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Serpentis Task Force Destroyed by Capsuleer Forces

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Crausaum Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.14 01:26:00 - [1] 20:00 Hours, August 12th, Placid Region. Responding to a tip from Federation Customs agents capsuleer forces from Acheron Federation, Dark Star LTD, Illoren, Lutin Group, TAKAGI Corp, and The Cyrene Initiative intercepted a Serpentis task force carrying a large shipment of narcotics into the Placid region. During the ensuing battle the majority of Serpentis vessels were destroyed with one of the only only surviving vessels being a Serpentis carrier that was intercepted and held in deep space by the capsuleer forces while Federation Customs forces negotiated the surrender of its pilot. Upon boarding the carrier Federation Customs found the vessel to be "loaded to the bilge" with a harmful new drug know simply as RISE. The vessels captain was taken into custody and shall soon stand trial with the carrier serving as evidence in the trial. Although many of the pilots in the capsuleer forces were dismayed to see Federation Customs seize the carrier as evidence rather than put it to use in the defence of the region most agreed the Placid region is likely to benefit from the removal of this carrier from Serpentis possession and hope that this will slow the Serpentis Corporations unethical business practices in the region. --------------------------- absit iniuria verbis
Yarod Cool Team JAVELIN The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.14 02:35:00 - [2] That carrier is just a down payment on what Serpentis owes the Federation. And with all the pilots of the Placid Militia willing to stand up to these gangsters, along with the kind of force Fed Customs has been showing lately, Serpentis should just stay in Fountain. Placid should be for legitimate business, not drug-running.
Eric Lupanasia	Posted - 2007.08.14 03:15:00 - [3] From the desk of Eric Lupanasia: Well done, all, well done indeed. Strikes like this may not stop the Serpentis Corporation, but every sting they feel, every obstacle placed in their path, means innocent lives are saved. I applaud your efforts and hope that, in the future, I may be able to contribute to them. ------------------- "There can be good done while profiting."
Boma Airaken Yurai-Tenshin Zaibatsu	Posted - 2007.08.14 04:14:00 - [4] Congratulations to the Placid Milita on a job well done. I enjoyed flying with you folks the few times I was engaged in militia activities. Keep up the fight and I am sure you will overcome.
Mebrithiel Ju'wien Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.08.14 05:05:00 - [5] Have you wondered who's paying for the RISE? I doubt it's in Serpentis interests to flood a market with such a large shipment. Profits are made through market management on a smaller scale. I'd question who's buying the stuff... Good girls go to Heaven. Bad girls get drunk and pew pew everywhere!
Mithrantir Ob'lontra Gallente Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.14 05:20:00 - [6] Originally by: Mebrithiel Ju'wien Have you wondered who's paying for the RISE? I doubt it's in Serpentis interests to flood a market with such a large shipment. Profits are made through market management on a smaller scale. I'd question who's buying the stuff... We are wondering about this, but so far we have no substantial facts for suspecting a group or single person. Our objective is being fulfilled either way, the buyer doesn't gets that shipment (or the next ones, Serpentis be sure of that). ------- Nobody can be exactly like me. Even I have trouble doing it.
Thuul'Khalat Gallente Phoenix Wing Acheron Federation	Posted - 2007.08.14 10:09:00 - [7] Indeed, who the buyer for a shipment of this size must be a priority to find out, but for now however, we are pleased about if nothing else having kept it away from our streets and young. --- We are Recruiting!
John Tanashima Caldari Ekchuah Incorporated	Posted - 2007.08.14 10:59:00 - [8] Exceptionally, I wish to congratulate Federal Loyalist forces in this action. This kind of police action is both to the benefit of all, and non intrusive in other empires internal affairs. Whatever the other faults of the federation in Placid, it cannot be said that federal pod pilots do not help the people of Placid. With my respect, John Tanashima John Tanashima CEO, Contre-Amiral Ekchuah Incorporated
PiF Gallente TAKAGI Corp	Posted - 2007.08.14 11:04:00 - [9] Although Placid is not our main region of operation, TAKAGI Corp is proud to have helped the Federation authorities, for once active against piracy. "The power gained now by huges pirates organisations threatens every single being in this galaxy, analyses Shinji Takagi, CEO of TAKAGI Corp. For one carrier loaded with RISE intercepted, how many did the Serpentis pass thru the Customs hands ? And even that such powerful asset like a battle carrier in the hands of a known pirate and criminal gang like the Serpentis should be disturbing enough to call for more active actions against them. We are eagerly awaiting the Senate's response on this matter. A Federation like ours cannot rely on private corporations to enforce its safety on this scale." About Takagi Corp Takagi Corp (SDQ :TAKAG) "Manning Federations' outposts" is a privately-owned corporation. Led by its main shareholder, Admiral Shinji Takagi (Takagi Holding & Invest), based in Grinacanne, Tagaki Corp made a global business of 1579.5 billions ISK for fiscal year 23345. For further informations, please visit our GalNet. PiF, Director of the Nexus division Takagi Corp
Iyachtu Achlysiel Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2007.08.14 13:14:00 - [10] Impressive blow against the enemies of us all. Congratulations. Heads will roll in Serpentis organization over this one.
Marcus Xero UKCS corp Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.08.14 13:49:00 - [11] i was looking forward to some of that shipment, now im getting withdrawal symptoms
Anton Teg Political Warfare Executive	Posted - 2007.08.14 14:31:00 - [12] Curse you Gallente scum! Take away our Slaves and our Drugs! Whats next a quafe prohibition?
Fraction Nurse	Posted - 2007.08.14 20:29:00 - [13] Edited by: Fraction Nurse on 14/08/2007 20:30:00 ((oops...wrong character))
Able Citizen Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.14 20:31:00 - [14] I would not be the least surprised if some of the "honourable" agents of the Federation that reside in and around the Osmeden-Orvolle environs were the ones expecting such a shipment. During my indentured servitude to those scoundrels, requests were made of me by these agents for various illicit substances. That the substance known as RISE may or may not be harmful is of no concern to me. The hypocrisy of the Federation is the more glaring of issues, however. I would venture to say that the Federation felt using well-meaning capsuleers to capture a shipment without having to actually pay for the cargo was preferable to being exposed as doing business with the so-called pirate organization. Seizing a carrier was just icing on the cake, I imagine. To the capsuleers who serve those devils that sit in the halls of power within the Federation: Beware of the distant elites that pull your strings. Once you are no longer of use to them, you may find yourself on the receiving end of their political wrath.
Gorion Wassenar Caldari Tsurokigaarai APEX Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.14 21:47:00 - [15] Fantastic news. I don't think any law abiding capsulier will find anything to begrudge over this news. Well done. ----- results may vary
dutrev vilenia	Posted - 2007.08.15 00:25:00 - [16] congratulations on a sucessful mission, but a haul that size next time will most likely be more heavily guarded if they are willing to learn from there mistakes, as i doubt the buyer of all that RISE will be happy with the fantastic result seen here,
Nolin Riis Gallente Placid Reborn The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.15 04:56:00 - [17] Originally by: Able Citizen I would not be the least surprised if some of the "honourable" agents of the Federation that reside in and around the Osmeden-Orvolle environs were the ones expecting such a shipment. During my indentured servitude to those scoundrels, requests were made of me by these agents for various illicit substances. That the substance known as RISE may or may not be harmful is of no concern to me. The hypocrisy of the Federation is the more glaring of issues, however. I would venture to say that the Federation felt using well-meaning capsuleers to capture a shipment without having to actually pay for the cargo was preferable to being exposed as doing business with the so-called pirate organization. Seizing a carrier was just icing on the cake, I imagine. That is a very interesting take, Able. It would be a bitter pill to swallow if it were true. As of now, the only real sin I've seen of the Agents we've worked with to be pride, not much else. Never a threat, but always a thorn in the side.
Crausaum Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.15 07:28:00 - [18] Originally by: Nolin Riis As of now, the only real sin I've seen of the Agents we've worked with to be pride, not much else. Yeah, well that and the fact that they were real jerks. I mean when they hauled me in for our last "meeting" they didn't even bother playing good cop/bad cop. They just went bad cop/bad cop. By the end of our meeting they were just being plain insulting. I would love to say that what Federal Customs agents lacked in manners they made up for in efficiency but that wouldn't really be true now would it? --------------------------- absit iniuria verbis
Pytria Le'Danness Placid Reborn The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.15 12:53:00 - [19] Originally by: Nolin Riis That is a very interesting take, Able. It would be a bitter pill to swallow if it were true. As of now, the only real sin I've seen of the Agents we've worked with to be pride, not much else. I believe Able is talking about agents who hire capsuleer pilots for various tasks. These have been known to have various... faults. For instance I was frequently asked to transport slaves to various Caldari agents I have worked for. Complaints filed against these agents invariably got lost in the bureaucratic threadmill. Corporation RP channel: "PlacidReborn"
Ophichius Es and Whizz	Posted - 2007.08.15 13:46:00 - [20] RISE you say? Intriguing. Were any samples of the drug captured by involved capsuleers? -O
innot Minmatar Corp 1 Allstars Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.15 17:07:00 - [21] Interesting
Able Citizen Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.15 17:22:00 - [22] Originally by: Nolin Riis Originally by: Able Citizen I would not be the least surprised if some of the "honourable" agents of the Federation that reside in and around the Osmeden-Orvolle environs were the ones expecting such a shipment. During my indentured servitude to those scoundrels, requests were made of me by these agents for various illicit substances. That the substance known as RISE may or may not be harmful is of no concern to me. The hypocrisy of the Federation is the more glaring of issues, however. I would venture to say that the Federation felt using well-meaning capsuleers to capture a shipment without having to actually pay for the cargo was preferable to being exposed as doing business with the so-called pirate organization. Seizing a carrier was just icing on the cake, I imagine. That is a very interesting take, Able. It would be a bitter pill to swallow if it were true. As of now, the only real sin I've seen of the Agents we've worked with to be pride, not much else. Well, those scoundrels have become quite adept at covering their tracks, so my inference is not based on any particular evidence, but only on personal experience.
Able Citizen Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.15 17:29:00 - [23] Originally by: Pytria Le'Danness Originally by: Nolin Riis That is a very interesting take, Able. It would be a bitter pill to swallow if it were true. As of now, the only real sin I've seen of the Agents we've worked with to be pride, not much else. I believe Able is talking about agents who hire capsuleer pilots for various tasks. These have been known to have various... faults. For instance I was frequently asked to transport slaves to various Caldari agents I have worked for. Complaints filed against these agents invariably got lost in the bureaucratic threadmill. I don't know if I would characterize the desire for "illicit" substances a fault, Pytria. And "fault" is too mild a word for the blatant hypocrisy that Federation agents display. Serpentis Corp. is an easy target to criticize in the Federation; it's status as "Most Valuable Pariah" serves those Distant Elites in the seats of power that desire to distract their own citizenry from the malfeasance and lack of honor of their leadership.
Damith d'Estelas Gallente Strix Armaments and Defence Acheron Federation	Posted - 2007.08.16 07:47:00 - [24] The official news report: "Federation Customs captures Serpentis carrier in drug raid" "Si vous voulez la paix, prTparez vous a la guerre."
DutchGunner	Posted - 2007.08.16 11:06:00 - [25] Congratulations to all capsuleers involved in the capture of this load of drugs. I just wished i was there at the time but my capsuleer time for that day was over as i already crossed the safe amount of time to stay within a capsule. Good job anyhow, and hopefully i will be able to do my part in these actions soon! DutchGunner, signing off
Marie D'Artois Gallente D'Artois Legal Services	Posted - 2007.08.16 11:50:00 - [26] Originally by: Damith d'Estelas The official news report: "Federation Customs captures Serpentis carrier in drug raid" Funny, I heard something different than this report... Marie D'Artois Legal Counsellor Team JAVELIN
Mithrantir Ob'lontra Gallente Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.16 13:55:00 - [27] Originally by: Marie D'Artois Originally by: Damith d'Estelas The official news report: "Federation Customs captures Serpentis carrier in drug raid" Funny, I heard something different than this report... Funny is that we experienced something tottaly different than the "facts" of this report. ------- Nobody can be exactly like me. Even I have trouble doing it.
Damith d'Estelas Gallente Strix Armaments and Defence Acheron Federation	Posted - 2007.08.16 15:29:00 - [28] Originally by: Mithrantir Ob'lontra Funny is that we experienced something tottaly different than the "facts" of this report. Relieved to hear you say that Mithrantir, since both my memory and my ship's comm logs say something quite different to what's reported in that article. I'll stop worrying that I'm hallucinating, then. "Si vous voulez la paix, prTparez vous a la guerre."
Kovid Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.16 16:31:00 - [29] Originally by: Mithrantir Ob'lontra Originally by: Marie D'Artois Originally by: Damith d'Estelas The official news report: "Federation Customs captures Serpentis carrier in drug raid" Funny, I heard something different than this report... Funny is that we experienced something tottaly different than the "facts" of this report. Typical really. Even when both sides have representation in a news item, both will agree to disagree on the details fo the report. ---------------------------------- An informal Star Fraction FAQ \| ----------------------------------
Rhensom Gallente Scrutari The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.16 18:59:00 - [30] Such contraversy over ridding the world of drug traders! Clearly the free thinking individuals of Placid understand that we're ridding this place of a vile and deadly substance. One has to wonder where the naysayers motives are coming from. Perhaps we have confiscated your shipment and you want it back!
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.17 00:34:00 - [31] News reports being far from the truth is no news. I could refer to the completely bonkers reports from the Sisters of EVE's provocations against us, but I'll be careful with that. That said, I would not be surprised if facts are entirely other than was presented. Furthermore I must point out the rampant hypocrisy shown by self-styled advocates of freedom that would aid imperialist forces bent on restricting free trade of goods and services. You don't help any cause of freedom by your action, but rather show yourselves once again as nothing but a tool of the imperialist.
Vorada Kuvakei	Posted - 2007.08.17 20:11:00 - [32] Fellow supporters of Democracy. A grave injustice has been wrought this week. As already noted, a large force of Placid Militia pilots tracked down and disabled a Serpentis carrier. This carrier was the single conduit through which Rise was being brought into Placid. The entire operation was led by local and dedicated capsuleers, risking their personally-funded assets to finally bring down the Serpentis operations in Placid. These facts have already been announced. What is galling however, is the behaviour of Inspector Xavier of Federation Customs. Single-handed, he has managed to remove any trace of this achievement from record and replaced it with his own. Manipulating the supposedly free press in a recent news item, the Inspector has managed scoop the victory for himself and the Federation, leaving our message and efforts unheard. The public have the right to know the truth of this matter, and the armchair policing of Inspector Xavier should be exposed. Once again, elements of the Federal authorities have shown themselves to be the lazy, glory-seeking fops they always were. Countless lives, clones and ISK were spent unearthing the intelligence that allowed us to jump those carriers, and the Federation, in typical Gallentean fashion, is trying to steal the show. Shoran and I intend to present the truth to the Federation authorities in Luminaire on the 19th. We will form a peaceful procession at around 20:00 EVT in Stacmon and proceed to Luminaire, with evidence of the work that has been done out in Placid. Please, if you wish to lend your support, assemble with us, flying only unarmed industrials or shuttles and help make our message heard.
Crausaum Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.17 20:44:00 - [33] Edited by: Crausaum on 17/08/2007 20:44:58 Originally by: Vorada Kuvakei Inspector has managed scoop the victory for himself and the Federation, leaving our message and efforts unheard. Mr. Kuvakei; the Federation cannot steal a victory that was freely given by peoples of the Federation to the people of the Federation. You would do well to remember that it is not attention that you should seek in service to your fellow citizen but merely acknowledgment. Inspector Xavier has committed a grave offense against us in his attempt to claim undue glory for his part in the seizure of this carrier and that is something I think none of us shall soon forgive. I think many will attend your protest but I would advise you to pick your words carefully and make sure that your actions are in the interests of the Federations peoples and not merely for self promotion. Inspector Xavier has chosen the unwise path of valuing his own ego above the people he serves. --------------------------- absit iniuria verbis
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.17 21:31:00 - [34] While this is all charming, I am curious about one thing: will the Cyrene Initiative seek to seek... recompense... for these insults in any forceful manner - or are you limiting yourselves to words?
Yarod Cool Team JAVELIN The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.18 04:07:00 - [35] Originally by: Tatsue Nuko While this is all charming, I am curious about one thing: will the Cyrene Initiative seek to seek... recompense... for these insults in any forceful manner - or are you limiting yourselves to words? It's a disagreement over a news story. Are we going to start a fight over it? No, we're not the Star Fraction.
John Tanashima Caldari Ekchuah Incorporated	Posted - 2007.08.18 06:17:00 - [36] Out of respect for the police work done by the federal capsuleer community, and because this is an internal federation problem; I hereby propose a cease fire to Takagi Corporation in the Essence region from 1800 to 2100 EVT so that they can attend this protest without military interference. John Tanashima John Tanashima CEO, Contre-Amiral Ekchuah Incorporated
Karanth Gallente Cirrius Technologies O X I D E	Posted - 2007.08.18 06:26:00 - [37] If at all possible, I'll attend. This is too important to pass up. Free beer for those who mod my sig! There is only one sig hijack that matters, the orginal and only member of the hijack squad. me. -Eris. ps Black russians are better then beer. I'll see your beer, and raise you a goat kebab -Tirg I'll take that pint and raise you two -Timmeh I bet 2 goats, 1 pint and a bag of slugs -Lordharold I grab it all, cook it/eat and drink it all and say thank you. -Pirlouit I'll call your bluff, and go all in on 3 locks of Hutch's hair. -Incognus I'll see that bet, depending on where the hair came from. -Rauth pushes the other mods out of the way Mmmm, bree - Karass Bree & goat kebabs!!! I'm in!! - Yips IT WAS ME, MUHAHAHA. -Hango How did I miss free BREE!!? -Kaemonn always fashionably late - Deckard Better late than never! -Sahwoolo
Boma Airaken Yurai-Tenshin Zaibatsu	Posted - 2007.08.18 07:23:00 - [38] Originally by: John Tanashima Out of respect for the police work done by the federal capsuleer community, and because this is an internal federation problem; I hereby propose a cease fire to Takagi Corporation in the Essence region from 1800 to 2100 EVT so that they can attend this protest without military interference. John Tanashima A very respectable and admirable gesture. This kind of thing goes a long way when it comes to respect and credibility. Good work Mr. Tanashima.
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.18 09:21:00 - [39] Originally by: Yarod Cool It's a disagreement over a news story. Are we going to start a fight over it? No, we're not the Star Fraction. Originally by: Vorada Kuvakei Single-handed, he has managed to remove any trace of this achievement from record and replaced it with his own. So, your crew does a gig to stop the proliferation of a highly sought after item of goods "for the good of the federation" and whatnot. Then this Fed comes along and gobbles up the glory through some creative management of the media. All good so far? ...and after all that, all you're going to do is say "meh"? Are you people always that easy to roll over? Grow some backbone and tell that scheming Fed where to shove his lack of respect for your actions. (Or stay quiet and docile so they all know you'll be equally useful to any other corrupt member of the polity that needs a stepping stone on the way up.)
Nachshon Caldari Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2007.08.18 21:36:00 - [40] I'd recommend contacting the Scope. They'd love a story like this. Anyway, good shooting. If you ever hear of Serpentis operations in the Republic, or Serpentis working with the Angel Cartel, please contact one of the Republic paramilitaries. ____________________________________ Caldari by birth, Minmatar by citizenship. The True Meaning of Freedom
Verone	Posted - 2007.08.19 13:44:00 - [41] Originally by: Mebrithiel Ju'wien I'd question who's buying the stuff... The state the Federation is in, I wouldn't be surprised if half the Senate is high on the stuff to be perfectly honest. >>> THE BEAUTY OF NEW EDEN <<<
Crausaum Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.19 23:00:00 - [42] At 20:00 hours today Vorada Kuvakei and his fellow Illoren pilots were placed under arrest by agents of the Federation Intelligence and Customs Offices while attending a peaceful protest movement in the Luminaire system. Federation officials stated the reasons for this arrest would be released within the next 72 hours. --------------------------- absit iniuria verbis
DarkNicodimus Gallente Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.19 23:55:00 - [43] This doesnt sit well with me.
Mississippi Gunn	Posted - 2007.08.20 00:19:00 - [44] Troubling news from a government that places such value on free speech and different ideals. They are guilty of nothing more then many other paramilitary and pod pilots who undertake missions on behalf of security forces/navies across the cluster. How very hypocritical after Caldari paramilitaries stopped a peaceful protest, leading to the deaths of thousands via the destruction of the frieghter and the riots, for the Federation to arrest less then a dozen individuals attending a peaceful protest. I hope they have evidence for their supposed crime as opposed to asking us to "take their word for it".
Mithrantir Ob'lontra Gallente Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.20 12:19:00 - [45] Originally by: Tatsue Nuko Originally by: Yarod Cool It's a disagreement over a news story. Are we going to start a fight over it? No, we're not the Star Fraction. Originally by: Vorada Kuvakei Single-handed, he has managed to remove any trace of this achievement from record and replaced it with his own. So, your crew does a gig to stop the proliferation of a highly sought after item of goods "for the good of the federation" and whatnot. Then this Fed comes along and gobbles up the glory through some creative management of the media. All good so far? ...and after all that, all you're going to do is say "meh"? Are you people always that easy to roll over? Grow some backbone and tell that scheming Fed where to shove his lack of respect for your actions. (Or stay quiet and docile so they all know you'll be equally useful to any other corrupt member of the polity that needs a stepping stone on the way up.) Rolling over is not our way ms Tatsue and you know it quite well. But also we are not fond of putting more weight than deserved to minor events. The statement of Inspector Xavier was only a media stunt. He knows as well as we do that we keep the Serpentis drug shipments to a check. The people of Placid know that. We are not here for glory, we are here to help the people of Federation, not the Senate. Take your insulting remarks elsewhere. And i hope you choke on them. ------- Nobody can be exactly like me. Even I have trouble doing it.
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.20 12:35:00 - [46] Edited by: Tatsue Nuko on 20/08/2007 12:37:27 Originally by: Mithrantir Ob'lontra Rolling over is not our way ms Tatsue and you know it quite well. It's ms Nuko. And I contest that I don't know it. But either way, it shall be interesting to see how your Feds will use some dreamt up accusations against the Illoren to further cement the official picture that this little fed was that mastermind and hero. He's making a career on you guys throwing pearls around and not even getting a pork chop in return. But if that suits your taste, then fine. I guess. Edit: My guess on the future accusations is that the Illoren will be charged with drug trafficking. The irony and expedience of such a charge would be too beautiful for the imperialist to pass up.
Pytria Le'Danness Placid Reborn The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.20 13:32:00 - [47] I could not care less about his career and his standings within the Federation. I do not care for the fame and fortune or a reward. What bothers me is that the Inspector is abusing this success of the Placid Militia to paint a pretty picture for his superiors, a picture saying "All is well in Placid, we have it all under control." All is not well there. Anyone saying differently should fly an Iteron V from Barlequet to Orvolle and see how far he gets, or step into a freighter full of drugs and fly it to Intaki and see how many customs agents question him. If not for courageous individual pod pilots Placid would suffer even more. The Inspectors behaviour will cloud the eyes of his superiors and this cost many lives because the Federation does not see the need of the people in Placid. THIS is why I want the truth to be known. For all I care the Inspector can run for president on the wave of this success. As for Mr. Kuvakei, I am not sure if these accusations bear any substance or are just intended to remove him from the public until the affair has vanished from the public sight. I know no misconduct of Mr. Kuvakei during the 'Rise' operations and will do my best to ensure that he can continue his work there. I suspect however that there will be some show trial with trumped up charges to get rid of someone threatening the relaxed lifestyle of certain officials by pointing out the truth. So, if anyone can point out a competent lawyer, contact me as soon as possible. Corporation RP channel: "PlacidReborn"
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.20 14:19:00 - [48] Originally by: Pytria Le'Danness The Inspectors behaviour will cloud the eyes of his superiors and this cost many lives because the Federation does not see the need of the people in Placid. (My italics) While I agree in principle, one question on the nit-picky side: Would you agree then with the Federation in that the people of Placid do not know their own good, since you obviously agree with using force to prevent the entry of goods that are in apparent demand in Placid. If the people of Placid were to decide for themselves, it is obvious that a portion of the populace would use this "Rise" thing. Do you alongside the Federation consider your diktat about what the people need to stand so far above their own desire that you would use force and sacrifice lives to see the free choice removed from your people?
DarkNicodimus Gallente Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.20 19:20:00 - [49] Edited by: DarkNicodimus on 20/08/2007 19:21:06 Ms Nuko you once again in typical Star Fraction language twist and distort the dialoge into some form of bs that suits your views. Your comments are vague and can be applied to anything and everything anybody does.Having such vague principls allows you to twist anything into something that suits your own personal needs. A prime example is your goals(in a nut shell) about having "all pod pilots free to choose anything they want" , your use of force in any and all instances counter acts your own principles and thus makes anything you guys state mean nothing. We have made our statements regarding this matter and most pilots understand. The fact that you cant doesnt surprise me
Marie D'Artois Gallente D'Artois Legal Services	Posted - 2007.08.20 20:17:00 - [50] I am willing to take up the defense of M. Kuvakei and his comrades in all criminal and civil proceedings, including possible actions against M. Xavier of Customs and also against certain Federation Intelligence Office agents. I suggest that M. Kuvakei is a victim of the current government's heavy-handed policy against the opposition, in which they seek to crush our treasured right to protest their ineffectual and self-satisfying performance in office. In addition, this may be a case of inducement by certain agents of the government. I have contacted M. Kuvakei with a proposal, and hope to hear from him or his appointed agents soon. Marie D'Artois Legal Counsellor
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.21 11:27:00 - [51] Originally by: DarkNicodimus Your comments are vague and can be applied to anything and everything anybody does. Having such vague principls allows you to twist anything into something that suits your own personal needs. My comments are not vague. I have highlighted that you are being used by the corrupt polity of the Federation and stand quite willing to accept that without meaningful resistance. I have furthermore highlighted the fact that you consider yourselves the arbitrary judges of what goods the people of Placid shall be allowed to consume, rather than letting them have the freedom to judge for themselves in such matters. My principles are also hardly "vague", however your own comprehension of the simple concept seems to be so. The fact that you consider our actions against those that would see us restricted and lorded over by their own imperialist structures to contradict our own principles is a superb example of that. You comprehend nothing and that is no surprise, but it is also not the topic of this thread. The topic of this thread is the violent action taken by you and yours against a private enterprise that supplies sought-after goods to the population of Placid. It is furthermore about the fact that this action was manipulated in the media by would-be lordlings of the Federal hierarchy to make themselves look great, using your backs as a stepping block in his career without the courtesy of giving proper credit. It is about the telling fact that the (apparent) true organizers of this lauded event are promptly arrested when these glorious little protest rallies are gathered. As for our use of force against any and all imperialist - lordlings and minions alike - it most certainly does not contradict our principles. The very fact that they seek to restrain the free choices of their peers make them a valid target for any military action.
Able Citizen Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.21 13:59:00 - [52] Originally by: Crausaum At 20:00 hours today Vorada Kuvakei and his fellow Illoren pilots were placed under arrest by agents of the Federation Intelligence and Customs Offices while attending a peaceful protest movement in the Luminaire system. Federation officials stated the reasons for this arrest would be released within the next 72 hours. This is a very disturbing development; one that is likely designed to chill dissent. How many other examples of this type of 'jack-booted thuggery' need to occur before the Federation's facade of democracy is exposed for the oppressive regime that exists beneath the surface. I wrongly thought that this type of activity would be practiced exclusively by a Blaque administration. How much longer will the capsuleer community tolerate this blatant attack on freedom?
Marie D'Artois Gallente D'Artois Legal Services	Posted - 2007.08.21 17:42:00 - [53] Originally by: Able Citizen I wrongly thought that this type of activity would be practiced exclusively by a Blaque administration. You are defaming a good man and an able leader! This would not happen under a Blaque administration, only under Foiritan's corrupt government! Marie D'Artois Legal Counsellor
Vendrin Caldari APEX Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.21 18:11:00 - [54] As always, if any organization desires aid to help the Illoren, the APEX Conglomerate will be happy to offer it. _____________________________________ APEX Conglomerate is recruiting. Join channel APEXCOM for information!
DutchGunner	Posted - 2007.08.22 18:01:00 - [55] Edited by: DutchGunner on 22/08/2007 18:02:08 Originally by: Tatsue Nuko Originally by: Pytria Le'Danness The Inspectors behaviour will cloud the eyes of his superiors and this cost many lives because the Federation does not see the need of the people in Placid. (My italics) While I agree in principle, one question on the nit-picky side: Would you agree then with the Federation in that the people of Placid do not know their own good, since you obviously agree with using force to prevent the entry of goods that are in apparent demand in Placid. If the people of Placid were to decide for themselves, it is obvious that a portion of the populace would use this "Rise" thing. Do you alongside the Federation consider your diktat about what the people need to stand so far above their own desire that you would use force and sacrifice lives to see the free choice removed from your people? It's not about stopping the drug that much. If people want to buy drugs, that's their call. The real problem behind drugs is that those who are able to distribute it, will get total control over those who wish/need to use it. All that said and done i think that it was a good thing to intercept that drugsrun with that carrier. The only shame is that it didn't get destroyed to destroy the tool of the dealers and their bosses to control populance of placid. What i am about to say now is on my own accord and does not represent the opinion of my corperation or alliance capsuleer members. Should there be any attempt to resque the poor man who is falsly accused, tell me and i will do my best to help out!. Placid is in need of those who are willing to step forward to defend it, as so many just wish to benefit from it, or hunt the benefitters for the hunters benefit. Once again, this is an opinion of my own accord and not one from my corperation or alliance! DG
DutchGunner	Posted - 2007.08.23 17:51:00 - [56] I have done some asking around and i know the following: Vorada Kuvakei is geing held at Luminaire VII - Moon 1 - Federation Customs Testing Facilities station in the Luminaire system of the Crux constellation. I suggest that those who wish to show that it what happend is unacceptable will join me at a protest gathering outside this station on sunday the 26th of august at around 17:00 eve standard time. DG
Crausaum Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.25 18:34:00 - [57] Originally by: DutchGunner I suggest that those who wish to show that it what happened is unacceptable will join me at a protest gathering outside this station on Sunday the 26th of august at around 17:00 eve standard time. Given the total lack of communication from the Federation in regards to Mr. Kuvakei and the Illoren corporations pilots legal status I think our only option for the moment is to protest. I feel that legal proceedings the Federation are in order but I am unaware of how to begin such an action. --------------------------- absit iniuria verbis
Mericot Finweth Gallente Swords to Plowshares	Posted - 2007.08.26 09:19:00 - [58] I apologize if I'm butting into a private discussion here, but there is a matter of principle which I felt I couldn't shut up about. It pertains to the argument about freedom: (originally by Tatsue Nuko, of the Star Fraction Alliance) Quote: Furthermore I must point out the rampant hypocrisy shown by self-styled advocates of freedom that would aid imperialist forces bent on restricting free trade of goods and services. You don't help any cause of freedom by your action Quote: If the people of Placid were to decide for themselves, it is obvious that a portion of the populace would use this "Rise" thing. Quote: I have furthermore highlighted the fact that you consider yourselves the arbitrary judges of what goods the people of Placid shall be allowed to consume, rather than letting them have the freedom to judge for themselves in such matters. In an abstract universe that might be the case. However, free choice cannot be an isolated variable but must be related to a power context. In this case, on the macro-scale, the power that lies behind the spread of drugs is a power that would, if un-checked, develop into a greater hassle for freedom and democracy for the Intaki people than the Federation i. e. stopping the Serpentis Corporation and its supporters results in greater freedom for the Intaki people, since supporting the Serpentis Corporation's profits, would in the long run restrict people's freedom more than supporting Federation law. And on the micro-scale, the power of the drug to induce addiction makes it restrict people's individual freedom, thus restricitng the free choice of the person using it. Therefore it is a lesser evil to restrict the drug's influence, preferably by destroying it, than restricting people's freedom of trading with it. Democracy, in practice, is less about maximizing indulgent freedoms, than minimizing the influence of powers that would restrict freedoms unduly whether such powers are monopolies, drugs or religious fanatics. I believe this is the prime difference between anarchic ideology and democratic ideology. (originally by Dutch Gunner) Quote: It's not about stopping the drug that much. If people want to buy drugs, that's their call. The real problem behind drugs is that those who are able to distribute it, will get total control over those who wish/need to use it. Signed. In this case the cause of freedom seems clearly more served by restricting the power of the drug distributors than by restricting the powers of the (corrupt or non-corrupt) Federal Customs to stop the drug from circulation. Don't you agree?
Kormus Xaal	Posted - 2007.08.27 01:43:00 - [59] This past week I've been out of my "pod" for some much needed R&R, and I was browsing the holo-net, and found something quite interesting: Intaki Bank secures funding for Syndicate R&D program POITOT, SYNDICATE - The Intaki Bank has secured funding for an extensive interstellar R&D program, its spokesman revealed during a delayed Quarterly Reports meeting today. The project will be run on behalf of parent body The Syndicate - which was recently granted licenses to key astromechanical patents - and while no official confirmation has been given, most analysts agree it will be almost certainly focused on starship technology. I find it quite interesting that the Intaki bank has "Secured" funding from ... Now, before we all jump on the bandwagon stating this is mere speculation, lets take a look at the Intaki banks profits from the last year: Q1 -3.560% Q2 -7.131% Q3 -1.977% Q4 - 8.031% for a total loss over the last 4 quarters being -20.699%. After the announcement, the stock of the bank rose 5.17% in a solar WEEK. One question I would like to ask is: - HOW and WHERE is the Intaki bank securing funds from ?, who is the backer ?, there are some things slightly amiss here. This is not the first time the intaki bank has been up to no good. I expect more reverberations in the not so distant future.
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.28 19:07:00 - [60] Mr Finweth, You describe democracy as an ideology not about 'indulgent' freedoms, but about restricting what you consider bad or limiting influences. The problem is that you have to show that you have the right to enforce this. What gives you that right? The voice of the corrupt majority? What gives them the right? Nothing beyond the fact that they, by proxy of the apparatus of government, control the most resources of violence. The democrat is an amarr holder in all except personal power.
Nolin Riis Gallente Placid Reborn The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.28 21:06:00 - [61] Originally by: Tatsue Nuko Mr Finweth, You describe democracy as an ideology not about 'indulgent' freedoms, but about restricting what you consider bad or limiting influences. The problem is that you have to show that you have the right to enforce this. What gives you that right? The voice of the corrupt majority? What gives them the right? Nothing beyond the fact that they, by proxy of the apparatus of government, control the most resources of violence. The democrat is an amarr holder in all except personal power. By the Ida... Look, as any first year university student should be able to tell you, the concept of democracy gives all people an equal inherent right to an equal say in governance. This isn't about two wolves and sheep deciding what's for dinner. This is about a society using compromise and consensus to become a functional, just unit that serves every member. But wait, there's poor! And sick! And disenfranchised minorities! Not everything is picturesque and perfect in the Federation, so democracy obviously doesn't work in any way, right!? You may not be able to understand this, and I pity you for it, but accepting a government is the realization that you simply can;t be selfish about everything. There are trillions of people who have decided to pay taxes and sacrifice some luxury so that a poor, injured man has a chance at health care. So that the elderly can have access to medication. So all children can have access to education and have a shot at their own success. Cigarettes may not that harmful to others, but public smoking laws are something smokers must accept. In return, something else is gained. Like public drunkenness reduced for safer roads, or laws against noise pollution. If you want to argue the mistakes and crimes of the Federation (like imprisoning the Illoren), then be my guest, but your argument against the concept of democracy is ridiculous. Never a threat, but always a thorn in the side.
Pytria Le'Danness Placid Reborn The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.29 11:08:00 - [62] Back on topic, when will the charges finally be announced? Way more time than the legally acceptable 72 hours have passed, and the Illoren still are missing. I demand an answer, we are not a state where secret police should have the power to vanish people without trace! Corporation RP channel: "PlacidReborn"
Able Citizen Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.08.29 19:41:00 - [63] Originally by: Pytria Le'Danness Back on topic, when will the charges finally be announced? Way more time than the legally acceptable 72 hours have passed, and the Illoren still are missing. I demand an answer, we are not a state where secret police should have the power to vanish people without trace! Pytria, You are to be commended for your insistance. Oh, that it were an innate value of the Federation to conduct themselves with honor and justice...
Pytria Le'Danness Placid Reborn The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.29 21:22:00 - [64] During a talk with Inpector Xavier I was finally able to determine the charges levied against the Illoren: Quote: Inspector Xavier > No, Kuvakei is going to stand trial, as he rightly should. Pytria Le'Danness > And the charges being? Inspector Xavier > The machinations of our judicial system may take months, even years. Inspector Xavier > I have been informed that he was arrested for interfering in a Federal Investigation, mainly on the premise of furthering his own agenda to the detriment of the Federation. Inspector Xavier > Which, in laymans speak, he was using the Rise situation to cause unrest in Placid. Pytria Le'Danness > Oh? You could say the same about my activities there. That would not make it any more true, but you could say it. Pytria Le'Danness > I wonder what's your motive is in wanting Kuvakei stashed away so fast. Inspector Xavier > Kuvakei and Illoren have a history of this behaviour. Inspector Xavier > I am an officer of the Federation Customs, I don't presume to guess how the FIO conduct themselves. Inspector Xavier > I have of course, informed the FIO that Illoren were affecting my investigation due to witholding evidence and intelligence I could have used. Inspector Xavier > Which, I am sure you will agree, is true. Pytria Le'Danness > Frankly, the only unrest they caused was among the Serpentis. They put their lives and the lives of their crews on the line to destroy the drugs. Whatever they planned is secondary, because the only thing they DID was to stop Serpentis. Pytria Le'Danness > And again the same charges could be levied against any pilot of Placid Reborn. Pytria Le'Danness > I'm just saying, these men actually helped the Federation. Pytria Le'Danness > They helped US. Inspector Xavier > Pytria, a lot of pod-pilots behave selfishly. It's in their nature. Kuvakei was actively preventing me doing my job. : Inspector Xavier > They certainly were not helping me. Inspector Xavier > He will have his day in court, and if the charges are unfounded, then he will be recompensed for his time on remand. Pytria Le'Danness > Sorry, but what did you do? You scanned travelers in the Cistuvaert system. You neither needed help there, nor were there any Serpentis there. Pytria Le'Danness > The message you're sending to everyone here is "Help the Federation at your own risk, we will see that we screw you over in the process." This discussion has been slightly edited for readability and to remove irrelevant informations. Corporation RP channel: "PlacidReborn"
Crausaum Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.29 21:58:00 - [65] Edited by: Crausaum on 29/08/2007 22:00:05 Quote: Inspector Xavier > I have of course, informed the FIO that Illoren were affecting my investigation due to witholding evidence and intelligence I could have used. With some regret I must concede that the Inspector may have a point here. During its operations the Placid Militia did in fact recover a number of scan resistant containers from Serpentis delivery craft that were intercepted. In many cases the containers were handed over to Mr. Kuvakei under the assumption that he would would remand them to Federal custody to assist in bringing the Serpentis pilots to justice. What actually happened to these containers remains a mystery as it seems they were never delivered to any Federal authorities and failing that Mr. Kuvakei never mentioned what he was doing with these containers. As much as the events surrounding this operation have soured my opinion of civil servants interpersonal skills I am slowly being forced to conclude (and concede) that the Federal Customs and Intelligence agents may indeed have had a very solid reason for their arrest of the Illoren pilots. --------------------------- absit iniuria verbis
Pytria Le'Danness Placid Reborn The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.08.31 20:16:00 - [66] Originally by: Crausaum Edited by: Crausaum on 29/08/2007 22:00:05 ... I am slowly being forced to conclude (and concede) that the Federal Customs and Intelligence agents may indeed have had a very solid reason for their arrest of the Illoren pilots. I heartily disagree. If they are guilty of that "crime" everyone who ever fixed his tax report slightly needs to be classed an enemy of the state and be prosecuted by the FIO. In fact if the containers are the reason for the arrest, I think there are still some in the Placid Reborn hangars somewhere that we never delivered to Customs. Even if M. Kuvakei were to be a Caldari spy who infiltrated the Serpentis, instigated the Rise freights and then appeared to save the day to earn our trust to later sell our loved ones to Sansha Slavers there is still one small detail missing: A proof. Last I checked the Federation justice system operated on the principle that everyone is innocent until his guilt has been proven. This little detail is still missing from all the conversations revolving around the matter. The arrest of the Illoren smacks of a "let's arrest them and hope we find some sort of proof later" and thus appears highly illegal to me. It is a behaviour highly unbecoming of the Federation which after all is supposed to be a better and fairer place than the other Empires. Corporation RP channel: "PlacidReborn"
Mericot Finweth Gallente Swords to Plowshares	Posted - 2007.09.01 13:52:00 - [67] Actually, Ms Le'Danness is right. Regardless of crime, the accused is supposed to have due process and a fair trial which among other things means that he is not to be held without evidence being presented to him at a public hearing, I think, though I'm not a lawyer. Every schoolboy in the Federation knows this is one of the basic civil rights of the Federation. I'd say the Federal Intelligence Office seems to have messed up. My Placid Senator will hear about this, you can be sure. As for the argument with Ms Nuko, (see above), you seem to fail to see the difference between a nation's constituting moment and its constituent history. During a constituting moment all nations, even democratic ones, are dependent on violence. All nations (except perhaps a mythical 'original nation') were formed by killing or subjugating the previous powerholders whether these were nobles or savages. Democracy is only a form of government under a constitution - the original establishment of that constitution is not covered by the constitution itself. It was by all evidence a violent act and any radical change in it would have to be a through revolution. Personally I'd like this to be different - though democracy never included non-violence as a constituting principle. However, critisizing democracy for being violent is sort of beside the point. The difference between democracy and Amarrian law is - as you so poignantly pointed out - one of personal power - power in the Federation is not personal but is contained within the concept of office-holding. It is one of the essential cornerstones of representative democracy. Confusion of personal power and the power of one's office is a common form of corruption and as such illegal in the Federation, though I suppose the question would not even be a question in Amarr. And as to your last point i.e. what gives me or a corrupt majority the right to decide for others what is right for them it is simply a case of sovereignity. In the Federation, Federation law and democracy is sovereign. I am sure anarchic law has a similar position somewhere in this vast universe where Star Fraction laws are sovereign and you can live your life as you see fit. And yes, sovereignity is a matter of violence, in this case the violence of the Federation Navy and Concord. This is certainly not the case in most of the null-sec part of space where you will find no interference for using RISE or other drugs if that is to your liking, though I'm sure you'd have to ask whatever alliance that is currently holding sovereignity whether you can snort or not. Or perhaps you'd prefer to challenge Federation sovereignity in Placid in order to use the drug there? If you win then you will get to decide for others what is right for them - having access to RISE or not having access to RISE - even if your choice is one of non-involvement...because doing nothing is also doing something...there is no freedom without a reference to power. It's just a question of which power you choose to refer to. To sum up, I agree with your reasoning, Ms Nuko, I just draw a different conclusion, that democracy is based on violence is not in any way a reason to declare it hypocritical nor give it up as an obsolete form of government. Au contraire, self-preservation and self-defence, and the recognition of other's need of sovereignity, as well as one's own, is a basis for existence. Once that is recognized, violently or not, ideologies like anarchy, fascism or democracy come into the playing field. And, back on topic, as a citizen of the Federation, I demand that the evidence against the Illoren is presented or he is set free immediately.
Mithrantir Ob'lontra Gallente Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2007.09.02 11:13:00 - [68] Edited by: Mithrantir Ob''lontra on 02/09/2007 11:13:41 Originally by: Mericot Finweth Actually, Ms Le'Danness is right. Regardless of crime, the accused is supposed to have due process and a fair trial which among other things means that he is not to be held without evidence being presented to him at a public hearing, I think, though I'm not a lawyer. Every schoolboy in the Federation knows this is one of the basic civil rights of the Federation. I'd say the Federal Intelligence Office seems to have messed up. My Placid Senator will hear about this, you can be sure. words And, back on topic, as a citizen of the Federation, I demand that the evidence against the Illoren is presented or he is set free immediately. Mr Finweth, first of all as you have said you are not a lawyer. Illoren were kept to custody and not standing a trial out of the blue. They were being investigated and questioned by FIO. That constitutes a preliminary inquiry, which as far as i know in my limited knowledge of the law, is prohibited (and in fact is punishable by the law) to be given to public. So let's not break the law we are supposedly trying to impose on others, no? Also i would like to direct your eyes to this statement. I guess you will see that Mr Kuvakei and his comrades had a different point of view to their innocence after all, since they made a bargain for their freedom. I am willing to bet that there were some dealing under the table also and that things were never as bad as it seemed. Anyway Illoren are free now to roam in space (except Gallente Federation i persume) and i wish them to always have a great time. It was an honor to fly alongside with them, and the cause was a worthy one. ------- Nobody can be exactly like me. Even I have trouble doing it.
Olshan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.02 11:18:00 - [69] Well, as long as they throw the book at Sylvaine Ouvrard, I suppose it'll work out fair enough.
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.09.05 11:30:00 - [70] Originally by: Mericot Finweth As for the argument with Ms Nuko, (see above), you seem to fail to see the difference between a nation's constituting moment and its constituent history. During a constituting moment all nations, even democratic ones, are dependent on violence. All nations (except perhaps a mythical 'original nation') were formed by killing or subjugating the previous powerholders whether these were nobles or savages. You offer this as a step to defending the legitimacy of your government? The fact that a government can only be put in place through violence? There really is no comment possible, other than that you only reinforce my argument. Originally by: Mericot Finweth Personally I'd like this to be different - though democracy never included non-violence as a constituting principle. A shining example of the deplorable complacency of democrats of our era. You want something that is in contradiction with your selected social structure, but you don't want to change it because for some reason that social structure is given higher priority than what you consider right and just? I find myself completely unable to understand the rationale. Originally by: Mericot Finweth The difference between democracy and Amarrian law is - as you so poignantly pointed out - one of personal power - power in the Federation is not personal but is contained within the concept of office-holding. It is one of the essential cornerstones of representative democracy. So if I live in a democracy I should be consoled by the fact that if I am thrown into prison or otherwise deprived of my liberty, it is done through an office given to someone through the votes of the corrupt majority? No. There is no difference in the violence used against me whether it be by mandate of "office" or mandate of inherited power. The violence is the same, and I - and all victims of this oppression - are equally justified in responding to the violence through any and all actions of self-defence that are found necessary. There is no difference, because in both cases there are people harboring the notion that they have power over me by right, and that this power can be justly executed to restrict me and, ludicrously, that I should be considered even more a criminal if I have the nerve to actually defend myself. Such is the situation of the people of placid today. It remains apparent that many of them desire a good that their corrupt majority has decided that they should not be allowed to consume, because this majority feels themselves to be superiors in deciding what is good for their fellow citizens. If you are a democrat, you have taken upon yourself the right to dictate over others, and taken claim to the right of violent punishment against those that only wish to do what they consider to be in their interests. In this, there is no fundamental difference between the democrat and the Holder as both presume to rule others. Originally by: Mericot Finweth In the Federation, Federation law and democracy is sovereign. I am sure anarchic law has a similar position somewhere in this vast universe where Star Fraction laws are sovereign and you can live your life as you see fit. Yes, yes, democracy is "sovereign" in the Federation. That exactly is the problem! Dissidence is met with violence! Indulgence in pleasures the majority dislikes is met with violence! Non-violent behaviours not pleasing to the majority's sense of good private conduct is met with violence! And, indeed, any wish to seceed from the Federation when a group of people no longer desires to live under the corrupt majority is met with violence, up to and including planetary bombardment targeting civilian centres of habitation.
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.09.05 11:31:00 - [71] As for "anarchic law", the hilarious oxymoron aside, the principle is quite simple: Initiation of force or coercion is the only taboo, and as such it can be justly met with defensive force. In this, you can see, that the concept of a non-violent society really does require an absense of government, because any government is by itself a structure perpetuating violence. If you desire to live a non-violent life with no petty lordlings coercing you to fit their wishes, you must bu necessity start with rejecting the concept of government. Aspirations to restrict violence under the guise of government of any sort is fraud, nothing else, and should be met as such by those that truly desire their freedom.
Lyzra Amarr Peregrine Guidance Systems Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.06 23:14:00 - [72] Even as I am no citizen of the Gallente Federation, nor respect it much. Regardless of my own personal views it is also good to hear that at least there is.... some attempts to clear the skies from those that profit from the distributed misery of narcotics. It is a task for any loyal citizens to cleanse those succumbing to vice from they societies to life well without taint of it, nor it being forced upon the people. I applaud the good and hard work of removing the criminals.

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