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I have to ask.. about nano ships

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Jennai The Silent Rage R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.08.09 18:54:00 - [31] Originally by: Auraurious I did have many ways to kill nano pilots but then i realised... why help kill myself :P nano gangs are very easily killed or atleast stopped so they wont engage you if you go about it the right way, hell why dont you try figure this out, its not hard. they won't engage anything unless they know they're going to win, or if they're idiots and fell for an aggression trap (in which case they'll immediately disengage unless you can get them with a huginn), or if you've chased them into a sucking bubble with a smartbomb battleship sitting on the spot where they'll appear. the problem isn't with making them run away (this is not particularly difficult), it's holding them long enough to kill them.
Goonswarmalwayslose	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:07:00 - [32] Nano ships are cowardly and require a blob to take them down. Most people fit nano's so they can run from a 1v1 or 1v2 etc.. if they are losing, so the only way to kill them is blob them. People who are too weak to fight the opposing force usually fit them, so in that case why are they even there, they only do carebear kills no actual pvp. Just like Burn Eden they do run tactics... aka not pvp but carebear tactics. But at least Burn Eden will engage sometimes... most nano's just run first sight in trouble in local tbh. Like all those outbreak people.. cowards always run.
Tarminic Black Flame Industries	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:15:00 - [33] Originally by: Goonswarmalwayslose Nano ships are cowardly and require a blob to take them down. Most people fit nano's so they can run from a 1v1 or 1v2 etc.. if they are losing, so the only way to kill them is blob them. People who are too weak to fight the opposing force usually fit them, so in that case why are they even there, they only do carebear kills no actual pvp. Just like Burn Eden they do run tactics... aka not pvp but carebear tactics. But at least Burn Eden will engage sometimes... most nano's just run first sight in trouble in local tbh. Like all those outbreak people.. cowards always run. I believe the phrase you're looking for is "gankbear." ------------ Whiners - Unite! Tarminic - 25 Million SP in Forum Warfare.
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:19:00 - [34] Originally by: Jennai they won't engage anything unless they know they're going to win I hear this all the time and tbh is quite silly, nobody in this game is going to engage unless they think they are or might win. Of course there are exceptions to this. That's the whole thing, you have to lure them into a fight, now this is easier with normal setups as they are easier to force a fight since they are around gates. But more than likely a nano gang will engage every gang they come across unless its just insane... so guess what, learn to make your camp look not as scary. Two very important things I'm sure you all know, they are very cap dependant and have very weak tanks.Using these two things its very easy to stop a nano ship. Force them into positions and take advantage of this. _____________________________________________
darth solo Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:22:00 - [35] TRI alliance shockingly over use nano ships. i imagine this is who the post is aimed at given that u both fight eachother. in my experience all gangs faced against them have been nano. it just seems to me VERY boring and removes the risk. i honestly couldnt ask celes apoc to do this, it would just feel like, ermm cowardly to me. ppl are the problem in eve. d solo. RECRUITING... visit www.celesapoc.com ingame channel "celespublic" for recruitment or chat
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:26:00 - [36] Originally by: Goonswarmalwayslose Nano ships are cowardly and require a blob to take them down. Most people fit nano's so they can run from a 1v1 or 1v2 etc.. if they are losing, so the only way to kill them is blob them. People who are too weak to fight the opposing force usually fit them, so in that case why are they even there, they only do carebear kills no actual pvp. Just like Burn Eden they do run tactics... aka not pvp but carebear tactics. But at least Burn Eden will engage sometimes... most nano's just run first sight in trouble in local tbh. Like all those outbreak people.. cowards always run. Personaly i have to agree with a lot of this BUT that is because majority of nano ships you see arent specialist nano pilots. Corperations like Celtic Anarchy and Euphoria Released(dont quote me on the second) used there skills to fully pvp now dont get me wrong if they seen a nice raven npc'ing they would kill it but who wouldnt? it was also a good source of income. Everybody runs, if your 5 close range BS were aware of another 30BS gang coming your way wouldnt you run too? so really that point isnt worth much. _____________________________________________
ChimeraRouge Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:30:00 - [37] people who fly nano ships and use dampeners are the lamest pvper's in eve. They don't want to man up and fight up close with real weapons like guns. instead they use lame tactics like dropping fighters or drones.
Kagura Nikon Minmatar Guardians of the Dawn Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:44:00 - [38] And people that do not want to find a way to fight them and decide to fight using lame forum tactics are even lamer If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Hei'di Blood Corsair's	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:53:00 - [39] Look mum, I'm in a hydra thread!! Tbh finally I found someone who writes slower than me. According to what u r trying to tell us it must have took around a year to write the first post...
Jennai The Silent Rage R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.08.09 20:14:00 - [40] Originally by: Auraurious I hear this all the time and tbh is quite silly, nobody in this game is going to engage unless they think they are or might win. we attacked a 15-man gatecamp with 6, and they immediately jumped out. my corpmate, alone in a hurricane, encountered a gang of 9 (including a T2 BC) and they ran away when he charged them. people are so twitchy now that you can make what should be a suicide run and come out alive because they all ran away. Originally by: Auraurious But more than likely a nano gang will engage every gang they come across unless its just insane... so guess what, learn to make your camp look not as scary. aren't login traps considered an exploit now? and any other form of trap generally ends in them running away and you being unable to stop them, or requires excessive amounts of preparation and luck like the smartbomb battleship bubble trap. Quote: Two very important things I'm sure you all know, they are very cap dependant and have very weak tanks.Using these two things its very easy to stop a nano ship. Force them into positions and take advantage of this. if they get within nos range, they're stupid, and their lack of tank isn't going to matter when you're damped down to 10km and being scrambled by an arazu at 30-40.
Ellaine TashMurkon MetaForge Ekliptika	Posted - 2007.08.09 20:29:00 - [41] Nano nerf did work. Now not all close combat ships are nano ships. Now nano ships are expensive. My alliance has hard time killing very fast ships too, but I don't really see how is it unfair, they are way more expensive then our average close setup and they cannot really harm a gang with mixed sniper setups (which we don't use but if we did, they'd be shooting those fast ships at 180 km, even if not killing, making way less comfortable to fly around).
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 20:32:00 - [42] Originally by: Jennai we attacked a 15-man gatecamp with 6, and they immediately jumped out. my corpmate, alone in a hurricane, encountered a gang of 9 (including a T2 BC) and they ran away when he charged them. people are so twitchy now that you can make what should be a suicide run and come out alive because they all ran away. So you thought your whole gang was going to die there? Was there no other option to but engage? These and many more are all factors hence why I said there were exceptions. If you were 100% sure you were going to die and kill ntohign you wouldnt do it. This also goes with what I was saying about specialist nano corps, they will engage you, they dont use this tactic to run away from fights. Originally by: Jennai aren't login traps considered an exploit now? and any other form of trap generally ends in them running away and you being unable to stop them, or requires excessive amounts of preparation and luck like the smartbomb battleship bubble trap. who mentioned anythign about login traps? not having your whole gang in one place for a start having cloaked ships, not letting your enemy know what you fully have. and if you spring the trap at the right time they shouldnt be able to run. lastly what is wrong with preperation, you are trying to kill single ships and pods worth atleast 1bill(ish) Originally by: Jennai if they get within nos range, they're stupid, and their lack of tank isn't going to matter when you're damped down to 10km and being scrambled by an arazu at 30-40. Force them into nos range its easy to do if they are engaging you, and why not use them arazu in oyur own gang? _____________________________________________
Dez Affinity Caldari Ore Mongers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.08.09 20:44:00 - [43] Edited by: Dez Affinity on 09/08/2007 20:44:25 Originally by: Auraurious Force them into nos range its easy to do if they are engaging you, and why not use them arazu in oyur own gang? You don't need to go into nosrange for your drones to *****the other guy. Nor do you need to have a lock. WE NEED MOAR HOOOOGINS. _______________
Felony Assualt Nubs. D-L	Posted - 2007.08.09 21:09:00 - [44] There are so many way that you can counter a nano-gang these days. This shouldn't be a discussion about how to deal with nano ships because they've been around for so long.
Jennai The Silent Rage R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.08.09 21:14:00 - [45] Originally by: Auraurious So you thought your whole gang was going to die there? Was there no other option to but engage? These and many more are all factors hence why I said there were exceptions. If you were 100% sure you were going to die and kill ntohign you wouldnt do it. we were coming back from an uneventful roaming gang op, and the gatecamp was only two jumps out of our way. death was a definite possibility, but we wanted to shoot something, so we went in to bust it. only got to kill a t1 cruiser and a hauler full of arb cruise and t2 stuff because everything else ran away. Quote: This also goes with what I was saying about specialist nano corps, they will engage you, they dont use this tactic to run away from fights. and why do they engage? because they know they can run away unless there's a huginn. Quote: who mentioned anythign about login traps? not having your whole gang in one place for a start having cloaked ships, not letting your enemy know what you fully have. and if you spring the trap at the right time they shouldnt be able to run. lastly what is wrong with preperation, you are trying to kill single ships and pods worth atleast 1bill(ish) if they don't run when they see the gang entering local, they'll run when they see people warping in or uncloaking. any trap has too many points of failure to be worth setting up - they might not go in the direction you wanted them to, they might safespot and cloak instead of jumping out, the bubble might only catch a scout, they might warp around a bit before going to the gate and miss the bubble, your alliance might have idiotic standings that let blues run all over your space and feed intel to their -10 buddies.
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 21:18:00 - [46] Originally by: Dez Affinity Edited by: Dez Affinity on 09/08/2007 20:44:25 Originally by: Auraurious Force them into nos range its easy to do if they are engaging you, and why not use them arazu in oyur own gang? You don't need to go into nosrange for your drones to *****the other guy. Nor do you need to have a lock. WE NEED MOAR HOOOOGINS. well really thats to do with drones not nano ships in genral. and yes more huginn pilots, the peopel doing this are specialising in this tactic so if you want to stop them specialise in stopping them make sure your gangs are filled with hugin pilots. _____________________________________________
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 21:38:00 - [47] ill accept your reasoning on the first, partly because im tired now but as i have said there are exceptions boredom and the very much loved drunken suicide ops are in there too. Quote: and why do they engage? because they know they can run away unless there's a huginn. I wish I'd trained minmatar instead of gallente - not only would I have access to the HAC that outruns interceptors, but I'd also get the only ships that can reliably counter annoying nano gangs that constantly run away. no the reason they engage is because they are confident in what they are doing, hence why we engage even when there are huginns and rapiers present. and all recons can pretty much feck up a nano pilots day. but yes train for it, the ppl who specialise in nano gangs have spent their time training to do so, if you want it countered also train to do so. Quote: if they don't run when they see the gang entering local, they'll run when they see people warping in or uncloaking. any trap has too many points of failure to be worth setting up - they might not go in the direction you wanted them to, they might safespot and cloak instead of jumping out, the bubble might only catch a scout, they might warp around a bit before going to the gate and miss the bubble, your alliance might have idiotic standings that let blues run all over your space and feed intel to their -10 buddies. if you do it well and have people warp in/uncloak exactly where they need to be then yes you will get them because before the pilot knows it he will be webbed nossed and having plenty of dps put on him, especially for interceptors since you can pretty much insta pop them. and as for the alliance thing all I can say is join a better alliance or get them to sort these issues out. to summarise: even from your arguments you know there are ways to kill them, if you were as skilled at there as the nano pilots are in flying their ships im sure you would be killing plenty. (note im not talking about the everyday nano pilot as personally i think there are easy enough to kill) _____________________________________________
Maltitol Gallente Tides of Silence Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.09 21:38:00 - [48] Directed at Aurorious (apoligies for spelling) Let me ask.. what;s the problem with sitting in anything other than what your allways in? Is a bc too hard to pvp in? bs? t2 cruiser? basically anything without it being nano-ed? whether you do fly one or not, you havent shown it in pvp... why? this isnt a flame reply, dont take it that way, im just honestly curious.
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 21:53:00 - [49] Originally by: Maltitol Directed at Aurorious (apoligies for spelling) Let me ask.. what;s the problem with sitting in anything other than what your allways in? Is a bc too hard to pvp in? bs? t2 cruiser? basically anything without it being nano-ed? whether you do fly one or not, you havent shown it in pvp... why? this isnt a flame reply, dont take it that way, im just honestly curious. Playstyle Why do people lead allainces? because they enjoy it. Why do people do missions all day? because they enjoy it. Why do people fly nano ships? because they enjoy it. On other acounts I have flown bs bc cs you name it but I dont enjoy that anymore, its like rl you get spead freaks. Its the same in eve you get a certian rush from flying nano stuff. Another big factor which also ties in with the adrenaline rush is it allows you to fight out numberd, we have fought you guys a lot recently and it certainly has been fun mainly because you have that huge gang blinking red on overview yet using skill you can still effectivly take out some of there ships. People enjoy different stuff and this is what I prefer. _____________________________________________
Jennai The Silent Rage R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.08.09 21:55:00 - [50] Originally by: Auraurious to summarise: even from your arguments you know there are ways to kill them, if you were as skilled at there as the nano pilots are in flying their ships im sure you would be killing plenty. (note im not talking about the everyday nano pilot as personally i think there are easy enough to kill) utterly impractical ways to kill them that fail most of the time, and a ship that I can't fly. no one even bothers going after the nano-gangs any more, they won't fight unless they have 3:1 advantage and full intel and they're all too paranoid to trap. if you somehow manage to make a trap work, that's the only time it'll ever work, and then you're back to the only option being a bigger nano-gang or more huginns.
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 22:07:00 - [51] Originally by: Jennai utterly impractical ways to kill them that fail most of the time, and a ship that I can't fly. no one even bothers going after the nano-gangs any more, they won't fight unless they have 3:1 advantage and full intel and they're all too paranoid to trap. if you somehow manage to make a trap work, that's the only time it'll ever work, and then you're back to the only option being a bigger nano-gang or more huginns. As i said if you devoted your playing skill and trained skill as much have nano pilots to killing nano pilots im sure you could kill them. Really untill you do so and come back and say that it still dosent work you really have no argument in my personal opinion. If people dont go for nano gangs how did I have close to an hour long battle the other day? and yes whats wrong with more huginns, if you want to kill the gang set your gang up to kill it. _____________________________________________
Dez Affinity Caldari Ore Mongers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.08.09 22:21:00 - [52] Originally by: Auraurious Why do people fly nano ships? because they enjoy it. Because people don't like losing ships. Flying nano ships has always been a way of being effective in PvP and still having what it takes to GTFO and not die. That's why people fly them in my opinion. So I guess you are right, they enjoy not dying. Being able to not be caught reduces the risk factor (undebatable) You can nano a lot of ships, but not everybody can use Minnie recons. Personally I dislike the whole super speed hacs/bs etc. However, given the chance I'd fly an Ishtar and go kill some stuff, sadly I fly Caldari. _______________
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 22:29:00 - [53] Originally by: Dez Affinity Originally by: Auraurious Why do people fly nano ships? because they enjoy it. Because people don't like losing ships. Flying nano ships has always been a way of being effective in PvP and still having what it takes to GTFO and not die. That's why people fly them in my opinion. So I guess you are right, they enjoy not dying. Being able to not be caught reduces the risk factor (undebatable) You can nano a lot of ships, but not everybody can use Minnie recons. Personally I dislike the whole super speed hacs/bs etc. However, given the chance I'd fly an Ishtar and go kill some stuff, sadly I fly Caldari. I dont see it as that at all, since everything boils down to isk. Eventualy nanoships die and when they do that invested isk could have bought plenty of other ships to loose. Being able to not be caught does reduce the risk factor, BUT nano ships can be caught especialy if you plan/specialise to do so. You are right, not everyone can use minnie recons but everyone can train to use them so really it comes down to do you want to specialise in training to do so ot do you want to just sit and complain about it on the forums? _____________________________________________
Dez Affinity Caldari Ore Mongers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.08.09 22:40:00 - [54] Originally by: Auraurious I dont see it as that at all, since everything boils down to isk. Eventualy nanoships die and when they do that invested isk could have bought plenty of other ships to loose. Being able to not be caught does reduce the risk factor, BUT nano ships can be caught especialy if you plan/specialise to do so. You are right, not everyone can use minnie recons but everyone can train to use them so really it comes down to do you want to specialise in training to do so ot do you want to just sit and complain about it on the forums? I'm sure by not getting caught and killing people that are often defenceless, you make the money back up rather quickly (obviously snake implant investment a bit longer ) In my opinion one of the main reasons people use nano ships is due to 'blob warfare' heck we all do it and we are all a victim of it, people just don't like dying anyway. Would you rather have a ship that if attacked can be killed by a couple of ships or one that if attacked can mwd away unless webbed by a Huginn. Note: You don't always have a Huginn handy ;) I'm not complaining on the forums, maybe I am, I don't honestly know. I can't use a Huginn and it would take 50 days for me to just use the ship or something, then I need to be effective in it, which will take longer. That's a long time for me to wait just to be able to tackle a guy in a nano hac. Honestly though I don't care, if they don't want to fight, I won't fight. If they want to gank me then they might be unhappy when they get blobbed and have to log. _______________
Auraurious Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.09 22:51:00 - [55] As i have said it does allow you take on the odds more but even if it wasnt for blob warfare or anything like that im sure it would still because people enjoy it. yes i would love my couple of billion isk ship to withstand a couple of ships, wouldnt you? You do always have a huginn handy if you optimize your gangs/corp/allaiance. as for your last paragraph, thats eve, if you want somehting bad enough you will train for it, if you want to blob you will blob if you want to gank you will gank. _____________________________________________
Cygnus Zhada Amarr UK Corp FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.09 23:01:00 - [56] Originally by: Maltitol Every pvp engagement ive had the past few weeks are non-stop nano bs's.. I honestly dont see how honorable a nano-ship in pvp is.. you run away, pew pew, run away, pew pew and then i go pop (some of the good pops include booze ).. I just dont get it, is this the only way to fight now? what ever happened to real close combat pvp? It drives me nuts.. come here and face a real fight instead of doing 5km/s in a bs.. it doesnt help to insta-lock and multi web anymore.. the momentum of these ships is too much they get out of range anyways anyways.. if this is the case, then i will only fit nano bs's and screw everything else in the game :( so much for a real pvp fight.. Flame on............ Not to smack or anything but you should ask a few of your alliance mates, they're very good at visiting D4R and surrounding systems in afforemented nanophoons and similar stuff :) Welcome to EVE Online: Press 1 for Caldari, PVE Online Press 2 for Minmatar, PVP Online Press 3 for Gallente, PWN Online Press 4 for Amarr, Lulz Online
Maltitol Gallente Tides of Silence Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.09 23:11:00 - [57] Originally by: Cygnus Zhada Not to smack or anything but you should ask a few of your alliance mates, they're very good at visiting D4R and surrounding systems in afforemented nanophoons and similar stuff :) You mean our suicide gangs?
Cygnus Zhada Amarr UK Corp FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.09 23:30:00 - [58] Dunno about the suicide part, they do get some kills afaik (never really bothered by them since I fly covops). Welcome to EVE Online: Press 1 for Caldari, PVE Online Press 2 for Minmatar, PVP Online Press 3 for Gallente, PWN Online Press 4 for Amarr, Lulz Online
Chavu Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.10 00:20:00 - [59] Originally by: Cygnus Zhada Not to smack or anything but you should ask a few of your alliance mates, they're very good at visiting D4R and surrounding systems in afforemented nanophoons and similar stuff :) Lies! Oh no wait, he speaks the truth and is probably talking about me. I've even seen some enemy nano-BS popup after we started showing that nano-BS is not dead, I guess we are popular. I haven't seen any enemy get the exact fit down yet which makes me happy as it is a extremely nasty fit. It's very simple, I need to get in, kill a BS and get out before I get carriers or a mothership dropped on me (has happened before) A non-nano ship won't even make it to the target destination let alone catch anyone ratting/mining. 1-4 nano-ships are not hard to kill. Rapiers/Huginns, intys + ecm support are all fantastic counters. Now those 15 man TRI gangs with 5 vagas 5 ishtars and 5 curses, now that's far more evil. Now if CCP actually gave us the "tactical objectives for smaller attack forces" that they promised in Rev 2 I would have a fun way to start fights without using low DPS/tank nano ships. I shouldn't need 20 capitals + 20 BS snipers to play in 0.0, I need something to do while BS V and all that sh** is being trained.
The Cosby Minmatar Darwin With Attitude oooh Shiny	Posted - 2007.08.10 00:31:00 - [60] Nano ships are great for this game. They give us other ways of fighting than either sitting next to each other shooting, or sitting along way from each other shooting. I'm not sure if the OP has ever flown a nano ship before, but they cost alot of isk, and take alot more pilot skill to use effectivly than your standard f1-f8 pilot. Nano ships breath much needed life into pvp and i think they would be sorely missed. No other way of fightings allows a 3man gang of nano cruisers to engage a 15man gate camp and not only survive, but drive the enemy gang off with heavy losses. People need to stop moaning about stuff they do not understand and just play the game.

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