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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:19:00 - [1] I seem to remember a claim that there are no goons, and that they would never be allowed to build up in 0.0 again. Since that is BoB's own criteria for success, I guess we can say they've patently failed.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:23:00 - [2] Originally by: TWD The bpo pushed us from being alliance ranked as #501337 to #1. Whether the BPO pushed you anywhere is not the point. The point is no-one else received an ill-gotten bpo from a dev. The value that was extracted from that BPO was and can never be repaid to those who never received an ill-gotten bpo from a dev.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:31:00 - [3] Originally by: TWD Artificial timetables of accomplishing that set out goal would be a mistake. An artifical timetable would say to an enemy, just wait them out; it would say to the goons, don't do hard things necessary to achieve our objectives; and it would be discouraging for our troops. It is one thing to argue the above when you're on the offensive and taking enemy territory, and quite another when you're down to your last region and all your allies have abandoned you.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:35:00 - [4] Originally by: Zorland And you can prove that everyone in BOB (with leadership or not) was aware that BPO was not won on lottery thus making them ALL cheaters rather then only 1 person being labeled as such? Honestly, Coalition lost me at the point when they accused CCP as a company as being cheaters trying to help BOB. How stupid can someone be to beleive that? Did I say all BoB were aware, or did I say the value that was gained was not gained by any other player, corp, or alliance? Learn to read please. And whether the rank and file knew about it or not, they benefited from it as an alliance asset. No other alliance leaders or rank and file members benefited from the cheating actions of a dev.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:47:00 - [5] Originally by: Keeves BoB is so 6 months ago... Fixed that for you.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:58:00 - [6] Originally by: Zorland Well if BOB is under attack by the rest of EVE for the reason of cheating then they must all be involved in the act right? And I said already, if you think that an alliance like BOB (or any other alliance tbh) will benefit from 1 tech 2 BPO, then you are really clueless about how biggest alliances in game generate ISK. Yes, because a bpo worth at least 10 billion isk on the open market, producing an item of limited supply and great practical use, confers absolutely no benefit whatsoever to those who have it. And it was more than one bpo, eight if I remember correctly. And you call others clueless... Even if they received a single t1 bpo any use of it would still be the proceeds of cheating. That will never change.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:01:00 - [7] Originally by: Zorland You sound like a racist to me.... When your argument fails, accuse them of racism, eh?
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:07:00 - [8] Edited by: Exioce on 03/02/2008 00:07:37 Originally by: Zorland Well I have to at you for thinking that 10 bil is a LOT of isk. So I'm a racist AND poor. wow Zorland, you really are clutching at straws today. If you could formulate a decent point it wouldn't really be necessary. Quote: Eight what? BOB members had stolen 8 tech 2 BPO's? Is that what you are saying? You have a proof to back that up or you just making stuff up now? Eight bpo's were given to BoB by t20, dumbass. Most were ammo types, but it's more than anyone else got from any dev.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:18:00 - [9] Originally by: Zorland Who said my arguments failed? But yes, in general when you accuse many for the act of one, you can say that's because you hate a specific group or race. Your arguments have clearly failed, since your only recourse is to attempt to equate my factual assertion that BoB as a whole benefited from those ill-gotten assets with racism.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:20:00 - [10] Originally by: Zorland I've failed to make any decent arguments so I shall now run away Fixed that for you.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:41:00 - [11] Edited by: Exioce on 03/02/2008 00:41:37 Originally by: HEY LISTEN I thought it was a sabre bpo and a t2 ammo bpo i do not remember there being 6 others or that the whole of bob was involved so blaming an entire alliance for the misdeads of a select few is stupid. Plus i do not see how it changed the course of all the wars they fought even if their was 8 cos at best it would have made 4 ppl self suffecient. Did I say all were to blame? No. Did I say all benefited from the assets as a whole? Yes, and that's a fact because what benefits an alliance benefits its individual members. And if you don't see how an asset worth over ten billion isk changes anything then perhaps you should pass all your money and assets to a random person because hey, it won't changed anything for you or that person either, right? Quote: The whole t20 issue seems to me like a flag bitter victims of bob wars or currant enemies drag out like some sort of flag to wave around but tbqfh its a rather thread bare and pathetic flag at best. The t20 thing could have happened in any alliance in game not just bob and to blame an entire alliance for the misdeads of a few is pitiful. Yeah, because it's not like any of it ever happened, right, so let's not mention it ever again
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:03:00 - [12] Originally by: HEY LISTEN I did not say it made no differance at all i said it made no differance to the wars they won lets face it in a multi multi thousand player war 10 bil is the cost of 1 engagment if that. When any other alliance in this game is given one free engagement or ten or more deathstars by a dev, then we'll talk. Cheating that benefits someone only slightly is still cheating. Quote: And i do not say it never happened only that ppl like you drag it up wave it like a sad little flag as if it was the whole of the alliance and like it made some sort of differance to eve apart from for 2 or 3 ppl at most. When an alliance insists on telling you how great it is, it is only fitting to remind it that some of that greatness was bought with ill-gotten gains.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:09:00 - [13] Originally by: Ekram Riz It's the person that was cheating, not the alliance. The alliance benefited, and was not reduced of assets equal to the value of the benefit derived. The cheater is still employed with the company.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:14:00 - [14] Originally by: HEY LISTEN The coalition had taken 11 bil a day losses in delve so far acording to the molle post you are a clue less noob if you think 10 bil is anything other that pocket change for the alliances involved in this war. But if you wanna believe that the 10 bil worth of bpo's is as you say "greatness was bought with ill-gotten gains" then by all means do so but understand that the rest of us that know how large wars and alliances work are laughing our asses off at you bud cos you do not have a clue. And the Coalition wasn't given back 11 billion isk by t20, so your point is rather stupid. If the Coalition was given back 11 billion by t20 you might have a point, but until then you don't. Sorry.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:19:00 - [15] Originally by: Ekram Riz So destroy the company or remove the cheater? A company of dozens is not destroyed by the removal of one person. At the very least, the company could have tallied a rough value of the benefit derived from the bpo (daily production capacity x days owned x average market value) and taken that isk value from the BoB corp wallet. That would have gone some way to making amends, but it was never done.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:20:00 - [16] Originally by: Ekram Riz Sorry, but your propaganda just don't work on some of us. Those would be the people who like to excuse BoB its cheating derived benefits.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:22:00 - [17] Originally by: Murina HIS point is that 10 or 11 billion is chump change to alliances and in wars this large pal you are the one claiming it was a eve changing momentous event lol. So where is the "chump change" CCP dumped in everyone elses lap via t2 bpo's?
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:27:00 - [18] Originally by: Zorland Yada,yada,yada. If you Goons are so concerned about some stupid tech 2 BPO, and not the fact that BOB griefed you and still does, like no one EVER will, why don't you remove them from the game? Oh, wait, you've been trying.... Including this propaganda war you are taking to the forum. I for one, don't beleive one word you are typing here. I must be reading the maps wrong, because apparently I see BoB losing its precious Fountain and Delve and the Coalition gaining it. Don't tell me, they didn't want those regions anyway.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:32:00 - [19] Originally by: HEY LISTEN Nowhere but then as i have been trying to drum into your head not every single bob member got the bpo's only 1 or 2 did (most did not even know about it) and it proly made those 2 ppl self suffecient but hey if you think that changed bobs fortunes and made them all those titans and gained them all that space then i can only say LOL. And those one or two used those assets to benefit the alliance as a whole. And those one or two (or the corp) never had assets to the value of the benefit taken off them. It's strange you're not able to comprehend this simple fact. I wonder what drives people like yourself to such dishonesty...
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:34:00 - [20] Originally by: Murina Neither did i get any but then i suppose nor did all of bob just a couple of em. All of BoB did benefit as they were alliance held assets, and what benefits an alliance benefits its individual members.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:43:00 - [21] Originally by: Zorland Well, after NAPing MC, TOXIN and KIA, the only remaining entities on BOB side are Reikoku, FinFleet and Evolution. If you can somehow make them believe in your forum crap like others on this forum do, you might actually win against BOB. Oh I see: BoB is superior due to its ability to LOSE regions and allies. And here I was thinking the ability to TAKE regions and make allies conferred superiority...
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:45:00 - [22] Originally by: thoth foc so why do you still suck so badly?? you can only beat an excuse for so many years tbh.. So how many regions and allies have you gained lately? Do tell.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:46:00 - [23] Originally by: HEY LISTEN 11 bil devided by say 4000 = 2 million 750 thousand each lol omfg why dont they all have titans!!!!!!! lol I don't recall a dev giving anyone else a free 2 million 750 thousand each.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:50:00 - [24] Originally by: Lucas Avignon Someone beating their drum about a dev who abused his power and cheated, that could have been in any alliance but happened to be in BoB, therefore you believe all of BoB are guilty of cheating. Your making pathetic arguments of little consquence and your only goal is to smear bob in some way, to the casual observer your actually achieving the opposite of what your aim is. You must be attention starved or something, but tbh I don't care either way but it's terribly boring to read one or two people drag up the same crap that happened what, one or two years ago now and beat it to death, what nearly everyday since it happened If you were able to read you would have noticed not once did I say all BoB were guilty of cheating, I said all BoB benefited from the cheating, which is simply a fact.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:52:00 - [25] Originally by: HEY LISTEN Neither do i but then as i have already said im not stupid enough to think that such a pitiful ammout could or did change the face of eve and made bob a super power lol lets face it that ammout is about what you would get from a good rat including the loot. People who get that amount from a rat haven't got it through cheating.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:53:00 - [26] Originally by: Zorland Yes, they play EVE online. You Goons are more into "Lets make friends because we can't do **** on our own" online. Didn't want those regions and allies anyway, amirite?
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 02:07:00 - [27] Originally by: HEY LISTEN 1) Most importantly i nor anybody else has denied that it happened what we say is that it is such an insignificant ammount when measured against a normal days ratting. But you claim it changed the course of eve and that is stupid. 2) Most bob members proly were not aware of it and like i said only a hate freak would want to keep dragging it up like it actual matters to the big picture and using terms like "bob cheats" instead of more acurate terms like "a couple of bob members cheated and the members of bob at that time may have benifited by a couple of million isk or so over a very long period". So you're saying 'insignificant' cheating is fine and shouldn't be punished, only 'significant' cheating is bad and should be punished?
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 02:19:00 - [28] Originally by: HEY LISTEN No my points are clear (point 2) to see, your just avoiding them. But i do think the individuals directly involved should be punished accordingly but i do not think the alliance or unknowing members should be considered guilty of any crime what so ever unless they knowingly involved themselves. Neither am I saying that those who had no knowledge should be punished. Certain top level BoB guys knew it was a dev who was giving them the bpo and how he got it. The alliance wallet itself was never reduced to the value of the benefit (it was an alliance held asset so it was only appropriate), and neither were the guys who took in full knowledge and the guy who gave in full knowledge punished in any serious manner. That's the fundamental problem. Everyone else who exploits or cheats gets punished, but an exception was made in this case.
Exioce Gallente Trisomy 21	Posted - 2008.02.03 02:38:00 - [29] Originally by: HEY LISTEN Then if your so into justice i suggest in future that you name the individuals instead of using broad terms and the alliance name as you are tarring several thousand innocent individuals with a brush they do not deserve some of witch were not even in said alliance at the time. If justice is as important to you as you claim of course. The individuals are known to CCP from logs that were released on a particular site when this all first came out, and they're still around. I won't post the logs or give the specific names but suffice to say one of those in the know committed capital suicide recently, and another has a name that sound a bit... diabolical, shall we say. Others knew about the bpo's being given, but I'm not certain if they were high enough to know who exactly was giving it to them.

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