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The Plate Craze

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Ashaz Mindstar Technology United Confederation of Corporations	Posted - 2007.08.24 14:10:00 - [31] As a wise man said the other day. "Maybe it's time for the old plate vs resists demonstration." Take two equal BS. Fit one with plates and a rep. Fit the other with resists and a rep. Send 5 fighters at each ship. see who pops first. iDrone
Abye Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.08.24 15:00:00 - [32] Originally by: twit brent I might use active tanks when CCP stops lasers from using stupid ammounts of cap. Learn Amarr BS to 5 and voila, you don't use more cap on firing than a hybrid ship with a Geddon or Apoc. ___ Inappropriate signature. Please do not use this signature. Email us for more information -Eldo ([email protected])
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.08.24 15:23:00 - [33] Edited by: Goumindong on 24/08/2007 15:27:09 Originally by: Abye Originally by: twit brent I might use active tanks when CCP stops lasers from using stupid ammounts of cap. Learn Amarr BS to 5 and voila, you don't use more cap on firing than a hybrid ship with a Geddon or Apoc. Yes you do. With just the guns firing an All skills 5 Geddon firing uses 32.3 cap per second for megapulses. A megathron uses 22 cap per second with just Neutrons firing. A megathron uses 29 cap per second to fire 425 railguns. A geddon uses 45.9 cap/second to fire Megabeams and 48.3 cap per second to fire Tachyons. An Apoc uses 27.7 cap per second to fire megapulses. 39.4 for Megabeams and 41.4 for tachs. A hyperion uses 25.2 cap per second to fire Neutrons. and 34.2 to fire 425 rails. Max skilled, an Amarran pilot will still be using more cap[some times significantly] to fire his guns than anyone using hybrids.
Daelin Blackleaf No Joy Corp	Posted - 2007.08.24 16:26:00 - [34] Originally by: Goumindong An Apoc uses 27.7 cap per second to fire megapulses. 39.4 for Megabeams and 41.4 for tachs. A hyperion uses 25.2 cap per second to fire Neutrons. and 34.2 to fire 425 rails. Max skilled, an Amarran pilot will still be using more cap[some times significantly] to fire his guns than anyone using hybrids. He will also be doing more damage (sometimes significantly) than rails at short to mid ranges and blasterboats need an MWD offsetting the slightly reduced cap on their weapons. The main issue is that (like the Rokh) people try to force them into either operating at "standard" fleet range in which case the problem is lazy fleet commanders or operating withing tackling range in which case... your doing it wrong.
Gawain Hill	Posted - 2007.08.24 17:26:00 - [35] Originally by: Daelin Blackleaf Originally by: Goumindong An Apoc uses 27.7 cap per second to fire megapulses. 39.4 for Megabeams and 41.4 for tachs. A hyperion uses 25.2 cap per second to fire Neutrons. and 34.2 to fire 425 rails. Max skilled, an Amarran pilot will still be using more cap[some times significantly] to fire his guns than anyone using hybrids. He will also be doing more damage (sometimes significantly) than rails at short to mid ranges and blasterboats need an MWD offsetting the slightly reduced cap on their weapons. The main issue is that (like the Rokh) people try to force them into either operating at "standard" fleet range in which case the problem is lazy fleet commanders or operating withing tackling range in which case... your doing it wrong. so how do you keep out of web range with the slowest ships in the game? ofacause a mwd would help but then everyone has a mwd and then not enough cap for the guns.... i supose an ab might help a lil but then against a mwd it's not really goin to keep you out of tackling range long enough to pop a ship and you'll never have enough cap to keep guns and ab going never mind guns and mwd i supose with a couple of domination web you can keep range but then again that's a VERY pricey mod to be fitting on a PvP ship also you'd have the problem if you did manage to keep your mwd and guns going at the same time you wouldn't hit anything without a lot of help for your tracking... but then they'd just warp away since you couldn't hold them in place hurm not so easy when you think of it is it oh i know fly with a gang
Daelin Blackleaf No Joy Corp Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.24 18:42:00 - [36] Originally by: Gawain Hill oh i know fly with a gang Excuse my tone but, well duh. If the opponent is tackled you can apply your damage from a range where those weapons that do more damage can't reach you and those with higher damage can't out damage you. If the game were balanced for 1v1 the only option would be to remove all differences between ships. Every ship has weaknesses, every good gang (even if it's just two pilots) covers them. Solo PvP is fun but nothing to base game balance on. Take Guildwars, Magic the Gathering, Command and Conquer etc. Each class, card, or unit isn't balanced against the others it is balanced for use as part of a whole.
Marcus Druallis Quantum Industries Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.24 19:17:00 - [37] Originally by: Nocturnal Avenger My ignorant reply is, that being old fashioned always lose to those who adapt. Real skill is doing whatever - within game mechanics - it takes to win. Nominated for President. -- Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes - Devil ([email protected])
Corwain Gallente Kamite	Posted - 2007.08.24 22:22:00 - [38] Originally by: Daelin Blackleaf Solo PvP is fun but nothing to base game balance on. Take Guildwars, Magic the Gathering, Command and Conquer etc. Each class, card, or unit isn't balanced against the others it is balanced for use as part of a whole. You've obviously never played fighting games professionally. Or a good FPS at any competitive level...ah well. Also note that Magic IS a 1v1 game...your set of cards is comparable to your choice of modules, rigs, drone loadout, implants and ship in EVE. Games CAN be balanced both at a 1v1 level and a group level and NO everything doesn't have to be the same. -- A Solo Arbitrator vid, Distortion by Corwain
Daelin Blackleaf No Joy Corp Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.25 16:27:00 - [39] Edited by: Daelin Blackleaf on 25/08/2007 16:34:22 Originally by: Corwain Originally by: Daelin Blackleaf Solo PvP is fun but nothing to base game balance on. Take Guildwars, Magic the Gathering, Command and Conquer etc. Each class, card, or unit isn't balanced against the others it is balanced for use as part of a whole. Games CAN be balanced both at a 1v1 level and a group level and NO everything doesn't have to be the same. No I certainly haven't, I have a family, a job, and a life... ah well I'll accept your argument about Magic, it was a poor example, but you cannot say a Battlefield series medic is balanced for 1v1 with a typical soldier. I don't believe EvE should or could ever be balanced on a 1v1 level due to the fact that ships are designed to full-fill roles as part of a group. Certainly some of these ships are better at acting alone than others but their inherent weaknesses will out sooner or later due the fact that they have an intended role and perform poorly beyond it. To balance 1v1 for EvE:- >All weapons would have optimals within tackling range. >All ships would have equal potential speeds to prevent one side having the advantage of escape or dictating range. > Due to equal speeds whoever got into optimal first would win so optimal ranges would have to be the same. > You could certainly from here begin a little variation between DPS, EW, and tank the end result however would be each player would (with max skills and best kit) inflict an equal percentage of damage upon the other over time. It goes on, but this is already a game I certainly don't want to play, it would rely on reflex skills because whoever misses a second reloading a module or some-such would lose. This is not a reflex based game, there are plenty of those, here intellect and social skill are far more important than how quickly you can hammer your keyboard. The majority of EvE combat is not 1v1 anyway, and it shouldn't be in a game such as this. The separate roles and inherent weaknesses of ships in certain areas promote variety, team play, and tactical thinking and that is kind of game I do like to play.


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