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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
![doombreed52 doombreed52](https://images.evetech.net/characters/211748991/portrait?size=64)
doombreed52
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
26
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Posted - 2012.02.18 16:16:00 -
[571] - Quote
Havent filled thread with post for aa few pages posting to fill spam mail. |
![Lyris Nairn Lyris Nairn](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1629399332/portrait?size=64)
Lyris Nairn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
10110
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 17:47:00 -
[572] - Quote
rodyas wrote:I decry the straw man argument on that. Thinking is hard, but math wasnt involved so I had a little hope. Few people on this forum care for the rules of formal debate. Sky Captain of Your Heart; Lyris Chronicles of Narnia in the World of Tomorrow's Goonfleet dot Com; RIFTERSWARM : Good Poster Extraordinaire and Spacebook Superstar; Vote Lyris Nairn for CSM7. |
![rodyas rodyas](https://images.evetech.net/characters/90242766/portrait?size=64)
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
397
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 18:06:00 -
[573] - Quote
The people are too desperate for formal debate, its a free for all. disorientating |
![Talamant Talamant](https://images.evetech.net/characters/744874980/portrait?size=64)
Talamant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
14
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Posted - 2012.02.18 18:07:00 -
[574] - Quote
Falin Whalen wrote:Princess, I really have to point out that your arguments are all based on Logical fallacies. Go Here, or better yet try to avoid the two you seem to make HERE, and HERE. Your entire argument is based on you either affirming the consequent, or denying the antecedent. :siren: BADPOSTING DETECTED :siren: |
![Volgram Volgram](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1541517559/portrait?size=64)
Volgram
Imperium Immortalis Ab Jove Principium
1
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Posted - 2012.02.18 18:09:00 -
[575] - Quote
The Mittani wrote:
Become a constituent. Vote Mittani.
I have but a simple question.
Of all the questions that one individual or several groups could think about, this sole question seems to me the most significant. And thus, I wish to ask you this:
What is your vision for our sandbox?
The CSM might not have game changing power, prehaps not even any power at all. The final decision always lies with CCP. However, with all of this seemingly "powerlessness", we still see men and women who wish to be a beacon that the masses can rally behind. Yet, no "power" is within their grasp.
I would imagine that being on the CSM, sometimes a person has to go to great lengths to ensure that our game, our sandbox, still looks the way we know it. Sometimes without benefit to oneself and, prehaps, even to the detriment of one's surroundings.
So, in essence, I ask:
What drives you to continue your work in the CSM? What is your vision? |
![Midge Mo'yb Midge Mo'yb](https://images.evetech.net/characters/141491554/portrait?size=64)
Midge Mo'yb
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
87
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Posted - 2012.02.18 19:00:00 -
[576] - Quote
The Mittani wrote:a delightful sacrifice in the finest democratic tradition~
http://kb.batcountry-eve.org/index.php/cc_detail/4/
500 has come and gone, and the thirst for blood has not subsided. |
![Devalis Devalis](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1444713616/portrait?size=64)
Devalis
CyberShield Inc ROMANIAN-LEGION
4
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 22:21:00 -
[577] - Quote
Why is your dog punching your junk? Little weird bro! |
![The Mittani The Mittani](https://images.evetech.net/characters/443630591/portrait?size=64)
The Mittani
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5224
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 23:21:00 -
[578] - Quote
I forgot to troll Jita Park for two days because I've been too busy playing in Red vs Blue with a 400mm plated Rifter.
Couple of things:
1. I withdraw my prior support for any kind of batlteground/instanced PvP arena. This is not needed, as Red vs Blue provides exactly that.
2. You guys should give it a whirl, it's like Syndicate in 2006 - frigate slugfests and no supercaps. The Office of the Chairman: A Thread for Constituent Issues |
![The Mittani The Mittani](https://images.evetech.net/characters/443630591/portrait?size=64)
The Mittani
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5224
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 23:29:00 -
[579] - Quote
Volgram wrote:The Mittani wrote:
Become a constituent. Vote Mittani.
I have but a simple question. Of all the questions that one individual or several groups could think about, this sole question seems to me the most significant. And thus, I wish to ask you this: What is your vision for our sandbox? The CSM might not have game changing power, prehaps not even any power at all. The final decision always lies with CCP. However, with all of this seemingly "powerlessness", we still see men and women who wish to be a beacon that the masses can rally behind. Yet, no "power" is within their grasp. I would imagine that being on the CSM, sometimes a person has to go to great lengths to ensure that our game, our sandbox, still looks the way we know it. Sometimes without benefit to oneself and, prehaps, even to the detriment of one's surroundings. So, in essence, I ask: What drives you to continue your work in the CSM? What is your vision?
Your question is a funny one, because it's predicated on a lot of 'the CSM has no power' assumptions and predicates, when it's pretty obvious that it does have power - at least, to the people who understand power, influence, and politics, those being the barons of nullsec. If I had a dime for every time a hisec miner bleated about how power 'really' works while updating their spreadsheets, I'd buy another house in cash.
That power can't be allowed to fall into the hands of drooling idiots, like it has in the past. The power also has to be used wisely to counteract the penchant of CCP's management-level suits to drink Kool-aid and consider their ideas (pants!) flawless despite criticism.
As CSM Chair, I offer sound guidance and guardianship of that power; I'm one of the first to truly wield it effectively. I'm here to protect the nullsec population against the existential danger of allowing an ignorant hiseccer and Greyscale to get together and talk about jump bridges. I'm here to keep the focus of the game on spaceships instead of a testbed for WoD or a venue for more pants. It's a guardianship.
My ideas are not particularly unique; all nullsec candidates have a similar worldview. What's unique about what I offer the CSM and EVE as a whole is a puissant understanding of politics, influence, dealmaking, and Getting Things Done. The record of CSM6 - the most successful CSM in history - is a testament to that savvy.
The Office of the Chairman: A Thread for Constituent Issues |
![The Mittani The Mittani](https://images.evetech.net/characters/443630591/portrait?size=64)
The Mittani
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5224
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 23:32:00 -
[580] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:Tyrion Struan wrote:
And no. You are making a rather common mistake in the application of innocent utill prove guilty. This applies in the eyes of the law, but does not mean that a thing has or has not happened. Also, it applies in criminal law, which this is not. (You've seen to many cop shows.) That something is a legal issue - like if Marzetti has promised not to pee on your leg or not and whether he has violated that promise or not - does not mean that it may not have taken place unless it has been found to be so by a court. I have never been found guilty of exeeding the speed limit, doesn't mean that I never have. The alleged victime has chosen to say that they lack proof, and apparently in in private that though it was said in a channel where all information was to be considered priviliged under the NDA, that this particular information did not. As a matter of law that is an assessment, and no more. Its not desicive either way.
Oh, and just so no one thinks that I'm claiming e-peen here, I neither hold, nor have I ever studied for, an undergrad in philosophy.
My goodness. If you cut out all of the condescending parts, you're not even left with something funny, just kinda sad. Again, you're failing to differentiate between a determination of law, which the question of breach clearly is, and a determination of fact. I am not questioning whether someone's leg was peed upon, nor whether information from a chat was leaked. The first I'm sure is true in some context, and the second I can stipulate to. The question is whether Darius III breached his NDA with CCP. That's a legal question, and as CCP has stated they have seen no evidence of a breach, it's safe to assume there was no breach. If there was no breach, which again is a legal question, then Mittani's statement that there was a breach is mud slinging. You seem stuck on this word "assessment". Relabeling a legal determination made by a non-party does not make it any more valid. It could be my "assessment" that my neighbor trespassed on another neighbor's property. However, when I make the statement "He trespassed", that does not make a legal truth of it. That would be a legal determination. If my neighbor is not alleging trespass, and a court has not found this to be the case, then I can "assess" this all I want. I could have witnessed one neighbor walking on another neighbor's land. But that doesn't mean there was a trespass. Perhaps there was an easement I don't know about. Your main argument seems to be that The Mittani was not lying, only being ignorant. Either way, politically motivated ignorance is still mud slinging. Also, when being condescending, please make a better effort to keep your writings clear of obvious errors. Trying to look down on me when you are adding extra Ls to until, Es to victim, Is to privilege, dropping the C in decisive, etc. does little to prove your condescension is valid.
Are you writing a lot of words to say that I sling mud?
This is an election; deal with it. The Office of the Chairman: A Thread for Constituent Issues |
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![The Mittani The Mittani](https://images.evetech.net/characters/443630591/portrait?size=64)
The Mittani
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5224
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 23:37:00 -
[581] - Quote
holy crap you guys spent the last three pages arguing about 'if i sling mud' and having non-lawyers trying to parse legal phrases
i sling mud, i scam supercaps, and i'm a sadist, this isn't new or particularly interesting
The Office of the Chairman: A Thread for Constituent Issues |
![rodyas rodyas](https://images.evetech.net/characters/90242766/portrait?size=64)
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
418
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 23:47:00 -
[582] - Quote
We could have worst sadists, then just ones that throw mud to get jollies.
Also on the RvB it does sound great and I can see what ya mean by it being a battleground or an arena. I suppose I usually dont like to talk about the isk costs of ship and supporting pvp through isk, Just alot of pvpers talk about needing isk to pvp. Wondering with how RvB is and what size of ship can be used to support it being arena based on isk making, or what ships are too big to sustain in arena use in RvB.
It seems what can be hard with arena, is the constant isk using to buy ships to keep fighting. Wondering if you have any ideas on isk useage in arena pvp really. disorientating |
![rodyas rodyas](https://images.evetech.net/characters/90242766/portrait?size=64)
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
419
|
Posted - 2012.02.18 23:59:00 -
[583] - Quote
Well I was thinking of isk making potential and supporting arena pvp. It seems tech moons and high sec incursions are the best isk makers. Maybe that means hi seccer have potential to run arena and null seccers. Of course that isk is used to make titans and mothers, as well as reimburesment and whatever incursion runners buy. So some hard decisions would have to be made there I imagine. But it does seem low sec has no real way of making decent isk. I am not a sadist, so I wont mention them just doing low sec incursion if they want an arena style pvp.
So there are some decent isk makers to support arena play, but they do come with hard decisions and people who enjoy low sec would be hard hit up to make isk enough to join in. disorientating |
![Andski Andski](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1498850496/portrait?size=64)
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2115
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 00:26:00 -
[584] - Quote
"guys guys we need to nerf anomalies and jump bridges, people are making way too much ISK and projecting far too much power hey why is nullsec empty" yeah no i'm not actually running for csm7
got you lol!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
![Alavaria Fera Alavaria Fera](https://images.evetech.net/characters/91492021/portrait?size=64)
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
137
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 02:10:00 -
[585] - Quote
The Mittani wrote:i sling mud, i scam supercaps, and i'm a sadist, this isn't new or particularly interesting Mittani for CSM chair !
|
![Princess Bride Princess Bride](https://images.evetech.net/characters/764486282/portrait?size=64)
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
155
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 02:23:00 -
[586] - Quote
The Mittani wrote:holy crap you guys spent the last three pages arguing about 'if i sling mud' and having non-lawyers trying to parse legal phrases
i sling mud, i scam supercaps, and i'm a sadist, this isn't new or particularly interesting
What's most interesting about this statement is that your alliance has spent a lot of effort trying to draw the distinction between your role in-game (dishonest, scammer, etc.) and what you are in real life. It appears that they're wrong about you and we can expect the same things from you as a CSM as we expect in game. All those arguments about how Eve is a sandbox which excuses your in-game behavior and how silly people are for thinking you're not different in real life were for nothing.
Thank you for clearing that up. http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
![The Mittani The Mittani](https://images.evetech.net/characters/443630591/portrait?size=64)
The Mittani
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5227
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 02:48:00 -
[587] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote: What's most interesting about this statement is that your alliance has spent a lot of effort trying to draw the distinction between your role in-game (dishonest, scammer, etc.) and what you are in real life. It appears that they're wrong about you and we can expect the same things from you as a CSM as we expect in game. All those arguments about how Eve is a sandbox which excuses your in-game behavior and how silly people are for thinking you're not different in real life were for nothing.
Thank you for clearing that up.
I'm an incumbent. You can expect exactly the same kind of stuff from me in CSM7 as you got in CSM6, the most effective CSM in history.
I'm delighted to run on my record. The Office of the Chairman: A Thread for Constituent Issues |
![Princess Bride Princess Bride](https://images.evetech.net/characters/764486282/portrait?size=64)
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
155
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 03:02:00 -
[588] - Quote
The Mittani wrote:Princess Bride wrote: What's most interesting about this statement is that your alliance has spent a lot of effort trying to draw the distinction between your role in-game (dishonest, scammer, etc.) and what you are in real life. It appears that they're wrong about you and we can expect the same things from you as a CSM as we expect in game. All those arguments about how Eve is a sandbox which excuses your in-game behavior and how silly people are for thinking you're not different in real life were for nothing.
Thank you for clearing that up.
I'm an incumbent. You can expect exactly the same kind of stuff from me in CSM7 as you got in CSM6, the most effective CSM in history. I'm delighted to run on my record.
There's an old saying that "you can't make a good deal with bad people." I view a vote for a CSM as a contract between myself and the CSM. You are an admitted sadist, brag about slinging mud as a politician, and draw no distinction between you as a person and The Mittani. Regardless of how effective you say you were as a CSM last year, I feel its only a matter of time before you fall back on who you are as a person and politician. When this happens I think it's safe to say that you'll have no problem with screwing everyone over if you can... Eve, CCP, the players, and those who voted for you. I mean that's what mud-slinging sadists do, right? I'm sure it'll be lol-tastic too.
However, I'd rather vote for someone who is a decent human being to represent me in Iceland. http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
![Solinuas Solinuas](https://images.evetech.net/characters/504909362/portrait?size=64)
Solinuas
Viziam Amarr Empire
57
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 03:29:00 -
[589] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:
There's an old saying that "you can't make a good deal with bad people." I view a vote for a CSM as a contract between myself and the CSM. You are an admitted sadist, brag about slinging mud as a politician, and draw no distinction between you as a person and The Mittani. Regardless of how effective you say you were as a CSM last year, I feel its only a matter of time before you fall back on who you are as a person and politician. When this happens I think it's safe to say that you'll have no problem with screwing everyone over if you can... Eve, CCP, the players, and those who voted for you. I mean that's what mud-slinging sadists do, right? I'm sure it'll be lol-tastic too.
However, I'd rather vote for someone who is a decent human being to represent me in Iceland.
And because of this me and all of my alts shall vote for mittens! |
![Princess Bride Princess Bride](https://images.evetech.net/characters/764486282/portrait?size=64)
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
155
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:06:00 -
[590] - Quote
Solinuas wrote: And because of this me and all of my alts shall vote for mittens!
Don't kid yourself. You and the rest of the goons will vote for him because you're a socially inept lemming who is happy to do what he's told because you live vicariously through The Mittani. The bigger he gets, the bigger and more important you'll feel. The fact that he's an admitted sadist and mudslinging politician who has trouble distinguishing between his role as a CSM and his role in-game will not affect your decision in either direction. http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
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![The Mittani The Mittani](https://images.evetech.net/characters/443630591/portrait?size=64)
The Mittani
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5228
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:19:00 -
[591] - Quote
*advises people not to kid themselves*
*posts earnestly about contracts, ethics, and the moral high ground in jita park*
heh The Office of the Chairman: A Thread for Constituent Issues |
![Home Strech Home Strech](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1651145140/portrait?size=64)
Home Strech
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:21:00 -
[592] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote: The fact that he's an admitted sadist and mudslinging politician who has trouble distinguishing between his role as a CSM and his role in-game will not affect your decision in either direction.
Um being a politician when running for council seat is a bad thing?
And what is wrong with being a sadist I am a masochist and LOVE sadists :) |
![The Mittani The Mittani](https://images.evetech.net/characters/443630591/portrait?size=64)
The Mittani
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5228
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:26:00 -
[593] - Quote
I think there's a lot of folks who missed my CSM6 campaign last year. I make no bones about being a complete bastard. Most people who know me in nullsec or have been on the wrong end of my alliance are entirely aware of the lengths I go to in order to win.
In CSM6 I vowed that I would put my skill at raw bastardry to use - to improve the game and make the CSM actually work; I did exactly that. I'm not a saint, an angel, or a ~nice guy~. Those kind of people don't do well in a political group where your task is to influence and persuade others, to cut deals, to think in a Machiavellian manner.
If you think an effective politician is a 'moral' person, well, I know a great guy who can act as a trusted third party if you need to transfer a supercap!
The Office of the Chairman: A Thread for Constituent Issues |
![Princess Bride Princess Bride](https://images.evetech.net/characters/764486282/portrait?size=64)
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
156
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:32:00 -
[594] - Quote
The Mittani wrote:I think there's a lot of folks who missed my CSM6 campaign last year. I make no bones about being a complete bastard. Most people who know me in nullsec or have been on the wrong end of my alliance are entirely aware of the lengths I go to in order to win.
In CSM6 I vowed that I would put my skill at raw bastardry to use - to improve the game and make the CSM actually work; I did exactly that. I'm not a saint, an angel, or a ~nice guy~. Those kind of people don't do well in a political group where your task is to influence and persuade others, to cut deals, to think in a Machiavellian manner.
If you think an effective politician is a 'moral' person, well, I know a great guy who can act as a trusted third party if you need to transfer a supercap!
Actually, you're kinda fail as a follower of Machiavelli. To quote The Prince:
"For this reason a prince ought to take care that he never lets anything slip from his lips that is not replete with the above-named five qualities, that he may appear to him who sees and hears him altogether merciful, faithful, humane, upright, and religious."
See, Machiavelli understood that a leader had to APPEAR virtuous, despite his true nature. It's funny you should mention Machiavelli as I was just musing to myself that you must have never read him. You're not going to be elected because you're a master of Machiavelli's teachings. You'll get elected because of the structure of the election and the large voting block you control. http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
![The Mittani The Mittani](https://images.evetech.net/characters/443630591/portrait?size=64)
The Mittani
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5230
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:37:00 -
[595] - Quote
all i see in your posts is 'a bloo bloo bloo', my computer must be screwing up again~ The Office of the Chairman: A Thread for Constituent Issues |
![Sara XIII Sara XIII](https://images.evetech.net/characters/91235749/portrait?size=64)
Sara XIII
My lil Tax Shelter
57
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:40:00 -
[596] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:The Mittani wrote:I think there's a lot of folks who missed my CSM6 campaign last year. I make no bones about being a complete bastard. Most people who know me in nullsec or have been on the wrong end of my alliance are entirely aware of the lengths I go to in order to win.
In CSM6 I vowed that I would put my skill at raw bastardry to use - to improve the game and make the CSM actually work; I did exactly that. I'm not a saint, an angel, or a ~nice guy~. Those kind of people don't do well in a political group where your task is to influence and persuade others, to cut deals, to think in a Machiavellian manner.
If you think an effective politician is a 'moral' person, well, I know a great guy who can act as a trusted third party if you need to transfer a supercap!
Actually, you're kinda fail as a follower of Machiavelli. To quote The Prince: "For this reason a prince ought to take care that he never lets anything slip from his lips that is not replete with the above-named five qualities, that he may appear to him who sees and hears him altogether merciful, faithful, humane, upright, and religious." See, Machiavelli understood that a leader had to APPEAR virtuous, despite his true nature. It's funny you should mention Machiavelli as I was just musing to myself that you must have never read him. You're not going to be elected because you're a master of Machiavelli's teachings. You'll get elected because of the structure of the election and the large voting block you control.
Psst, your pubbie is showing. Please stop. ![Ugh](https://forums-archive.eveonline.com/Images/Emoticons/ccp_ugh.png) |
![Poetic Stanziel Poetic Stanziel](https://images.evetech.net/characters/90689347/portrait?size=64)
Poetic Stanziel
Major Kong Freight
749
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:49:00 -
[597] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:... and draw no distinction between you as a person and The Mittani. The Mittani would beat a dog if he thought it would get him something he desired (like a ham sammich).
This Alexander Gianturco fellow, I don't think he would beat a dog, unless under the most extreme circumstances/duress.
The Mittani is an asshole. I hear that this Alexander Gianturco fellow is actually a pretty nice and friendly guy. The STAIN Travel Bookmark Collection - 451 Bookmarks |
![Endeavour Starfleet Endeavour Starfleet](https://images.evetech.net/characters/91002127/portrait?size=64)
Endeavour Starfleet
646
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:53:00 -
[598] - Quote
Would you mind please going over your views of incursion going into CSM7? With the possibility of a renewed campaign to get them seriously nerfed in the future I would like to know if you are willing to go from a rather passive stance to that of defending them and content like it from those with an agenda of pushing more CTA participation without benefits. Or those who just hate highsec. |
![Princess Bride Princess Bride](https://images.evetech.net/characters/764486282/portrait?size=64)
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
156
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 04:56:00 -
[599] - Quote
Poetic Stanziel wrote:Princess Bride wrote:... and draw no distinction between you as a person and The Mittani. The Mittani would beat a dog if he thought it would get him something he desired (like a ham sammich). This Alexander Gianturco fellow, I don't think he would beat a dog, unless under the most extreme circumstances/duress. The Mittani is an as shole. I hear that this Alexander Gianturco fellow is actually a pretty nice and friendly guy.
So who are we speaking to here. The Mittani, or Alex? More importantly, who are we electing? http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
![Mintrolio Mintrolio](https://images.evetech.net/characters/90965992/portrait?size=64)
Mintrolio
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
311
|
Posted - 2012.02.19 05:02:00 -
[600] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote: So who are we speaking to here. The Mittani, or Alex? More importantly, who are we electing?
PLESE ELECTIGN ME AND LEAFIGN THIS POOR DEFENSLESE GOON MITANI ALONE NOW.
ALSO THESE CONTINU POASTIGN IS PUSHIGN MINE POAST DOWN DOWN DOWN.
THENK YOU. MINTROLIO FUR CSM7 |
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