EVE Search - [ISSO] August report

All Channels

Market Discussions

[ISSO] August report

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Ghost Emperor Amarr EvE Mutual Fund Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.05 17:01:00 - [31] Well the returns have been what we expected ty ISSO. We will be holding onto the majority of our stock and if people pick them up at below IPO prices they can still deliver a regular income in excess of 5%. Regular reporting is always appreciated as well. For EMFI it is about spreading the risk (especially after the EIB and ISS outposts hits). This means that for the budding investor out there having a spread of stocks: FIN-U; FRPB; ISSO and other large capital stock releases (with 5% or more return). As always its about not keeping all your eggs in one basket from our point of view. Visit EvE Galactic Stock Exchange and Real-time Eve Stock Exchange (in game or out, but trades in game)
Montaire Lacedaemon. Fallen Souls	Posted - 2007.09.05 17:23:00 - [32] Originally by: Ghost Emperor Well the returns have been what we expected ty ISSO. We will be holding onto the majority of our stock and if people pick them up at below IPO prices they can still deliver a regular income in excess of 5%. Regular reporting is always appreciated as well. I have to disagree. THe returns so far have not been "As expected" - they have been at the absolute minimum. they have been passing thus far by getting a D- in every way. And this is especially telling since it appears they have been, and continue to take steps to make sure their profits stay at that absolute minimum.
Friznit 5punkorp Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.09.05 17:38:00 - [33] I'm pretty happy with my ISS shares investment. Of all the shares I own it is probably one of the most reliable payouts - not the biggest or the best, but it's reliable. I couldn't give a hoot whether it should be doing 10% or more, cos frankly I've not got the time to waste studying the economy. If I did, I'd be making the isk myself and not investing in someone else to do it for me. Seems to me that if people think shares are under performing, they should sell them on rather than complaining endlessly like a stuck record.
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.09.05 18:07:00 - [34] sure, if there was a buy-back policy as initially promised i'd do that immediately, no worries however, i've been trying sell orders for ~6months now and managed to sell roughly 30%. the group of optimists is veeery small. our uttered dissatisfaction is a call for change: we point out errors. alas, they don't see any let alone fix them. if they react as fast as they did with their shopping baskets or the T2 BPOs they were never supposed to have (at least none that required such a depreciation) then it's really time for someone who can to take over. - putting the gist back into logistics
Johnny ReeRee The ReeRee Brigade	Posted - 2007.09.05 18:34:00 - [35] I AM OUTRAGED THAT ISSO IS EXACTLY FULFILLING THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE IPO, EVERY MONTH OF THEIR EXISTENCE! OUTRAGED I SAY!
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.09.05 18:49:00 - [36] Originally by: Johnny ReeRee I AM OUTRAGED THAT ISSO IS EXACTLY FULFILLING THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE IPO, EVERY MONTH OF THEIR EXISTENCE! OUTRAGED I SAY! Put the WoW keyboard away little johnny Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Friznit 5punkorp Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.09.05 18:56:00 - [37] Originally by: Roemy Schneider sure, if there was a buy-back policy as initially promised i'd do that immediately, no worries however, i've been trying sell orders for ~6months now and managed to sell roughly 30%. the group of optimists is veeery small. our uttered dissatisfaction is a call for change: we point out errors. alas, they don't see any let alone fix them. if they react as fast as they did with their shopping baskets or the T2 BPOs they were never supposed to have (at least none that required such a depreciation) then it's really time for someone who can to take over. Well tbh I really can't think of anyone I'd rather do it. If I'm making a loss here (although I don't fully understand your discontent, we all know what happened to the T2 market but ain't hindsight a wonderful thing) then I'd much rather stick with the reliable income source that I know, then hand it over to some unknown quantity. From my perspective it looks very much like ISS has been through hell and back and still managed to produce my dividend every month. Pretty impressive track record given that I reckon most people in a similar situation would have put 2 fingers up to Eve and run with the money. Kudos to them I say.
Zachariah Ombiby	Posted - 2007.09.05 22:27:00 - [38] Originally by: Johnny ReeRee I AM OUTRAGED THAT ISSO IS EXACTLY FULFILLING THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE IPO, EVERY MONTH OF THEIR EXISTENCE! OUTRAGED I SAY! Hello bob-wannabe-alt. Quote: At the end of august, the profit ticker stopped at 18.814.000.000 isk, which is 6,47%, slighty lower as july. then Quote: we wrote off 8 Bn this month. If you're too stupid to understand what Roemy (and others) are saying in this and other threads; then, I guess the majority of your posts really aren't an act. Sometimes it is what it is, sometimes a left turn really IS just a left turn.
Zachariah Ombiby	Posted - 2007.09.05 22:31:00 - [39] Originally by: Friznit If I'm making a loss here (although I don't fully understand your discontent, we all know what happened to the T2 market but ain't hindsight a wonderful thing) then I'd much rather stick with the reliable income source that I know, then hand it over to some unknown quantity. What does t2 sales/losses have to do with the ISSO IPO, or anything they've stated publicly since said IPO?
Johnny ReeRee The ReeRee Brigade	Posted - 2007.09.05 23:09:00 - [40] Edited by: Johnny ReeRee on 05/09/2007 23:09:57 Yeah, the reporting from ISSO is so horrendous, especially in comparison with Market forum faves FIN...err, well, not really...or Proton...err, no, not them either,... Wait -- NO ONE provides serious reporting. All people really get are payouts, which ISSO is doing. ISSO should simply refuse to provide any disclosures, and pay out whatever. If people don't like that, too damn bad. Go buy FIN and hound Eefrit for a close accounting of every transaction decision. ISSO's mistake is offering these partial reports. Disclose fully or don't disclose at all. Since disclosing fully is silly for a game like this and probably not possible anyway, they should just rethink their silly little reports. But the bottom line is that they are making their dividends and fulfilling their obligations. If people think they could manage 300 billion better, then go raise 300 billion and do it. Quit whining.
Friznit 5punkorp Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.09.05 23:31:00 - [41] Well presumably those 'shopping baskets' are largely T2 items for trade for a good profit in 0.0 stations which I'm sure was the original intent. At the time, it made very good market sense. However, no doubt like a lot of large scale traders, ISS have had to swallow a considerable loss due to invention crashing the T2 market when Revelations arrived (it certainly fits the timescale of the IPO looking at the dates). I'm sure the same can be said for any T2 BPO's they bought: as a long term investment for people with large amounts of liquid isk BPO's were very good but again the market has changed - hindsight, as I said before, is a wonderful thing. I guess that left them 2 options. Declare a big loss and pay no dividends for the first couple of months until they started clearing a real profit (and lose 90% of their investors I should think), or spread the losses over a period of months and continue to pay out the 5% dividend as promised - thereby keeping most of the investors happy because they're getting what they expect, although the disadvantage being that in real terms profits above 5% take comparatively longer to materialise. As an investor I certainly prefer the second option. It keeps my cashflow healthy and if ISS can offset their initial losses with alternative investment plans - they clearly have - then that's pretty impressive in my book. Given that throughout all this ISS fought a major war, relocated the entire alliance twice, and is now embroiled in another major war and at no time, to the best of my knowledge, have they dipped into the IPO to bail them out more than is their due (>5<9% profit margin notwithstanding as per the policy), I'd say they've managed this pretty well. Personally, I'd ask what I can do to make the situation better for ISS in order to increase my share value. Unless of course I was a competitor.
Wolfgang Jager Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2007.09.06 02:07:00 - [42] The biggest thing ISSO (or any company really) could do at this point to bolster confidence and raise share value and interest; would be to simply start a buyback program. It would be the clearest possible sign that everything really is well in hand and that the management are confident of the future.
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.09.06 02:11:00 - [43] Edited by: Roemy Schneider on 06/09/2007 02:12:40 indeed, hind-sight is a wonderful thing. it is quite a valueable tool if it doesn't get out of hand: invention is older than ISSO. two months into the IPO would still have been perfectly fine to tone done the shopping baskets. about those T2 BPOs, again: "The Alliance isn't basing the investments on Tech II assets, although the people wanting to borrow do. So loans are secured against a (low) valuation of the Tech II BPOs." (almost at the bottom) you do see someone screwed up big time if already low valued BPOs end up being reevaluated by another 25bil, no? quite a large loan must have defaulted and it must have been a "long" time ago (which would have left months to reconsider their value). however ~100bil was the maximum total amount of loans and that was reached only recently. which leaves us with very few excuses... multiple huge loans defaulted? makes you wonder why they still went on until 100bil. they weren't valued below market price? would be a direct violation of the plan. and it leaves lots of room for tinfoil: maybe some of those "iss related entities" (formerly known as "entities that are part of ISS") got 100% on their BPOs... and then defaulted -.- - putting the gist back into logistics
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.09.06 02:28:00 - [44] sure, you guys that are happy with 5%, go on fanboiing. the IPO could be eating its own tail and you'd still be happy. you are not able to sell those shares for the price you purchased them (which brings us back to the lack of ISSO buy-back orders on egse) right now there's buy-orders for 46 whooping shares on both EGSE and RESX combined. if we consider serenity's "private" offer for 8mil, that's +25% over 9 months or 2.77% monthly return. and you'd still be happy with that? therefore we want to put ISSO on solid feet again - make people trust in the NAV - get shares back to "full" value. new management, new information policy, forgotton promises picked up again, malpracticed loans stopped etc. - putting the gist back into logistics
Friznit 5punkorp Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.09.06 09:01:00 - [45] Edited by: Friznit on 06/09/2007 09:02:10 I'm not going to comment on tin foil hattery or these supposed "loan defaulters". All these rumours serves to do is rock shareholder confidence more than anything ISS has ever done and that's bad for my investment. I will talk to some of my contacts in the business though, and see if there's any truth to what you suppose. On these baskets, I'd suspect given the scale of the IPO there may well have been a large amount of toning down to do. I'm pretty confident that ISS would have done their best to recover as much of their initial investment as possible on those, spreading the losses in order to maintain the minimum 5%, as mentioned in that same post by Serenity Steele I cannot understand your insistance that there is a change in management. I believe I have adequately demonstrated that this very large IPO is in the hands of someone we can trust to run it (and Stins himself is a known and trusted broker for super cap sales). In situations like this I'd much rather maintain long term investment stability than mess about with it and risk getting scammed out of the lot (a very real possibility in Eve). Besides, if we really need a change then the correct way would be to forward some viable alternatives and motion for a shareholder vote on the issue (again, see the bottom of that post by Serenity). Please don't resort to rhetoric and CAOD style mud slinging in what is otherwise a sensible discussion. If there are a significant number of people who are content with their investment then let them be.
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.09.06 09:18:00 - [46] well then, you could help both of us: how about you buy my shares for issue price? - putting the gist back into logistics
Montaire Lacedaemon. Fallen Souls	Posted - 2007.09.06 09:24:00 - [47] So a direct question : ISSO said it would buy back shares. Can you please outline the steps necessary to do this ?
Friznit 5punkorp Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.09.06 11:26:00 - [48] Originally by: Roemy Schneider well then, you could help both of us: how about you buy my shares for issue price? Well I was about to increase my portfolio anyway (there's lots of shares for sale on EGSE for below IPO price) which is why I looked here first to see the state of things. However, given your thrust on CAOD I can only see the share price falling in the near future. I think I'll wait and buy them off you much cheaper in a few weeks time.
Montaire Lacedaemon. Fallen Souls	Posted - 2007.09.06 12:09:00 - [49] Originally by: Friznit Originally by: Roemy Schneider well then, you could help both of us: how about you buy my shares for issue price? Well I was about to increase my portfolio anyway (there's lots of shares for sale on EGSE for below IPO price) which is why I looked here first to see the state of things. However, given your thrust on CAOD I can only see the share price falling in the near future. I think I'll wait and buy them off you much cheaper in a few weeks time. Just buy FIN dude. Better returns, better stability, better managment.
Johnny ReeRee The ReeRee Brigade	Posted - 2007.09.06 13:45:00 - [50] Originally by: Montaire Originally by: Friznit Originally by: Roemy Schneider well then, you could help both of us: how about you buy my shares for issue price? Well I was about to increase my portfolio anyway (there's lots of shares for sale on EGSE for below IPO price) which is why I looked here first to see the state of things. However, given your thrust on CAOD I can only see the share price falling in the near future. I think I'll wait and buy them off you much cheaper in a few weeks time. Just buy FIN dude. Better returns, better stability, better managment. The FIN which pays 5% or less, provides no insight whatever into their transactions, and was forced to amortize a massive loss of t2 bpo value? Oh you mean, FIN-U, which is now unavailable, and still offers no transparency? Or Ionia's new issue, which takes money without even bothering with any pretense of reporting? Better stability? Is that some kind of ironic joke? Where's the punchline? ISSO has paid every single month. Is there a higher level of stability than EVERY SINGLE TIME?
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.09.06 15:04:00 - [51] yep - a buy-back policy for example. but trust can get you a long way. alas, ISS managed to forfeit that privilege. about waving the flag: as long as they spam the eve world with news about how well they're doing, i'll point out how they're not. yep, i'm cutting into my own flesh but i'd rather not see some 'small' hunter putting his entire battleship savings into an IPO that missed to dump its T2 like everybody else did 4 months ago (unless it was the explicit purpose of it). noone is taking responsibility this time either. 40billion lost and counting but weee 45% return - only one more year and you'll be back where you started. - putting the gist back into logistics
Friznit 5punkorp Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.09.06 15:18:00 - [52] Originally by: Roemy Schneider yep, i'm cutting into my own flesh... And mine, and every other ISS shareholder. But I appreciate your concern, thankyou. I've decided after a little investigation to keep hold of my ISS shares but I won't be buying any more in the immediate future. I'll drop you a line in a month or two when you decided to cut your losses for a fraction of that 40bill investment ;)
Montaire Lacedaemon. Fallen Souls	Posted - 2007.09.06 17:16:00 - [53] Originally by: Montaire So a direct question : ISSO said it would buy back shares. Can you please outline the steps necessary to do this ?
FastLearner Fury Holdings Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.09.06 18:14:00 - [54] Originally by: Friznit Declare a big loss and pay no dividends for the first couple of months until they started clearing a real profit (and lose 90% of their investors I should think Can you explain how a corporation that doesn't offer a buy-back can lose investors? And isn't the 5% guaranteed?
Friznit 5punkorp Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.09.06 20:52:00 - [55] They won't be able to sell any more shares and the trading price of current shares will fall as people try to offload them. So while not technically losing investors, the market value of the shares will fall (assuming of course that there is a trade exchange in ISS shares other than back to ISS itself). In that sense they'd be 'losing' there investors although in real terms I understand what you mean. I've done some digging over the last couple of days since reading this thread. Although Serenity Steele said they'd instigate a buy back on EGSE, he has since left ISS and there is nothing on the IPO report to back up what he said. That probably explains the lack of a buy back at the moment and although a concern, while I continue to receive 5% per month I'm not going to panic about it. I hope in future this will be instigated though. Tbh, I'm prepared to see what happens when the losses are finally written off completely and we can see the full benefits of the profits. If ISS can swallow those losses whilst still clearing 5% profit per month now, I can only imagine that without any losses to cover the profits will be quite nice. In summary, a lot of bad **** happened to ISS at the time the IPO was floated and yet they still managed to pull through when lesser men would have taken the isk and run. That in itself speaks volumes for their integrity if you ask me.
Proton Power Amarr Power Corrupts Tech Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.09.06 23:12:00 - [56] Originally by: Johnny ReeRee Edited by: Johnny ReeRee on 05/09/2007 23:18:14 Yeah, the reporting from ISSO is so horrendous, especially in comparison with Market forum faves FIN...err, well, not really...or Proton...err, no, not them either,... Wait -- NO ONE provides serious reporting. All people really get are payouts, which ISSO is doing. ISSO should simply refuse to provide any disclosures, and pay out whatever. If people don't like that, too damn bad. Go buy FIN and hound Eefrit for a close accounting of every transaction decision. Roemy's specific objections about amortizing the t2 losses are nonsense. ISSO's mistake is offering these partial reports. Disclose fully or don't disclose at all. Since disclosing fully is silly for a game like this and probably not possible anyway, they should just rethink their silly little reports. But the bottom line is that they are making their dividends and fulfilling their obligations. If people think they could manage 300 billion better, then go raise 300 billion and do it. Quit whining. Here is a major diff between me and ISS though. I didn't do a major break down of my assets monthly. I couldn't, and honestly I don't see how ISS can. BUT I reported daily if I had to what was going on with peoples ISK. I reported if I was doing somthing new, if I was stopping somthing, if I took a 2 day break because i was burnt out, if I lost isk, how I lost it and what I would do to make that isk back up. ISS reports 1 time a month, and its always the same report, we made the same amount of isk we made last month you get 5%. This is my biggest problem, how does a 290bil isk IPO make the exact same profit every month, you can't do it even if you try, unless you are fixing the numbers so it looks like you are making the same profit. Another question that has yet to be answered is why is there t2 bpo's that were not suppose to be held under the IPO, and after 3mths does that mean there will be 8bil isk extra a month paid in dividends? ----------------------------------------------- http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=439797Cli
Shadarle	Posted - 2007.09.06 23:49:00 - [57] Originally by: Proton Power Another question that has yet to be answered is why is there t2 bpo's that were not suppose to be held under the IPO, and after 3mths does that mean there will be 8bil isk extra a month paid in dividends? This, more than anything else, needs to be answered. As does why on earth it is taking 3 months to account for this loss, instead of 1. It is purely to pad ISS wallets as I've stated in a previous post as we are guarantee 5% no matter what. To the investors it is far better if all 24 billion loss was accounted for at once... since we are already getting the min payout, we can't get lower and we will still get the 5%. Instead, we're being screwed for 3 months instead of just 1. Tanking Setups Compared Stacking Penalty / Resists Explained
Friznit 5punkorp Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.09.07 07:52:00 - [58] Save that if they declared all losses in one month and paid dividends out of capital, then they'd have less to invest and we'd lose out in the long run. Ignoring the argument as to whether they should have had T2 BPO in the first place, those things are capital assets. The actual value of a BPO doesn't matter as long as it's in production making >5% profit per month. It only matters when the item you make is no longer profitable and you have to sell the BPO. At a guess, I'd say this is what happened, which is why the BPO loss was only realised several months after invention started.
Johnny ReeRee The ReeRee Brigade	Posted - 2007.09.07 10:53:00 - [59] Originally by: Proton Power This is my biggest problem, how does a 290bil isk IPO make the exact same profit every month, you can't do it even if you try, unless you are fixing the numbers so it looks like you are making the same profit. Then you don't know much about business. Maybe you're good at making isk in Eve, but you don't understand business. Which has greater variation in earnings reports: Exxon or the little startup? Why do you think that might be? And you grossly exaggerate the detail and quality of your reports. For the most part they were worthless little stream of consciousness rambles which would not have withstood much scrutiny. Oops! I lost 2 billion! Dunno where it went. You paid more than 5% though, so no one complained. None of this is about principles of reporting. It's mostly about market or political competitors to ISS throwing dirt around, and some of it just about greedy investors looking to extract a few extra isk. ISS should simply stop reporting altogether.
Zachariah Ombiby	Posted - 2007.09.07 13:02:00 - [60] Originally by: Friznit Originally by: Roemy Schneider yep, i'm cutting into my own flesh... And mine, and every other ISS shareholder. But I appreciate your concern, thankyou. I've decided after a little investigation to keep hold of my ISS shares but I won't be buying any more in the immediate future. I'll drop you a line in a month or two when you decided to cut your losses for a fraction of that 40bill investment ;) So, what you're saying is that you've decided to NOT sell shares that no one wants to buy? Brilliant strategy. Are you a Johnny RooRoo alt?

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.