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BYDI vs FDN..A few good words about the war..(and some not)

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Ugluuk Caldari Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.01.18 20:31:00 - [1] There has been a overwhelming interest from people in Molden Heat about the war between BYDI and FDN so i thought id make a little update on how it is going on the forum..Then i dont have to repeat myself all the time.. INTRO: Bydi and Foundation have been a pain in the arse for each other for a while as we live in the same place.. The fights had been fun with usually bs/bc gangs going at each other but the fun stopped when FDN started to cyno in ships non stop in most fights.. So we declared war on them to get some easy kills on solo pilots and even out the score with us avoiding sentry damage.. Week 1: The first week went by with some awesome fights and FDN showed that there is lots of quality and trigger happy pilots in the alliance.. We have had good contact between us and the FDN leadership have been going to the BYDI killboard to get losses that aren`t posted.. I feel that they have to get credits for that and it is a very good attitude by FDN.. There was capital ships from both sides entering fleet fights but generally it got kept to a minimum. Week 2: Week 2 started with a dissapointment when they added our friends in RUIN to the BYDI campaign on their killboard after killing a few capital ships in a RUIN vs FDN gang.. I asked them why and they said that they had to make the score more even by adding our friends losses.. The war is between BYDI and FDN imo but we do the same gest for them and added some of their friends which ofcourse doesn`t show the correct picture of the war.. I talked to Space Chutney and we came to an agreement to not make a fuzz about it and once again the FDN leadership was cool to talk with.. The second week has gone by with a almost non existant FDN and lots of small ganks from our side to lonely pilots.. Unfortunately the last few days have been the most useless days of any war i have had.. Almost every third kill we got from FDN the pilot has a cyno on the ship and there is no will to fight.. 2 examples: Yesterday a Bydi Harbinger attacked a Myrmidon,Rapier,Tristan and Punisher and they cynoed in a Nyx.. I came in a Rapier to help out too late but in the end we lost the Harbinger and killed a Myrmidon,Rapier,Taranis and Tristan.. Then today i met a Rapier in my Rapier..We went at it 1vs1 (not arranged) and as his shield was going down it happened.. First in was a Chimera..Then a Nyx..And 3 seconds later a Thanatos.. I was 50km away at that time so i sticked around long enough to kill the Rapier and get out.. If you just sent a few cruisers i would died and it would been much faster than getting 3 capital ships to undock and warp to me.. We will keep this war going and even tho the last days has been pretty bad we hope that they keep bringing the fights they did the first week.. And now to some stats: Bydi vs FDN: 61 - 24 Bydi vs FDN and friends = 143 - 31 8 bill dmg done and 2,3 bill recieved.. http://bydi.griefwatch.net/?p=campaigns
Keepit cool	Posted - 2008.01.18 20:49:00 - [2] You guys are bob-pets?
Jhonen Senraedi Minmatar Universal Exports FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.01.18 21:32:00 - [3] Nice to see the fiction section of these boards being kept alive!
Zinx 007	Posted - 2008.01.18 21:41:00 - [4] Molden Heath is a great battle ground. I have been in a few gangs with BYDI and RUIN and it's been great fun. I have to admit the supercaps are a little excessive, but besides that the pew pew is plentiful and it has been the best low sec war I have been in. Thanks for the fun BYDI and FDN.
munchy Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2008.01.18 21:46:00 - [5] sounds like you guys are having a good time down there. good to hear bydi and fnd are still pew pewing, and hopefully you'll get some better fights in the coming days. stop that ms spam fnd you're better than that! ---
Crazy Tasty Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.01.19 00:39:00 - [6] Originally by: Jhonen Senraedi Nice to see the fiction section of these boards being kept alive! How is it fiction? The numbers match your killboard almost exactly except for a few of your losses not posted. Seriously, less caps = more fights and less gankage of solo pilots, fun for everybody.
Ackaroth D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.01.19 04:53:00 - [7] Was a good read. Good stats put up by BYDI. Not sure if old mate Noobjuice is still among ya, but I still have my first ship from 0.0 out in a detorid station that he donated to me. "Noobjuice's Merlin". I kept it for nostalgia. A year and some change later he ganked me in deklein in sleipnir while I wasn't watching local. As always, an amazing pilot. By the numbers, BYDI fly some expensive ships :) ___________________ Add total value of open buy and sell orders to "Orders" tab of wallet. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=626498
Karandor Minmatar Wildlands Heavy Technologies FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.01.19 08:08:00 - [8] if you want more fights come to us in GW sometime. Don't ***** about having to train a lot of skills until you fly minmatar.
Blight1 Caldari Wreckless Abandon	Posted - 2008.01.19 09:05:00 - [9] Hi, we wardec'd you, but please don't bring big ships its not fair!
CamMan Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.19 10:43:00 - [10] Ugluuk, far too much whinging in your thread, if you know what they are doing then use it to your advantage, setup a trap for their MS. The next post I want to read from you should be "BYDI setup, trap and kill FDN nyx". As for the killboard stats thing "they did it, so we did it too" is a poor excuse mate, take the high ground and dont adjust your campaign stats, at least then you can say that your killboard is accurate. Cheers Cam Originally by: Bender Interesting, no the other one ... tedious
Awox Advanced Logistics	Posted - 2008.01.19 10:52:00 - [11] It's too easy for small NPC corp space alliances to get supercaps. I guess it has something to do with all the ISK farmers? :/ Nice work BYDI. Originally by: Jhonen Senraedi Nice to see the fiction section of these boards being kept alive! Yeah, because cynophoons don't exist?? :D faction loot ║ affordable hosting
MAXSuicide Cosmic Fusion When Fat Kids Attack	Posted - 2008.01.19 10:58:00 - [12] Edited by: MAXSuicide on 19/01/2008 10:58:50 Originally by: Jhonen Senraedi Nice to see the fiction section of these boards being kept alive! there are too many people that have experienced the exact same thing from the people of 'the east' for this to be fiction. capital spam.. its why 0.0 and to lesser extent, lowsec..) sucks complete balls for any small time pvper(s)
Alazais Fairlight Corp FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.01.19 11:06:00 - [13] This demonstrates the nature of killboards and friends, since on our campaign against you we have 66% efficiency, which is outstanding for a larger entity fighting a smaller one (who can pick targets and avoid the FCs). The key is that we are including The Reunion, your capital support corp, in the statistics. If you include our friends (and we fly very pure gangs anyway) you should include yours too :) Cap ships have certainly been dropped on both sides. For example: Friday, January 11th A merry band of FDN warriors, from new corp Aurora Acclivitous, travel through Oddelulf. Birds are singing, weather is sweet (Bob Marley is dancing). Then the heavens open and two Moros, one Phoenix (all 3 from The Renuion) and a Thanatos flown by Ugluuk drop from the sky to support the BYDI battleship gang. Four FDN battleships are lost. A few hours later.. Coffee has been served and the main FDN gang is a little bored. Word comes through about some capital ganking so Valdor sends a gang to investigate. Sure enough, we hit Molden Heath with about 8 ships and Villwrath (one of the Moros pilots from the earlier engagement) is on a gate in Bosena in a Hyperion. Valdor Hag engages and Villwrath drops a cyno. A Moros, Archon and Thanatos jump in and begin engaging our 3 bs on the gate. We return the favour with our own cyno, and you can enjoy the resultant rout in some nice premium graphics screenshots (extreme shadows/HDR/bloom): http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/morium/11jan1.jpg http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/morium/11jan2.jpg All three BYDI/Reunion caps are destroyed. Now the thing is, this is natural when a small corp decs a 0.0 alliance - the key is the cat and mouse game; to make your hit before the kitchen sink falls. Since we have 66% efficiency (all stats are relative though), you guys still have some work to do (not saying you don't get some nice kills though; and you'll get more). However, I would say none of this really deserves a CAOD thread, even our triple cap ship ganking described above, which was the biggest fight in - as you admit - a very low key war.
Kaleeb Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2008.01.19 11:31:00 - [14] Originally by: Ackaroth Not sure if old mate Noobjuice is still among ya, No mate Noob is in OMNOR, still flying bs with tech I guns
unknownuna Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.01.19 13:29:00 - [15] Edited by: unknownuna on 19/01/2008 13:29:43 Alazais: There is a slight difference between dropping carriers/dreads on a battleship gang, and dropping carriers and a mothership on a single recon cruiser. ;) It all boils down to the problem of two groups pre-empting each other with capitals, but it has to be said that you have used them far more liberally than us. That said, you obviously have more at hand. I believe the key difference is that we are all about getting good fights. A one sided gank means nothing more to us than a cargo full of loot and some meaningless KB stats. I'm not saying fighting to win is a bad thing, but it has lead to repeated blobbing. I want to make it clear that i'm not whining in any way here. That said, our wardec on FDN is one of several, and not the whole focus of our fighting. Quoting single killboard stats to paint a different picture is meaningless. The best way is to look at both killboards and find out for yourself, if that sort of thing pleases you. In the meanwhile, i'll be flying around MH looking for 1v1s. :P
Simariliia Spartan Industries Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.01.19 14:21:00 - [16] Edited by: Simariliia on 19/01/2008 14:21:39 Originally by: unknownuna Edited by: unknownuna on 19/01/2008 13:29:43 Alazais: There is a slight difference between dropping carriers/dreads on a battleship gang, and dropping carriers and a mothership on a single recon cruiser. ;) It all boils down to the problem of two groups pre-empting each other with capitals, but it has to be said that you have used them far more liberally than us. That said, you obviously have more at hand. I believe the key difference is that we are all about getting good fights. A one sided gank means nothing more to us than a cargo full of loot and some meaningless KB stats. I'm not saying fighting to win is a bad thing, but it has lead to repeated blobbing. I want to make it clear that i'm not whining in any way here. That said, our wardec on FDN is one of several, and not the whole focus of our fighting. Quoting single killboard stats to paint a different picture is meaningless. The best way is to look at both killboards and find out for yourself, if that sort of thing pleases you. In the meanwhile, i'll be flying around MH looking for 1v1s. :P First of all, I rly like bydi and ugluuk. Ugluuk is one of the heros in eve in mye eyes. (used to get insperation by watching his vids). But even I greaty agree that pvp should be fun, and it should be small non cap gangs pew pewing having fun agains each other in well balanced fights, I kinda lost faith in that a long time ago. Its longer and longer between u find such fights as more and more ppl get more and more cynical about the whole pvp thingy. Ppl want kills, and as few losses as possible. Even its annyoing ppl blob u, its kinda what u got in eve atm. Even I rather would see equal fleets and such, u cant stop your own allinace m8 from wanting to join in fighting with u, when u report a gang ect. u want to deal as much dmg as possible and have as good stats as possible. Even its sad, its the hard reality. I rly doesnt find many ppl that pvp just for the sake of fun anymore, its either ideologi or territorial warfare, where u aint intersted in much besides killing as many ppl as possible, losing as little as possible. Ofc u might get some fun in there and have a great time together, but...not to be rude, its rly no point complaining about been blobbed. the lag sux, but besides that brining the blob is eve....I think. sadly enough. Its like complaining USA been noobies for brining too many men when they nucke some small country. the whole 1vs1 thingy is great, but its a lost chase. -------Made in Thailand---- -------Living in Norway----
Rhaegor Stormborn Volition Cult The Volition Cult	Posted - 2008.01.19 14:39:00 - [17] You really can't blame an alliance for using whatever tools they have at hand to to damage to their enemies. BYDI has dropped capitals on my corporation multiple times now (and spanked us a few times) when we have never used a capital against them ourselves and were only looking for small gang pew pew. I am not sure how you can fault Foundation for using assets they have worked hard on developing for just this sort of circumstance. My corporation does not fault BYDI for dropping four capitals on our 10 man gang as that is what you have available to you, and it is your right to use them in any manner you deem appropriate. You can't ask people you are at war with the pull punches, and you should expect them to attempt to knock you out at every given opportunity.
Bailian Moxtain Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.01.19 15:24:00 - [18] have fun uggie, love you big time <3 goes for u too crazy tasty *- made in Norway -*
Crazy Tasty Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.01.19 15:54:00 - [19] Edited by: Crazy Tasty on 19/01/2008 15:55:02 Originally by: Alazais This demonstrates the nature of killboards and friends, since on our campaign against you we have 66% efficiency, which is outstanding for a larger entity fighting a smaller one (who can pick targets and avoid the FCs). You actually have a 28% efficiency vs Bydi. Obviously the only reason the 66% exists is RUIN losing a few of their caps (No Bydi cap has ever been lost). Even with the RUIN cap loses, ISK value of your loses is getting close. As you said though, you can mix and match stats on a KB to your liking any time, which is why the OP contained Bydi vs FDN only stats also. /me touches Bail.
Space Chutney Minmatar Wildlands Heavy Technologies FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.01.19 16:15:00 - [20] Edited by: Space Chutney on 19/01/2008 16:23:12 You threw capitals at us and lost them. It was not coincidence they happened to be there with you guys. Have to say though, using another corporation so it doesnt count for BYDI is entirely genius but doesnt make the loss any less substaintial; your "friends" will not be fielding those ships against us again. And what do you expect? You guys are extremely skilled solo and small gang pilots. If you weren't performing very well, then your reputation would be entirely undeserved; you are outperfoming a less-efficient alliance who have a much lower average skill than yourselves. This isnt rocket science it is how the game works. We aren't expecting win based on efficiency, we dont need to add corporations or alliances to our campaign just to make nice statistics we are not going to start crying about it. You cannot complain that we throw our capitals at you, just because ours have our name on them rather than someone elses. Lastly, stop expecting us to come to you for fights. EDIT: Awox, stfu. That is all.
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2008.01.19 16:16:00 - [21] Originally by: Ugluuk There has been a overwhelming interest from people in Molden Heat I'm not sure if that was intended or not . . .
Lord Maldoror Fairlight Corp FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.01.19 16:27:00 - [22] The thing is that we live in GW and this fight is in MH, two different regions. So we need to distinguish between 'core' fighting and 'peripheral' fighting. When you do that you'll see that FDN and BYDI basically operate the same way, as do most other alliances and corps: For FDN: Our 'core' fighting was against Veritas, Church and friends. This contained numerous capital battles but also some fantastic 'straight fights' against the faces we engaged day in and day out. For example, a few times Dreamworks (one of the enemy FCs) asked us to offline our regular cap alts and we did; he did the same and we had some great fights with all the nuances of remote rep chains, ecm sub-battles, etc. Fighting in MH is 'peripheral' fighting against people we don't necessarily know. It's a waste of flying that far if the hostiles just dock up, as often happens, so cyno-bait is sometimes tempting. It's not our bread and butter pvp, it's a side issue so one is more likely to drop a cap and get it done with. For BYDI: Your 'core' fighting, the fights you are looking for - correct me if I'm wrong - are the same ones we look for, on a scale matching your corp, i.e. similar size gangs duking it out in a slug fest, 1v1s, etc. Your 'peripheral' fighting is when you camp a gate with 10 guys and a hauler jumps in (since you pirate, you'll gank him). Yes, you blobbed him technically, but it was a side-issue, not your bread and butter fight that makes the evening tick, so you thought nothing of using ten ships to do it. I think this is the reality of combat in Eve and we need to accept it. Our apples fight your oranges, to mix metaphors :) Our core guys and your core guys actually look for the same cool fights but we do so in different places.
MAXSuicide Cosmic Fusion When Fat Kids Attack	Posted - 2008.01.19 16:54:00 - [23] Originally by: Rhaegor Stormborn You really can't blame an alliance for using whatever tools they have at hand to to damage to their enemies. people claiming to be pvpers and living for the fight, dropping motherships on a few cruisers - is what i think is pathetic.
Aoki Shinya	Posted - 2008.01.19 17:36:00 - [24] Originally by: MAXSuicide Originally by: Rhaegor Stormborn You really can't blame an alliance for using whatever tools they have at hand to to damage to their enemies. people claiming to be pvpers and living for the fight, dropping motherships on a few cruisers - is what i think is pathetic. People who *** and complain about other people playing Eve as a whole when they are only interested in a small part of it are *** **s, you are a *** **. This is a very complex game and that is why it includes capitals. If this was a fit-your-spaceship and fight evenly matched gangs game it would be a completely different game and every fight you had would be a "good fight." Unfortunately, not many people would play that game. They play EVE because of the nuanced interplay between different game elements, as well as the interaction between dramatically different kinds of players. A smaller PvP corp dec'ing an alliance like in this situation is one example... and the OP's excessive emphasis on killboard numbers and evenly matched fights speaks volumes of how shallow his understanding is of the true beauty of what makes Eve "fun." MAXSuicide is equally ****. Like in almost every other online game, he is one of those people who like to complain about something being cheap, pathetic or dishonorable when that is only the case in his narrowly defined bubble of what the game should be like. Meanwhile, the reality of the game, in the sense of how the developers intended it, is already being played by the people he is ***ing about. STFU dude.
Ugluuk Caldari Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.01.19 17:53:00 - [25] Foundation is a big alliance..Many people either hate or love them and contact us because they see the war dec.. Lately there has been up to 4-5 convo`s from i log in and until i log off by people interested in info on FDN, their tactics and so on..I dont like to loose focus from my pvp by talking and i dont like to be rude by blocking people.. So i send them to this topic instead for some good reading on what our experiences are.. This is a week too week update where the first week was great in our eyes and the second week has been crap with mulitple capitals being dropped on as small targets as recon ships and BC.. I have not called it unfair, not called it blobbing and i have not called them carebears.. I just simply stated that it has been a change of direction from FDN and they want to fight that way.. Nothing else.. If you see this as whining go read an older Ugluuk topic..
MAXSuicide Cosmic Fusion When Fat Kids Attack	Posted - 2008.01.19 18:00:00 - [26] Originally by: Aoki Shinya Originally by: MAXSuicide Originally by: Rhaegor Stormborn You really can't blame an alliance for using whatever tools they have at hand to to damage to their enemies. people claiming to be pvpers and living for the fight, dropping motherships on a few cruisers - is what i think is pathetic. snip Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Navigator ([email protected]) Reply to moderated post removed - Navigator
Ugluuk Caldari Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.01.19 19:19:00 - [27] Originally by: Alazais This demonstrates the nature of killboards and friends, since on our campaign against you we have 66% efficiency, which is outstanding for a larger entity fighting a smaller one You have 29% efficiency against Bydi and 6 losses that aren`t posted..
Khalid Zhee Fairlight Corp FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.01.19 19:53:00 - [28] Originally by: Ugluuk You have 29% efficiency against Bydi and 6 losses that aren`t posted.. FDN has 66% efficiency against your forces, which is indulgently high considering the smaller entity can hit and run in a region we don't even live in :) Remember, to fight us you gang with Reunion. This is the nature of killboards; for example if I joined a multi-alliance gang against Bob or someone, as the sole FDN pilot, I could get on 70 killmails and die only a few times, even if we lost each fight overall. That would give a 90%+ ratio against them, which of course is nonsense :) Even FDN has mixed gangs, though less so than BYDI, so our ratios aren't perfect either. But no mistake, I would have expected to have a very low k/d in this kind away-from-home fight; 66% is very high (re-read the alazais report above for why).
Pride NL Momentum. The Reckoning.	Posted - 2008.01.19 21:05:00 - [29] See Cyno? Bail. Costs them not you. You should know this Ugluuk Arrive. Raise Hell. Leave.
Crazy Tasty Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.01.19 22:39:00 - [30] Originally by: Khalid Zhee Originally by: Ugluuk You have 29% efficiency against Bydi and 6 losses that aren`t posted.. FDN has 66% efficiency against your forces, which is indulgently high considering the smaller entity can hit and run in a region we don't even live in :) Remember, to fight us you gang with Reunion. This is the nature of killboards; for example if I joined a multi-alliance gang against Bob or someone, as the sole FDN pilot, I could get on 70 killmails and die only a few times, even if we lost each fight overall. That would give a 90%+ ratio against them, which of course is nonsense :) Even FDN has mixed gangs, though less so than BYDI, so our ratios aren't perfect either. But no mistake, I would have expected to have a very low k/d in this kind away-from-home fight; 66% is very high (re-read the alazais report above for why). If you feel like adding in anyone who has ever gangs with us, go ahead, however, you're missing quite a few more corps that could possibly boost your percentage some. The war was Bydi vs FDN, you added RUIN after the fact when you happened to get a few of their caps. If you want to talk stats vs all involved parties that 143 to 32 and 8.1b to 2.4b doesn't look so hot for you either does it? As a matter of fact, you'd still be in the negative on that even with the cap kills. To keep the stats relatively straight forward we can take the main protagonist from either side, FDN and Bydi, and compare: 61 to 24 by our board and 53 to 24 (29% efficiency) by yours.

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