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Ilea Celentay Veiled Justice	Posted - 2007.09.22 21:54:00 - [1] Okay, I was doing some PVP... An '03 Nighthawk pilot, and myself, mid '05 Minmatar Pilot. Why could I not fit to kill it I didn't have everything I could have wanted, but I am totally Manmatar spec, so, I'd like to know what should I use to kill a passive tanked Nighthawk. I assume that a 800mm Autocannon Tempest would work, Duel armour tanked? The pilot had FOFs and a fill array of missiles, so Jamming wouldn't work. I only had 1400 shield tanked tempest available, and although it performed better then my Command ship; it would not have broke its tank; or at least in enough time to do it. So, ideas, help, advice. This is of course, just 1v1. Faction Ship Info \|\| Rig Factory
xHalcyonx Amarr Lucian Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.22 21:58:00 - [2] The Nighthawk has one of the best tanks in game. You can't break it solo if it is passive. ------------------- ნỊs uʍop əpỊsdn
Ilea Celentay Veiled Justice	Posted - 2007.09.22 22:05:00 - [3] Edited by: Ilea Celentay on 22/09/2007 22:04:52 ^^ I was afraid that would be the answer Faction Ship Info \|\| Rig Factory
DaveW Caldari South Park Development	Posted - 2007.09.22 22:11:00 - [4] The old Passive Tank on the Nighthawk was so good it had to be 'nerfed'. (I just love CCP,....don't you?) It went from 'Outstanding' to just 'Very, very good'. Like the guy above said. You're not going to take one down solo. --------------------------------------------------- "If you can't stand the heat..., stay out of the Kitchen."
Tunajuice Convergent Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.09.22 22:11:00 - [5] What were you in? Not sure for minnie.. but something like an astrate could tank a nighthawk for a long time, while doing some nice DPS.... should be close ;P Did you try a minnie command ship with an injecter based tank?
enymphia The Movement	Posted - 2007.09.22 22:22:00 - [6] Originally by: Tunajuice What were you in? Not sure for minnie.. but something like an astrate could tank a nighthawk for a long time, while doing some nice DPS.... should be close ;P Did you try a minnie command ship with an injecter based tank? the nighthawk has very high natural resists vs astarte - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Alchemos Gallente Middle School Comedy Club	Posted - 2007.09.22 22:28:00 - [7] sleipner could kill one given enough ammo.
royal killer Amarr The Funkalistic SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.22 22:29:00 - [8] I was in an absolution with close range ammo and stuff, and he was starting to go down faster than i expected, but then at 85% shield the red bar didn't even move. --------------------
Fuazzole	Posted - 2007.09.22 22:45:00 - [9] You can kill a properly fited night hawk, but most gey bears just load 10 slot + 2 rig tanks it seems. A Drake can indefenatly tank my 7xneut + colision/burst + drone astarte, at command ship 5 on test server, that all does fit btw, with next to no tank, but enuf to tank drake/nighthawk on the typicle boring set up.
ArmyOfMe hirr Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.09.22 22:51:00 - [10] not possible to kill solo with probably anything less then a carrier or mom
Miriyana Gallente Legions of Derek	Posted - 2007.09.22 23:25:00 - [11] Originally by: ArmyOfMe not possible to kill solo with probably anything less then a carrier or mom Plenty of ships do more damage than a carrier. gank mega/hyp? - - - - - - Change just leads to more problems Originally by: CCP Wrangler Oh please no, I've had enough with real world taxes, and dealing with the tax agency. No more taxes!!
enymphia The Movement	Posted - 2007.09.22 23:32:00 - [12] Originally by: Miriyana Originally by: ArmyOfMe not possible to kill solo with probably anything less then a carrier or mom Plenty of ships do more damage than a carrier. gank mega/hyp? a nighthawk can tank around 1000dps passive a gankthron does about 1200dps, but that is vs 0% resist. a nighthawk can tank a gankthron passive? - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Ararius EP0CH Black Sun Cartel	Posted - 2007.09.22 23:41:00 - [13] My friend recently killed a active tanked NH solo in his Geddon. It was a damn close fight too Im ugly, just look at my face!
Minmatar Alt Minmatar	Posted - 2007.09.23 00:27:00 - [14] Originally by: Ararius My friend recently killed a active tanked NH solo in his Geddon. It was a damn close fight too I wonder what that NH pilot was thinking using an active tank, its a sin to do that while flying such a thing. ---My Unjacked Sig Space---Can't Touch This Does Hammer Slide--- A Veldspar dies every 2 minutes, Donate money to me to help fund my rightous cause to stop further Veldspar Massacres.
HellsRazor Caldari Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.09.23 05:07:00 - [15] Originally by: Minmatar Alt Originally by: Ararius My friend recently killed a active tanked NH solo in his Geddon. It was a damn close fight too I wonder what that NH pilot was thinking using an active tank, its a sin to do that while flying such a thing. guess im a sinner. I fit MAX damage and active tank. 4.7 rof with 390hp max damage per fury scourge.(no implants,all t2) Anyways, Mega got great chance of winning.( max sp) Other commandships of high skilled pilots can do pretty well.
Yakia TovilToba Halliburton Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.23 06:03:00 - [16] Originally by: enymphia Originally by: Miriyana Originally by: ArmyOfMe not possible to kill solo with probably anything less then a carrier or mom Plenty of ships do more damage than a carrier. gank mega/hyp? a nighthawk can tank around 1000dps passive a gankthron does about 1200dps, but that is vs 0% resist. a nighthawk can tank a gankthron passive? There's no way a nighhawk can recharge raw 1000dps, so if you say 1000 then you count resistances in. Then the 1200 break it, as resistances already counted in the 1000. The best ship would be the torp raven i guess, simply caus of ammo choice. Usually NHs have a hole with EM, to compensate that they'd have to fit 2 EM hardener, which hardly any NH pilot does, so pack caldari navy EM torps in your launchers, at least 3 BCU and decent missile/bs skills and the NH will melt away in no time.
6Bagheera9 Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.09.23 06:19:00 - [17] I'd think that a Torp Typhoon with a complete T2 fit might be your best bet, but its by no means a sure deal.
Karyuudo Tydraad Caldari Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services	Posted - 2007.09.23 06:30:00 - [18] I've taken out a few with laser-gank setups and faction crystals (one of the few instances they're better, Amarr Navy does almost all EM damage, Conflagration does more therm), but it was slow work.
Arii Smith Caldari StarHunt Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.09.23 06:41:00 - [19] I was able to get a ~1400DPS tank on a Nighthawk using EFT and bull** mods that I would never actually fit, but it was an interesting test. Results of that test? You better bring friends if you wanna *** this CS.
Selia Rain	Posted - 2007.09.23 06:43:00 - [20] Originally by: Yakia TovilToba Originally by: enymphia Originally by: Miriyana Originally by: ArmyOfMe not possible to kill solo with probably anything less then a carrier or mom Plenty of ships do more damage than a carrier. gank mega/hyp? a nighthawk can tank around 1000dps passive a gankthron does about 1200dps, but that is vs 0% resist. a nighthawk can tank a gankthron passive? There's no way a nighhawk can recharge raw 1000dps, so if you say 1000 then you count resistances in. Then the 1200 break it, as resistances already counted in the 1000. The best ship would be the torp raven i guess, simply caus of ammo choice. Usually NHs have a hole with EM, to compensate that they'd have to fit 2 EM hardener, which hardly any NH pilot does, so pack caldari navy EM torps in your launchers, at least 3 BCU and decent missile/bs skills and the NH will melt away in no time. Except that the nighthawk will be tanking a spot more than 1k dps of pure therm+kin, of which it should easily have between 80-85% each to(which a single invuln accomplishes for both resists. The 1k dps tankable is easy to see in EFT, fit 3x LSE II, 2x CDFP I, 5x SPR II 1x EM and 1x invuln, and it's 1097 dps average tanked with no implants or faction gear, however, take the same and check it with a therm/kin damage distrobution instead of a normalized one... I'd wager the best ship against a nighthawk would probably be, yes, a lazor ship. Probably a geddon, and likely with Praetor IIs(the only possible use for htem?). Even so, the chance of breaking his tank is entirely skill dependant. Would be a good fight though, massive passive armor vs shields. 'Course the geddon could leave any time he wanted, and the nighthawk wouldn't have the same liberty. Unless you're going to argue that a nighthawk with tackle could tank any given battleship easily at the same time.
zayanka	Posted - 2007.09.23 06:45:00 - [21] i could take down pvp fitted nighthawk of my corp mate. But that wasnt Nighthawk fitted JUST to tank, it had a passive tank, some BCU...
LUKEC Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.23 06:56:00 - [22] Amarr/minmatar bs should wtfpwn it. Espacially if he tries to fit tackling gear. More annoying is to get people who don't want to fight, killed in nighthawk as it's hard to pin it down unless you have specific setups to hold it down.
Yakia TovilToba Halliburton Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.23 07:05:00 - [23] Originally by: Selia Rain Except that the nighthawk will be tanking a spot more than 1k dps of pure therm+kin, of which it should easily have between 80-85% each to(which a single invuln accomplishes for both resists. The 1k dps tankable is easy to see in EFT, fit 3x LSE II, 2x CDFP I, 5x SPR II 1x EM and 1x invuln, and it's 1097 dps average tanked with no implants or faction gear, however, take the same and check it with a therm/kin damage distrobution instead of a normalized one... I'd wager the best ship against a nighthawk would probably be, yes, a lazor ship. Probably a geddon, and likely with Praetor IIs(the only possible use for htem?). Even so, the chance of breaking his tank is entirely skill dependant. Would be a good fight though, massive passive armor vs shields. 'Course the geddon could leave any time he wanted, and the nighthawk wouldn't have the same liberty. Unless you're going to argue that a nighthawk with tackle could tank any given battleship easily at the same time. 1x Invul and 1x EM is ofc. more common than 2 EM, but the point is with this setup the nighthawk tanks worse thank a drake if you take the base resistance/rechargerate. In the end it might come up with tanking around same, as it has 1 more lowslot but 1 less medslot. Of course you get nice values if you look at Thermal as it has it's best resistance there, but an average tanking ability throughout all damagetypes does not matter in combat against a raven or another ship that can switch ammo. The raven will fire it's first volly of mixed damagetypes. After the first volley it will switch to that damagetype that hurts most (which is easy to see in the log), that in most cases will be EM (and if the NH has 2 EM then there are only 3 medslots left for tank, you get it with kinetik or wherever the hole is). Ever had problems to take down a drake with em torps ? So why you should have problems with a NH (again, same EM resists like a drake but a slightly lower rechargerate, 1low vs 1med = about same EM tanking ability), unless you have noob skills and no damagemods.
Hectick	Posted - 2007.09.23 08:47:00 - [24] Originally by: royal killer I was in an absolution with close range ammo and stuff, and he was starting to go down faster than i expected, but then at 85% shield the red bar didn't even move. Nighthawk is lame vs other commands (1vs1) ... every other command can tank it long enough to keel it. Absolution with maxed skills and 800 dps Therm/EM kills a NH ( needs a while but does the job eventually ) and can tank it for quite a long time. And if u arent specced enough to kill it ... then warp-out ... easy as that. They usually dont carry tackle gear, and if they do they die, simple.
Santorin Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.23 08:50:00 - [25] Originally by: Yakia TovilToba Originally by: Selia Rain Except that the nighthawk will be tanking a spot more than 1k dps of pure therm+kin, of which it should easily have between 80-85% each to(which a single invuln accomplishes for both resists. The 1k dps tankable is easy to see in EFT, fit 3x LSE II, 2x CDFP I, 5x SPR II 1x EM and 1x invuln, and it's 1097 dps average tanked with no implants or faction gear, however, take the same and check it with a therm/kin damage distrobution instead of a normalized one... I'd wager the best ship against a nighthawk would probably be, yes, a lazor ship. Probably a geddon, and likely with Praetor IIs(the only possible use for htem?). Even so, the chance of breaking his tank is entirely skill dependant. Would be a good fight though, massive passive armor vs shields. 'Course the geddon could leave any time he wanted, and the nighthawk wouldn't have the same liberty. Unless you're going to argue that a nighthawk with tackle could tank any given battleship easily at the same time. 1x Invul and 1x EM is ofc. more common than 2 EM, but the point is with this setup the nighthawk tanks worse thank a drake if you take the base resistance/rechargerate. In the end it might come up with tanking around same, as it has 1 more lowslot but 1 less medslot. Of course you get nice values if you look at Thermal as it has it's best resistance there, but an average tanking ability throughout all damagetypes does not matter in combat against a raven or another ship that can switch ammo. The raven will fire it's first volly of mixed damagetypes. After the first volley it will switch to that damagetype that hurts most (which is easy to see in the log), that in most cases will be EM (and if the NH has 2 EM then there are only 3 medslots left for tank, you get it with kinetik or wherever the hole is). Ever had problems to take down a drake with em torps ? So why you should have problems with a NH (again, same EM resists like a drake but a slightly lower rechargerate, 1low vs 1med = about same EM tanking ability), unless you have noob skills and no damagemods. Nope Nighthawk tanks better.
Allestin Villimar	Posted - 2007.09.23 12:53:00 - [26] Edited by: Allestin Villimar on 23/09/2007 12:53:56 I can fit a passive set up with t2 gear/t1 rigs alone that's capable of tanking 1200 points. Start getting some of the lesser end faction gear, 5% implants, and t2 rigs, and you're talking 1500+ easy. That's only using just 1 active module, an invuln field. With good comp skills you only lose about half of it's effect when it's off. Note, this is for a nighthawk, not a raven.
Ceremony Garp	Posted - 2007.09.23 12:56:00 - [27] Originally by: Yakia TovilToba Originally by: enymphia Originally by: Miriyana Originally by: ArmyOfMe not possible to kill solo with probably anything less then a carrier or mom Plenty of ships do more damage than a carrier. gank mega/hyp? a nighthawk can tank around 1000dps passive a gankthron does about 1200dps, but that is vs 0% resist. a nighthawk can tank a gankthron passive? There's no way a nighhawk can recharge raw 1000dps, so if you say 1000 then you count resistances in. Then the 1200 break it, as resistances already counted in the 1000. The best ship would be the torp raven i guess, simply caus of ammo choice. Usually NHs have a hole with EM, to compensate that they'd have to fit 2 EM hardener, which hardly any NH pilot does, so pack caldari navy EM torps in your launchers, at least 3 BCU and decent missile/bs skills and the NH will melt away in no time. Mr Yakiya, I once forced a Megathron to turn and run after he scrammed and webbed me as I was jumping into a lo-sec system to run a mission. Thing was, I was in a passive Drake. After killing all his Ogre II's, and turning my missiles onto him, he eventually ran out of cap charges, about-faced and legged it. Tbh, I was quite surprised at the passive tanking ability of the Drake, although I had no scram or web fitted, which would gimp the tank somewhat. I can only imagine therefore that a passive Nighthawk [I own one, but haven't pvp'd in it yet] would easily tank a Megathron - ganked or otherwise. I may just have been up against a poorly fitted Megathron and/or a novice pilot, but either way, I was impressed
E Vile	Posted - 2007.09.23 13:26:00 - [28] Originally by: enymphia Originally by: Tunajuice What were you in? Not sure for minnie.. but something like an astrate could tank a nighthawk for a long time, while doing some nice DPS.... should be close ;P Did you try a minnie command ship with an injecter based tank? the nighthawk has very high natural resists vs astarte I've tanked a dmg fit astarte in a passive shield tanked Myrmidon. A nighthawk sure as hell can also. "The key to immortality is to first live a life worth remembering."
E Vile	Posted - 2007.09.23 13:34:00 - [29] Originally by: Yakia TovilToba Originally by: Selia Rain Except that the nighthawk will be tanking a spot more than 1k dps of pure therm+kin, of which it should easily have between 80-85% each to(which a single invuln accomplishes for both resists. The 1k dps tankable is easy to see in EFT, fit 3x LSE II, 2x CDFP I, 5x SPR II 1x EM and 1x invuln, and it's 1097 dps average tanked with no implants or faction gear, however, take the same and check it with a therm/kin damage distrobution instead of a normalized one... I'd wager the best ship against a nighthawk would probably be, yes, a lazor ship. Probably a geddon, and likely with Praetor IIs(the only possible use for htem?). Even so, the chance of breaking his tank is entirely skill dependant. Would be a good fight though, massive passive armor vs shields. 'Course the geddon could leave any time he wanted, and the nighthawk wouldn't have the same liberty. Unless you're going to argue that a nighthawk with tackle could tank any given battleship easily at the same time. 1x Invul and 1x EM is ofc. more common than 2 EM, but the point is with this setup the nighthawk tanks worse thank a drake if you take the base resistance/rechargerate. In the end it might come up with tanking around same, as it has 1 more lowslot but 1 less medslot. Of course you get nice values if you look at Thermal as it has it's best resistance there, but an average tanking ability throughout all damagetypes does not matter in combat against a raven or another ship that can switch ammo. The raven will fire it's first volly of mixed damagetypes. After the first volley it will switch to that damagetype that hurts most (which is easy to see in the log), that in most cases will be EM (and if the NH has 2 EM then there are only 3 medslots left for tank, you get it with kinetik or wherever the hole is). Ever had problems to take down a drake with em torps ? So why you should have problems with a NH (again, same EM resists like a drake but a slightly lower rechargerate, 1low vs 1med = about same EM tanking ability), unless you have noob skills and no damagemods. If you fit for tank and not gang mods like scram then I would disagree. It really depends on how the drake is fitted. "The key to immortality is to first live a life worth remembering."
Kuno Hida	Posted - 2007.09.23 13:35:00 - [30] The nighthawk's tank is still outstanding. At only t2 supplies, that nighthawk could have had easily 73-80% resists across the board, and still tank over 70 non-peak DPS. If he's a mission running bastard, he could be handing himself gang bonuses without real effort as well. A t2 fit sleipnir might be able to do the DPS to kill it, but the sacrifice of slots to tackling gear concerns me. Short answer: get two friends.

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