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WTB nightmare for....300mil?

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Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.12.01 04:16:00 - [31] Edited by: Soulita on 01/12/2007 04:17:29 Originally by: Blane Xero Im going to keep this short because i was writing a well thought out post and my posting timer timed out and i got logged out, Pre patch, 8/4/8, good cap, reliable tank, varibale damage All thigns people want more of these days. Post Patch, 6/7/5, Cap problems, ok tank, set-damage. Too many downsides, but oh wait, WE GETS 3K WRECKINGS! oh well everything MUST be fine then. [/sarcasm] Pre patch it used 4 lasers and 4 launchers, the lasers got 50% reduction in cap. Post patch, 4 lasers, no cap reduction, more tracking and damage with a built in damage mod of 100%. I dont know where you get your math that your getting a built in capp reduction, i know where YOU think your getting it from, but your not. If it was an 8 turret boat pre-patch with the 50% reduction in cap, you would have a point, here it wasnt, so you dont. end of. OVerall : You lost most of your variable damage, you gained epeen wreckings on clean resist objects and idiotic shield tankers, and pretty much kept the same tank. YOu gained 2 useless utility slots, (Who the hell salvages during a level 4, or salvages mid-pvp in a BS?) I'm really trying to put my point out there to show why there is no reason for this change, i'm not just outright saying "This wont work no matter what you do", i'm showing you where things ARE going to go wrong, with this...pointless change. People keep telling me the tank will be the same and the DPS the same, so err...the point of the change at all? Settups. Old 4 modulated mega beams, 4 arbalest cruise launchers, 100mn AB II, 3x Cap charger II's 2x LAR II, 4 hardeners, 2 CPRS. 3x CCC New 4x Mod tachies, 2x whatever. XL SB II, SBA II, 4 hardeners, one passive em resist, 4 PDS, 1 DC/HS/whatever. 3x CCC First one, cap runs indefinately, and can tank 3 waves of blockade level 4. Second one, caps out trying to handle the first 2 waves, and just doesnt have the firepower to kill anything other than battleships in a timely way. First one can use cruise on the cruisers, and megas on BC's. Second only has drones for frigs/cruisers/bc's unless he snipes the BC's on the way in... (NEWSFLASH, BS's are NOT the majority DPS in most missions) And in pvp, if you cant hit a BC or smaller...well...yeah... Ok so not so short but you get the idea,,, Blane, I understand where you are coming from. You have found good use for your current Nightmare, and you trained skill specific for your setup. Now with the changes, your skills might not be fitting for possible new setups. Also the ship might now be good for different tasks than you use it for. In other words, the change is bad for you. And honestly, sorry to hear that. Sucks to loose skilltime due to changes, been there myself. On the other hand some people may like the new setup possibilities, for these people the changes are good.
Lance Fighter Amarr	Posted - 2007.12.01 05:01:00 - [32] 6 highs 7 mids 5 lows 4x tachys, 1x drone link, 1x tractor 2x tracking computer (especially with scripts coming in) 5x cap rechargers 1x Large rep II, 2x hardener II, 1x EANM II, heatsink insert rigs of choice here Not actually worked out the numbers, but the idea is that it will be able to run the rep and guns off the cap rechargers, and be able to at least 2 damage rigs. (damage/RoF) Tracking computers can be fit one for optimal, one for tracking, or both for tracking, both for optimal... no scripts at all, if that is how you roll. (they still work) shrug at least that is what I would do.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2007.12.01 06:43:00 - [33] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton want a rigged navy raven Who? Me? I already got one. But sure, why not, give it to me. gimme a nightmare
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.12.01 06:48:00 - [34] Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton want a rigged navy raven Who? Me? I already got one. But sure, why not, give it to me. gimme a nightmare Rosie O'Donnel Naked enoguh nightmares for you? Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to: "Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
Surfin's PlunderBunny Minmatar mUfFiN fAcToRy	Posted - 2007.12.01 06:51:00 - [35] 1 billion isk! does the Dr Evil finger thing Originally by: ISD Valorem The Devs have stated multiple times that they are looking at the Amarr issues. Weekly quote: "No flying machine will ever fly from New York to Paris." ~Orville Wright.
Del Narveux Dukes of Hazard	Posted - 2007.12.01 07:37:00 - [36] WTB 4 medslot battleship shieldtank _________________ [SAK] Alumnus--And Proud Of It! -- aka Cpt Bogus Is that my torped sig cloaking your base? Originally by: Wrangler Well, at least we have forum PvP..
Twilight Moon Minmatar Malicious Intentions The Church.	Posted - 2007.12.01 08:13:00 - [37] I'll gladly take it off your hands if you cant rub two braincells together to realise how good it is. New siggeh required!
Sokor Jei	Posted - 2007.12.01 09:30:00 - [38] okay, retry the pvp setup, but put mega pulses on it and a web and some nos run your cap low with the boosting and guns, so your nos kick in it suddenly is an interesting pvp ship This is not a fleet pvp ship, don't put tachs on it
Katharina Gorbacheva Amarr Soviet Star Federation Celestial Frontier	Posted - 2007.12.01 10:11:00 - [39] Real men use turret ships for pve, only noobs use missiles and ravens.
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This Derek Knows Us	Posted - 2007.12.01 10:17:00 - [40] Originally by: Sirial Soulfly Lol wut ? As these ships have become totally uber they have risen in price accordingly. Save EveTV, please. Sign to ask CCP to fund EveTV!

ISD Valorem Amarr ISD STAR	Posted - 2007.12.01 11:19:00 - [41] Moved from General Discussion to Ships and modules. forum rules \| CAOD Rules \| [email protected] \| Our Website

Kina Putten Amarr Noble House	Posted - 2007.12.01 12:02:00 - [42] Nightmare mk2 might work as a shortrange pvp boat, maybe. But the fact that the best armor tanker EVE universe ever saw is gone, is kind of sad. Nightmare mk2 have cap problems, period. And as for the dmg from 4 turrets,...when you miss with one turret you actually miss with two. And you will miss alot if you use tachyons. Oh, and I never had cpu problems with the "old" Nightmare. The only good thing about all this is that I made 800mill selling the sucker
Incantare Caldari Kernel of War Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.12.01 12:15:00 - [43] I'll trade you a navypoc for it .
Deva Blackfire D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.12.01 13:26:00 - [44] are we still bidding for it? i want my cheap mare
Dristra Amarr Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.12.01 14:40:00 - [45] Omg, op is angry because his ship got changed, whines about how bad it is, even though old nightmare was the cream suck. Conclusion: op don't have the needed skills, and should just sell his ship when it is changed to make a great profit, as the nightmare is alot more valuable in its neo-form. Soon (Tm) the khanid apoc comes in it's black armour tanking missile spamming form and all will rejoice. It's great being Amarr isn't it. Support the introduction of Blaze M crystals for Amarr!
Xequecal	Posted - 2007.12.01 14:46:00 - [46] So, what do you guys think? Is Blane Zero deliberately lying in order to push the price down or is he just an idiot?
Layla Ashley Amarr Children of Avalon Avateas Blessed	Posted - 2007.12.01 15:27:00 - [47] how about a mission setup along this line: high: 4x mp or tachyons 1x drone range 1x nos meds: 1x range tracing computer (for mp) or 1x webber (for tach) rest cr low: 1x x-type LAR 1x x-type em hardener 3x hs rigs: 1x therm resistance (t2 if possible) 1x armor rep amount 1x ccc maybe drop the rep amount for another ccc so it's easier to switch to shield tank for gurista/angel missions. but then again, who would want to do them with lasers. and the tank will be realy week for sansha missions. don't know if that would work, if cap would be enough or tank strong enough. but thats about the best i could come up with for a good mission fittings. (if i can't use 3hs i did rather use an abbadon or paladin then a nightmare)
Aakron Filthy Scum	Posted - 2007.12.01 15:51:00 - [48] who cares how it runs missions, its a pirate faction battleship, it should be used in PVP, amazingly it is now great in this role. ---
Fon Revedhort Aeria Gloris Inc United Legion	Posted - 2007.12.01 16:12:00 - [49] Edited by: Fon Revedhort on 01/12/2007 16:15:03 Originally by: Blane Xero Settups. Old 4 modulated mega beams, 4 arbalest cruise launchers, 100mn AB II, 3x Cap charger II's 2x LAR II, 4 hardeners, 2 CPRS. 3x CCC New 4x Mod tachies, 2x whatever. XL SB II, SBA II, 4 hardeners, one passive em resist, 4 PDS, 1 DC/HS/whatever. 3x CCC First one, cap runs indefinately, and can tank 3 waves of blockade level 4. Second one, caps out trying to handle the first 2 waves, and just doesnt have the firepower to kill anything other than battleships in a timely way. First one can use cruise on the cruisers, and megas on BC's. Second only has drones for frigs/cruisers/bc's unless he snipes the BC's on the way in... (NEWSFLASH, BS's are NOT the majority DPS in most missions) And in pvp, if you cant hit a BC or smaller...well...yeah... Ok so not so short but you get the idea,,, You failed at fitting Nightmare Wasting 7 slots on cap is a sheer stupidity. Use Crapoc then or something. ---
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.12.01 16:16:00 - [50] In pvp (if it will be used) it will be awesome. However I'm reluctant to believe it will be better than the amarr marauder for missions. Looks pimp second only to the mach though, I'd buy another one if I lost it Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty. ... - Cortes honestly now... the sig is 25k :S
Layla Ashley Amarr Children of Avalon Avateas Blessed	Posted - 2007.12.01 16:29:00 - [51] i still don't really see a reason to buy an paladin instead of my abbadon. same damage, about same tank, only faction ammo will get cheaper and you got webber bonus, in case you use one for missions. however, the tracking + damage bonus on the nightmare might be useful for missions. though it will be tight to fit 3 hs + some sort of stable tank on it.
Aronis Contar Caldari Independent Manufacturers	Posted - 2007.12.01 17:04:00 - [52] Originally by: Kina Putten And as for the dmg from 4 turrets,...when you miss with one turret you actually miss with two. And you will miss alot if you use tachyons. And when you hit with one turret you actually hit with two... And don't forget that you get a 37.5% tracking bonus. Ciao, Aronis!
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Elite	Posted - 2007.12.01 17:25:00 - [53] Originally by: Xequecal So, what do you guys think? Is Blane Zero deliberately lying in order to push the price down or is he just an idiot? ... Why would i lie to bring prices down? already got one, and as everyone keeps telling me, these changes are good ... still to see whats good. Against an omnitank your DPS will be weak, against small ships your never going to hit with tachies, and mega's will be even worse DPS. Your going to cap out if you fit more than 2 damage mods max, (Tried and tested on current sisi with energy man 5, systems op 5 and shield compensation 5, with an XL2 booster) And i wonder why nobody has challenged me on this claim rolls eyes Your more vulnerable to ewar, as your dependant on one weapon system for damage. Also, to whoever said "Why waste cruise on frigs and cruisers" with skills, your doing almost full damage to cruisers, and one volley kills most frigates, drones suppliment this and help with the harder frigates. With the new nightmare, if you tachy fit to comensate for the lack of other weapon slots, your only going to hit BS, maybe BC on the way in, an even with multifreq, your range will be too big to hit anything closer than 25km, leaving drones with the job of killing anything smaller than BC...etc... Not time healthy is it? Like i've said in other forums, show me FIGURES, STATISTICS, and i'll shuttup if they prove me wrong, NOBODY has yet, so i continue my side of the arguement. AND its Blane (Bl-ay-ne) Xero (Se-ro) not Zero.. Welcome to EvE
Wayward Hooligan Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.12.01 17:47:00 - [54] Edited by: Wayward Hooligan on 01/12/2007 17:53:48 This ship will be a nice gang ship. 4xTachy II 1x100mn MWD II 1xHeavy Injector II Random Shield/EWAR mods 3xHeat Sink II 1xDC II ^^ something like that will be quite a bit of fun. Or 4xMegaPulse II 2xHeavy Unstable Neut 1xMWD II 1xHeavy Cap Injector II 1xWarp Disruptor II 1xFleeting Stasis Web 1xECM Burst 2xRSD 3xHeat Sink II 1xDC II ^^ Don't know exact slot layout as I don't log onto test but I've heard its 6-7-4 /w 4 turret. . .. WELP! .. .
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Elite	Posted - 2007.12.01 17:58:00 - [55] Read some of my posts its 6/7/5 :) some people think i'm trolling cause i dont like the changes, i've even now been called a lier, but i'm the only person giving a half decent argument to keep it as is.. Welcome to EvE
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.12.01 18:37:00 - [56] Here's a statistic: It's freakin vertical mon and looks cool! Reason enough for me to buy it anyways Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty. ... - Cortes honestly now... the sig is 25k :S
Jupiter Sun	Posted - 2007.12.01 22:05:00 - [57] i would stick a model nightmare up my bum tbqh.
Arleonenis Minmatar NET Profit Trading	Posted - 2007.12.01 23:02:00 - [58] Originally by: Lance Fighter 6 highs 7 mids 5 lows 4x tachys, 1x drone link, 1x tractor 2x tracking computer (especially with scripts coming in) 5x cap rechargers 1x Large rep II, 2x hardener II, 1x EANM II, heatsink insert rigs of choice here Not actually worked out the numbers, but the idea is that it will be able to run the rep and guns off the cap rechargers, and be able to at least 2 damage rigs. (damage/RoF) Tracking computers can be fit one for optimal, one for tracking, or both for tracking, both for optimal... no scripts at all, if that is how you roll. (they still work) shrug at least that is what I would do. Did you ever done any level 4 mission? Or anything harder than the easiest ones? I think i know the answer unless nightmare magically is getting tech2 HAC resists this tank will FAIL under NPC firepower... to be honest it will fail very very fast. Only resists it will have decently high (though doubt that high enough) with this setup will be EM and thermal if those hardeners are em and thermal, though without pump rigs doubt it will be enough... but hello Angels bye bye Nightmare... Also i noticed few others also post "uber" 3 slot tanks... and than i always wondered why so many peoples lose ships in lvl4s and scream about insane npc dps... i think i have an answer...
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.01 23:32:00 - [59] Originally by: Arleonenis whining about nightmare 7 slot shield tank is probably better than an 8 slot armor tank. It can be made cap stable with the same "tricks" used by Ravens and CNRs. It looks like a fine ship to me ... Liang -- Retired forum *****. Plz tell me to STFU. Yarr?
Arleonenis Minmatar NET Profit Trading	Posted - 2007.12.01 23:39:00 - [60] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Arleonenis whining about nightmare 7 slot shield tank is probably better than an 8 slot armor tank. It can be made cap stable with the same "tricks" used by Ravens and CNRs. It looks like a fine ship to me ... Liang Unfortunetly wrong here. Comparing to CNR isnt accurate in any instance becouse: a) tachyons use lots of cap and launchers use 0 cap b) to hit anything with those tachyons you must have web, good officer one or at least 1 but more possibly 2 tracking comps... tracking of launchers isnt an issue so some of those 7 meds dissapear here in thin air so yes you could use tricks to get it perma but i already stated that it will be around 20b becouse you would need MUCH harder "tricks" to make it work

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