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Chobham	Posted - 2007.10.01 02:45:00 - [1] I don't understand the logic behind the real time skill system. It forces good players to play another game or buy a character. I literally have no reason to play the game until I get 5-10mil SP because of these reasons: 1. There isn't anything else for me to learn really 2. I don't need any more ISK, it's too easy to get with salvaging and playing the market 3. No corp worth joining will recruit me even though I'm more knowledgable than 90% of the people with 5 to 10 times more SP than me This leads me to just play other games until I get enough SP to join a decent corp. No, I wont settle for second rate by joining a noob corp because I can't stand being around people that aren't on the same skill/knowledge level. Yea that's a little conceited, but I can at least back it up.
Minee Ze	Posted - 2007.10.01 03:15:00 - [2] Edited by: Minee Ze on 01/10/2007 03:19:16 my good sir, as a player that just breached 1.5m sp I beg to differ. I am in with a small group of friends doing regular lowsec mining and forays into 0.0 for ratting, we have had ups and downs and we are looking to make our first alliance within the week. and yes that is how you get ISK, and as for recruitment or joining a corp; going into a corp with that attitude of course you won't get accepted; don't go in with that attitude approach a smaller corp that is on the up and up with the attitude that i am knowledgeable but ready to learn, because I can ensure you their is stuff in this game you do not know. like transversal velocities and it's uses or fining the hidden skills and bpo's.
Chobham	Posted - 2007.10.01 03:19:00 - [3] Edited by: Chobham on 01/10/2007 03:22:22 I hope you're kidding when you say that I don't know what transversal velocities are. Also, I'll go in and get recruited by being me. I don't wanna get stuck with a corp that recruits everyone or recruits people just based off of SP. In the other MMOs I've played I've been in good guilds/corps whatever you wanna call em because I didn't settle for the stupid guilds/corps. To be perfectly honest, you'd be lucky to have me in your corp and that's how I go looking for corps. I make them prove that they're worth my time, not the other way around.
Subruz	Posted - 2007.10.01 03:24:00 - [4] Edited by: Subruz on 01/10/2007 03:27:01 It doesn't take a whole lot of skillpoints to get into the game, that is if you read up a bit and plan your skill leveling accordingly. By specializing into what you wish to do you can quickly get going. For starters you can try doing missions or mining, get a little money. Once you know what you wish to do (PvP, trading, mining & whatnot) it won't take long before you're started. Sure it's slow at first, especially if you wish to train learning skills first (recommended) but it picks up the pace after a while. - The system has discouraged alot of players from the game no doubt, but EVE got one of the best communities around and is still going solid after many years. EDIT: As for corps that recruit after ammount of SP, many corps don't. The SP requirements are usually not set for the need of SP per se, but actual game experience (which is far more important).
Leora Nomen	Posted - 2007.10.01 04:00:00 - [5] Edited by: Leora Nomen on 01/10/2007 04:04:36 A corp that recruits everyone is not necessarily bad. Have you thought about the possibility that perhaps after recruitment such corp boots the 'muppets' and 'asshats' and can be actually a rather good corp? You make assumptions and build up prejudices based on these assumptions. Good corps do not recruit solely based on amount of sp but rather based on your history and what you have done in game. If you don't play and have no corp history and no friends to vouch for you you'll have very difficult time getting into them. Yeah so you know it's not just if the corp is good enough for you - but you have to show them that you're good enough for them not just because you say so during interview. How are you going to prove yourself without playing? So I'd suggest putting aside you prejudices against noobs corps and making a post in recruitment section detailing your situation. You can find a corp that suites you if you have patience and don't give up easily on it. guide to game time codes
Asestorian Minmatar Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.10.01 07:22:00 - [6] If you look at a lot of the corporations that ask for a specific amount of SP as a minimum, they'll often add at the end in brackets (may consider taking on those with less SP if they show that they are excellent PvPers) or some such. The SP limit is there basically because by that time most people tend to know roughly what they are doing. Corporations can only go with what is most common, and unfortunately before they hit around the 10-15m SP mark most people are clueless about the game. If you are as knowledgeable as you say you are, you should go back it up. Get out there and kill people (assuming that's what you want to do anyway) and prove that you are better than all the other n00bs. If you can prove that you're a cold blooded killer who knows what their doing but happens to have less SP than others, you have a decent chance of getting into a corporation in my opinion. Certainly, most corporations claim to want quality over quantity. It's just a case of finding out what they mean by quality. --- ---
Ancy Denaries Caldari Isseras Manufacture	Posted - 2007.10.01 07:58:00 - [7] I actually find the skillpoint system to be quite refreshing from, example, World of Grindcraft(TM).
Shanur Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.10.01 08:03:00 - [8] Here's a little tip. Since you claim to have no trouble at all raising the billions of cash you'll need to afford the high end ships and fittings you'll be expected to fly in a high end alliance like BoB, invest a small percentage of it (about 100-150m each i beleive i last saw pure skill enhancing implants go for. Of course the ones that also improve certain abilities like the snake implant set are more expensive) into +5 implants. That should improve your skill gain significantly.
Kalazar Amarr Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.10.01 11:15:00 - [9] What an incredibly arrogant person... Eh well, my advice would be to actually get out there and look for a corp if you want to get into one. Don't just sit there playing another game thinking that people will passively realise how god-like you are (if that is indeed the case) and flock to you en masse, offering you sacrifices and other appeasements if you'll give them the honour of joining their corporation. Not every corp looks for just SP, and even some that say they want a minimum of say 5mil SP often ask for that so that they have proof you've been in game that long and hopefully know what the hell you're on about, they may be willing to make an exception (it's also so that they know you can (hopefully) fly and fit something that isn't a noob ship). Your attitude is another major factor in recruitment. You could have billions of SP and still not be recruited by a majority of corps for being an asshat, or you could have 1.5mil SP and get recruited by a major corporation because they like the sound of you, and you're a decent person. Also, with regards to getting SP faster. Buy implants, it's as simple as that, train cybernetics up a few levels (shouldn't take you too long to get to lvl 3) and then plug a set of +3's in, train to lvl 4, plug some +4's in and train to lvl 5, then buy a set of +5's and plug those in to get your SP's flowing in. You're apparently wallowing in ISK, so that shouldn't be too hard for you. ----------------------------------------------
Stroker Vherok'r Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2007.10.01 11:23:00 - [10] It would seem you don't have the patience to play this game properly. Go fly around and learn something.
Spigoe Liberty Rogues	Posted - 2007.10.01 11:45:00 - [11] Drop that attitude of yours and you can get a place in LR, keep it and I'll have to use a locator agent to find you, and then pod you until you quit.
Frelix	Posted - 2007.10.01 11:54:00 - [12] Originally by: Ancy Denaries I actually find the skillpoint system to be quite refreshing from, example, World of Grindcraft(TM). I just started EVE this past weekend, and I have to agree. I rather like the skill point system, its very different than anything that's out there. I've been an Everquest player (both of em) since the originals launch, but I can honestly say I've enjoyed myself more this past few days, than I had been in EQ for a while. I think the lack of "grind" for xp, has a fair amount to do with it. I'm new yet so, my view is probably colored by glasses with rose tinting but.. I like the skill system thus far.
Kazuma Saruwatari	Posted - 2007.10.01 12:25:00 - [13] Sheesh, such attitude. No wonder you have trouble finding a good corp - Odd Pod Out, a blog of EVE Online
Estel Arador Minmatar EA Corp	Posted - 2007.10.01 12:37:00 - [14] If you want more SP, use your uber-iskmaking skills to get a few billion isk and buy a character with more SP. =AFK=
JonnyRandom	Posted - 2007.10.01 12:49:00 - [15] Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari Sheesh, such attitude. No wonder you have trouble finding a good corp ditto. the only corp that might accept you is one full of other punk jackarses. don't expect to be very successful in this game with that kind of 'holier than thou' attitude. all this bulls* that you say about knowing more than others is exactly what it is, bulls*. knowledge that you might have gotten from guides, forums, and other more experienced players means nothing unless you have experience. don't waste your time, find what you like to do. you want to kill people? get yourself in a good frigate and go hunt in low sec. prove to yourself first that you are as good as you claim to be, before you go mouthing off like that.
Sakura Nihil Stimulus	Posted - 2007.10.01 13:05:00 - [16] I'll throw an idea your way . If you are so sure of your own capabilities, try leading others - start your own corp. If someone won't accept you due to skillpoints, form a corp and go shoot them up . Eve Golden Rules
Dretzle Omega Caldari Psychedelic Party Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.01 13:27:00 - [17] Better yet, share the secret ISK making tip with low SP with me. ------------------- 4 8 15 16 23 42 108
Daeva Vios Ardent Adversary Anvil.	Posted - 2007.10.01 13:34:00 - [18] Edited by: Daeva Vios on 01/10/2007 13:34:50 The secret is to play the market. Unfortunately, if you're no good at it (and a lot aren't...a whole lot) you end up making no money or, worse, losing all your money to people like me. I will greatly enjoy taking it from you.
Ard UnjiiGo The Bastards	Posted - 2007.10.01 14:59:00 - [19] Originally by: Chobham Yea that's a little conceited, but I can at least back it up. Well let's give you that chance . I've been playing around 2 months; so not much longer than you I'm guessing. Convo me in game (this is my main...is Chobham yours?) when you have however many SPs you feel you need to "compete". If your isk making powers are as great as you say you should have no problem affording expensive implants (I wear only +1s since I have been living in low sec since day 1) and catching me quickly in SPs. I'll happily duel you in similiar class ships and you can "back it up" that you don't need game experience only SPs to win. This should be easy for you. From the tone of your post I'm guessing I'm old enough to be your father so I'm not really as sharp mentally anymore as you obviously are . Let's see if experience is as unnecessary a teacher as you say. Of course my guess is you won't be around long enough for us to find out. EVE is not a game for those that need instant gratification. "the Yarr is strong with this one" -Azirapheal
Cypherous Minmatar Liberty Rogues	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:05:00 - [20] Originally by: Spigoe Drop that attitude of yours and you can get a place in LR, keep it and I'll have to use a locator agent to find you, and then pod you until you quit. Now now share the podkills :P --------- Liberty Rogues Website
Riese Blecja Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.01 18:01:00 - [21] Any corp with half a brain will take you even as a newbie with a million SP. You can be part of something big, even if you're in a frigate, and I'm sorry that you haven't found a group that will take you in. Really though, the realtime skill system is a bit annoying until real life forces you to take a week/month-long break. At that point it immediately transforms into the best thing about the game. There really is no feeling quite like leaving for a month and coming back to find that you have new toys or are that much closer to a Dreadnaught or something.
Helen Hunts Gallente Red Dragon Mining inc	Posted - 2007.10.01 19:30:00 - [22] Edited by: Helen Hunts on 01/10/2007 19:31:38 and for those of us who actually have to pay attention to RL, there's planning skill training with EVEMon. Right now, I've got skills planned around my work life until sometime in December. (Fairly short term, I know) Pick your priorities and shuffle skills to fit your needs. And as for needing 8.5-10million SP to join a corp....well, the proper word won't get past the profanity filters. I've trained a few noobs and corrected the education of a few not-quite-noobs. The result is I've made a few good connections in several corps and regions. The player skill is more important than the SP. Player skill has no time clock, but is learned thorough actually stepping outside and getting bloodied up a little so you can figure out how best to avoid getting bloodied up. 56 million SP chars can be had without a bit of combat (GTC sales to buy a char or all the skillbooks, or the lame, illegal Ebay) but being familiar with and instantly responding to a situation is not in any skillbook. Running with a corp helps protect one from small mistakes that new players make. My corp has a couple trial account players who we're having to train up. This is not a problem, but then again, they don't bring in an attitude. If one of them started with the massive attitude non-stop....well, they might find themselves back in Velators and Ibises and out in the cold right quick. (Education, one way or another) _______________________________ Mine da rocks, make more ships. Pop da rats, make more rigs. Sell da gear, make more money. Any Questions?
Tarazed Aquilae	Posted - 2007.10.01 20:49:00 - [23] For what itÆs worthà In my limited observations, Corporations (particularly ones in 0.0) need organizers and leaders more than they need high SP soldiers. If you can calmly and effectively quickly organize a gang to fly out, meet, and defeat, invading enemy gangs. If you can track the supplies available for a corporations POSes. If you can arrange to keep 0.0 station markets well stocked with goods. Then you will be such an asset that no oneÆs going to notice you are doing it all in a T1 cruiser. Here are the reasons the skill system works like it does. Experience has taught game designers that a big part of the appeal of a game is in growing and developing a character. That is what keeps people coming back. In a game like Eve, there has to be some reason to protect your characterÆs reputation. Without this there is no reason to concern yourself with security status or with your reputation with other players. The ôDungeons and Dragonsö model that has been used in most games forces people to perform certain activities to advance. This XP grind turns off many people. So, Eve uses a time based system. This can be frustrating because you sometimes have to wait months for a ship you want, but it makes for better game play than expecting someone to kill the same mob over and over. (For people who are willing to grind, Eve lets you hunt rats and run missions for ISK.) In short: They had to have some kind of character development system and a time based skill system seemed preferable to yet another XP grinding game. I, and most other Eve players, think they were right.
Christina Bamar Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.10.01 20:51:00 - [24] Like the others have said, there are plenty of good corps which don't have a solid SP requirement. The thing is that any good corp without an SP requirement also picks people carefully. When you're recruiting low SP people you want people you can teach and mould easily. Having a big ego and a complete lack of patience tends to make these two things impossible, hence your lack of good recruitment offers.
NightF0x Gallente Chicken Coup Raiders	Posted - 2007.10.02 00:41:00 - [25] can i have your stuff?
Billy Sastard Amarr Life. Universe. Everything. Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.02 01:25:00 - [26] Originally by: Kalazar What an incredibly arrogant person... QFT Also, if it is that easy for you to make loads of ISK then why don't you just buy a character with the skills you want? -=^=-
Pirate Tom	Posted - 2007.10.02 03:15:00 - [27] OMGz No powergrinding to level cap in less than a week! What a horrible game! You better quit before you start having fun and look like a complete and total hypocrite.
Val Vympel	Posted - 2007.10.02 03:47:00 - [28] Originally by: Ancy Denaries I actually find the skillpoint system to be quite refreshing from, example, World of Grindcraft(TM). Agreed.... This system is quite refreshing. I almost gave up on MMORPGS because of "grinding". World of Warcraft is bad....but in my opinion try City of Heroes(I'm still having nightmares about the grind in that game)for the absolute most horrific grind you will encounter.(starts to tremble over the memory)
Chobham	Posted - 2007.10.02 05:29:00 - [29] Edited by: Chobham on 02/10/2007 05:34:24 Edited by: Chobham on 02/10/2007 05:31:53 This game is fun no doubt, just a little disheartening when people don't consider you because of your SP and there's nothing you can do about it really. For the people that said for me to prove myself well I did, I went out in low sec today and killed some guy in an atron that came after me who was playing back in 2006.
ZerKar Caldari Zen'Tar	Posted - 2007.10.02 06:35:00 - [30] The logic is that if it takes you X amount of years to learn the skills that make you an awesome player and you pay for Y months of those years in order to progress thus and cannot "rush" your way through these skills in any way then CCP gets very wealthy off of you. Seems like it works very well IMO. I have always thought it would be very interesting for a person to work up the cash to get all the skills they wanted then go on a training spree. Hardly play EVE at all during that time, just log to switch skills, then at some date 2 to 3 years down the line come on and actually Play the game with fairly uber skills. It would just be an odd testiment to the strange design of that skill system. However, if there is anything I find most irksome about the skill system it is not really the time or even the money making scheme it is the fact that I will never be able to beat players who are older than me if they have been keeping on their skill learning at least as much as I have. Someone older will always be dealing me more damage, tanking mine better, and using better ships/modules than me. They will likely even have more and more powerful allies and there is NOTHING I can do to ever catch up or surpass them, ever. There is no way I can work to become better than them. They would have to stop learning and playing for a couple years and let me catch up. That is, for me, the most frustrating aspect of the skill system. ------------------------------------------------ everything is never Nothing is Never Not ------------------------------------------------

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