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Teeth
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Posted - 2004.02.01 18:35:00 -
[31]
Shia Dai sums it up. It's not that the ships are useless, it's just that their comparitive advantage vs some of the other ships gets lost. They don't even need to be made "better," just more unique.
The comment about the caldari ships being the only ones to get this right is also right on.
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Sqalevon
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Posted - 2004.02.01 19:08:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Sqalevon on 01/02/2004 19:15:22
Edited by: Sqalevon on 01/02/2004 19:13:18
The problem is Jim, Ships are replaceable
thats why everyone flies lvl3 cruisers.
But if people didnt have money in quantities we now have, people would be more carefull with what they fly. And might prefer a "lesser" ship above the high end ones, because when lost, it wouldnt make that much of a setback.
So basicly the problem is, why the hell do i have money to buy a Rupture for everyday of the week, not bothering when i loose one.
And not, why does this ship have lesser stats then that one.
I think i aint much off when i say 30% of EVE ( active members ) has one or more Battleship(s).
I think thats the problem, its too easy to make money ... catch my drift.
And i dont want to say, nerf all incomes, i say, the ships are made for a system where people would not have huge amounts of resources. This game will be alot more intresting of people werent so rich :)
I remember when i just started playing this game ( round the time the highway system got implemented ) My first Cruiser was a Scythe, I loved it, and didnt have much more money, so i couldnt afford a Stabber or even a Rupture.
I remember it as the fun days, where i still was amazed when i saw a Battleship.
the Cost/Stats isnt important anymore, cause Cost isnt a isue, so people just shop for the best Stats.
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Fester Addams
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Posted - 2004.02.01 19:59:00 -
[33]
I dont know much about the other ships but the bellicose actually is very usefull.
Most people go for the stabber over the bellicose but if you compare them and take drones into account then the bellicose is a better ship.
The bellicose has only gotten such a bad rep because all the problems with drones.
For mining that drone space should put it before the stabber be it mining with escorts (3 lasers and 750m3 of miningdrones) or solomining (3 lasers and a bunch of drones guarding).
For combat the bellicose is a good ship too as the 750m3 cargo as compared to the 100m3 of the stabber more than compensates for the lost turret/Hi slot. The bellicose also has 4 low slots (3for stabber) wich is very valuable for PvP.
In short, if the drones would stop doing suicide runs into missiles and spread out a tad the bellicose would be a valuable alternative to the stabber.
And it looks nice too, I love my bellicose.
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Ordo Abchao
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Posted - 2004.02.02 00:34:00 -
[34]
Arbitrator is probably the only semi usefull amarr cruiser for pk'ing.
Order out of Chaos |
Tyria Evenstar
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Posted - 2004.02.02 00:51:00 -
[35]
 Quote:
Ships should have more varied uses than just how much dmg/sec they can dish out and take.
I agree completely.
-Tyria.
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Isang Relow
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Posted - 2004.02.02 10:44:00 -
[36]
I think Ravens would look better if they had a left wing, or is it the right? cant remember, lol
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Denst Rowell
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Posted - 2004.02.02 11:06:00 -
[37]
i bloody hate sycthes
they suck.
herons look pretty 
but sycthed def. are balls
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The Return Of Denst |
Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2004.02.02 11:38:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Zyrla Bladestorm on 02/02/2004 11:39:58
Heron I believe actually has a lot lower mass than the condor (memory from testing them on chaos is that its one of the lightest?) so in theory it gets more out of the mwd than the condor in j0's example .. although no telling if/what they changed it to since I last looked
Scythes definetely aren't helped by looking like a flying vacuum cleaner imho :P although in theory it has the lowest sig radius and highest agility of any cruiser, maybe scan res too ?.
Belicose is also more agile than the stabber afaik, I think others already covered the other notable points of that
.
-----
Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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fras
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Posted - 2004.02.02 11:51:00 -
[39]
Arbitrator is my fave Amarr cruiser, it's great as long as you have the drone and missile skills.
Osprey, yeah it's very weak.
Exequror is possibly the best lvl 1 cruiser. Decent cargo, can mine and hunt ok.
I've had a couple of Celestis but never kept them long, I think it was just too ugly but any ship that has guns, drones and missiles is a good combo imo.
But forget the above ships, Augoror! omg 
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Zopha
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Posted - 2004.02.02 12:32:00 -
[40]
I loved my Exequror, mostly because the only thing I was a treat to was asteroid. It could hold twice the mining lasers my frigate could! and it could hold more drones! I started attacking Kernite roids then :)
Cool looking ship aswell, got a few "wtf is that?" Nice cargo bay on it aswell, it got dusted off an used for agent mission quite a few times.
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Agan Rafa
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Posted - 2004.02.02 13:14:00 -
[41]
Don't forget though that *in theory* these ships would have been exclusive to race - in other words if any of these ships were the only one of a type available they might see more use. Its just too damn easy to learn the skills for other races ships imo....
Carebear extraordinaire |
Rahzelk
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Posted - 2004.02.02 15:38:00 -
[42]
Quote:
Its just too damn easy to learn the skills for other races ships imo....
Totally agree
(elegance-corp.net)
Do not look where you fell, but where you slipped. |
Mrissa Easeah
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Posted - 2004.02.02 17:24:00 -
[43]
Well, for a beginner who's trying to stay race specific, the Heron's essentially a 'poor man's Vigil'.
Nowhere as good as a vigil, but they're so flinking cheap to make compared to the vigil, you could feasibly get into one 40% if you're just starting out, and certainly a lot sooner if you're not branching out your frigate skills to other races. Even now, I still sell a Heron about every other week, so -someone- must like them. Either that, or I'm the only one making them anymore in Eve, and they're being bought for completing someone's frigate collection?
Other than that, style's the only reason I can see an experienced player using a Heron, just to be weird - they're tinfoil terrors otherwise.
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pooti
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Posted - 2004.02.02 18:29:00 -
[44]
i had a scythe once..it lasted maybe 3 hours before i sold it. definitely useless.
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Lhyda Souljacker
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Posted - 2004.02.02 18:40:00 -
[45]
Quote:
I fly an arbitrator occasionally and have flown a few ospreys .. went boom pretty much right away tho :P
Exequror is the only lvl 1 cruiser that can use 4 turrets.. best noob mining cruiser.
From what I hear Celestis get used by some people.. can't say I know why.
I keep a Celestis around for agent missions and it is a fine ship. If you have say, battleship level skills, then go back to it, it has wonderful fitting. 3 250s a H-50 and a M-12 no problem. I wouldn't PVP with it, but it would be a decent hunting ship . . . also can carry 8 Hammerheads.
... That's when I reach for my revolver ... |
Kaylon Syi
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Posted - 2004.02.02 19:02:00 -
[46]
I like the Celestis and the Bellicose - I have both.
Bellicose is basically a Blackbird missing 3 mid slots and gaining 2 low slots. It also has drone space for 3 heavies so it has its uses. I used to camp gates in CFS space ,waiting for pirates to show up, with one when i first got Torpedos way back when.
Celestis is a decent hunter though I dislike NPC hunting to the 10th degree. Don't think its much use PvP except the fact it can use a Large Shield boost, 2 hardners ... 4 cap relays and fire missiles ( FoF cruise too ) so it has its rare uses. Actually, the bellicose can do that a bit better too which isn't a bad idea if you want a cheap cruise missile boat.
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Diana Merris
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Posted - 2004.02.02 20:34:00 -
[47]
I fly a Bellicose and a friend of mine flies a Arbitrator.
I've seen plenty of celestis in gallente space.
All of the lvl 1 cruisers get kinda neglected because it only costs a couple 100k more to get a much better lvl 2 cruiser.
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Naz Farooq
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Posted - 2004.02.02 21:25:00 -
[48]
I had a Bellicose for quite some time and rather liked it. Good for mining solo with the heavy drones for cover. I think the main problem is you can spend another couple of days and be able to fly a Vexor or Thorax, both of which are much better. The cross-training is something that really should be looked into.
The Scythe sucks tho.
Sure, everyone supports saving Einstein's brain, but when you put it in the body of a Great White Shark, suddenly you've "gone too far". |
Dreck Morrison
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Posted - 2004.02.02 23:44:00 -
[49]
I agree that CCP blew it and should have made training other races ships skills possible but at a 2 time penalty.
My first 3 cruisers were an Aurgoror. Can fit 3 mining lasers and run 2 basic mining drones. I used it to mine for my Omen and replacement augorors. Learned all the bad lessons about gate guns and losing ships to hard NPCs with it....glad I used a lvl 1 Cruiser since with insurance it only cost me about 1M isk to get back on my feet back then. Still have the third one I bought and use it for agent hauling missions.
Dreck
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Hanns
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Posted - 2004.02.03 03:44:00 -
[50]
i agree i think the Heron should be the bantam and vice versa, the bantam is soo but ugly, and the heron is sooo cool, shame the heron is a pile of ****
and the auguror amarr cruiser, i have NEVER seen anyone fly that ship on TQ, i have seen all the other ships u mentioned jim (only see n a scythe once lol), but the auguror is like WTF am i? LOL
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Ukiah
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Posted - 2004.02.03 03:51:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Ukiah on 03/02/2004 03:53:31
Quote:
I fly an arbitrator occasionally and have flown a few ospreys .. went boom pretty much right away tho :P
Exequror is the only lvl 1 cruiser that can use 4 turrets.. best noob mining cruiser.
From what I hear Celestis get used by some people.. can't say I know why.
The Celt is a fine ship, although the ship description is wildly inaccurate. It's 'usability' is the fact that it is the ONLY gallente cruiser that can use missiles. Additionally, it's the fastest base gallente cruiser, has decent drone space and decent CPU and powergrid (actually has more CPU than Thorax).
I ignored it initially because I thought that the Thorax was the cruiser to have, simply because it was the lev3. However, when I began farming NPC's, I found it ..... lacking. I bought a Celestis to experiment with and promptly lost it within the hour. Horrible setup. However, I bought another, changed the setup and I've used that ship for MONTHS now. I LOVE the ship. There have been several other people who sing it's praises and, although I can't remember their names, there have been a couple pirates and anti-pirates who SWEAR by it for cruiser pvp. One person claiming that he could use a well fitted Celt to beat a well fitted Thorax and had done so repeatedly.
It is NOT the top of the line ship. Howeve, it's inexpensive, it's flexible (that part of the ship description is dead on) and the fact that few people are smart enough to give it the second glance it deserves makes it the ship for me.
I've used mine several times to run blockades and have actually forced a couple BB's to find easier prey
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Sebiestor Jackal
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Posted - 2004.02.12 18:30:00 -
[52]
and look heres another topic that Jim is whining in AND once again not everyone agrre's with u includeing me these ships r not useless as explained above. u just need to learn how to use them stop whining
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**Free My People**
**All Amarrians MUST DIE!!** |
Ukiah
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Posted - 2004.02.12 19:26:00 -
[53]
Well, to be fair, Jim DOES post a lot of what I'm sure some people consider whining posts.
While it would appear that I disagree with him in this thread, this is an aberration. Most of the time, I think his criticisms are dead on.
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Jarjar
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Posted - 2004.02.12 19:55:00 -
[54]
Quote:
and look heres another topic that Jim is whining in AND once again not everyone agrre's with u includeing me these ships r not useless as explained above. u just need to learn how to use them stop whining
Give me a few reasons to use a Heron instead of another caldari frigate in the same price range, then.
Sure, Jim "whines" a lot, if you consider wanting better game balance whining. Not a bad thing IMHO and he usually does it right too - not the "I want it all" way.
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.02.12 20:07:00 -
[55]
The guy is a troll Jarjar, and not even a very good one at that, he's obviously under the age of 12, so why argue with a child?
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Sebiestor Jackal
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Posted - 2004.02.12 20:35:00 -
[56]
Quote:
The guy is a troll Jarjar, and not even a very good one at that, he's obviously under the age of 12, so why argue with a child?
its called useing m0o forum tatics Jim and u fell right into it not bad for a 12 year old i just want to get a rise out of u thats all. Jim expects the game to be balanced within a day or 2 but these thing take time Jim u gotta have patience relax dude you'll get your way sooner or later just like the carebears do
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**Free My People**
**All Amarrians MUST DIE!!** |
Bobbeh
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Posted - 2004.02.12 21:45:00 -
[57]
arbitrator is perhaps the coolest ship in teh game. I dont care about its useability, the fact that its rare and looks good make it a decent cruiser. decent drone bay, and can fit some decent stuff.
Mimiru > It'd be a tie, the monkies nerfed pooflinger wouldnt have enough tracking to hit the parrot orbiting him, but the parrot's beak is so small it couldnt break the monkey's fur tanking. |
Aldelphius
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Posted - 2004.02.12 21:55:00 -
[58]
jim, osprey is not usless, its a noob crusier. chap to get into, and easy to insure. Ive seen alot more of them in the past month than i ever had before.
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Atandros
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Posted - 2004.02.13 03:40:00 -
[59]
Quote:
i agree i think the Heron should be the bantam and vice versa, the bantam is soo but ugly, and the heron is sooo cool, shame the heron is a pile of ****
and the auguror amarr cruiser, i have NEVER seen anyone fly that ship on TQ, i have seen all the other ships u mentioned jim (only see n a scythe once lol), but the auguror is like WTF am i? LOL
I saw an Auguror in Luminaire the other day. I was half expecting to wake up.
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Sebiestor Jackal
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Posted - 2004.04.09 14:47:00 -
[60]
Quote:
Quote:
i agree i think the Heron should be the bantam and vice versa, the bantam is soo but ugly, and the heron is sooo cool, shame the heron is a pile of ****
and the auguror amarr cruiser, i have NEVER seen anyone fly that ship on TQ, i have seen all the other ships u mentioned jim (only see n a scythe once lol), but the auguror is like WTF am i? LOL
I saw an Auguror in Luminaire the other day. I was half expecting to wake up.
nice looking ship
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**Free My People**
**All Amarrians MUST DIE!!** |
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