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Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
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Posted - 2008.02.07 17:46:00 -
[1]
Costs are not going to decrease with the upcoming patch. The only things being changed are the ships' stats and the possible number of runs on the BPC's. Increasing the possible number of runs may sound like it will reduce cost but you can only get more than 1 run if you use the decryptor that doesn't give the best ME and the build cost 4+B means ME is far more important.
The stats on jump freighters will, however, be substantially improved so they should sell better after the patch. Not that I think there is much of a market for them but I made my case for that in the last JF thread.
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
|
Posted - 2008.02.07 18:41:00 -
[2]
If they could not just jump into low sec from high sec but jump back, they would be worth every penny. Even without that they have their uses, I just don't see that large of a market. Not when you get 3 times the cargo space at 1/7 the cost using a standard freighter. If an alliance wants to do heavy logistics they use a combination of jump bridges, titans and freighter convoys, that covers the full range of activities and it does it for far less cost than JF's.
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
|
Posted - 2008.02.07 19:17:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Montaire
The Future : The Rorqual's ability to 'haul' non-ore/ice products will be DESTROYED. Probably given a 250k ore/ice only bay.
I'm sorry but I haven't seen the dev's say anything about that. I don't suppose you have a link or two to go with your wild speculation?
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
|
Posted - 2008.02.07 20:04:00 -
[4]
I'm not saying "buy a Titan and setup jump bridges, they're cheap logistics." They are expensive but they also have tremendous military uses, hence the big alliances already have both. Then consider that it's cheaper and in many cases easier to use those in conjunction with normal freighters than to acquire and use Jump Freighters.
Further, the build cost of a Jump Freighter is 4-4.5B but to that you need to add the cost of invention which currently runs you about 1.2B for the best possible ME, including failure rates. So you're looking at close to 6B with 0 profit.
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
|
Posted - 2008.02.07 21:34:00 -
[5]
If you have small-haul needs then the Rorqual's more than 100k m3 of capacity will do just fine. If you need to do massive logistics, you might as well load up a couple freighters and use the alliance's existing jump bridge or wait until the titan is available or a gang can be put together to escort you. Freighters hold at least 3 times as much, are much easier to train an alt for and cost much less. Combine them with the jump bridges and titans that every major alliance has and they're also easier to work with. I don't see how they replace freighters as the basic unit of alliance logistics.
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
|
Posted - 2008.02.07 22:18:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Shadarle
So every alliance has jump bridges and titans... good to know!
Also great that even the smaller members who need to transport things have complete access to both of these as well.
I had no idea every alliance had access to these things.
Yes, every single one, even the alliances made of just a pair of 1-man alt corps....that's exactly what I meant.  I'm sorry but are we playing semantic games or are we discussing the market?
My point was major alliances already have those things, I even think I used the adjective "major" in several of my earlier posts. The small ones generally have very limited territory in which case you don't need to jump your stuff around, a normal freighter will do. Basically it's just those operating high volume operations in low sec that don't have the personnel to guard a freighter as it jumps around. That small group includes me and my reactors but we won't supply significant longterm demand. There can only be so many of us and once we all have jump freighters the demand and thus market is gone. Basically I see jump freighters as a niche item that while usable across 0.0 is only the best option for a select few in low sec, combine that with the fact that they rarely ever get killed and it's userbase doesn't grow much and the long term profitability of producing them goes to 0.
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
|
Posted - 2008.02.09 08:46:00 -
[7]
The invention cost is not 300M unless the success rate jumped to 100% recently.
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
|
Posted - 2008.02.18 21:23:00 -
[8]
Apparently we're not the only ones to have this argument. Someone even took my side in the argument  I knew there was a reason I liked SHC....
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Lothian Quay Industries
Zzz
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Posted - 2008.02.28 16:09:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Admiral Nova
(Invention is a very small part of their cost now, with cheaper datacores and BPCs)
Not sure when Trinity 1.1 will be.
That's extremely misleading. Even if the datacores were free the Freighter BPC's are still pricey and you have a higher than 50% failure rate so you'll need more than 2 on averge to get 1 BPC.
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
Kwint Sommer
Lothian Quay Industries
Zzz
|
Posted - 2008.02.28 18:49:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Shadarle
The main reason invention prices are dropping is due to a MASSIVE over supply of freighter BPC's on the market. Prices were at 400-500+ mil per a few months back, they are now down to pre-JF prices and headed downwards. Shortly copying a freighter BPO will be worse than copying a carrier bpo.
Kirjava and I had been making plans to go into Jump Freighter production before they were introduced but we ended up delaying a few weeks and once we saw the absolutely ridiculous number of people buying freighter BPO's (just one of the IPO's that cropped up was going to buy 40B worth of them) we decided to keep our distance. Right now the BPC's are still quite profitable but given a few more months we'll be at the point where a freighter BPO takes more than 2 years to break even.
5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants |
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