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Chen Hao
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Posted - 2007.10.21 22:54:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Chen Hao on 21/10/2007 23:06:36
Edited by: Chen Hao on 21/10/2007 23:04:26
I didn't read the forums until one fateful night last week when I was bored out of my skull and decided I'd take a peek at the Ships and Modules forum. To my UTTER HORROR I found people talking complete **** about Amarr ships. Buff this and Buff that...and reeling off endless trash from EFT. I happen not only think but know for FACT that amarr ships are absolutely superb...if you think otherwise then gtfo :) Its this simple.I've read pages of how lasers are apparently "********" and Amarr suffer from HUGE cap issues and that they have SEVERE lack of midslots WHICH MAKES IT IMPOSSIBLE TO POSSIBLY EVEN CONSIDER PLAYING THE GAME AS AMARR.(<<Sarcasm intended)
So where to start? Lasers? Ok :). Sure blasters do more damage...and ACs use no cap. But Lasers hit as stated MANY times at huge range in comparison. Mega Pulse II for example, with conflag (or AmarrNavy Multi etc) Hit at 25km...PERFECT pvp optimal, it hits further than a T2 point already. Fine the 'geddon has trouble fitting a propulsion mod...but in a larger BS/Command based gang engagment I dont care what anyone says but the only reason a BS would have an MWD is to get in range....of which the geddon has no need todo. As far as medium lasers go...Heavy Pulse IIs...hit out at 25km with scorch for superb damage and great tracking espesh at that range tbfh. A Heavy Pulse II Zealot, Absolution, Harby and so on can track vagabonds (zealots do this at 35km) and the majority of nano HACs Ishtars etc etc etc. As for the damage type? Who SERIOUSLY tanks EM super hard anyway yes it has to be said EANMs do boost EM up high in some cases..whereas the majority of ships simply tank Kin-Therm and Explosive..you EFT lovers out there will find that EM is often a mid range resist on most T2 ships...apart from Minnie but as a counter T2 Amarr ships have huge explosive resists...so again POINT NULL AND VOID.
Now as for laser cap use....WTF HAS EVERYONE BEEN SMOKING!? Last time I looked a Heavy Pulse Absolution can perma run its setup with 800s....and is as efficient as all the other commands in that devision IN FACT I put a medium neut on my Absolution and NEVER have serious cap issues (unless I'm being neuted by a BS or something along those lines...this is irrelivant though as most ships will have trouble with that anyway :))..tis a little thing called managing your ship properly. I heard someone say that the Absolution was hideously cap booster 800 dependent...so dependent on cap boosters in fact that it can perma run a medium armour rep without any cap mods and whilst firing a full rack of conflag loaded heavy pulse it lasts for 4 minutes..whereas the "FABLED" Pwnastarte can only run MARII and a Rack of Void Neutrons for around the 1 minute 30 mark with MWD fitted but not on? Yet ofc thats not cap booster dependant its COMPLETELY IMBA! (<<Note Sarcasm) I'm not taking anything away from the Astarte I think its a great ship but people need to stop being so stupid and either play Amarr ships properly (and yes woe betide actually PvP with a good fit) or gtfo :).
As for the T1 Amarr ships every talks about the Abaddon having appalling cap im fully aware that at times it struggles..but many people have discussed the plated Mega Pulse II abaddon which is a fantastic ship and yes is cap booster dependent like the majority of other BS in the game (I dont care who you are its true). The tachabaddon? ..its the best sniper BS in the game to be frank. Fitting issues? Lies. 1 RCUII Gives you enough PG to fit 8 Tachs...that leaves 6 lows...4 Heat Sinks, 2xCPRII. 3xCCC Rigs. MIDS - 2 x Cap Recharger Tracking Comp and Sensor Booster...Max Range 165(ish) and Lock range of 175...and you can fire those guns forever :) Not to mention with Amarr Navy Multi...Your lookin at the best part of 1000dps (Yes thats right 15x Damage mod and 6.5 second ROF) I've watched the Tachabaddon melt fleets. As for Megapulse/Dual Heavy Pulse and the 'geddon..again I fit a Heavy..
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Chen Hao
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Posted - 2007.10.21 22:55:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Chen Hao on 21/10/2007 23:04:46
..Neut to my geddon of which has 30k armour and a LARII ....and does again the best part of 1000dps and has no cap issues atall. So Thats Lasers Done :). What Next? The Ships :)
I've heard "Zealot needs another Turret" and the Apoc is ****...oh wait that bit was right D: >_< But a whole host of unholy sins that amarr have apparently inherited are complete arse. Tbh as far as the Amarr fleet goes I think its got some fantastic ships that seriously excell in PvP. Starting with cruisers? It has to be said an omen would struggle to down a thorax its gallente rival...however the Arbitrator is one of the best cruisers in game versatile and increadably fun :). As for the BCs. The Proph is a pile of **** but I dont care because the harby is a great ship solo or in gang. High dps...and yes omg 4 mids, the guys that struggle to contemplate pvp without 983426787mids will like this one :D. After having cleared up why lasers are far from nerfed you can now see why the harby is a fantastic ship especially in the capable hands of someone that actually plays EVE rather than sit around ****ing about on EFT all day.
BS? Well as above really the 'geddon is a top notch ship 5 Heavy Drones...7 Mega Pulse with identical HPs of the FOTM PlaterThron better resists due to its Awesome 8 Lows. Does a fraction DPS less than the mega with ... over 2x the range? And looks like a giant ***** in the bargain what more could you ask for. Abaddon (See Above ^^).
The Absolution. One of the best commands in the game, Commands 5 Absolution is a ****ing monster and its Commands 4 counterpart isnt far behind. 80% + Resists across the board? I saw some guy talking bull**** about the Astarte melting an Abso because it would just orbit at 2km and out track it. If an Abso pilot gets himself into the position to be soloed by an astarte and he hasnt got a web fitted he's doing alot of things wrong...Afterburner or MWD (if you insist) for bigger gangs..but for small command/BS gangs webz tbh.
Zealot? One of the fastest HACs in game...7 Lows..with a CPRII 2xCCC and a Cap Recharger in the mids you can EASILY run your MWD and Guns forever...no need for web as your pulse track cruisers without any problem as far as DPS goes? I hear so much about the deimos...when infact its a complete LOL boat because people seem to think fitting a gank neutron deimos is win in actual fact its complete fail....a zealot would drop a deimos well before it even started digging into it namely because it scorches at 30KM and goes as fast. I also hear that HACs are meant to be damage dealers? As far as I can see HACs are anti-support boats (unless your in a sizable nano gang then you have enough dps to break large targets tanks) Commands and BS for damage ships in all honesty...the amount of times ive watched deimos' gleefully MWD towards me and be dead in seconds because they're completely useless is actually commical.
Whats left? Recons...I have no intrest in recons...I've popped 3 falcons today nuff said. (Although I think the nano damper curse pre NOS nerf was hilariously lame) All I'm trying to say is...people can throw EFT and Endlessly number crunch but that doesnt count for **** when you actually play EVE imo its pilot skill and how well he thinks with the ships hes in. I happened to choose amarr and I couldn't be happier with the choice. EVERYONE Stop playing EFT Games and join what we like to call "Giant Space Chess" Its much better than talking trash on the forums about how you cant pvp because it's the "Ship" your in...take a look at your own skill as a player.
Final Thought, Im fully expecting to be flamed. Bring it on >_<.
AMARR FOR THE ****ING WIN.
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tarin adur
Gallente
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2007.10.21 22:57:00 -
[3]
Edited by: tarin adur on 21/10/2007 22:56:54
WTF? that wall of text scares me.
Get some damn paragraphs! I hope you dont expect people to actually read that.
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Fon Revedhort
Aeria Gloris Inc
United Legion
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Posted - 2007.10.21 22:59:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: tarin adur
Edited by: tarin adur on 21/10/2007 22:56:54
WTF? that wall of text scares me.
Get some damn paragraphs! I hope you dont expect people to actually read that.
It's yet another 'amarr is fine' thread.
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mallina
Caldari
Core Contingency
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:00:00 -
[5]
Rage explosion ftw
You bring up some fair points, though the wall of text hurts my eyes 
Amarr are extremely underrated
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Karyuudo Tydraad
Caldari
Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:02:00 -
[6]
You know, I logged in to post about how hideous your wall of text was, and immediately following that, you posted a second wall of text. A quick glance over your paragraph from hell is a pretty good indicator that you do not quite understand the dynamics of combat you're claiming favour Amarr. But if you really expect me to break it down any further, you're going to have to adjust your format.
PS: Capital letters add emphasis, but they really don't help sway the audience. Quite the contrary, in fact.
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Hudsonn
Infinitus Odium
The Church.
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:35:00 -
[7]
lol chen.
___________________________
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Cailais
Amarr
VITOC
Fang Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:39:00 -
[8]
Yes, nothing wrong with Amarr - just pop onto SISI and you'll see countless Amarr ships being flown, its just like wall to wall Amarr - oh hold on a sec...Actually Im talking rubbish...theres a couple of Abbadons and erm....well that's it.
C.
- sig designer - eve mail |
Chen Hao
Amarr
Core Contingency
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:47:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Hudsonn
lol chen.
Haha. Dude I have no idea why i'm posting on the forums must have been something I ate. D: I'll stick to pvping in my 'nerfed' Amarr ships.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Uninvited Guests
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:48:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Chen Hao
Edited by: Chen Hao on 21/10/2007 23:31:34
Oh My God, Totally a new topic! "Amarr Don't Need To Be Buffed, Because They Are Actually Fine. Discuss"
Oh noes an Alt-forum warrior. We amarr simply fail to respond to your overwelming arguments. We give up, you win.
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Lil Mina
Caldari
FireTech
Pure.
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:50:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Chen Hao
Originally by: Hudsonn
lol chen.
Haha. Dude I have no idea why i'm posting on the forums must have been something I ate. D: I'll stick to pvping in my 'nerfed' Amarr ships.
less forums, more booze/drugs.
WIN!
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mallina
Caldari
Core Contingency
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:50:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Cailais
Yes, nothing wrong with Amarr - just pop onto SISI and you'll see countless Amarr ships being flown, its just like wall to wall Amarr - oh hold on a sec...Actually Im talking rubbish...theres a couple of Abbadons and erm....well that's it.
Because SiSi is a 100% accurate representation of combat in EVE.
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Chen Hao
Amarr
Core Contingency
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:51:00 -
[13]
Apparently I'm an Alt! Awesome. :D
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Lil Mina
Caldari
FireTech
Pure.
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Posted - 2007.10.21 23:54:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Chen Hao
Apparently I'm an Alt! Awesome. :D
piwate(alt)!!!!
PIWATE!!!
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Sarah Benthwell
Dolaris Holdings
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Posted - 2007.10.22 15:19:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Chen Hao
Apparently I'm an Alt! Awesome. :D
grr, stop stealing my alt status.
Yes, amarr are fine. It's only EFT noobs who think they suck
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shig |
Sangus Victus
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Posted - 2007.10.22 15:52:00 -
[16]
i think the amarr are actually not fine.
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Sarah Benthwell
Dolaris Holdings
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Posted - 2007.10.22 16:08:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Sangus Victus
i think the amarr are actually not fine.
GOOD FOR YOU MATE. YOU'RE AWESOME A++ WOULD READ AGAIN
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shigs |
shinsushi
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Posted - 2007.10.22 16:16:00 -
[18]
No, they aren't.
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Sarah Benthwell
Dolaris Holdings
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Posted - 2007.10.22 16:17:00 -
[19]
Originally by: shinsushi
No, they aren't.
My sentiments exactly
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shigs |
FT Diomedes
Gallente
Ductus Exemplo
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Posted - 2007.10.22 16:21:00 -
[20]
I must be the only person on these forums who drools when he looks at the Amarr ships. I am especially envious of the Abaddon and the Harbinger. I already have Gallente, Caldari and Minmatar accounts, I wish I had an Amarr one. The only thing that turned me off was the backstory...
One of these days I will have to crosstrain Amarr or get an Amarr character.
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Improvize. Adapt. Overcome. |
Chen Hao
Amarr
Core Contingency
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Posted - 2007.10.22 16:44:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
...a pretty good indicator that you do not quite understand the dynamics of combat you're claiming favour Amarr.
Yep I haven't got a clue tbh it's not like I can pvp or anything I get completely owned everytime I try...Oh no wait. I'm not a complete idiot and actually set my ships up properly. Ever thought it might be the pilot not the ship? >_<
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shinsushi
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Posted - 2007.10.22 16:52:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Chen Hao
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
...a pretty good indicator that you do not quite understand the dynamics of combat you're claiming favour Amarr.
Yep I haven't got a clue tbh it's not like I can pvp or anything I get completely owned everytime I try...Oh no wait. I'm not a complete idiot and actually set my ships up properly. Ever thought it might be the pilot not the ship? >_<
Ever think its the ship and not the pilot?
Care to share with us these super-pwnage setups that keep getting brought up in "amarr sucks." Or would your response to this be "I am not gonna let everyone know" or "its obvious" or some other non-answer.
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Chen Hao
Amarr
Core Contingency
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Posted - 2007.10.22 16:53:00 -
[23]
What would you like to know? :) >_<
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shinsushi
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Posted - 2007.10.22 17:15:00 -
[24]
Edited by: shinsushi on 22/10/2007 17:16:30
Originally by: Chen Hao
What would you like to know? :) >_<
Ok, setup a abaddon for fleet fights that last more than a few minutes, while remaining competitive with is counter-parts.... a zealot that isn't outclassed.... an omen that can compete with other cruisers.... an apoc thats worth a crap... a maller that isn't just bait (using lasers ming you)... a harbinger that isn't equaled by a Brutix (tier 1 vs tier 2) or completely outmatched by a myrmadon...
How about amarrian laser boats that can fit a MWD, full rack of top tier guns, a cap booster, and a repper without fitting mods and works.
Well I guess thats enough for now.
(Oh on the MWD front, amarr need to keep range in order to track {i.e. do dmg} so you kinda need one just like every other boat.)
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Chen Hao
Amarr
Core Contingency
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Posted - 2007.10.22 18:11:00 -
[25]
Abaddon:
Highs: 8 x Tachyon IIs
Mids: 2 x Cap Recharger II, 2 x Sensor Booster, 1 x Tracking Comp
Lows: 4 x Heat Sink II, 1 x RCUII, 2 x CPR II
Rigs: 3 x CCC
Well Well...That runs 8 Tachs forever. 165km Optimal, 15x Damage Mod and a 6.6 ROF.
Zealot:
Highs: 4 x Heavy Pulse IIs, Medium NOS
Mids: 10mn II MWD, Cap Recharger II, Point
Lows: MARII, Thermic Membrane, EANM, Nano II, CPRII, 2 x Heat Sink II
Rigs: 2 x CCC
Perma runs guns and MWD no problems. Can rep when needed. Goes 2km/s+ and hits out at 35km with Scorch M. A perfect anti support boat (which is what HACs are for none of this "damage" dealer nonsense.)
Harbinger:
Highs: 3 x Heavy Pulse II, 4 x Focused Med Pulse II
Mids: 10mn MWD II, Cap Injector, Web, Point
Lows: MARII, 800mm Plate, Explo Hard, Magnet Membrane, Therm Membrane, HS II
Rigs: 3 x Trimark
That gives you around 15k armour, 600dps with Hammerhead IIs and an MWD. This setup has no cap issues aslong as you have cap boosters...which is exactly the same for most of the other pvp races.
Ill happily admit the omen and mauler arent great cruisers but the arbitrator is one of the best in game.
Apoc:
Is a Mining Ship everyone knows that . Alternitavely tank it hard for bait and whack on Autocannons. Or its good for 1v1 if you know eachothers ship class, they tank EM you whack out ACs, you rofl heavily when they die.
As for having a full rack of Heavy Pulse, MWD, Rep etc. The zealot has that :). The Absolution can fit 6 Heavy Pulse IIs an MWD, Cap Booster and dual rep no problem.
Your tracking comment is again complete lies. Pulse have superb tracking at mid and short ranges, Multi M (and conflag on BC/BS) has no trouble what so ever tracking up close. I happen to fit a web to most of my ships :).
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Sarah Benthwell
Dolaris Holdings
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Posted - 2007.10.22 18:14:00 -
[26]
Originally by: shinsushi
Edited by: shinsushi on 22/10/2007 17:16:30
Originally by: Chen Hao
What would you like to know? :) >_<
Ok, setup a abaddon for fleet fights that last more than a few minutes, while remaining competitive with is counter-parts.... a zealot that isn't outclassed.... an omen that can compete with other cruisers.... an apoc thats worth a crap... a maller that isn't just bait (using lasers ming you)... a harbinger that isn't equaled by a Brutix (tier 1 vs tier 2) or completely outmatched by a myrmadon...
How about amarrian laser boats that can fit a MWD, full rack of top tier guns, a cap booster, and a repper without fitting mods and works.
Well I guess thats enough for now.
(Oh on the MWD front, amarr need to keep range in order to track {i.e. do dmg} so you kinda need one just like every other boat.)
CLUELESS.
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shigs |
shinsushi
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Posted - 2007.10.22 18:37:00 -
[27]
Edited by: shinsushi on 22/10/2007 18:37:34
Originally by: Chen Hao
Abaddon:
Highs: 8 x Tachyon IIs
Mids: 2 x Cap Recharger II, 2 x Sensor Booster, 1 x Tracking Comp
Lows: 4 x Heat Sink II, 1 x RCUII, 2 x CPR II
Rigs: 3 x CCC
WTB: 5 mid, Abaddon. Oh guess what? Fleet ships need a MWD standard. so now you have no cap rechargers in the mids, 1 less heat sink in the lows (due to requiring a 2nd RCU II) and are no where near cap stable. Oh, and you have just about the least amount of hitpoints in the fleet. Too bad one DDD will knock you out of the game.
Originally by: Chen Hao
Zealot:
Highs: 4 x Heavy Pulse IIs, Medium NOS
Mids: 10mn II MWD, Cap Recharger II, Point
Lows: MARII, Thermic Membrane, EANM, Nano II, CPRII, 2 x Heat Sink II
Rigs: 2 x CCC
Perma runs guns and MWD no problems. Can rep when needed. Goes 2km/s+ and hits out at 35km with Scorch M. A perfect anti support boat (which is what HACs are for none of this "damage" dealer nonsense.)
Good luck hitting stuff going anywhere near that speed with Scorch L (-tracking penalty). Any demios, munnin, vagabond, ishtar, cerebus will do the job better and be much faster moving.
Originally by: Chen Hao
Harbinger:
Highs: 3 x Heavy Pulse II, 4 x Focused Med Pulse II
Mids: 10mn MWD II, Cap Injector, Web, Point
Lows: MARII, 800mm Plate, Explo Hard, Magnet Membrane, Therm Membrane, HS II
Rigs: 3 x Trimark
That gives you around 15k armour, 600dps with Hammerhead IIs and an MWD. This setup has no cap issues aslong as you have cap boosters...which is exactly the same for most of the other pvp races.
Oh right, so completely out-classed by the brutix and myrmadon then? ok thanks.
Originally by: Chen Hao
Ill happily admit the omen and mauler arent great cruisers but the arbitrator is one of the best in game.
Is the arbi really better than the vexor? I mean they are basically the same boat right.. cept for the vexor is better?
Originally by: Chen Hao
Apoc:
Is a Mining Ship everyone knows that . Alternitavely tank it hard for bait and whack on Autocannons. Or its good for 1v1 if you know eachothers ship class, they tank EM you whack out ACs, you rofl heavily when they die.
I am glad you can laugh about how crappy the apoc is.
Originally by: Chen Hao
As for having a full rack of Heavy Pulse, MWD, Rep etc. The zealot has that :). The Absolution can fit 6 Heavy Pulse IIs an MWD, Cap Booster and dual rep no problem.
Oh, sry I missed two boats. BCs/command ships are kind of in a fitting range all their own, haven't seen one have fitting problems yet.
Originally by: Chen Hao
Your tracking comment is again complete lies. Pulse have superb tracking at mid and short ranges, Multi M (and conflag on BC/BS) has no trouble what so ever tracking up close. I happen to fit a web to most of my ships :).
Its really easy to see which turrets track better and which track worse. Its measure in rad/sec. Pulses are the lowest by a fair margin (but better than they were before.) Now I am not asking for a boost or a nerf, but it is a characteristic that should be taken into consideration when balancing.
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shinsushi
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Posted - 2007.10.22 18:38:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Sarah Benthwell
Originally by: shinsushi
Edited by: shinsushi on 22/10/2007 17:16:30
Originally by: Chen Hao
What would you like to know? :) >_<
Ok, setup a abaddon for fleet fights that last more than a few minutes, while remaining competitive with is counter-parts.... a zealot that isn't outclassed.... an omen that can compete with other cruisers.... an apoc thats worth a crap... a maller that isn't just bait (using lasers ming you)... a harbinger that isn't equaled by a Brutix (tier 1 vs tier 2) or completely outmatched by a myrmadon...
How about amarrian laser boats that can fit a MWD, full rack of top tier guns, a cap booster, and a repper without fitting mods and works.
Well I guess thats enough for now.
(Oh on the MWD front, amarr need to keep range in order to track {i.e. do dmg} so you kinda need one just like every other boat.)
CLUELESS.
At least Chen tried, your just a troll.
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Sarah Benthwell
Dolaris Holdings
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Posted - 2007.10.22 18:50:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Sarah Benthwell on 22/10/2007 18:51:27
Edited by: Sarah Benthwell on 22/10/2007 18:51:05
Edited by: Sarah Benthwell on 22/10/2007 18:50:42
Originally by: shinsushi
Too bad one DDD will knock you out of the game.
DONT STICK AROUND TO GET HIT BY A DDD THEN *facepalm*
Originally by: shinsushi
Good luck hitting stuff going anywhere near that speed with Scorch L (-tracking penalty). Any demios, munnin, vagabond, ishtar, cerebus will do the job better and be much faster moving.
YOU DONT LEAVE A MWD ON IN 99% OF THE NANOSHIPS. And it still can probably track.
Originally by: shinsushi
Oh right, so completely out-classed by the brutix and myrmadon then? ok thanks.
Uuuh, what?
Originally by: shinsushi
Is the arbi really better than the vexor? I mean they are basically the same boat right.. cept for the vexor is better?
Its basically the same boat... but the vexor is better... MAKE SENSE. Arby gets ewar bonus aswell.
Originally by: shinsushi
I am glad you can laugh about how crappy the apoc is.
OH NO A SINGLE CRAPPY SHIP. RACE X SUCKS
Originally by: shinsushi
Its really easy to see which turrets track better and which track worse. Its measure in rad/sec. Pulses are the lowest by a fair margin (but better than they were before.) Now I am not asking for a boost or a nerf, but it is a characteristic that should be taken into consideration when balancing.
Less tracking is needed the further you go out... and GUESS WHAT. IT HAS THE HIGHEST RANGE SHORT RANGE GUNS. OMGROFL
_______
shigs |
Chen Hao
Amarr
Core Contingency
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Posted - 2007.10.22 19:00:00 -
[30]
Corrected Abaddon Mids.
WTB Zealot that can fit Scorch L.
You fit an MWD to a sniper BS for fleet ops? What fleet are you flying in tbh lol? I can understand it MAY be useful, but when it comes down to it if your FC can't get your snipers in place without having to MWD them around (or NOT jumping into bubbles) then you need a new FC.
"Oh, and you have just about the least amount of hitpoints in the fleet. Too bad one DDD will knock you out of the game."
LMFAO ^^ That one speaks for itself.
If you can't micro manage your speed so you can track correctly and keep your target transversal down, then that is PILOT skills. I don't want to hear "when I leave my MWD on and click orbit at 20km I can't track" Manual pilot your ship.
We're all aware that the Myrm is a great ship. Pretty much all of the tier 2 BC's have serious trouble taking one out. As for a Brutix vs. a Harbinger? That Harby would **** all over a Brutix end of.
As for tracking. It's not if one is better than the other in comparison, its if the tracking is competent enough in a combat situation. Heavy Pulse II with Scorch M tracks all of the nano HACs unless we're talking snaked up faction Vagas...which no turrets can track.
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