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X3S
Minmatar
Native Freshfood
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Posted - 2007.12.01 22:37:00 -
[1]
Edited by: X3S on 01/12/2007 22:40:05
How about we make jet cans more secure, if not make fake ones that are booby traps.
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VJ Maverick
Caldari
Maverick Specialized Services
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Posted - 2007.12.01 23:30:00 -
[2]
How about you stop jet-can mining and cluttering up my universe.
 Originally by: Bodhisattvas
by the way you keep on missing the "a" from pwn, do you need any help with its pl
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Empire marketslave
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Posted - 2007.12.01 23:59:00 -
[3]
just be glad that you can even shoot them
before RMR you had to sit and watch them steal it and you could do absoulty nothing about it without taking a security hit and getting concordorked.
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Karma
Gallente
Vortex Incorporated
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Posted - 2007.12.02 00:57:00 -
[4]
if you want secure can mining... then mine into a secure container.
simple.
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Ellaine TashMurkon
CBC Interstellar
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Posted - 2007.12.02 01:56:00 -
[5]
You can easily avoid ore thieves by mining in 0.0 and killing everyone on sight before they get to your mining op :)
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Syberbolt8
Gallente
The Fated
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.12.02 02:51:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Ellaine TashMurkon
You can easily avoid ore thieves by mining in 0.0 and killing everyone on sight before they get to your mining op :)
/signed ^^^^
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James Sheridan
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Posted - 2007.12.04 11:43:00 -
[7]
The easiest solution is to use a secure container. However this is often pointless for the larger mining ships because the current containers arent big enough.
I think the better solution is to introduce a much larger type of container that is essentially designed to be used for mining ops. A.K.A at least enough space equal to the jet can.
a 25 - 30,000 m3 can would hold up to or more than a jet can and is almost untouchable by ore thieves unless they are using something with a fairly large hold to scoop up the container.
If you want to go overboard then you could have containers being dropped that are even bigger but I doubt many ships can actually drop something that big and I am loathe to imagine a belt full of things that size.
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Tahti Gaikoukan
Caldari
Lai Dai Infinity Systems
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Posted - 2007.12.04 14:18:00 -
[8]
Quote:
How about you stop jet-can mining and cluttering up my universe.
Jetcans don't clutter up the universe, especially if you remove everything before you leave, they go poof.
It is the ore thieves that cause the miners to use secure cans, which are anchored and clutter up our universe.
I agree that a ORE Mining Container would be a helpful tool. These might even come in various sizes ranging from 5k m3 to 100k m3! They would however have to be assembled on site and take time to assemble.
Maybe even require something to run (10 units of Enriched Uranium / day or something). Consider it a mini-pos, but that may be to far.
Chief of Public Relations, Lai Dai Infinity Systems |
Abrazzar
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Posted - 2007.12.04 16:37:00 -
[9]
There are means to oppose ore thieves.
1.) Friend in a hauler. He'll scoop up the ore when it's mined and jettisoned. One hauler can serve 2-3 barges.
2.) Combat ship on stand by. Could either be a friend or you have the ship in the station. Ore thieves and can flippers usually fly directly to your can. You warp off as soon as one is identified and hop into your combat ship. Advantage is that you can choose your fights and have the first strike. Also you are most likely warping directly on top of the red blinking thief.
3.) Ninja Hauling. If someone flips your can you warp off and fetch your hauler. You then fly to the can, open it, activate the warp drive, move the ore into your hold to have the naughty warning message up and click ok a quarter second before you enter warp. This tactic also works for stealing the crap out of the cans some people use to lure noobs with. You only need to know your ping.
4.) Deprive them of the joy of getting to you. They steal your ore? They flip your can? Ignore them. If they are persistent just switch over to cargo mining for a while until they get bored. Don't give them the satisfaction of having you run out of the belt.
Those are the things I tried out so far and they do work fine. While larger secure cans would be appreciated they are not acutely necessary.
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Nur Vadenn
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.12.04 18:31:00 -
[10]
What there needs to be is a container that can be dragged by a barge or other large vessel. It needs to just be nothing more than a large cargo hold you can attach to the barge like a trailer giving it at least another 30,000 m3 worth of space. It could slow the barge or drastically reduce the barge's maneuverability, but it would mean a barge could actually do the job it is intended to do.
I never understood why mining was the only profession that seemed to require an alt to do it efficiently. NPC hunters in belts don't need a hauler alt to carry away the bounties of the targets they destroy. Mission runners don't need a second account to go around collecting the isk generated from their mission kills, yet miners are all but required to have an alt just to mine since the alternatives are laughable at best. I wonder how loudly mission runners or NPC'ers would scream if they had to dock and empty their ship after only killing one or two frigates.
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Hatch
Minmatar
Cloak and Daggers
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Posted - 2007.12.04 18:39:00 -
[11]
there needs to be fewer newbs complaining about game mechanics that have been around since the beginning of the game.
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Kritch
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:53:00 -
[12]
So when do us miners get to screw over non-miners?
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Kell Braugh
Caldari
letter of marque
Plunder-Bears
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Posted - 2007.12.04 23:16:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Kell Braugh on 04/12/2007 23:16:39
OR we could just end the discussion by saying that enterprise-level (10,20,50,100K M3 at a time) mining ops should work effectively and safely when executed as/by a corp (or at least group of people)
You guys are trying to force the game mechanics to fit and further enable flaws in the original spec (yes, jet can mining was a hack and devs have said it was a mistake)
How bout jet cans get fixed. As far as I see it, a jettisoned can should never be larger than the cargo hold it came from. That's the flaw.
Beyond that and all I gotta say is you should lookup the word jettison if you don't understand the definition. (I know I'm not the first to make this point)
Quote:
jet+ti+son
1. To cast overboard or off: a ship jettisoning wastes; a pilot jettisoning aircraft fuel.
2. Informal To discard (something) as unwanted or burdensome: jettisoned the whole marketing plan.
n.
1. The act of discarding or casting overboard.
Now tell me again how you guys got the idea that jettison implied some sort of security?
evil prevails when good men do nothing. |
Neu Bastian
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Posted - 2007.12.04 23:42:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Neu Bastian on 04/12/2007 23:42:45
inspirational vid: Linkage
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Amarr Holymight
deii feram
Aegis Militia
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:49:00 -
[15]
Haha Neu you beat me to it.
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Sirius Problem
Darkness Inc.
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Posted - 2007.12.06 05:15:00 -
[16]
Originally by: X3S
How about we make jet cans more secure, if not make fake ones that are booby traps.
Or even better. A a new module that you can fit to mining ships that will beam the ore directly to a station in the local system. Then add a new skill for this module that, for each skill level, will allow beaming of the ore +1 systems away. So, at level 5, you could beam the ore to a station 5 jumps from you.
This would be so awesome because then miners could gather their ore in hi-sec with absolutely no risk whatsoever.
----
I am Super Cool
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Zighsev
Helios Incorporated
Insurgency
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Posted - 2007.12.06 09:03:00 -
[17]
corp kill rights on ore theives for a week FTW!
_____________________________________________________________
Helios Incorperated |
Admiral Pelleon
Caldari
White Shadow Imperium
Burning Horizons
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Posted - 2007.12.06 09:46:00 -
[18]
Originally by: X3S
Edited by: X3S on 01/12/2007 22:40:05
How about we make jet cans more secure, if not make fake ones that are booby traps.
How about we stop posting useless ideas that have been posted 342432453243243297365496326743926749732967439267967432679342 times before?
________
"It's a good day to die!"
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isomo gelard
Gallente
White Shadow Imperium
Burning Horizons
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Posted - 2007.12.06 09:48:00 -
[19]
Edited by: isomo gelard on 06/12/2007 09:48:31
Originally by: Zighsev
corp kill rights on ore theives for a week FTW!
nah, a carebear wouldent capitalize on this anyways, since they are too chicken to come to lowsec. the solution...0.0 mine
******** noobs complaining about game mechanics FTL!
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Maalan
Caldari
Lutin Group
Acheron Federation
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Posted - 2007.12.06 13:55:00 -
[20]
From this miner/manufacture.
NO, NO and erm NO!
No part of this game is supposed to be easy. You want risk free mining? Go to a 1.0 system and put a mining laser on well tanked hauler. Your only risk is suiciding idiots who are willing to blow away their ISK on a ship worth less than their suicide ships.
You want to make more ISK? Ninja mine in 0.5 sec with a nice hauler. Increased risk since it takes longer for Concord to take out a suicider.
Still not enough ISK? Take your chances jet can mining. If an ore thief comes along and you don't like the risk of fighting back, move back up the risk tree.
Still not enough ISK? Join a mining corp that protects the mining op, consider running to low sec or null sec. Increased profits and further increased risks.
Still not enough ISK? Deal with it, no one else is making more ISK from mining, its not meant to be free money.
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You think you are a pirate? You should see how much I made selling you that ship you just went and got blown up...
((Until CCP admits what I look like please pretend my face looks normal)) |
Nur Vadenn
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.12.06 16:21:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Nur Vadenn on 06/12/2007 16:23:06
It is simply astonishing the responses in this thread. Where to begin...
Well lets see. First, just because a mechanic in game has been broken since inception does not mean it should stay broken. No harm at all in fixing things or improving things that could use improvement.
Using the tired excuse that mining ops should be run by corps and/or large groups of people only becomes valid when missions and ratting require a group of people as well. Mining is the only profession in EVE requiring an alt or group to be efficient. CCP even went as far as to give mission runners and ratters a further boost in a ship designed to run missions and loot/salvage simultaneously while not loosing any of its combat effectiveness. All that is really being asked for here is an equitable amount of treatment for miners.
Ratting I can operate far afield for hours looting and salvaging every wreck I produce, not to mention gathering 100% of the bounty with the cargo hold on any combat ship out there. Mining I have maybe 2 cycles with the lasers mounted on a barge before I have to dock and unload. There is a clear inequity here that should be addressed so I nor anyone else have to jettison mine to remain efficent.
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Kempeth
Gallente
Thunderbolts
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Posted - 2007.12.07 13:17:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Kempeth on 07/12/2007 13:17:42
Originally by: Sirius Problem
Originally by: X3S
How about we make jet cans more secure, if not make fake ones that are booby traps.
Or even better. A a new module that you can fit to mining ships that will beam the ore directly to a station in the local system. Then add a new skill for this module that, for each skill level, will allow beaming of the ore +1 systems away. So, at level 5, you could beam the ore to a station 5 jumps from you.
This would be so awesome because then miners could gather their ore in hi-sec with absolutely no risk whatsoever.
Traditionally range increases to "entire Region" on level 5...
We also need Covert Mining Barges which can fly and mine cloaked by using Covert Strip Miner II... 
On a serious note. As I miner I too suffer from the fact that you need help from others to do any serious mining. I would welcome a change to that or at least a balance with other professions. But creating bigger and bigger secure cans is not the solution! I think anchoring secure cans is already way too easy.
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The glass is neither half full nor half empty.
It's just twice as big as it need to be... |
Alz Shado
Ever Flow
DeStInY.
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Posted - 2007.12.07 22:21:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Alz Shado on 07/12/2007 22:21:12
Queue up requests for "Transferrable kill rights'
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Jacob Mei
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Posted - 2007.12.08 00:50:00 -
[24]
Perfect solution:
Get a Second account either by yourself or a friend (GASP! HUMAN INTERACTION!) who is in a industrial hauler and use a jetcan or secure container that is anchored as a ore exchange point.
Semi perfect solution:
Spawn several jetcans around the ligit one and hope that any ore theif doesnt get lucky.
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