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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.03 19:38:00 -
[1]
Yesterday I was shot down approaching a gate with a hauler in an empire high-sec system while I was afk smoking at the window. The hauler wasn't worth anything but the cargohold contained stuff worth around 300-400 Mil ISK. Of course I was scanned at the gate by a high-sec pirate (and/or his nearby mate in an industrial/freighter), my stuff was identified as a lot more worth than his battleship and he decided, let's draw an expensive ticket in the ganking lottery.
OK, he failed (can happen). He destroyed my hauler, the loot can dropped, CONCORD took down his battleship and ... the loot container didn't contain the pile of the item he was after (the remaining stuff was almost worthless compared to the BS). So it was an unlucky evening for both of us (more for me, by the way), blowing away half a billion iskies into space.
This is, of course, crap and INACCEPTABLE and can only be the result of a big hole in the game design.
So first of all it MUST be possible to afk smoke at the window without risk while flying through high sec. Nobody can really have the patience and expect or wish to sit in front of the screen, mouse clicking and jumping and waiting for alignment of ships with terrible agility over distances of 10 or 20 or whatever solar systems.
So I need urgently the following alternative changes in the game mechanics:
Option 1:
CONCORD must strike much faster and harder in high sec.
Proposal for the storyline background: An ancient paper of the Talocan was discovered describing in detail the construction and deployment of a "wormhole smartbomb" (Note: "The Talocan were masters of Spatial manipulation and Hypereuclidean Mathematics." They were able to do such things!)
This nice weapon (controlled only by CONCORD) works like the following: As soon as someone fires the first missile or blaster particle or bullet at a high sec gate a detector installed inside the gate takes notice of that, constructs a wormhole leading directly into the hostile ship, deploys a smartbomb with almost infinite destructive power through that wormhole and blows up the ship. At the same time the wormhole sucks the fired ammunition back before it can reach the attacked ship which will stay happy without a single scratch. All this must work with faster-than-light speed to take also laser guns into account which isn't really a problem for the Talocan. (Note: The Talocan could build technology "even though the scientific theories behind them remain a mystery". Yes, there are things between heaven and earth we cannot understand!)
Option 2:
I need an Autopilot-Warp-To-Zero option together with a Autopilot-Cloaked-Alignment-And-Immediate-Warp-After-Decloaking capability. I don't care if this is bound to a module or skill. I will buy the BPO, build the module and train the skill to level 5.
As far as both options allow me to afk smoke at the window it doesn't matter for me which one is choosen.
Because I cannot imagine that anyone (especially the window smokers) will disagree (pirates could still hunt in the middle between two gates waiting for ships with low capacitor capacity coming out of warp directly in front of them - with a little luck), so you only need to sign this petitionlike request for an early implementation in one of the next patches. (If necessary the Trinity patch can be postponed.)
Thank you in advance!
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.03 19:45:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: Tarminic
...carrying around 400 million ISK in a 1 million ISK hauler is absolutely idiotic.
Yes, but I do that afk.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.03 20:29:00 -
[3]
Originally by: JamnOne
I recommend if you want a safe game play a non-online game.
Non-online games are dangerous as well. I already requested at id-software to remove the hell knights out of Doom3.
Originally by: JamnOne
Concord does arrive quickly and does damage quickly.
Not quick and hard enough to protect me. If it would have been the case I wouldn't need the game change.
Originally by: JamnOne
What you are asking is to AFK without any risks what so ever. What is the point of playing the game then?
I am only talking about high sec.
Originally by: JamnOne
Option 1 - Don't Fly AFK
But I want. That's why the game change is necessary.
Originally by: JamnOne
Option 2 - Fly a ship that can defend itself or at least be able to tank the suicide gankers until Concord gets done with them.
I need the cargo space. So only freighters, Indies and transport ships are possible. Freighters are too slow, the Blockade runners' cargohold is too small. Then the Indies and the big transport ships are an option. But with the requested changes it doesn't matter anymore.
Originally by: JamnOne
Option 3 - Don't play the Game.
Why that? I am trying to improve the game with my proposal.
Originally by: JamnOne
Final advice, remember it is a game.
I know. And it's a good one! But it could be even better if I could afk smoke at the window.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.03 20:42:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Kessiaan
There was a post a few days back that proposed that cargo / ship scanning someone not in your gang or corp would flag you for kill rights for 15 minutes (like stealing a can or wreck does now).
I have even kill rights over one month against the pirate. But I won't make use of them I think. He seems to be a friendly guy, we almost had a deal selling him a new battleship but his sec status dropped and he can't enter my manufacturing system anymore after attacking me. CONCORD should allow that after a personal invitation.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.03 22:47:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Aaron
--Rules of Haulage--
1, NEVER, EVER, EVER use autopilot when hauling valuable cargo.
2, NEVER, ever, ever, ever, go afk.
3, Fit a cloak, cloak when u enter system, double click up or down, then half a second later turn on your cloak. if u stick to busy trade routes you will get lost in the crowd of ships. fly away from possible gankers to 40km. and then initiate warp.
4, Never warp to within 15km of gate.
5, Do not complain on forum if you lose expensive cargo by not following these simple, logical rules.
I just talked with a Dev (or was it a voice in my head, I'm not sure) and he decided to change that to the
NEW RULES OF HIGH-SEC HAULAGE:
1. Use your Autopilot because it is designed for autopiloting
2. Go afk whenever you want. Nothing can happen to you when autopiloting through high sec. (If something happens it's a bug, we reimburse, except in case of natural disasters)
3. Cloaks are fully integrated into the Autopilot, no user interaction necessary.
4. Autopilot-Warp to 15 km is OUT! Autopilot-Warp to 0 is IN!
5. We let the self destruction button unchanged to leave enough room for complaining on the forum after hitting that button accidentally.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.04 14:55:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Xaen
That's a contradiction. You exploded = he succeeded.
He had another opinion. It's like invention: Twice a failure, three times success. Noone is happy about the two failures. On the long run of course suicide ganking must be quite profitable, considering what deal on a daily delivery volume of battleships we were talking about. Hm, I don't seem to be the only afk smoker in the game.
Originally by: Xaen
Looks fine to me. Let me guess, T1 hauler with minimal tanking modules fitted.
Active shield tanking. I heard, the safest way when afk playing.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:48:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Malcanis
http://support.eve-online.com/Pages/KB/Article.aspx?id=341
I really don't know why at first my post is quoted and then a link to this chapter about "Kamikaze attacks" ("This is not seen as an exploit of the intended game mechanics and there is no compensation or reimbursement to be had for losses caused by attacks in secure space.") follows.
It is as if I tell you I want to eat beef next Sunday and you reply: "On Friday we eat fish."
This chapter talks only about the current state of the art. And it doesn't prove that suicide ganking is NOT a hole in the game mechanics.
From a developer and legal point of view a software does not need to do what it SHOULD do applying a few atoms of common sense but only what the documentation tells about the software.
Or from another direction: If the software has a bug - and who could disagree that suicide ganking is not only a bug but a heavy design failure - you can either remove the bug or write down in the documentation that it is intended and only looking like a bug.
It can only be a temporary state. Flying around in high sec, sitting in front of the screen, not smoking at the window, pleaaaaase..., an impossible and only transitional situation, you know it!
OK, Trinity deployment wasn't postponed so I expect the implementation of the necessary changes will follow very soon after.
So, dear high sec gankers: adapt in advance and quit your business before you tumble in a deep hole of a futile ingame-life and end as a shattered nervous wreck scrunching sandcastles in the marvellous world of Hello-Kitty Online.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:30:00 -
[8]
Originally by: brinelan
I don't see the problem. Nothing is safe..
You see the problem.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.06 16:12:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Rufus MacMaranth
...Maybe an 'away for a smoke, or a drink' icon can be applied that lasts for 5 minutes and renders you invulnerable and can be used once every 30mins or so...
This is a really constructive post and a great proposal! I have updated my opening post and included the INVULNERABILITY BUTTON as Option 3 (while I removed the time restriction which seems to be only the half of the way to the optimal solution).
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.07 16:48:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Karrade Krise
Originally by: Kolmogorow
(pirates could still hunt in the middle between two gates waiting for ships with low capacitor capacity coming out of warp directly in front of them - with a little luck),
Sure......that makes perfect sense. Since a ship can only see ships warping into their grid for about 400 km....why not make a huge chain gang of ships, one every 400 km, from one gate to another...Because obviously you're not going to be able to probe them within 30 seconds before they warp away...
Well, suicide ganking is a lottery anyway. I only want to move this lottery away from the gates to somewhere else in space. It might reduce the chance of winning a little bit but ... we have to sacrifice something for the serious improvements I proposed.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.07 17:31:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Taurequis
Suicide ganking happens to all types of ships from freighters down to shuttles.
Do they really have a chance taking down freighters at a gate in high sec?
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.07 19:12:00 -
[12]
Originally by: dust monkey
Originally by: Kolmogorow
Originally by: Taurequis
Suicide ganking happens to all types of ships from freighters down to shuttles.
Do they really have a chance taking down freighters at a gate in high sec?
YES
My hauler had around 5% of armor and 1% of hull compared to a freighter and the battleship attacking me popped at the same time than my ship.
How should it be possible to kill a freighter in High Sec? If so, it's obviously a bug because freighters are designed to be untouchable in High Sec.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.07 20:32:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Hamfast
...34 seconds...
Bah, as I said: CONCORD is too slow and too weak.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.08 14:11:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Carolina Sky
...the gankers get all the rewards for no risk , cause insurance covers them...
Hahaha, I didn't know that they get insurance payout. Now it becomes even more ridiculous. What is the insurance fee for a battleship? I don't know, 20 Mil or something like that?
So with goods in cargo space worth a bit more than this insurance fee suicide ganking starts to be profitable and it even doesn't hurt the ganker so much to do it just for fun.
Obviously the game fails at high sec travelling. Why isn't the Autopilot removed, it is useless.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.10 17:55:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Edelhonk
...did you ever fly 25 or more (even with warp to 0 it takes over 45 min to do a run of 25 jumps) jumps, its boring like hell and i play this game to have fun, not to be bored.
THAT is by far the most sophisticated statement about the issue! And the only solution not to be bored flying 25 jumps through high sec is to fly afk and to do something other in the meantime.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.11 17:07:00 -
[16]
Does "Trolling" include not to tell the truth? Probably it is one of the most used words in the forum but it is not suitable in this thread.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.12 20:19:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Anacrit Mc'Sinister
INVULNERABILITY BUTTON!!
YES!!!
Today I was locked and probably scanned again during gate approach in a T1 hauler. 10 Mil cargoload including fitted modules. Seemed to be not worth enough so they unlocked me. I observed the spectacle around the gate: Two different ships locked me, either one large (some battleships, cruisers, Ittys, freighters) bad coordinated group of gankers or two or more different competing groups. The other side of the gate was already contaminated by more than a hundred CONCORD ships causing terrible lag, an impertinence!
This crap seems to be getting more and more popular which is extremely bad because it forces to sit in front of the screen mouseclicking for every stupid movement resulting in square shaped eyes. That nonsense must be removed from the game quickly. Must be able to smoke relaxed at the window.
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.13 19:18:00 -
[18]
Quote:
the other, almost identical post
LOOOL, sadly I didn't see that til now (but looks similar only at first glance, probably simply by accident because there is no relationship between irony and the topic we're discussing here).
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Kolmogorow
Freedom Resources
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Posted - 2007.12.17 20:02:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Cvuos
Maybe you should be able to select that you're a smoker in the registration menu and then be able to safely go afk.
That's another great idea!
But we probably cannot really expect an implementation because everyone would select this option, even the non-smokers.
But with a small modification we could propose the following well-balanced
Option4:
The CONCORD-ESCORT-CONTRACT (popularly also known as the SMOKER-LICENSE). With a small pile of license documents in your cargohold which can be bought like the Empire Starbase Charters and like those are valid for one hour you are allowed to smoke and fly safely through high sec while a ultra-heavy escort of CONCORD or Empire faction ships convoys you in return for the payed fees. To avoid lag the escort flies cloaked and appears only and instantaneously when the escorted ship is attacked.
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