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Danari
Amarr
Viper Squad
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.10.04 07:12:00 -
[61]
If nos were changed to always supply cap and not touch the opposing cap I'd be happy.
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Krist Valentine
Amarr
Freelancing Opportunists
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Posted - 2007.10.04 07:13:00 -
[62]
 Originally by: Danari
If nos were changed to always supply cap and not touch the opposing cap I'd be happy.
Exactly. That's exactly what I want.
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pandymen
Caldari
Red Dwarf Mining Corporation
space weaponry and trade
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Posted - 2007.10.04 08:36:00 -
[63]
I would just like to point out that caldari recons, while useful in gangs because they can jam so well, have absolutely no damage output/tank whatsoever. The force recon falcon has a massive 2 launcher slots. The Rook has a whopping 5...giving it less damage than a caracal. Neither has drone bays. Each must use all its mids and lows for ewar.
So please, don't complain if the curse/pilgrim are no longer able to solo. The setup above would be great in a gang and allow you to take down someone's tank while staying out of harms way. If you get primaried in a gang by the rest of the enemy fleet...well, now you know what it feels like to fly a rook.
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Eben Rochelle
Gallente
Free Mercenaries Union
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Posted - 2007.10.04 09:33:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Flyit
Personally I think the nerf has affected the Curse more than the Pilgrim.
Without the energy from the nos, the Curse finds it difficult to maintain enough cap to run sensor dampeners and a MWD. (The SD fit is the most common setup I've come across)
But with the Pilgrim...I'm struggling to see much of a difference. Just fit 2 unstable neuts and one tech II small. All you're really doing is replacing a midslot with a cap booster. Once the opponent is out of cap just leave the 1 small neut running and you've easily enough cap to maintain your very decent tank
And there we have it. could you please tell me which other ship is able to run RSD's and a MWD indefinately ? this is simply a whine about overpowered ships being nerfed.
cant blame you, if my wtfbbq mobile had got nerfed i would cry too.
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Shiken Kan
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Posted - 2007.10.04 12:36:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Krist Valentine
Originally by: Danari
If nos were changed to always supply cap and not touch the opposing cap I'd be happy.
Exactly. That's exactly what I want.
aaah why didn't you say that earlier? :p
here you go:
hi
1 covops cloak
2 medium nos 2
1 medium neut 2
mid
1 named 10mn mwd
1 warp jammer 2
3 muon coil damps
low
3 cpr 2
1 dcu 2
1 mar 2
capstable without nossing if you don't run the repper/neut and almost capstable if you run everything. decreases enemy targeting range by about 86% with rigs.
oh and when you now complain that the tank is weaker then it was before then i'll tell you that's called a tradeoff a feature of shipdesign most other pilots had to adapt to and now it might be your turn to do so.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.04 13:02:00 -
[66]
Originally by: pandymen
I would just like to point out that caldari recons, while useful in gangs because they can jam so well, have absolutely no damage output/tank whatsoever. The force recon falcon has a massive 2 launcher slots. The Rook has a whopping 5...giving it less damage than a caracal. Neither has drone bays. Each must use all its mids and lows for ewar.
So please, don't complain if the curse/pilgrim are no longer able to solo. The setup above would be great in a gang and allow you to take down someone's tank while staying out of harms way. If you get primaried in a gang by the rest of the enemy fleet...well, now you know what it feels like to fly a rook.
The setup above would be ok at best in gang. Unlike caldari recons which are awesome in gangs the pilgrim is not. The balance of that was it was a good solo ship. Like the domi is terrible in fleet but great in solo or the eagle thats perfect for fleet but terrible for solo. Ishtar great in solo terrible in fleet. etc etc goes on and on. The curse and especially the pilgrim are no longer a great solo ship or even duel gang recon ship.
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Cailais
Amarr
VITOC
Fang Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.04 14:33:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Eben Rochelle
Originally by: Flyit
Personally I think the nerf has affected the Curse more than the Pilgrim.
Without the energy from the nos, the Curse finds it difficult to maintain enough cap to run sensor dampeners and a MWD. (The SD fit is the most common setup I've come across)
But with the Pilgrim...I'm struggling to see much of a difference. Just fit 2 unstable neuts and one tech II small. All you're really doing is replacing a midslot with a cap booster. Once the opponent is out of cap just leave the 1 small neut running and you've easily enough cap to maintain your very decent tank
And there we have it. could you please tell me which other ship is able to run RSD's and a MWD indefinately ? this is simply a whine about overpowered ships being nerfed.
cant blame you, if my wtfbbq mobile had got nerfed i would cry too.
The damp nerf is incoming, Arazu pilots had best stock up on tissues....
C.
- sig designer - eve mail |
Flyit
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Posted - 2007.10.05 12:35:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Depp Knight
Originally by: Flyit
Personally I think the nerf has affected the Curse more than the Pilgrim.
Without the energy from the nos, the Curse finds it difficult to maintain enough cap to run sensor dampeners and a MWD. (The SD fit is the most common setup I've come across)
But with the Pilgrim...I'm struggling to see much of a difference. Just fit 2 unstable neuts and one tech II small. All you're really doing is replacing a midslot with a cap booster. Once the opponent is out of cap just leave the 1 small neut running and you've easily enough cap to maintain your very decent tank
You seem a little off track. See that mid slot is very important for the pilgrim as its a close range ship. TP's and damps do little effect when your in web range you know. The 2 neut 1 nos setup with cap booster would of work before nos nerf as your nos's would still be giving you cap to relieve you from the drian you get by using nos's. Because your using 2 neuts with bonuses, you wont be getting many cycles of nos.
A 2 nos 1 neut set up which was used before nos nerf is still the best option for the pilgrim.
I'm not really sure what you're getting at? You realise my mentioned setup was 2 medium neuts and 1 small neut? Not a small NOS.
You say that the mid slot is very important to the Pilgrim, but then go on to say that TD and SD aren't of much use in web range? So surely that means you can easily sacrifice a TD anyway, since you're going to be in web range
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Flyit
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Posted - 2007.10.05 12:38:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Eben Rochelle
Originally by: Flyit
Personally I think the nerf has affected the Curse more than the Pilgrim.
Without the energy from the nos, the Curse finds it difficult to maintain enough cap to run sensor dampeners and a MWD. (The SD fit is the most common setup I've come across)
But with the Pilgrim...I'm struggling to see much of a difference. Just fit 2 unstable neuts and one tech II small. All you're really doing is replacing a midslot with a cap booster. Once the opponent is out of cap just leave the 1 small neut running and you've easily enough cap to maintain your very decent tank
And there we have it. could you please tell me which other ship is able to run RSD's and a MWD indefinately ? this is simply a whine about overpowered ships being nerfed.
cant blame you, if my wtfbbq mobile had got nerfed i would cry too.
And how on Earth am I wining? I didn't say other ships could run 3 SD and a MWD indefinitely.
My post was merely stating that I think the NOS nerf has affected the Curse more than the Pilgrim.
The Curse needed a nerf, I'm not complaining. So take your attitude and shove it up your arse. 
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Ashaz
Mindstar Technology
YouWhat
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Posted - 2007.10.05 13:12:00 -
[70]
Originally by: goodby4u
The pilgrim doesnt need to be able to solo...ITS A RECON SHIP.
so what is it you suggest we do with it, that can't be done with a cov ops frig for less then 10% of the cost and skill?
__________________________________
Gallente by birth. Amarr by choice.
iDrone |
Lord Rahvin
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Posted - 2007.10.05 15:08:00 -
[71]
The only reason they did the nos nerf is because people are too stupid to counter it. I'm sorry if i insult anyone but its true. Wanna know what stops a dom with 6 heavy nos's? 1 (ONE) target disruptor. For fleet battles have a scorpion at 100km scraming. Or just keep at range, and be smart enough not to jump on top of a vamping dom or another nos ship. Besides that. I have a bunch of friends with passive drakes that dont even need a single ounce of cap. They just passive tank their shields, and their good to go. The launchers dont require cap to fire. So still full dps. The only thing it does is prevent them from warp scraming or webbing. In my opinon the nos nerf was only done to satisfy the noobs.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.05 15:18:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Flyit
Originally by: Depp Knight
Originally by: Flyit
Personally I think the nerf has affected the Curse more than the Pilgrim.
Without the energy from the nos, the Curse finds it difficult to maintain enough cap to run sensor dampeners and a MWD. (The SD fit is the most common setup I've come across)
But with the Pilgrim...I'm struggling to see much of a difference. Just fit 2 unstable neuts and one tech II small. All you're really doing is replacing a midslot with a cap booster. Once the opponent is out of cap just leave the 1 small neut running and you've easily enough cap to maintain your very decent tank
You seem a little off track. See that mid slot is very important for the pilgrim as its a close range ship. TP's and damps do little effect when your in web range you know. The 2 neut 1 nos setup with cap booster would of work before nos nerf as your nos's would still be giving you cap to relieve you from the drian you get by using nos's. Because your using 2 neuts with bonuses, you wont be getting many cycles of nos.
A 2 nos 1 neut set up which was used before nos nerf is still the best option for the pilgrim.
I'm not really sure what you're getting at? You realise my mentioned setup was 2 medium neuts and 1 small neut? Not a small NOS.
You say that the mid slot is very important to the Pilgrim, but then go on to say that TD and SD aren't of much use in web range? So surely that means you can easily sacrifice a TD anyway, since you're going to be in web range
Because 2 TD's in web range helps alot. 1 TP in web range only helps minimally. Now because of nos nerf and now because you have to use a combo of neuts, injectors and to also drain your own cap to be able to use nos your losing that 2 TD. Also some pilots fitted damps not to reduce the chance of getting locked but to protect their drones. Nos nerf has nerfed that ability, thought still usable but not visable.
Yeh I saw the small neut. You do realise your cap won last long yeh? What if the hostile has 1 nos or 1 neut as well and cap injector? A bs would own that setup. As I said 2 neuts and 1 nos could work pre nos nerf because the nos would actually work the whole fight until the hostile ran out of cap.
Also because of nos nerf the pilgrim needs to use some neuts and cap intensive module to reduce its own cap its also prevented the pilgrim from using a mwd. Before like most ships the pilgrim could tightly fit a mwd and a decent little tank. Now because you have to fit a med injector and injectors cost 150pg and the pilgrim only got a 100pg increase (which is totally beyond me. Seriously the ship has to fit a 150pg module so ccp decide to only give the pilgrim only a 100pg increase. No one else sees something wrong with that?)
Anyway now the pilgrim struggles to do that. Also I like to mention that the mwd penalty of cap actually really hurts the pilgrim now. To try and explain it simply, because nos only works by % your nos(S) have less effect if you have a smaller amount of total cap. Say the target only has 10% more cap than you and to make it easier to explain that’s 100 more total cap than yours. You think you nos’s will give you the full 72 vampire ability? No because your increase your cap while decreasing theirs. So you will find you probably will get like 50 cap. Imagine if you had 2 x nos’s? What a waste. I hope that make sense, it’s hard to explain in writing. Test it out and you will see.
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Borasao
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Posted - 2007.10.05 17:13:00 -
[73]
Edited by: Borasao on 05/10/2007 17:13:26
Originally by: Krist Valentine
Originally by: Danari
If nos were changed to always supply cap and not touch the opposing cap I'd be happy.
Exactly. That's exactly what I want.
So... a high slot cap booster... or high slot cap recharger.
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Flyit
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Posted - 2007.10.06 00:22:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Depp Knight
Because 2 TD's in web range helps alot. 1 TP in web range only helps minimally. Now because of nos nerf and now because you have to use a combo of neuts, injectors and to also drain your own cap to be able to use nos your losing that 2 TD. Also some pilots fitted damps not to reduce the chance of getting locked but to protect their drones. Nos nerf has nerfed that ability, thought still usable but not visable.
Yeh I saw the small neut. You do realise your cap won last long yeh? What if the hostile has 1 nos or 1 neut as well and cap injector? A bs would own that setup. As I said 2 neuts and 1 nos could work pre nos nerf because the nos would actually work the whole fight until the hostile ran out of cap.
Also because of nos nerf the pilgrim needs to use some neuts and cap intensive module to reduce its own cap its also prevented the pilgrim from using a mwd. Before like most ships the pilgrim could tightly fit a mwd and a decent little tank. Now because you have to fit a med injector and injectors cost 150pg and the pilgrim only got a 100pg increase (which is totally beyond me. Seriously the ship has to fit a 150pg module so ccp decide to only give the pilgrim only a 100pg increase. No one else sees something wrong with that?)
Anyway now the pilgrim struggles to do that. Also I like to mention that the mwd penalty of cap actually really hurts the pilgrim now. To try and explain it simply, because nos only works by % your nos(S) have less effect if you have a smaller amount of total cap. Say the target only has 10% more cap than you and to make it easier to explain thatĘs 100 more total cap than yours. You think you nosĘs will give you the full 72 vampire ability? No because your increase your cap while decreasing theirs. So you will find you probably will get like 50 cap. Imagine if you had 2 x nosĘs? What a waste. I hope that make sense, itĘs hard to explain in writing. Test it out and you will see.
Thanks for a nicely thought out reply. Makes a change.
Firstly, a BS would beat that setup, but how many recons could solo a well set up BS? Of course I'm not saying it's doesn't happen, but the law of averages would fall in favour of the BS. Pre NOS nerf also.
The powergrid increase is stupid, I agree. I ended up having to fit a small cap booster, which is fine for maintain the TDs, web, scram and tank. But like you said, if the opponent is in a larger ship and has neuts fitted, you are in trouble. But surely that was the case before?
As pre nerf, you have to pick your targets. Yes the nos nerf has slightly limited those you could hunt down, but I still feel it's affected the Curse more in terms of soloing
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