Originally by: SchirmerN

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Edited by: SchirmerN on 23/08/2007 11:18:12

Originally by: DarthMopp

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Fact is that salvage is often more valuable then Mission Salary+Bonus+Loot together.

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Thats because you do crapy missions in carebear high sec.
Try lowsec where you also can kill whoever get in your sight.

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Originally by: CCP Prism X

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I see my example of car-jacking VS car-graveyard has confused some of you to the point where you totally overlook my recyclable soda-can scavenger example. I should probably stop using metaphors and write in pure logic implications instead.

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Originally by: CCP Prism X

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Ah but you're not in your garden. You're on the street. Your garden would be your corps station whereas empire deepspace pockets belong to empires, not you.

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Originally by: Tethraa KaiSuun

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If you loot someone elses wreck that you do not have permission to, you are flagged criminal.

If you salvage someone elses wreck, regardless of permission, you will not be flagged. Currently, you can salvage anyone elses wreck at anytime, any where regardless of permissions.

When someone salvages the wreck, if there was anying in the wreck at the time (other than the salvage), the wreck is converted into a cargo can after a successful salvage and follows normal rules.

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Originally by: Bart Roberts

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Originally by: DarthMopp

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As it is the same thing...you may get shot for looting 100 50CapBooster and not for salvaging trit-bars (300000 isk min. each).

Oh....and by the way...take concord away from every system lower then 1.0. So the new players can learn in 1.0 and the rest can smash each others heads in lower systems. As you know its a cruel world out there......

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Thanks Darth, you have jogged something in my mind. I now know another reason why comparing the loot in the can with the salvageable components in the wreck is like comparing apples and oranges ...

On the one hand, loot just sits there in the can, viewable to all without any skill whatsoever required. With hardly any effort, the owner can look inside and quickly decide whether it's worth taking. A potential loot thief can do the same: he can look, but will only get flagged if he takes.

On the other hand, no one even knows if there are any salvageable components in the wreck until a salvager is used and sometimes several attempts made. Even an Angels Battleship can turn out to be a dud, whereas a tiny frigate could have a couple of trit bars or melted consoles if you're super lucky. But killing the rat does not grant the shooter any inside knowledge about the value of the salvage: only using a salvager reveals this knowledge.

So:

loot = items first made accessible by -- and whose value is first revealed by -- the shooter who uses the tools and skills required for that particular job (pew pew)

salvage = items first made accessible by, and whose value is first revealed by, the salvager using the tools and skills required for that particular job (rip yank tear crowbar)

But! you cry. Without wrecks, there would be no salvage! Sorry to burst your bubble, but you are just god's agent in this case. Ashes to ashes, etc etc. Someone's got to populate the universe with wrecks because they are the salvage-component-containing "asteroids" of this game. But wrecks appearing out of nothing wouldn't be very immersive, now would they?

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Quote:

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1) not everyone has salvaging, so they leave wrecks floating and someone else comes to clean it up - it's irritating for those people to get flagged when really there's no need.

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Originally by: Bart Roberts

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Edited by: Bart Roberts on 24/08/2007 13:00:59
Edited by: Bart Roberts on 24/08/2007 13:00:08

Originally by: Tethraa KaiSuun

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Edited by: Tethraa KaiSuun on 24/08/2007 12:23:18

The people who spew out this drivel make me laugh, because in reality, they are the ones that don't want to fight. You won't catch them EVER doing this in 0.0 because they know they will be podded in a heart beat.

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Hah, as if the high-sec mission runners who start these threads are flying any missions in low-sec or 0.0 to be salvaged in the first place? They'd wet their flight suits at the first sniff of yarr. Salvagers would be the least of their worries.

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Originally by: Stakhanov

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The whole "salvage theft" lobbying just highlights how greedy and stupid carebears can be. Can flagging made highsec piracy so much easier and rewarding. Guess what would happen if salvaging gave aggro ? Highsec mission probers would look for semi-AFK drone boats , salvage some wrecks , and catch drone aggro in order to kill the mission runner.

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