originally by: Cedric Diggory The grid changes are needed, and a speed boost was too... but 220m/s base? With all those lowslots, you know they'll all be nanofitted. That said, better nanoships than sitting with dustcovers on. Quote: Your Heavy Neutron Blaster II glances off Monkeyshead <TRI>(Deimos), causing no real damage
DarkXenon	Posted - 2007.08.03 16:50:00 - [90] Originally by: Jim McGregor I think I see the plan now. Nerf all the speedy minmatar ships, but boost some of the gallente ones so they become speedy, and with twice the dps. I figured the tradeoff for having strong dps was being slow, but seems that no longer should apply. Changes like these makes me wonder if the balancing devs fly anything but gallente. Having strong DPS doesn't mean you should be slow, A deimos has to next to the target to do any dps, its got a weak tank and even weaker when you consider you need low slots for damage mods.

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