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Rells
Caldari
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
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Posted - 2007.12.23 23:49:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Rells on 23/12/2007 23:52:03
Remote Sensor Dampeners or ships doing high speed or ECM and unfortunately they often get very bad changes pushed through with a collective howl of whining.
The problem here is that this crowd of F1-8ers never even considers the possibility that Eve combat is more than what they think it is. They dont consider that they might be wrong about their perception of combat and seek to learn the difference. Instead they try to push through changes that will babysit thier poorly formed notion of how combat "should be" ... namely that they should be able to "own" anyone in combat if they have the bigger ship. If they werent so successful with this campaign, I wouldnt have bothered with this post.
AGONY has been teaching newbies to PvP for 2 years now. We take the player that barely knows how to fly and put them in 0.0 and take them out hunting. We have shattered the myth that you need millions of SP and billions of isk to PvP so many times I have lost count. Why is it that these new players are able to take on people in PvP in 0.0 with such small ships? Teamwork and tactics.
Others have tried many things to kill these fleets and have failed. Smartbombs have been tried and almost universally result in the loss of the battleship with minimal if any loss to the fleet. Yet, at the same time a random group of frigates without training would all be killed in a situation when the trained frigates prevail.
The difference between the group that gets wiped and the group that succeeds is tactics and training. It has little to do with skillpoints and far more to do with the skills of the players. Within minutes of being in PVP-BASIC, the newbie learns that PVP is a deeply tactical experience. The class takes nearly six hours of instruction and 50k words of reading. Many students come back again and again to pick up what they missed the last time. The opponents that they fight are not contrived or arranged. In fact, often these opponents read our boards and try to take on and kill the class. Sometimes they manage it but most of the time they get wiped or are forced to withdraw.
So what is the F1-8er supposed to do? First of all realize that there are five keys to pvp in eve. 1) Teamwork 2) Know your equipment 3) Train your skills 4) Get in your opponent's head and 5) Employ Creativity. Read on in the next post to learn how these principles are applied.
Four years is long enough to leave the corp interface broken! |
Rells
Caldari
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
|
Posted - 2007.12.23 23:50:00 -
[2]
First of all, one of the most important things to understand in Eve is the impact of teamwork. The group that works together as a team will prevail over those that are unorganized and poorly led. The team realizes that no one pilot can do everything and that the combination of specializations makes the gang work. Instead of trying to be one-man armies, they depend on their team mates to perform actions that keep them safe or take out the other guy. The battleships depend on the light and fast ships to get the tackles and the interdictors to bubble in the opponent. The frigs rely on the recons to keep enemy frigates off of them or neutralized. Each person in the gang makes up an integral component in the machine and the structure of the machine and the way the parts work together can be instrumental in a battle. Five well skilled and well fitted pilots can defeat 10 poorly organized pilots.
Knowing your equipment is a critical component of pvp in that it allows the pilot to understand the capabilities and limitations of their equipment. The newbie in PVP might get killed in his merlin by the enemy interceptor but the superior pilot in the Merlin would kill the aggressive interceptor. They accomplish this not by skill points or isk but by knowing their equipment and training their skills with that equipment. At the same time, the lone interceptor knows enough to avoid direct contact with a Rapier, Curse, or Vagabond. Knowing your equipment means knowing its limitations and its abilites. Two damps from a maulus can effectively remove that enemy vagabond from the fight.
Knowing your skills and training them is one of the major keys to PVP. Learning to manually fly that interceptor to avoid the superior pursing interceptor or knowing how to get that interceptor aggressed are critical. So is knowing the right orbit range, the capabilities of other ships and the synchronization of teamwork. If you dont know how to scan properly you can get the whole gang killed. If you don't know when to leave that fight alone and decline the engagement then you will potentially doom your gang to death.
Getting in your opponent's head is the most important part of fleet warfare. If you know what they are going to do then you can plan a response. That response may either counter their attack or perhaps choose to avoid the engagement completely. When you see that Dominix warping into your camp and aggressing when you clearly have usperior force, you should be thinking "why is he doing that" instead of the more instinctive reaction of "woot .. target". When you jump away from the obvious bait, ignoring them, you will know you are successful when they start smacktalking you for not fighting in local. Clearly the Dominix in question knew he had enough to take you all on. The 30 player spike in local as you warp away will confirm that. Getting in your opponent's head will give you more power than any single other PvP skill. If you cant do that then training that extra level in HAC is a waste of time.
Finally creativity is the cornerstone of tactical development. If your fleet's idea of tactics is to warp in 20 bs and pound then remove your roles right there. That fleet will inevitably get owned by more creative pilots that out think the "me have big gun" crowd. If you want to catch that nano ship or covops, there are ways to do it. All you need to do is come up with creative ways of catching the ships. When you combine that with the knowledge of your equipment, the skills of your pilots and getting in your opponent's head, you get a successful operation.
In conclusion, nerfing the game is not the answer except in circumstances where all of the above fails. Nerfs should be few and far between, carefully considered and the 0.0 players should be an integral part of the process, not mere victims to theoretical numbers, ****ed off carebears or stupid and lazy pilots.
Four years is long enough to leave the corp interface broken! |
Rells
Caldari
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
|
Posted - 2007.12.24 00:10:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: jongalt
his points are valid but...
rells' arrogance knows no bounds.
who knew he was so vain?
-jg.
Really? Well you are entitled to your opinion. Even if you are a coward enough to not post it with your main. I personally dont need to hide behind an alt.
Four years is long enough to leave the corp interface broken! |
Rells
Caldari
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
|
Posted - 2007.12.24 00:19:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Tortun Nahme
Rells has officially been forum podded
tip my hat to you jongalt
Really? By what? One moron with a flippant comment hiding behind an ALT char rather than posting with his main? Excuse me if I'm not mortally wounded. For all we know jongalt is your alt and you are posting to stroke your own ego.
At any rate I couldn't care less what either of you (f there are two) think.
Four years is long enough to leave the corp interface broken! |
Rells
Caldari
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
|
Posted - 2007.12.24 00:26:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Tortun Nahme
actually no, a forum podding comes from your response, not his, and whether you care or not, you've succeeded in killing your own thread 
Actually you should grow up or go back to wow. Im not going to play your stupid juvenile game. You remind me of little children running around playing stupid word games.
Four years is long enough to leave the corp interface broken! |
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