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JP Beauregard
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Posted - 2004.02.10 11:04:00 -
[1]
Edited by: JP Beauregard on 10/02/2004 11:07:04
Pilkington Industries' VP of Manufacturing managed to procure an interceptor bp yesterday. Seeing that there is little info about them out there, I thought I'd post a few screenshots of the bp with her consent to dispell the moronic myth that these ships would be cheap and easy to produce.
Expect a full press release in Corporations and Market later today.
Here then are the screenshots of our new Ares blueprint, about 60k jpegs each:
Blueprint attributes and copying requirements
Research requirements - ME and P
Bill of materials
JP Beauregard
=== The Pilkington Guides to EVE === |
Admiral IceBlock
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Posted - 2004.02.10 11:07:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Admiral IceBlock on 10/02/2004 11:07:32
30 Fusion Reactors? 
40 Ion Thrusters? must be a FAST *****!!
"We brake for nobody"
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Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2004.02.10 11:14:00 -
[3]
so an estimation of base cost ?
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.02.10 11:16:00 -
[4]
It all depends - if you have people doing agent missions you'll have most of those as agent rewards but I'm guessing 3-4M isk would be a reasonable price.
They DO have useful abilities.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Tano
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Posted - 2004.02.10 11:43:00 -
[5]
I agree that if you had agent runners under Castor pre the latest patches you will have a lot of T2 items but even so using 30 to 40 a time will use up supplies fast. At current drop rate will never be able to produce in quantity (100+ interceptors)
Interesting to see mechanical engineering was the second skill, implied somewhere else that it was astronautics skill for all interceptors and as not in game all ships would go to those researching starship enginering.
What do you think the construction blocks are for - ballast!
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Pychian Vanervi
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Posted - 2004.02.10 12:02:00 -
[6]
Only my take on the reasoning behind such costs and material needs.
I suspect its to give a little more individuality to the pilots. As more and more of these new ships come out it will be less likely that you can get hold of the best type on mass. Example pre castor Scorps where the number one ship and anyone who wanted one could get one. Now the Apoc and Tempest are in high demand but still farely easy to come by.
With this new system there will be a lot less willing to take on more than one of the new type of ship so be happy with the one they can get. As there is 8 new for each race in just the frigate class that will give plaenty of scope.
Not sure if that even made sense. 
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It's all about the fortune and glory, fortune and glory!
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2004.02.10 13:38:00 -
[7]
Wonder how much would Researching Material Efficiency lower the number of Tech II items needed to produce.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
Archemedes
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Posted - 2004.02.10 14:01:00 -
[8]
Hmmm... that is a LOT of items to build a frigate! Assuming a 10k per item average cost on the Tech 2 parts (which is reasonable based on what I've seen under the market history graphs), you have a bit over 2 million in parts plus another 100k or so in minerals. That means a fair market price is in the 3-4 million ISK range... FAR too expensive for a frigate-class ship if you actually want to fight in it!
Congratulations CCP... you introduced ships that die like frigates, fight like frigates, but cost as much as a L2 cruiser. I'm sure EVERYONE will want one...  You DO understand that frigate combat involves blowing up OFTEN, right?
Guess these things will only be bought by agent runners who already have the needed parts, collectors, and people who just want a faster scout ship. Ah well...
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Rahzelk
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Posted - 2004.02.10 14:12:00 -
[9]
Well... sure it's much money...but afterall, I heard many people saying that they were "rich". So I doubt the 4M price will prevent them from buying these frigates...
(elegance-corp.net)
Do not look where you fell, but where you slipped. |
Fausto
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Posted - 2004.02.10 14:38:00 -
[10]
Construction block?!?!?!? So I guess it will fly like a brick
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<brainpodder> |
DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2004.02.10 14:39:00 -
[11]
The reason i use frigates is that they are replaceable, if i get shot down i have 20 in my hangar waiting and their fully equiped for the price of 500-600k.
4mil gets me a blackbird, and has more hp and more slots than a interceptor.
This is indeed bad CCP, the price shouldnt be like a normal frigate but between that and cruiser prices.
__________________________
http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
Nightfang
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Posted - 2004.02.10 14:50:00 -
[12]
Assuming it's not being jammed - a Crow with cruise missiles and MWD will be able to solo any cruiser there is out there, so perhaps it's worth it after all?
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DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2004.02.10 15:04:00 -
[13]
 Quote:
Assuming it's not being jammed - a Crow with cruise missiles and MWD will be able to solo any cruiser there is out there, so perhaps it's worth it after all?
Thats allready possible in some current frigates.
__________________________
http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
JP Beauregard
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Posted - 2004.02.10 15:04:00 -
[14]
Edited by: JP Beauregard on 11/02/2004 15:00:41
I've been following this discussion with a certain degree of amusement. Too many cases of the pot calling the kettle black, really.
The problem is not so much the shopping list for the Ares as the rather ridiculous amounts of money people are asking for components with minimal mineral value.
Case in point: [edited again after clearing up the confusion j0sephine had thrown me into] carbonite armor plate has a mineral value at NPC prices of 4,096 isk (2048 Tritanium, 128 Mexallon as yield) - and yet in a cursory sweep of 8 central regions, I have not seen a single unit for sale at less than 10,000 ISK. That's a mark-up of almost 250%. On bonus goods.
Need I mention Zydrine at > 4,000 isk?
Simple case of economics, lads. If the greedy mining consortitium drives up the prices for minerals because they want to get rich fast; and if the greedy agent runner thinks he can make a quick isk slapping obscene margins on a bit of wiring and duct tape, they too will have to pay up at last when their friendly neighborhood shipyard needs to price accordingly to make any money at all.
We haven't put our heads together yet with regard to pricing, but expect retail to be in excess of 4 million. BYOC+ISK should be much more affordable with the ISK part below 2 million.
Stay tuned...
PS: A Blackbird for 4 million is a travesty in and of itself. Cut-throat competiton will hardly ever apply to elite ships. A thought to get used to there. Then again, who says we even need to build let alone sell even one Ares? ;-)
JP Beauregard
=== The Pilkington Guides to EVE === |
Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.02.10 15:41:00 -
[15]
It'll be interesting to see what the insurance costs/payouts on these are.
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Ukiah
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Posted - 2004.02.10 15:58:00 -
[16]
If you don't, someone else will, JP. Eve is full of people undercutting competitors.
I'm personally not itnerested in doing missions for a tech2 bp. I've been holding onto my tech2 components and watching the market. When it hits a certain point, I sell. I don't bother setting SELL orders, I just watch the advanced amrket info and if someone seems to be offering a decent price (ie 15k+ per unit) nearby, he's the lucky winner.
It HAS occured to me, however, to hold on to some of the compoents for a BYOC+isk deal for a crusader, but as tech2 ships STILL haven't been seen, I'll probably get impatient and sell if the price is right.
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Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.02.10 16:23:00 -
[17]
I sell all my tech 2 components for 10k isk each. HEHEHEHEHEHE I have thousands. Goto Alenia or Reset.
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Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
Lansfear
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Posted - 2004.02.10 16:41:00 -
[18]
Fact is all frigates are drone food.
Interceptors are useless unless you can get in close enough to attack, well that puts you right inside drone range.
Maybe Bombers will escape this fate like the kestrel does..
Also with targeting speeds the way they are now, you can be sure Interceptors will get locked just as easily as any other frigate.
Fix drones and lock on times and I'd fear an interceptor if i was in a cruiser. That racial bonus just looks sweet........
4 mil for an interceptor, sorry, not worth the loss.
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Heff
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Posted - 2004.02.10 16:56:00 -
[19]
Best way to advertise them is to prove that they are worth it. Build a few and beat the daylights out of a few superior ships and you will have customers lined up at your door.
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Shia Dai
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Posted - 2004.02.10 16:59:00 -
[20]
Quote:
Interesting to see mechanical engineering was the second skill, implied somewhere else that it was astronautics skill for all interceptors and as not in game all ships would go to those researching starship enginering.
Astronautics = covert ops ships.
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DeathBunny
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Posted - 2004.02.10 17:05:00 -
[21]
Either way on skills going to need a lvl 5 frigate for the ships and probley lvl 5 of that skill for the next tech 2 ships (cruisers)
Fear The Bunny
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Heritor
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Posted - 2004.02.10 17:23:00 -
[22]
Glad i never refined all my tech II goodies form my agent......Have huge amounts of those items
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Ukiah
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Posted - 2004.02.10 17:31:00 -
[23]
Quote:
Fact is all frigates are drone food.
Interceptors are useless unless you can get in close enough to attack, well that puts you right inside drone range.
Maybe Bombers will escape this fate like the kestrel does..
Also with targeting speeds the way they are now, you can be sure Interceptors will get locked just as easily as any other frigate.
Fix drones and lock on times and I'd fear an interceptor if i was in a cruiser. That racial bonus just looks sweet........
4 mil for an interceptor, sorry, not worth the loss.
Right NOW that's true, but if CCP gets what they appear to want out of elite frigates, that may change. When the Assault and Bomber variants are introduced, you may actually see Cruiser and BS pilots afraid of them. They'll use their drones, in turn, to counteract them. That's where the interceptors come in. They're being groomed as anti-drone and anti-other elite frigate ships. We may find a time when peolpe are far more afraid of the Mercenary Frigates people than SPVD, M0O, or BioMass....
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.02.10 18:36:00 -
[24]
"The problem is not so much the shopping list for the Ares as the rather ridiculous amounts of money people are asking for components with minimal mineral value.
Case in point: carbonite armor plate has a mineral value of less than 4,000 isk - and yet in a cursory sweep of 8 central regions, I have not seen even one unit on offer for less than 10,000. That's a mark-up of 250%."
... Sorry, i know next to nothing about the refining and mineral prices, so simply looked up the NPC mineral worth of the items in the eve-db. The carbonite plate you mention (and most of the stuff for that matter) is listed there with NPC value of 8192 ISK, so i rounded the prices up to 10k and to 20k for components which are listed with value of 14-16 k... ~20% profit seemed fair to both sides, especially back when everyone else was asking for 100-200 k per piece *shrugs*
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JP Beauregard
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Posted - 2004.02.10 18:43:00 -
[25]
Edited by: JP Beauregard on 11/02/2004 15:04:37
Quote:
... Sorry, i know next to nothing about the refining and mineral prices, so simply looked up the NPC mineral worth of the items in the eve-db. The carbonite plate you mention (and most of the stuff for that matter) is listed there with NPC value of 8192 ISK, so i rounded the prices up to 10k and to 20k for components which are listed with value of 14-16 k... ~20% profit seemed fair to both sides, especially back when everyone else was asking for 100-200 k per piece *shrugs*
Sorry, didn't double-check my own math - EDIT: today I did and it turned out to be right, wicked wicked woman sowing confusion :-7 - , should have known better. It is - EDIT: indeed at 4,096, and not at around 10k at npc mineral cost.
I knew there was a reason why I tended to ignore eve-db .-)
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Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.02.10 18:47:00 -
[26]
I want a carrier!
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Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
Lord Azraiel
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Posted - 2004.02.10 18:51:00 -
[27]
Very nice. I was hoping that the base ship would be required for construction. I'm glad I shoved that rifter bp into research for me 1000 about 2.5 months ago.
"I'm comin' for ya, and Hell's comin' with me!" |
Ukiah
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Posted - 2004.02.10 19:05:00 -
[28]
They had to. Had they NOT included 'tech 1' frigates in the construction process, the bottom would have fallen out of the ship market and most everyone realizes CCP never intended for lev3 cruisers to sell for 4-5 mil (I bought a Thorax for 4.5 mil a few months ago).
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DeathBunny
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Posted - 2004.02.10 19:20:00 -
[29]
Its one way to jack up prices litteraly without trying to rip people off because its truley what the ship costs.
Wonder what tech 2 cruisers and battleships will run for down the road.
Fear The Bunny
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Cpt Trenchard
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Posted - 2004.02.10 19:32:00 -
[30]
Quote:
Quote:
Fact is all frigates are drone food.
Interceptors are useless unless you can get in close enough to attack, well that puts you right inside drone range.
Maybe Bombers will escape this fate like the kestrel does..
Also with targeting speeds the way they are now, you can be sure Interceptors will get locked just as easily as any other frigate.
Fix drones and lock on times and I'd fear an interceptor if i was in a cruiser. That racial bonus just looks sweet........
4 mil for an interceptor, sorry, not worth the loss.
Right NOW that's true, but if CCP gets what they appear to want out of elite frigates, that may change. When the Assault and Bomber variants are introduced, you may actually see Cruiser and BS pilots afraid of them. They'll use their drones, in turn, to counteract them. That's where the interceptors come in. They're being groomed as anti-drone and anti-other elite frigate ships. We may find a time when peolpe are far more afraid of the Mercenary Frigates people than SPVD, M0O, or BioMass....
I think the great thing that is getting over looked is that if they are balanced right as Ukiah pointed out here we will get what most people are yelling for: Mixed Fleet Warfare
Yeah the cost is high but I am a casual player mainly Market Trader/Mission Runner and I turn between 10-20 Mil isk a week so it is not that big a deal.
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